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Lynyrd Skynyrd

Are there guns to avoid

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I am ready to purchase my shootin irons and was wondering if there are any brands or models to avoid? I am in need of everything, pistols, rifle and shotgun.

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Yes there are guns to avoid, do your homework and you'll figure it out. The wire is probably not as good as the range to get proper information. 

Watch the good shooters and ask questions. 

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Welcome to the best game there is!

 

If you haven't been to a match go BEFORE you buy anything.

 

 

Read this:

 

Whatever you do, DON'T buy a Henry Big Boy!

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Go to a several SASS shoots near you, and do a 'hands-on' live fire before you buy anydangthing:excl:

 

OLG

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STOP!! Do not buy anything. Get to your local club and spend time with them. Shoot their guns. Shoot Ubertis, Rugers, '73's '92's, SxS, pump action, .38's .45's, any and everything you can get your hands on. Don't buy anything until you do this. Those who rush out and buy without trying regret it. I know, because I did it. 

Getting new guns is fun, and it will be even more fun if you get the right guns. Those that are right for you. 

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Buy whatever you think you'd like and go shoot! You'll wind up buying and selling anyway so go for it!!

 

The only gun I would avoid for CAS is a Henry Big Boy.

 

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6 minutes ago, Marshal Chance Morgun said:

STOP!! Do not buy anything. Get to your local club and spend time with them. Shoot their guns. Shoot Ubertis, Rugers, '73's '92's, SxS, pump action, .38's .45's, any and everything you can get your hands on. Don't buy anything until you do this. Those who rush out and buy without trying regret it. I know, because I did it. 

Getting new guns is fun, and it will be even more fun if you get the right guns. Those that are right for you. 

^ this.

 

And don't be shy about asking if any mods have been set up in the guns you like.

There is a good possibility that you might have a local Cowboy gunsmith who can also assist you.

And maybe even some good buys from local shooters.

 

Many of us buy and sell GOOD guns quite frequently.

 

WELCOME and good luck.

 

..........Widder

 

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The Winchester 94 and any pump action rifle are good ones to avoid.  Also the Henry Big Boy is on the not advised list.   

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16 minutes ago, Badlands Bob #61228 said:

The Winchester 94 and any pump action rifle are good ones to avoid.  Also the Henry Big Boy is on the not advised list.   

 

To amplify...

 

The Winchester 94 is a nice rifle, but not well suited to our game.   It just doesn't work well with pistol caliber cartridges.   In rifle caliber cartridges it can be a good one to use in long range side matches, but I would not buy one in ANY caliber made after 1983.  In simpler terms, if it's got angle eject, don't buy it. 

 

The Henry Big Boy is considered to not be good for CAS, but also seems to be well regarded as a good all around rifle, just not for our game.

 

I will take exception to the "any pump action rifle" comment however.   Speaking, I assume of the Colt Lightning and its modern reproductions.   In a nutshell, everyone will agree that then Taurus version of the gun is very useful as a tomato stake, but not as a rifle.   That being said, others will say that some of the other makes can make for excellent rifles.    I own three myself, one Colt and 2 AWA's   One of the AWA's in .45 Colt is my favorite SASS rifle, and I shot EoT clean with it a few years ago.    That being said, the Lightning is very much a love it or hate it type of gun, and I would not recommend one to a newbie unless they REALLY like pump guns.   And even then I'd do so with caution.

 

For pistols, there is a reason why Colt/Clones or things very similar to them like the Ruger dominate the game.   Things like the S&W top breaks are excellent guns in and of themselves, but I think they have a higher learning curve and are harder to do really well with them.  Not saying they can't be used effectively, but you've got to be a real expert to do so.

 

The Russian Nagant is legal, inexpensive, and unless you want to use them for the novelty them being something different, they should be avoided.    Fun to shoot, but not the best gun for the game.

 

For shotguns, well, use what you like and enjoy.   Persons other than myself will have to tell you if a specific make/model should be avoided.

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1 hour ago, Lynyrd Skynyrd said:

I am ready to purchase my shootin irons and was wondering if there are any brands or models to avoid? I am in need of everything, pistols, rifle and shotgun.

Please follow anyone’s advice that told you to go to your local club(s) shoots. Then determine if you want to be very competitive or just want to have fun!  If competitive choose .38 spcl for a caliber and you will find that the competitors like either 1873 or Marlins, prior to the Remington purchase. 

If you would rather have fun then choose whatever guns will make you happy. I had a 94 large loop in .44 mag as my first rifle. It was a Winchester, could shoot the .44 specials my Colt New Frontier was chambered for and only cost me $300. I have a friend who loves the Big Boy. Don’t worry about the gun snobs that are here, go with what you can afford at the time and you will enjoy. Whatever you get will not be your only one, part of the gun is getting others that hit your fancy. 

