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Replacement for Clays


Shawnee Hills

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Been using 13.9 gr. of Clays behind a 7/8 oz. payload for 12 gauge but am almost out.  Since Clays is nonexistent, anyone have a recommendation for a replacement powder that's actually available?

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I have used a lot of Clay Dot in place of Clays.  Load to about the same powder weight in shotshells.

 

TiteGroup (also now marketed as High Gun) now has lots of data for light 12 gauge loads. It's pretty easy to find.  

 

Promo would be fine, too.  Load to the same WEIGHT as Red Dot recipes.

 

American Select has been showing up some places.  It loads just about like Red Dot.     Winchester WST is on some shelves and loads a nice light 12 gauge load.  As does TiteWad.

 

good luck, GJ

 

 

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Been using 14gr. Clay-Dot for a while now. Years back I used 700X with no issues as well, same load.

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We recently found 700X at LGS up here.       GW

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iive used clay and red dot but also 700x pretty much interchangeably , you do have to look at how the powder meters and check your charges , as with all powders ...they dont all ,meter the same but if burn rate is close you dont have to vary your charge a lot , clays and red dot are really close 

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Alliant Extra-Lite.  Picked up a keg a couple months ago.  That will be my backup if I ever run out of WST.  All those powders mentioned above will work about the same.

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Extra-Lite is my choice for 7/8 oz loads since WAALite was discontinued as a canister powder.  Like most Alliant powders availability has been poor the last few years.

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Hodgdon lists some light 1 oz loads (970 fps) with Perfect Pattern. I haven’t stumbled on many first hand experiences with it, but it’s available and relatively cheap.

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I started loading International Clay's, then switched to Clays, then Clay Dot ,then Red Dot, and since a friend gave me 8 pounds of Promo, I'm using it.All have worked well in loads that approximate the LNLR.

At these reduced levels I find that they all are a little "dirty".

Not terrible, but I clean after every match anyway.

Of course,YMMV

Choctaw

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Thanks for the replies, everyone!  I dug a little deeper and discovered 2 pounds of Red Dot that I had forgotten about.  So, based on several replies, it looks like I already have a replacement on-hand.  I may have to adjust bushing size (checked by weighing) to match the loads that I'm already using but need a place to start.  How does the burn rate of Red Dot compare to Clays? 

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13.7 red dot works well for me with 7/8 Oz load. 
 

on bushings, look on eBay for 3D printed powder bushings. They are cheap, but they work fine! 

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23 minutes ago, Marauder SASS #13056 said:

Clays, Red Dot and Clay Dot are all about the same on the burn charts.  Clays is right beside Red Dot.

Perfect!  MEC's bushing chart shows a bit heavier throw for Red Dot with the #25 that I'm using now but I have a #24 on-hand.  Certainly, I'll need to verify with the scale, but this info gets me to a row of seats in the ballpark.

 

At the rate that I've been shooting the shotgun, it's about time to upgrade the Sizemaster to a 9000GN.

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6 hours ago, Shawnee Hills said:

Perfect!  MEC's bushing chart shows a bit heavier throw for Red Dot with the #25 that I'm using now but I have a #24 on-hand.  Certainly, I'll need to verify with the scale, but this info gets me to a row of seats in the ballpark.

 

At the rate that I've been shooting the shotgun, it's about time to upgrade the Sizemaster to a 9000GN.

NEVER-EVER trust MEC powder bushings to drop what the chart says they do. ;)

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Alliant's BE-86 is said to be a "clean Unique".  I haven't tried it myself yet but plan to after I use up the last of my Unique on hand.  Just another option to look for.

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23 hours ago, Shawnee Hills said:

At the rate that I've been shooting the shotgun, it's about time to upgrade the Sizemaster to a 9000GN.

I upgraded from the Sizemaster to the MEC 9000E. You will love the 9000. It is so much faster and easier to load a box of shells in just a few minutes.

