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2 hours ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

he would refuse to start a shooter if they didn’t attempt the correct line because he felt that gave them a ‘competitive advantage.’

My eyes rolled so hard I may have injured them...

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Nobody ask, but here is my take on this 'remembrance 'P' penalty.

 

I don't get up on Saturday morning, travel anywhere from 1 or 2 hours

to enjoy the day with some friends in a 'SHOOTING' competition

just so somebody that aint got nothing better to do than hand out

20 second penalties for not remembering some phrase or line

that they made up.

 

Heck, at 72, I even forget my Bday sometimes and tell folks I'm

60 something.

I'll stay home before I let someone shove that in my face.

 

..........Widder

 

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How many more things can we come up with to scare people away?! Sometimes they whom wrote the line don't remember it. How does "shooter ready" compared to a different line create an advantage? Geez Louise.

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I have thought so hard about delivering the starting line correctly (or humorously) that I have screwed up the pattern.  I totally see how not saying the starting line could be a competitive advantage.  MDQ and a scarlet letter should be associated with their alias.  

Edited by July Smith
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2 hours ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

I’m lucky if I can remember what I had for dinner the night before. Not all MDs put the line where the shooter can see it like you do.

Well, they should. With firearm order and starting position if ya can get it all on there. Just helpin' the shooters.

If I take the time to write stages, print em, post em, and print the lines, I'd think trying to blurt out something other than "ready" isn't too much to ask. A "P" though is just silly.

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WyliefoxEsquire posted a list of what people said.  I like the list in that it's a good reference, but I'm gonna comment on a few of them.

 

Neon followers:  NO!  There should be no rule that requires people to modify a historic and possibly valuable firearm.

Stoke 98 &87  Long overdue.  Please do as soon as possible

Allow adjustable sights  Yes

Allow other pump shotguns  Yes!  At least the Burgess and the Spencer.   The 93 is also safe with short shells and black powder, just like an 87.  The Marlin...  The later members of that family may be all right, but I agree with whoever said you need to document it being safe.

Shoot and move:  Not high on my list, but I'd not object to it.

Multiple "P's" per stage  No

allow 22LR  Yes

Allow SxS ejectors  Yes!

Create Steampunk costume category:  No need.  It's at best a sub category of B Western, and it does not need defining.

Increase Classis Cowboy power factor.  No.

 

The ones I deleted, I have no opinion of.

 

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Less categories!  By less 50% would be a good start, let’s focus Gentlemen we only have 5 minutes!!!

 

I will start, as a freshly minted “Silver Senior” you can eliminate that… I got no problem competing with a 60 y.o. when I am 69 y.o.

 

Let’s make buckles meaningful again!!!

 

MBMA

 

 

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13 hours ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

 

It's NOT (at least in my copy of the current 2023 version)

Hey PWB hows about emailing me a copy of the ROIII 2023 version....make it an editable copy too....if I'm king I wanna write the "unwritten" rules in that version. B)

 

Kajun

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13 hours ago, Silver Creek Jack said:

Ok I admit I wasn’t around this sport in 2000, but please explain how the number of categories today has caused a decline in membership/ participation?

Might just be a coincidence., just like setting up big targets very close.

Things just seemed to get out of hand around 2008. MD's no longer used SASS recommendations for target size and placement, multiple hit target sequences, target arrays became closer together. All in order to make the game easier for those that were last to be picked for the kick ball team to receive an award. There was no need for short stroked guns when targets were spread out and a couple yards further out. Yeah, I've heard all the crap about that's what shooters want. It may have been a short term feel good fix for some. I don't think it's helped the growth of the game. 

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Somewhere I read about clubs not being required to hand out awards for categories with less than three participants.  I'd honestly prefer to simply see clubs follow that suggestion rather than feel obligated to hand out a bunch of awards for categories with one or two people in them.    

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18 minutes ago, Krazy Kajun said:

Hey PWB hows about emailing me a copy of the ROIII 2023 version....make it an editable copy too....if I'm king I wanna write the "unwritten" rules in that version. B)

 

Kajun

 

Best five minute segment yet!