But if you are getting into the game to win matches and tournaments, then listen to them getting the rifles short stroked, the pistols honed and smooth and the shotguns “smithed” as well. 

 

Nimble Fingers

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Thank you to all. I have shot two practices and my first match was Saturday. I have shot the ubertis and rugers and an open top that was cool. Most of the guys shoot the 1873 lever.

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Best to avoid the guns on someone else's cart unless you have permission first :D

 

The Henry Big Boy is NOT well suited for this game IMO.  

 

Can't go wrong with Rugers and a Uberti 73 IMO, if you tried them, and liked them, go git em!

 

Grizz

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Don't get in a hurry. I started with a win 94 in 45 colt, moved to a Uberti 1873 in 45 Colt, moved to a Winchester 1873 in 357. lost money on all of them except the last one. Started with Uberti 45 revolvers moved to Ruger then to the SASS model Rugers. Started with a Cimmaron 1897 moved to a Winchester 1897 and a SXS. Lost money on most of them to. So here we are thousands of dollars less. I shoot Rugers and Winchesters, with a Stoegers SXS thrown in. I'm happy with my guns now. I might ad most of the above guns were slicked up by high dollar smiths.

 

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As stated try if while you can.  I had a set but have gone through a few figuring out a few things I like and somethings I needed to change.

 

Also, take a look at the rules and decide if there is a particular category that appeals to you.  For example if you like the bling of B Western that dictates a certain cutoff in rifles.  The same for Classic Cowboy and that has caliber restrictions as well.  Maybe you might want to give WB a try.  A big bore lever means not having to get another (what's wrong with that though? It's just money).

 

Maybe you want to be a gunfighter - that is fixed sight revolvers for example. 

 

I did B Western but started shooting gunfighter style.  That was fine but 6.5" Laramies did not clear leather and did not cock as easily.  The weight of one in each hand was a bit hard on my wrist.  So, went to 32 single sixes with 4.75" barrels.  Easier to clear leather and less weight on my poor wrists.  Lots of mod parts available as well from springs to lowered hammers.  The Laramies did not have any of that available and without a sight change where illegal to just shoot gunfighter with.

 

I shoot with one pard and he loves full black powder warthog 45 colt loads.  You know when he has hit the target (I swear some spotters miss hearing or seeing the little 90gr 32s).  He does not go particularly fast but enjoys the boom and blast anyway. 

 

Trust me figure out where you want to start.  You might find your sweet spot but maybe after a point want something different. 

 

Anyway,  YEEHAW and welcome!

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It's not too hard to avoid the real disasters of firearms, so it's good you asked.

 

But it is MUCH harder to get the guns that you will really like, and like shooting.   Among just rifles, there's ten or more good choices of models and makers.  Pistols - twice that.  Shotguns - ten or more good choices.  Depends upon your price range, your size, your competitive goals, your current skill level, and tons more.  

 

Definitely go to some cowboy matches, ask tons of questions of everyone, shoot everything offered, and try things on for size.   It's not real value to rush into buying $3000 or more of guns and hardware and then be disappointed so as to sell them off and rebuy things.

 

Good luck, GJ

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Hello  LS,

 

awesome  alias . 

 

Like  others  have  said ,  go to matches ,  talk  to  people  (PLURAL) and try before  you  buy . 

 

CS  

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LS, come on up to Escondido on the first Saturday and shoot with the Bandidos. We’d love to meet you and start you out on the right foot. Many of the pards that shoot down south with the Desperados find their way up here too.

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I was advised to get the Ruger Vaqueros and Uberti ‘73 in 38 special, and a 12g SxS.  I did and I haven’t regretted it.

 

.38 special is the least expensive round by far.

 

The SxS is the most hassle free shotgun.  If you get the pump or lever, you need backup shotguns because they are not indestructible.  Some guys joke that, with the ‘97, you need 3.  One in the shop, one to shoot, and another as backup.  Plus, several alien abductees report being probed with their own ‘97s. The 12 gauge AA shells are so light on recoil, you can shoot your SxS like a pistol, offhand.

 

The ‘73 has the most upgrade kits available.  Unless you are considering B western, the ‘73 seems to be what almost everyone uses. All of the lever actions need to be set up by a pro and, at least in .38 special, are super finicky in the ammo they will feed.  You must either reload or buy from someone who does.  Most clubs have at least one professional reloader.  Otherwise, Cowboy Choice or Bullets by Scarlett.