 

TM

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1 hour ago, Texas Maverick said:

I upgraded from the Sizemaster to the MEC 9000E. You will love the 9000. It is so much faster and easier to load a box of shells in just a few minutes.

 

TM

The 9000 is a good machine. Takes a little fiddling to get the primer feeder set up just right, but after that you can crank them out. 
as others have said, put a shallow baking pan under the press. It’s not if, it’s when you spill powder & shot!

also, cut a couple of fired hulls to about 1.5” length. Keep them handy to put under powder/shot station when there is no hull in place. 
I wish MEC would not drop powder/shot if no hull in place. 

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On 7/17/2023 at 7:45 PM, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

NEVER-EVER trust MEC powder bushings to drop what the chart says they do. ;)

The weird thing is that their chart was spot on (+ or - a tenth) for Clays but is 1.4 gr. off for Red Dot.  Just goes to show that weights should always be verified with a good scale.

 

On 7/18/2023 at 1:18 PM, Texas Maverick said:

I upgraded from the Sizemaster to the MEC 9000E. You will love the 9000. It is so much faster and easier to load a box of shells in just a few minutes.

 

TM

Getting tired of pulling that handle 6 times per shell.  Of course, now I can't find a 9000 in stock anywhere.  Glad I have several hundred already loaded.

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52 minutes ago, Shawnee Hills said:

Getting tired of pulling that handle 6 times per shell.  Of course, now I can't find a 9000 in stock anywhere.  Glad I have several hundred already loaded.

That is exactly what I told my wife to get her to let me buy it. Now I can turn out hundreds whenever I need them. I like the electric because I push 2 buttons and it does a shell. No more pulling levers. I even added the optional foot lever so now I can just step on the pedal and it does a round.

 

TM

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2F with a Claybuster 1138-12 wad & 1 oz of #8 shot.  #37 Mec bushing, fairly soft recoiling but takes down KDs with the best loads!

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On 7/16/2023 at 8:10 PM, Shawnee Hills said:

Been using 13.9 gr. of Clays behind a 7/8 oz. payload for 12 gauge but am almost out.  Since Clays is nonexistent, anyone have a recommendation for a replacement powder that's actually available?

14 grains of American Select. 

Remington Hulls, Win 209 primer, Clay busters Grey 7/8 oz wad.

 

Its my go to load.

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I checked online 8# prices @ $215-$315. Clays was $237 and a few mentioned by others were +/- $20. I'll need to shop shortly since I've less than a pound of Clays. 

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Quote

I checked online 8# prices @ $215-$315. Clays was $237

I doubt any of those Clays powder listings were for In Stock.  Clays is NOT shipping currently.  Hasn't for about a year or two.

 

Either you found Clay Dot, or you found Clays that was listed a couple-3 years ago (back when it was being produced) that the vendors never took the listing off, they just marked it Out of Stock.

 

If you did find an In Stock listing for Clays, mention the vendor.  Several pards would like to find THAT unicorn.

 

good luck, GJ

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I think Alliant's Clay Dot would be an obvious choice here, especially since it was designed to simulate the performance of Clays.  I have personally found it to produce a bit less velocity for equal weights, but have loaded 12 ga. shotshells with the same powder bushing, wad, and shot weight and can't tell any real difference when shooting.  Frankly, Clays was my go to powder for shotshells and for pistol caliber cowboys loads and I had to find a substitute when it became unavailable.  I was able to obtain 8 pounds of Clay Dot back when virtually any powder was near impossible to purchase and I haven't looked back since.  You won't find published load data for Clay Dot for handgun loads, but I've done quite a bit of testing starting at the low end of published Clays data and working up from there and now load it in .38 Special, .357 Magnum, .44 Special, .44 Magnum, and even in 9mm auto with excellent results.  I would go back to Clays if I could get it (mainly because it is a bit cleaner in light loads), but Clay Dot appears to be a very good substitute and I will buy more if I still can't get Clays when the time comes.  Good luck and good shooting to all.      

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