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Shooting Bull

Practice mistakes to avoid?

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Posted (edited)

I had an epiphany this morning.  (The light bulb finally came on. ;))  When practicing my shotgun loading and shucking I always do six.  That way I'm ready in case a stage calls for that many or in case I need to make up one.  After "firing" the last two I save time picking up my snap caps from the floor by simply dumping them into my hand and then put them in my belt.  

 

This morning's light bulb moment came when it occurred to me, that's not how I do it in a match. It then further occurred to me that one of the most common time wasters in my SASS career has been having to reshuck or finger pluck one of the last two empties before leaving the shotgun.  The final thought was that shucking and re-shouldering the shotgun to load new shells and shucking empties and laying the shotgun down are two entirely different motions.  I should practice both.  

 

That's the mistake I discovered in my practice routine.  Do you have any you've discovered over the years? 

Edited by Shooting Bull
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Your observations is on point.

 

When practicing with any gun, practice the complete operation.

From picking it up, firing and returning to the position you must leave it.

 

Remembering, "What you practice will be what you do on the clock."

 

You can catch the shotgun empty hulls if the shotgun is your last gun.

Other wise, let the hulls go to the ground and restage the shotgun. (then you're done)

 

 

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Howdy Bull.

I don't necessarily have any helpful advice but I can say the more you practice, the more apt you are to

discover such things that you recently thought.   Good job.

 

..........Widder

 

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2 hours ago, Cliff Hanger #3720LR said:

Your observations is on point.

 

When practicing with any gun, practice the complete operation.

From picking it up, firing and returning to the position you must leave it.

 

Remembering, "What you practice will be what you do on the clock."

 

You can catch the shotgun empty hulls if the shotgun is your last gun.

Other wise, let the hulls go to the ground and restage the shotgun. (then you're done)

 

 

Most important thing, make sure they are not LOADED ROUNDS....Unless your are practicing at a LIVE range....

 

Texas Lizard

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Practice?

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One will perform the way one practices.  Good practice, good performance.

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1 hour ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

I won't practice running :lol: :P

OLG 

 

 

 

78780962_2687814704610381_3920464521658892288_n.png.83853fe65d9329630400483460beb905 (1).png

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Posted (edited)

I practice transitions, holstering, pick ups (hey, baby - come here often?) and put downs (you're ugly - and your mother dresses you funny).

I practice stage analysis and attempting to find the best way to engage a stage when options are presented.

I practice my shotgun loading and rifle reloads.

I even "try" to practice movement to ensure I'm leading with the correct foot and ending at a given position in a shooting stance without shuffling (too much).

 

But "I" do not do any dry FIRE practice.  (it works for others - I cannot deny the practice - for others)

But I find that I (personally) lack the discipline to ensure sights are on target when dry firing.

I can practice lever movement or "Widder hummingbird thumbs" pistol cycling speed.

I can practice first shot (or as a gunfighter - first two shots) from holster speed.

But actually practicing trigger drop and aiming in dry fire mode without (the live fire) consequence for sloppiness - simply makes me sloppy.

 

Of course, as my recent performance with the nice folks in Price Utah can attest - I'm apparently pretty sloppy in live fire as well.

Edited by Creeker, SASS #43022
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23 minutes ago, Creeker, SASS #43022 said:

I practice transitions, holstering, pick ups (hey, baby - come here often?) and put downs (you're ugly - and your mother dresses you funny).

I practice stage analysis and attempting to find the best way to engage a stage when options are presented.

I practice my shotgun loading and rifle reloads.

I even "try" to practice movement to ensure I'm leading with the correct foot and ending at a given position in a shooting stance without shuffling (too much).

 

But "I" do not do any dry FIRE practice.  (it works for others - I cannot deny the practice - for others)

But I find that I (personally) lack the discipline to ensure sights are on target when dry firing.

I can practice lever movement or "Widder hummingbird thumbs" pistol cycling speed.

I can practice first shot (or as a gunfighter - first two shots) from holster speed.

But actually practicing trigger drop and aiming in dry fire mode without (the live fire) consequence for sloppiness - simply makes me sloppy.

 

Of course, as my recent performance with the nice folks in Price Utah can attest - I'm apparently pretty sloppy in live fire as well.

 

@Widder, SASS #59054 What the heck is "Widder hummingbird thumbs"?  Hopefully it's something that I can use to improve firing duelist.

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28 minutes ago, Tequila Shooter said:

 

@Widder, SASS #59054 What the heck is "Widder hummingbird thumbs"?  Hopefully it's something that I can use to improve firing duelist.

It's the ability to draw and dump 10 rnds, gunfighter, in less than 2 sec.

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1 hour ago, Yusta B. said:

It's the ability to draw and dump 10 rnds, gunfighter, in less than 2 sec.

