Griff

Yes, but it doesn't require a revision to the rules to do. I'm not opposed to the use of .22s as a local matter, stopgap measure, but altering the rules will fundamentally change the game. But, continue down this path, and soon folks'll be shooting in tennis shoes, short sleeve shirts and any other manner of accoutrement they see fit as the cost of boots and hats and cowboy duds is "too expensive" for me... Alas, cowboy action shooting will be dead and gone. (If it isn't already, as least as conceived and promulgated by its' founders).

While reloading for rifle and pistol is a fairly simple matter of mating bullet weight with a powder charge that can provide sufficient power to knock down the occasional knockdown target, yet provide comfortable recoil, the shotgun is not quite as straight forward. Shotgun shells depend on a "stack" of powder, wad & shot to gain a certain height to produce a satisfactory crimp. (using plastic hulls of course), much easier to adjust if one uses brass hulls. Most loading manuals will list such combinations to yield such a "stack", but... at higher velocities than one needs for cowboy action. I loaded 20 gauge for my wife, before I learned that most 20 gauge shotguns are based on a smaller, lighter frame than 16 or 12 gauge shotguns. Thus any load from a 20 gauge gun will have more felt recoil than an equivalent load from a 12 or 16 ga. The amount of compression imparted to the wad at loading will also affect the result. Unless one of your fellow shooters has a proven 20 gauge load for a 3/4 or 7/8 load that yields slightly less than 1,000 fps you will not find something thus in either printed or online reloading guides. I found thru some experimentation that I could reduce powder charges and lighten the amount of compression of the wad and significantly reduce felt recoil in her 20 gauge loads and still maintain enough mass and velocity to take down shotgun reactive targets. I happened to use IMR's PB powder at the time, since discontinued, so my exact load would be of no use. I did find in my Lyman's Shotshell Reloading Handbook (2nd Ed.), an HS-6 load from which such experimentation would be feasible. However, it requires such a substantial reduction in powder that I'm hesitant to suggest it. There are loads using 473 & Unique which might prove more versatile. Winchester still makes AA "Low Noise/Low Recoil" shotshells in 20 gauge which produces 980 fps with 7/8 ozs of shot. This will still produce more felt recoil than the same product in 12 gauge, but far less than any other field or target load on the market.

I think a lot of assumptions are being made out here in the internet world of SASS. In a little less than a month, I'll be 75... I started this game the month I turned 35. I was working a full time job commuting from OC, CA to downtown LA, going to college and raising a family. Y'all think it was easy to afford going to matches... not time consuming to load ammo for 3 on a used, second hand single stage press. Desire my friends... is a tough mistress. Either one has the desire to do something, or one finds excuses for not doing it. Moving to TX in 1990, it took a few months to find a range willing to let me put on a match, took a trip to NM to buy steel from a CA member to acquire our first set of targets. I think it's fine that y'all want to make it "EASY" on new folks to get started. But changing the rules for the parent organization to accommodate the few folks that'll bother coming out is a fool's errand. Change 'em at YOUR club and see just how many NEW folks you attract. In the forty years I've been playing this game can you imagine the number of "NEW" folks I've seen come and go. FAR, FAR, FAR more than are currently playing. New folks come out all the time... for some that's their only visit... some shoot a few months, some as long as a year, others maybe a few. You will see more current members switching to their .22s than you'll see new folks. The single way to more members is thru advertising. Print, radio, TV, internet & word of mouth. I'm as guilty as the next person... How many of you post your personal cowboy action exploits on your personal TIC-TOC, Facebook or other media accounts about your cowboy shooting activities? Not SASS or club related pages... just your personal page where your family and friends see your posts? Before you see an influx of new shooters, you must generate the desire to do so. And desire will lead them to acquire the already legal guns and required paraphernalia.