 

The Rugers just work.  As someone who was injured when a pistol without a transfer bar system fell on the floor, I really like the Ruger transfer bar system.  Unless you want to spend 3 times as much on an American Standard or a colt, the Rugers are hard to beat.  I’ve not met many in CAS who choose anything else, but you have to figure out if the new vaquero or the Bisley vaquero hits your hand better.  Larger folks tend to prefer the Bisley.  Italy passed a law not long ago that forced the Italian gunmakers to switch to a transfer bar system, like the Rugers.  There were some failure to fire problems when that first started, and I haven’t followed the aftermath, so I’m not sure if that’s still an issue.

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Just an FYI: 

 

my Winchester 97 didn't need a back up... Maintain them well and they'll service you well.

 

My 73 is not anywhere near "super finicky" on the ammo that it'll feed.

 

My advice is to get to know folks before you take their advice.

 

Phantom

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If you want the Slickest feeding Cartridge for use in a Rifle get a .38-40 , it is also the cleanest cartridge for use with Blackpowder ....

And it is legal in all categories as long as the Rifle is right...

It is also more expensive to shoot :wacko: but fun ta shoot and Worth Style Points ..;)B):wacko: Big time ....

 

Jabez Cowboy

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First decide what categories  you plan to shoot, and what firearms/caliber are legal for them. Like others said go to a shoot, ask questions, and maybe shoot a few. You really can't go wrong with any Ruger revolver, Taylor/Uberti Colt SA clones revolver, Schofield or clone revolver, Winchester 73 or 92 rifle, Uberti Winchester 73 rifle, Winchester or Rossi 92 rifle, Marlin 1894 rifle, Winchester, or IAC later model, 97 shotguns, and just about any SxS shotgun without ejectors. Trust me whatever you end up starting with you WILL add to them as time goes by.

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a lot of clubs have members who have guns and gear to loan out.  Great way to try different guns in 'real life' situations.

 

reloading will be coming soon--don't know too many folks who can be in SASS and buy commercial ammo

 

+ WELCOME TO A GREAT SPORT WITH GREAT PEOPLE!

 

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14 hours ago, Lynyrd Skynyrd said:

I am ready to purchase my shootin irons and was wondering if there are any brands or models to avoid? I am in need of everything, pistols, rifle and shotgun.

Based off of personal experience I would avoid the following.

Rossi 92 lever actions.  Henry big boy rifles.  Single triggered Stoeger side by sides.  Any of the Beretta or Pietta revolvers with the transfer bar safety.  The new Uberti Cattleman II with its floating firing pin safety.  Open top cartridge conversion revolvers. 

 

Not saying any of the above are bad, but for SASS I would avoid them.

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When you find the type of rifle you want, consider buying it new already tuned and short-stroked by a well known and respected smith who'll stand behind his work.  The rifle will not be that much more than buying a stock gun and will be ready to run right out of the box.  I've had good luck with rifles from Cody Conagher, but there are many other smiths that offer race-ready rifles that are excellent.  Shoot some examples from other shooters and find one you like. 

 

Rugers will run right out of the box, but they benefit from a spring kit and maybe a hammer swap.  These are easy and cheap upgrades and you will find local knowledgeable shooters that will help you install the parts.  I have Rugers, but I have been shooting Pietta Colt clones the last few years.  Any new Colt style pistols will run much better after a trip to a competent cowboy gunsmith.

 

I started with a stock 1897 Chinese gun 15 years ago and it still runs fine.  I've ventured into SKB doubles and there are several gunsmith that specialize on working on doubles.  In my experience, most stock doubles are going to need some work.  Many shooters start with a Stoeger or Baikal double and never look back.  Others of us have gone to the more expensive SKBs. 

 

If possible, as others have stated, try as many guns as possible.  

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Watch out for early Navy Arms rifles.

                                                                    Largo

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12 hours ago, Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 said:

If you want the Slickest feeding Cartridge for use in a Rifle get a .38-40 , it is also the cleanest cartridge for use with Blackpowder ....

And it is legal in all categories as long as the Rifle is right...

It is also more expensive to shoot :wacko: but fun ta shoot and Worth Style Points ..;)B):wacko: Big time ....

 

Jabez Cowboy

 

I will politely ask you to keep this information to yourself.  The supply of .38-40 guns is drying up and I want more!

 

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3 hours ago, July Smith said:

Based off of personal experience I would avoid the following.

Rossi 92 lever actions.  Henry big boy rifles.  Single triggered Stoeger side by sides.  Any of the Beretta or Pietta revolvers with the transfer bar safety.  The new Uberti Cattleman II with its floating firing pin safety.  Open top cartridge conversion revolvers. 

 

Not saying any of the above are bad, but for SASS I would avoid them.

Rossi 92 can be fine in the right shooters hands, as well as open tops set up correctly IMO..... 