 

I'd love to see that!  I think I've dodo bird thumbs :wacko: :lol:

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3 hours ago, Matthew Duncan said:

Practice?

Exxxxaaaaactly

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2 hours ago, Creeker, SASS #43022 said:

 

But "I" do not do any dry FIRE practice.  (it works for others - I cannot deny the practice - for others)

But I find that I (personally) lack the discipline to ensure sights are on target when dry firing.

 

 

Lately I’ve been debating the merits of my pistol dry fire practice for that exact reason. 

 

If I wasn’t so damn lazy I’d break out my laser dry fire system. Did I mention I’m lazy? :(

 

What I’ve been concentrating on most with pistols is picking up the sights quicker to speed up the first shot. Also firing the last shot and MOVE while re-bolstering. 

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2 minutes ago, Shooting Bull said:

 

Lately I’ve been debating the merits of my pistol dry fire practice for that exact reason. 

 

If I wasn’t so damn lazy I’d break out my laser dry fire system. Did I mention I’m lazy? :(

 

What I’ve been concentrating on most with pistols is picking up the sights quicker to speed up the first shot. Also firing the last shot and MOVE while re-bolstering. 

 

Yes - you'll cut more time with transitions & keeping both hands busy than you will shooting faster.

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Practicing.

 

That's the mistake you need to avoid:P

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There are supposedly documented episodes of officers [shooting revolvers] finding mty hulls in their pockets after a gunfight that they presumably put there unconsciously. Their normal range routine. Called muscle memory. What you train is what you do. My solution is that I just don’t train. At one time I did but at 69 my glory days are long over. Now it’s just for fun. 

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Dry fire works the best for me if it is mixed in with range time.   The bad part of dry firing is that you tend to only work on cycling and not keeping the guns on target.   A range day gets aiming and cycling working together.   The other thing to do is get some paper targets and shoot them.  I find occasionally  that I'm hitting the targets more towards one area instead of centered around the center.  I use 9" paper plates at 5 yards for pistols and 10 yards for rifles.   This let's me adjust the aiming area (it's really not a point) on the target to get the pattern centered.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, Null N. Void said:

Dry fire works the best for me if it is mixed in with range time.   The bad part of dry firing is that you tend to only work on cycling and not keeping the guns on target.   A range day gets aiming and cycling working together.   The other thing to do is get some paper targets and shoot them.  I find occasionally  that I'm hitting the targets more towards one area instead of centered around the center.  I use 9" paper plates at 5 yards for pistols and 10 yards for rifles.   This let's me adjust the aiming area (it's really not a point) on the target to get the pattern centered.

 

 

 

Howdy Null.

This process pretty much works good for me also.   But, I managed to FOCUS HARD on my SG targets in my dry fire sessions that

it started to help me during the match.

 

I was timing my dry fire sessions in order to give me a good idea what my live fire times 'should' be..... or even 'could' be.

Then I started live firing more often and it surpassed my dry fire times.

 

There is no doubt that dry firing can has it limitations in helping a shooter, but sometimes its our mental part, more than physical, that either propels

us to greater things or hinders us from higher achievements.

I never told myself that 'such n such' time was impossible.   Mentally, I knew I could 'turn n burn' and I kept up my Dry Fire and Live Fire

practice until I was achieving those goals.

 

There is some good sound advice on some post above.  Good Luck Bull.

 

..........Widder

 

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Once upon a time, a very long time ago, one of the few gunfighters at our club out west finished his stage when he drew both handguns, blazed away for ten shots, then with all the flash and flourish you would expect from a B Western movie hero, he twirled both guns on his trigger fingers right into leather.  It took him a second or two to realize he had completely destroyed the 170 rule and swept everybody behind him.  He took his penalty with grace and admitted that spinning his guns into leather was part of his practice routine.  Oops.

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19 hours ago, Shooting Bull said:

had an epiphany this morning.  (The light bulb finally came on. 

Must have been a ex-low Wattage bulb. 

 

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In one of my SASS-U classes the instructor advised never having live ammo in the room where you dry fire.  He also advised never using your pets as targets for dry fire practice.  There are probably some unfortunate experiences behind this advise.

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45 minutes ago, Hells Comin said:

Must have been a ex-low Wattage bulb. 

 

 

My alternate alias is DM Bulb :lol:

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I highly recommend that you train/practice the way you plan to shoot in a match and/or real life.

 

I always heard the stories, like the Police Officers with brass in their pocket and other incidents.

 

It really hit home one time years ago. 

 

I bought a Texas Star target to practice on and get good at.  I shot it the usual way by starting at the top and working my way around, got pretty good at it.  Then I decided to shoot one of the bottom targets, so it would spin more and therefore make it more difficult.  Wouldn't you know, the next time we had a TS in a match, I shot the bottom target first.  Soon as the shot went off I said, out loud even, "you dummy, shoot the top one first".  I still cleaned it, because I practiced at it, but after that day, I practice the way I plan to shoot.  I will occasionally shoot a different way, just for the experience, but make sure I finish up a couple more runs the proper way.