How many of those advocating for a official .22 category would be traveling to either the National or World Championships to compete in that category on that stage. So many of you talk of costs for reloading and arms in the center-fire categories as justification for such a new category. Given the costs associated with attending just those two events as well as attending the various Regional & State championships, (not to mention the additional costs to the host organizations), I wonder about the cost/benefit to the governing body (SASS). Would the value of adding 1,000 new members to the rolls of SASS equate to even a 100 new entrants at large events... maybe just 10... 5... maybe only 2? Would the cost savings on ammo for shooting every monthly match available to me, exceed the cost of adding such firearms to my collection; AND include the cost to even attend one of these large, multi-day, prestigious matches? Frankly, I would postulate, not! I firmly believe that if your leisure-time monetary & time budget allows you to travel and compete in these events, you can afford centerfire ammo, whether you buy same or make your own. My personal, and long-standing feelings of the whole of the category question is that every call for a new category has been fueled by self-centered interests. Often felt by a large number of members... but self-serving, none-the-less. Not many here have seen the proliferation of categories from a real historical view... Well, I'll share this from my unofficial historical records. The first two EOTs, 11982 & 1983 had 2 categories, Male & Female. 1984 saw the addition of "Modern". 1986 had the "Blackpowder" category added. 1987 had "International" added. 1988 added "Traditional" 1989 the addition of "Junior" and "Senior". 1990 rang in Frontier Cartridge and the loss of the "Blackpowder" category. 1993 saw the addition of "Junior Girls" & "Duelist" to the list. 1994 added "Ladies Traditional" as a category. 1997 the "Frontiersman" category was added. 1998 was the first year for "Ladies B-Western", "Lady Duelist", "Lady Senior" & "Ladies International". 1999 is the 1st year I have a winner listed for "Gunfighter" & "Elder Statesman"; and the last year an "International" award was presented. 2001 added "Senior Duelist". 2003 had "49'er","Lady 49'er", "Ladies Gunfighter" & "Classic Cowboy" added. 2004 has the 1st listing for "Grande Dame". 2005 adds "Buckaroo", "Buckarette", "B-Western", "Classic Cowgirl", "Lady Frontier Cartridge", & Lady Frontrier Cartridge Duelist". 2007 added "Lady Senior Gunfighter" & Silver Senior Gunfighter". 2008 added "Silver Senior Frontier Cartridge Duelist", & was the last year "Modern" & "Traditional" in both men's and ladies categories were honored. Replaced in 2009 by "Lady Wrangler", & "Wrangler". From there on, it seems as tho' it's mostly age based divisions of shooting style, propellant, or costume categories. Remember, my list is "unofficial", and may contain some mistakes as shuffling around categories has created a couple of gaps that I've tried to fix to the best of my ability, but... Also note that a couple of category name changes have occured... and I've tried to keep my record in accordance with the latest category name. The early days (pre-1990) is largely based on the memory of a couple of shooters as actual records from then don't seem to exist. (If you find one an error, please let me know, as I'd like to have an accurate, if unofficial record). All the above to say... Adding a .22 caliber category to a shoot like EOT or Land Run is likely to ultimately add several divisions of style, costume, along with gender & age divisions that will become onerous to the parent and host organizations. Be (insert favored navel expletive here) happy if your local club allows you to shoot with your .22s! Methinks you doth ask too much.

Where'd ya go?

I've rarely bought two guns at the same time... I did when I bought two Pietta Patersons from EMF several years ago... I asked for consecutive numbers, but they didn't have any... instead I go XXX59 & XXX61. Close enough for me.

"No I ain't ready, but let'r rip when you are!"

That would handicap most '97 shooters. Only very few would be able to keep pace with a double shooter.

When I first started cowboy action shooting the rule prohibiting ejectors in tilt-action shotguns was in place. Everyone I saw shooting a mdl '97 for the first couple of years grabbed two, dopped one in the ejection port, slid the slide forward and stuffed the second in the bottom. The first person I saw loading both shells thru the port was Tequila... I think around 1988. And that quickly progressed to grab 3 or 4. The second person was Evil Roy in 1990 or '91. The side-x-side was pretty much the quicker option unless one mastered the 3 or 4 grab and slam fired the '97.. Ejectors would have just made it so one-sided as to be laughable. Certainly those shows were in their way into their 2nd or 3rd release by that time! * added for clarifying what history I'll discuss.

Btt... but... but... ain't they cool looking peeking out of a vest pocket? 😉

Myself... I would consider these as "sub-models", As sub brand might be like when Winchester made the Ted Williams line for Sears. Or like the Cadillac, Chevy Pontiac or Buick brands of General Motors. But, that's just my opinion... and we all know what those are.

I didn't use Steve's video on any of the 3 Rossis I have. But, then... I'm not sure it was available back in the late 1980s! But, the recommended techniques I was given by other shooters and developed on my own, are pretty close. Both of the .38/.357 carbines run either .38 Specials or 357s at speed. Both my wife & son used them when they were competing, and winning matches with them. The 45 Colt Short Rifle ain't quite as slick, but I didn't work on it quite as long either. And with 4 other 45 SASS rifles, not really needed for the game, it being more my hunting gun.

And... undoubtedly a lot more as you attend bigger matches with more side events that catch your fancy. Since starting cowboy action, I've acquired an 1886, a derringer (or 3), a Sharps, several pocket pistols, a couple other single shots, hammered & hammerless backup shotguns, 7 additional 1851s, at least 3 backup pistol caliber rifles among others. It's either guns, gunsmithing, reloading equipment & supplies or clothing... each keeps the pocketbook in a constant state of disrepair!

I have an AWA in .44-40 that I use in Wild Bunch... but since the targets are a bit farther than cowboy, I've never tried to see if it does slam fire.

I'm been using a Hornady 366 for the past 2 years to load my BP shotshells on. Once you get each station set up to perform, it does a remarkable job, my finished hulls look and function better than what I'd previously loaded on my MEC 600Jr. I still have that machine for those instances when I'm in the workshop and only want a round or two to test something... (new primer, different hull, wad, etc.) The only problem I've had on this "new-to-me" 366 is the auto advance. The "claw", or whatever that part is actually called, doesn't always return all the way to grab the shell plate. I haven't studied up on how to adjust its' travel, so it might just be a matter of adjustment, but if I watch for it, it's not a real hang-up. Again, once each station is occupied, one loaded, finished round per pull of the handle is far more productive than the 6 pulls per round of the MEC. My particular 336 doesn't have an easy method to shut off the primer feed, other than unscrewing it to raise it far enough so it doesn't drop a primer as the ram is raised. (Don't positively know that any do, but recently read that someone's does). I'm way past the point where I was about to give up in frustration, (coordinating all the hand movements, moving shells from the decap/sizer, to the moveable platten, replacing that shell with a fresh on, inserting a wad) and visually checking each station that its ready for the handle pull. While not much different to running a Dillon, just different enough that the learning curve was greater than I anticipated.