 

At at least they worked for me last year at EOT... 

OH yea and a state title the year before :)

Funny how that worked out :lol:

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4 hours ago, July Smith said:

Based off of personal experience I would avoid the following.

Rossi 92 lever actions.  Henry big boy rifles.  Single triggered Stoeger side by sides.  Any of the Beretta or Pietta revolvers with the transfer bar safety.  The new Uberti Cattleman II with its floating firing pin safety.  Open top cartridge conversion revolvers. 

 

Not saying any of the above are bad, but for SASS I would avoid them.

I must say I disagree with this. My wife has shot a Rossi 92 in 45 Colt since she started SASS and would not have anything else. Now a slicked up Marlin, '73 or '66 would probably be more competitive, but they are reliable and can be used decently competitively and about half the price of a '73. If you want to set land speed records, they won't be the rifle for you, but if you want a dependable rifle you can quickly run 10 rounds through, after you get Steve Gunz parts and video that is, the 2 Rossi's me and Dixie own have been great. 

 

That being said, I am faster with one of my Marlin;s lol

 

BD

 

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One more for the "go try things" vote.  Some didn't and have regrets.  I followed the advice and have none.

 

If you'll spontaneously combust if you don't get stuff tomorrow, I'd get the typical go-to's (Vaqueros in .38/.357, a 73 or 66 in .38/.357 and a 97 or Steoger coach gun) so you can sell em' easy if you change your mind later.  Those all move fast on the wire.  I know because I was often too late to get them haha.

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2 hours ago, Buckshot Dobbs said:

I must say I disagree with this. My wife has shot a Rossi 92 in 45 Colt since she started SASS and would not have anything else. Now a slicked up Marlin, '73 or '66 would probably be more competitive, but they are reliable and can be used decently competitively and about half the price of a '73. If you want to set land speed records, they won't be the rifle for you, but if you want a dependable rifle you can quickly run 10 rounds through, after you get Steve Gunz parts and video that is, the 2 Rossi's me and Dixie own have been great. 

 

That being said, I am faster with one of my Marlin;s lol

 

BD

 

 

I also have a Rossi 92 in 45 Colt that was owned and set up by Steve Gantz. Works flawlessly and smooth as butter, plus super accurate with the marbles tang sight, but the stroke is longer than a short stroked ‘73, no doubt.  I like that it provides a backup to my ‘73 and gives me the option to try costume categories, side matches, etc. down the line.

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1 hour ago, Hells Comin said:

Avoid:

Marlins and side by sides.

 

Would you care to explain why?

 

I don't bring it very often, but sometimes I like to shoot my old Marlin Model 1894 that was made in 1895.

 

marlin%201894%2004_zpsoi5pxndt.jpg

 

 

 

 

Side by Sides? This nice little Stevens hammer gun from about 1907 has been my Main Match shotgun for a long time now.

 

stevens%20hammergun%2003_zpsi2udi3im.jpg

 

 

 

 

Things to avoid?

 

I would avoid the S&W Russian model. That big hump on the grip makes it real awkward to cock it and shoot it one handed.

 

Russian%202nd%20Model%20with%2044%20Russ

 

 

 

 

Original Schofield Model.  Unless you accept the fact that you have to load it with cartridges loaded with Black Powder.

 

Schofield%20SN%202254%2002_zpst2jus5bq.j

 

 

 

 

Same with the S&W New Model Number Three. Black Powder only.

 

New%20Model%20Number%20Three%20Blue%2031

 

 

 

 

Merwin Hulberts. Avoid them like the plague.  Particularly the modern replicas, they don't work at all.:D

 

Pocket%20Army%20open%20Top%2003_zpsxtkn5

 

 

 

 

4 hours ago, J. Mark Flint #31954 LIFE said:

I will politely ask you to keep this information to yourself.  The supply of .38-40 guns is drying up and I want more!

 

 

I have to agree. There are not enough 38-40s to go around for those who want more, and the supply is drying up.

 

Winchester%20Model%201873%20and%20Colt%2

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2 hours ago, Hells Comin said:

Avoid:

Marlins and side by sides.

This is  an example of why u should know the folks you're getting advice from!!!!! (Like Phantom said above). And it was also  to get Deuce to respond. 

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2 hours ago, Hells Comin said:

This is  an example of why u should know the folks you're getting advice from!!!!! (Like Phantom said above). And it was also  to get Deuce to respond. 

 

I started to post a comment before I saw your reply.

 

I was gonna ask what do you have against Deuce?.....   ;)

 

You know that Deuce will probably reply and say to stay away from the 97, especially the kind you use..... :lol:;)

 

..........Widder

 

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