Stumbling Bear Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Not new to SASS, but fairly new to the Wire, so excuse my ignorance about some things I see here that kinda concern me. To the point, why is it that there exists a seemingly "clandestine nature" that prevents most of us from knowing what's going on in certain privileged forums like the Territorial Governors and the RO III forum areas. I'm not saying that those of us who ain't a TG or RO III need to be able to contribute our drivel to the stuff going on there, but a "read-only" capability for the general population on this forum so we can at least see what they're up to sure would be nice. Seems that they have more secrets and hidden agendas here than the NSA. My daddy always taught me that "If what you're doing can't stand the light of day, then maybe you ought not be doing it." Not intending to conjure up a brush fire or political debate here, just curious about the supposed need for secrecy. Just what exactly goes on behind those "closed doors" so to speak that we aren't allowed to see. Are we not worthy of being informed of current issues and what's in the wind? After all, we are the ones "paying the freight" here by supporting SASS. "Nuff said, just my two cents worth. I'll probably catch an earful here, but so be it. I opened this can of worms, so I'll take what lambasting I get for attempting to gore an apparent sacred cow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother King, SASS #69031 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Your daddy didn't run a secret society with sacred cows, right? Just ignore the man behind the curtain. He is only here for your safety. Long guns to the unloading table please.... Shhhh.....my own theory is that they're closed b/c nothing...absolutely nothing is happening there and they don't want anyone to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
irish ike, SASS #43615 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 I'm not sure what you mean by ROIII. Unless you mean the guys with Black Badges who are certified to teach the RO1 and RO2. There isn't an ROIII forum that I know of. As to the TG forum, not much goes on there. But they do discuss what's the calls, and potential agenda items for the SASS Convention. Ask your TG whats going on. Ike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loophole LaRue, SASS #51438 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Bear: I'm not involved in either, but my suspicion would be that, at certain times, members of those groups need to be able to speak their minds and address controversial topics, without starting a firestorm of largely uninformed comments on the Wire or in the gossip mill. Sort of like an Executive Session in a political body or a closed door hearing - not hiding the truth, but rather trying to get to the heart of a matter without unnecessarily exposing innocents to public scorn or ridicule. Just a guess. LL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fillmore Coffins, SASS #7884 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 It takes enough of MY time to just keep up here. Fillmore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Slim SASS #24733 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 How would you like it if your boss had a camera guy following you around all day, recording everything you say and do. Sometimes you just need to have private conversations without the whole world knowing it and commenting on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rance - SASS # 54090 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 I reckon if we could "only read" those forums of which you speak.. There would be a whole bunch of threads started on this forum of their discussions.. Rance Thinkin' like Fillmore.. Hard enough ta keep this one straight Edit: Allie Mo wouldn't have enough time ta lock all the threads up.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stumbling Bear Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 Well, that's probably true to some extent, but then, isn't this organization supposed to be "about us" and our thoughts, ideas, etc., or did I miss something along the way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goody, SASS #26190 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Having been a TG for a number of years perhaps I can shed some light on why that section is private. Many would feel inhibited to speak their minds openly and honestly if it were available for the general membership to read. This is not to say that what is said is bad, it just doesn't need to be seen and talked about by the members at large until decisions are made. A rule change or proposed rule change will go through lots of changes before being made public. This would only serve to confuse some who might think that it goes into effect right away, only to be changed or voted on later. But I can promise that there is nothing sinister going on there, at least not in the 6 or 7 years that I was a TG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 TGs have a place to discuss potential changes without the clutter of folks chiming in and cluttering the conversation. Any TG vote is discussed openly prior to the vote and we all get a chance to voice an opinion. We also can tell our TG how we feel and try to convince him/her to vote our way. You think it's a bad thing? Tell your TG and they can discuss it (privately), and maybe bring it to a vote. CR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stumbling Bear Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 Thanks Goody and Cowboy Rick, Finally got a reasonable straight answer, which is all I was asking for to begin with. SB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boulder Canyon Bob# 32052L Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Not new to SASS, but fairly new to the Wire, so excuse my ignorance about some things I see here that kinda concern me. To the point, why is it that there exists a seemingly "clandestine nature" that prevents most of