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21 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

I won't practice running :lol: :P

OLG 

 

I decided to take up running today.  Just a spur of the moment idea.

 

Man, those cops came out of nowhere! :D

 

Angus

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Someone on here needs to practice staying upright :ph34r:

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19 minutes ago, Hells Comin said:

Someone on here needs to practice staying upright :ph34r:

 

 

:ph34r:

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2 hours ago, Howlin Mad Murdock SASS #4037 said:

I bought a Texas Star target to practice on and get good at.  I shot it the usual way by starting at the top and working my way around, got pretty good at it.  Then I decided to shoot one of the bottom targets, so it would spin more and therefore make it more difficult.  Wouldn't you know, the next time we had a TS in a match, I shot the bottom target first.  Soon as the shot went off I said, out loud even, "you dummy, shoot the top one first".  I still cleaned it, because I practiced at it, but after that day, I practice the way I plan to shoot.  I will occasionally shoot a different way, just for the experience, but make sure I finish up a couple more runs the proper way.

Not so far in CAS matches I have shot but at several other modern gun matches, Texas Stars were expressly FORBIDDEN to start with the top target.  The faster shooters were doing it fast enough that there was never much movement so they mandated bottom shot first to accentuate motion.

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2 hours ago, Hells Comin said:

Someone on here needs to practice staying upright :ph34r:

 

Should Be a good idea for somedangbody we know.  :lol:

OLG 

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I have learned to have only one goal for each practice session.  Focus on that one thing alone, and when it’s achieved take a break.  If I have time and inclination, I may have more than one practice session in one day or one range trip, and then I can work on something else.  It may not be for everyone, but one “improvement” per session works best for me, rather than trying to work on everything at the same time.

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4 hours ago, The Verdigris Kid said:

Not so far in CAS matches I have shot but at several other modern gun matches, Texas Stars were expressly FORBIDDEN to start with the top target.  The faster shooters were doing it fast enough that there was never much movement so they mandated bottom shot first to accentuate motion.

Sounds a little weird to issue a mandate as to how a reactive target is shot but ok. Seems like someone has decided that the "fast" shooters need to be slowed down.

Haven't seen a texas star in a while but when they were around several years ago it was not uncommon to see the better shooters hit the top (slightly angled) target and then hit each subsequent target as it moved into the  3-4 o'clock position. If someone was unfamiliar with the process there were usually others that would fill them in.

there are ways to start bottom and hit in a slightly different order and the star will usually stop almost cold

Regards

 

:FlagAm: :FlagAm: :FlagAm:

 

Gateway Kid

 

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Practice mistakes to avoid?  There are a lot of 'em.  What you do in practice, you do in a match.  Keep that in mind.

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   A couple things to keep in mind that work for me: 

   Whether it's live fire range practice or dry fire at your man cave wall practice for transitions etc is to not overdo it. When I was training for a fight or a wrestling or boxing match, I would take 2 or 3 days off heavy practice just before the match. It helped to clear my head and allowed me to use muscle memory. With CAS, if I practice every day I tend to have a lot of brain farts. When I take a couple days off before, I have less and don't feel burned out. It took me a while to realize I was messing that up.

   Another thing that actually could be considered two separate items is knowing ITS WHAT YOU DO BETWEEN SHOTS that matters the most. That being said, it stands to reason to practice the most on what will help your times the MOST. That's transitions but also getting from one spot to the next. Some people move faster than others, that's a fact. However if it takes you 3 seconds to get from point A to point B and it only takes me 2 seconds but I also hesitate after my shot string for 1 second and it takes me an extra second to get set at my destination you've just beat me by 1 second by being smarter not necessarily faster. My point is, its not all about who can pull the trigger fastest so don't eat up your practice time pulling it.

Just my take on it.

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On 7/21/2020 at 7:29 PM, Shooting Bull said:

 

Lately I’ve been debating the merits of my pistol dry fire practice for that exact reason. 

 

If I wasn’t so damn lazy I’d break out my laser dry fire system. Did I mention I’m lazy? :(

 

What I’ve been concentrating on most with pistols is picking up the sights quicker to speed up the first shot. Also firing the last shot and MOVE while re-bolstering

There's the problem...

 

Practicing is a mistake that's easily avoided.  

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10 hours ago, Tennessee williams said:

    I also hesitate after my shot string for 1 second

 

As I mentioned earlier, that's one of the big things I've been working on.  MOVE after that last shot. Along with that I'm working on moving with purpose.  As has been very widely documented, I don't run.  But I do have long enough legs I can take a few steps and usually be where I need to be.  I noticed that sometimes I shuffle with little tiny steps and thus waste time.  I'm working on getting from A to B faster. 

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