us from knowing what's going on in certain privileged forums like the Territorial Governors and the RO III forum areas. I'm not saying that those of us who ain't a TG or RO III need to be able to contribute our drivel to the stuff going on there, but a "read-only" capability for the general population on this forum so we can at least see what they're up to sure would be nice. Seems that they have more secrets and hidden agendas here than the NSA. My daddy always taught me that "If what you're doing can't stand the light of day, then maybe you ought not be doing it." Not intending to conjure up a brush fire or political debate here, just curious about the supposed need for secrecy. Just what exactly goes on behind those "closed doors" so to speak that we aren't allowed to see. Are we not worthy of being informed of current issues and what's in the wind? After all, we are the ones "paying the freight" here by supporting SASS. "Nuff said, just my two cents worth. I'll probably catch an earful here, but so be it. I opened this can of worms, so I'll take what lambasting I get for attempting to gore an apparent sacred cow. Maybe you should donate your time and money like those folks do and you too can be in the "secret societies" Being a TG is pretty much a thankless job, people you represent accuse you of taking bribes and making bad decisions when in fact they just represent the clubs they belong to. The WB and RO's villify them for not making new rules or categories when they just represent the clubs they belong to. They can't win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madd Mike #8595 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh free masons may be list-ning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Sage, SASS #49891 Life Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Having been a TG for a number of years perhaps I can shed some light on why that section is private. Many would feel inhibited to speak their minds openly and honestly if it were available for the general membership to read. This is not to say that what is said is bad, it just doesn't need to be seen and talked about by the members at large until decisions are made. A rule change or proposed rule change will go through lots of changes before being made public. This would only serve to confuse some who might think that it goes into effect right away, only to be changed or voted on later. But I can promise that there is nothing sinister going on there, at least not in the 6 or 7 years that I was a TG. Well a Read Only access wouldn't let anybody just "chime in". It would give the membership a little insight on how everything works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 It doesn't make or break my being a SASS member. TG's and RO leader's discussions/debates/inquiries/hammering outs don't need to be 'public' information. If you want in on the 'party' work hard to become one of them GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Come On Christmas Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Even with Masonry or the Order of the Arrow in the scouts. Once you know, ain't no big secret, just one you keep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustang Gregg Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 GG: Well put! MG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Hello Folks, Have you ever asked a question & felt like an idiot due to some of the replies to the thread. Well, that is not as common on the Private Forums. If everyone could see posts on them & start a thread on the "regular" Wire, you would lose that comfort. Regards, Allie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 You mean you don't know about the "secret" handshake? We could tell you about it, but then . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradoblackjack Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 looking in on the TG and RO Instructor wires would be like peeking into a Chinese restaurant kitchen...once you see what it looks like you never want Chinese food again. other than the nightly free food and drinks and the dancing girls there isn't much going on. I give important updates at our safety meetings and have time allotted at our monthly board meetings to keep everyone current about what is going on. cbj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madd Mike #8595 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 hand shake what all these years I was doing the secret kiss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anvil Al #59168 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Well a Read Only access wouldn't let anybody just "chime in". It would give the membership a little insight on how everything works. Somewhat thought that myself. Until I really thought about it. Then no. They need that place for just them to work on things without us peeling over there shoulder. If you really want to know. Just ask YOUR TG. If he can not give you a good answer. Maybe they need replacing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother King, SASS #69031 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 I'm telling you ... there is absolutely NOTHING going on over there... nothing... nada...zilch.... all the action is right here on the SASS WAHR. Until the SASS WAHR gets that poker hot and ready for a branding there is not a single thing over on TG Or ROIII worth a moment of anyone's time. THEN.... once they get hitched all up they get to the TG meeting and LO AND BEHOLD! Not much happens there either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spades Hanlin SASS#66204 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Area 51 was secret too till Widder Hill broke in and stole the green goo!!! Spades H... PS: Madd Mike :-:..._:-:..///...:-:.. or did you already hear that one LOLLOLLOL... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Bonney Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 You mean you don't know about the "secret" handshake? We could tell you about it, but then . . . . Just great LEP....what next give away the secret code word to get in to the secret clubhouse? BB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yul Lose Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 TG meetings are like sausage making, you don't want to know how it's made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FriscoCounty Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh free masons may be list-ning Shhhhhhhhhhhhhh We are. Check out Hiram's Rangers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 What was that phrase I read in a book somewhere? Mah Ha Bone? Remember, Area 51 is a hoax to protect the real secret, Area 52! (Bugs Bunny said so!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Checotah Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 To reaffirm what has been said, the private forums simply allow us to discuss, in mostly civil and objective terms, the various issues that surface either here or from our clubs. We have all seen how some posts here on the Wire get way out of hand and have to be shut down. You cannot make progress on any given topic if people continually disrupt by yelling their views, especially when those views are poorly informed or driven by some other agenda. Someone reads something they don't fully understand and jumps on here with a rant against that misperception, and, off we go again. Oh, Miss Allie ...come rescue the Wire again! And, for some time, other are correct: there really isn't anything of consequence going on. When there is, good TG's will bring the issue(s) to you for feedback. Funniest thing that happened locally a couple of years back: we had a shooter who was similarly suspicious of the TG Wire and all the mysterious decisions being made. He stepped up and became a TG, and was SO disappointed that truly was nothing happening... If it really bugs you, become a TG and join all the excitement! Or, become a Mason. 2B1 Ask1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shooting Bull Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 hand shake what all these years I was doing the secret kiss Which is bad enough on it's own, why you gotta go using tongue too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Dave Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Somewhat thought that myself. Until I really thought about it. Then no. They need that place for just them to work on things without us peeling over there shoulder. If you really want to know. Just ask YOUR TG. If he can not give you a good answer. Maybe they need replacing. +1 My TG is very good about making current topics of discussion known to the club and gets input to take back to the other TGs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Korupt Karl Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 Well a Read Only access wouldn't let anybody just "chime in". It would give the membership a little insight on how everything works. Yes, but it wouldn't stop TG's from being quoted on the wire as well as other discussions. As others have said, this is a forum where we can exchange ideas and hash out up coming "possible" rule changes. I'm also not sure if they could set it up for a read only for some and a participation for others. It's no big thing what goes on. As a TG my club members often ask what's going on and I'll tell them....and also I give their feedback on the TG wire as well when it effects a rule change or other item. KK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stumbling Bear Posted April 8, 2014 Author Share Posted April 8, 2014 OK Pards! I give up! Thanks to Miss Allie and those pards who gave good insight and reasons. I just had what I thought was a simple straight-forward question, but like a pack of wild dogs and wanna-be comedians, I see that a simple question meets primarily with abusive and non-productive responses by and large. My sincere thanks to all of you who answered my question in a reasonable fashion, and yes, now it makes sense. The rest of you wiseapples can take your sarcasm and venom and put it where, well, you know where... Might be a long time till I post anything else here if this is the "cowboy way"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Brules Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 SASS being a bit different than most of these "clubs" or unbrella organizations (it's a privately-owned company for the time being), things may be a bit more secretive at the "corporate" level. However, the clubs, which SASS relies on to exist, are, for the most part, non-profits. At the clubs, the TG's are elected by the membership, sometimes the position is seized by one of the clique that runs the club where elections are never held, or there's some other process to put someone in the position of TG. In my opinion, everything the TG's do should be transparent and should be published. While it's unimportant to know who picks their nose or passes gas in a TG meeting, minutes of meetings and teleconferences should be published, including the issues that each TG brings to the table, their arguements for their issues and their voting record. This would ensure that those club members, who the TG's represent, know whether the issues that are important to them (the membership) were introduced and argued "for" by their TG and that their TG voted appropriately. It would ensure that their TG doesn't make any back room deals, doesn't introduce, argue for and vote for their own agenda, rather that that raised by the club and that the TG actually is actively and proactively involved with the TG process and the meetings. If that already exists and is visible on the SASS website, then I don't know where it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Shoer 27979 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 TG meetings are like sausage making, you don't want to know how it's made. That's funny Yul, I am making 3 different kinds of sausage right now so I do know whats in them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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