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Ok, I don’t think my 5 minutes are up yet…

 

EOT/Land Run, Top Ten Buckles

 

MBMA

 

For categories with less than 20 (Twenty) you only EARN a buckle award for half the field, minus one.  

 

Examples-

 

16 the category- 7 buckles

8 in the category- 3 buckles

4 in the category- 2 buckles

 

I’d be ok with “rounding up” in the case of odd number in category, sort of…

 

ok, my 5 minutes are up.

 

 

 

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10 hours ago, Equanimous Phil said:

Oh, let's shoot airsoft guns then, no wear at all anymore! :D Or paintballs for easy spotting, chose your color wisely ;)

 

The purpose of increasing PF in CAS or at least in some categories is - and that's just my opinion - making it a shooting sport rather than an oversized carnival shooting gallery. Steel targets are also used in other shooting sports, some even with FMJ bullets, for comparison: SASS WBAS (PF 150), USPSA (PF 125 / 165), IPSC (PF 125 to 170)

Well by all means, lets not insult your sensibilities.

 

How many sheets of steel have you purchased for your clubs??? What experience do you have with clubs that are on a shoestring budget? 

 

And lastly, why compare to those shooting sports? Do they have a large population of older folks? Do they have a large population of lady shooters? Do they dress up in costumes? Or are they just used to compare because they shoot firearms? That's grounds for comparison????

 

Stop beating your chest.

 

Phantom

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Would be nice if there was some way to have ONLINE RO courses.We have no instructors in New Mexico & a lot of our shooter do not travel much.Ive been to a few shoots but no courses..

                                                                                                                           Largo

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3 hours ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said:

Nobody ask, but here is my take on this 'remembrance 'P' penalty.

 

I don't get up on Saturday morning, travel anywhere from 1 or 2 hours

to enjoy the day with some friends in a 'SHOOTING' competition

just so somebody that aint got nothing better to do than hand out

20 second penalties for not remembering some phrase or line

that they made up.

 

Heck, at 72, I even forget my Bday sometimes and tell folks I'm

60 something.

I'll stay home before I let someone shove that in my face.

 

..........Widder

 

Worth repeating! ;)

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23 minutes ago, largo casey #19191 said:

Would be nice if there was some way to have ONLINE RO courses.We have no instructors in New Mexico & a lot of our shooter do not travel much.Ive been to a few shoots but no courses..

                                                                                                                           Largo

I've had this problem too. All the courses I hear about are 1000+ miles away. 

 

Our local MD finally got one setup in December for us, but I think it took him 2 to 3 years to get that arranged.

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I would see that RO1 and RO2 classes were available on line.

There aren't many opportunities  out here in the west to get certified as an RO. Lots of people would like to take the classes without having to travel so far out of state.

Just my 2 cents.

Choctaw

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4 hours ago, Krazy Kajun said:

Hey PWB hows about emailing me a copy of the ROIII 2023 version....make it an editable copy too....if I'm king I wanna write the "unwritten" rules in that version. B)

 

Kajun

Either you have the ROIII manual imprinted in your DNA, or you don't.  No amount of writing it down will help.  For basically, all you need to know is that it consists of knowledge that is derived from Uncommon Good Sense.  

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3 hours ago, largo casey #19191 said:

Would be nice if there was some way to have ONLINE RO courses.We have no instructors in New Mexico & a lot of our shooter do not travel much.Ive been to a few shoots but no courses..

                                                                                                                           Largo

2 hours ago, Idaho Gunslinger said:

I've had this problem too. All the courses I hear about are 1000+ miles away. 

 

Our local MD finally got one setup in December for us, but I think it took him 2 to 3 years to get that arranged.

 

2 hours ago, Choctaw Jack said:

I would see that RO1 and RO2 classes were available on line.

There aren't many opportunities  out here in the west to get certified as an RO. Lots of people would like to take the classes without having to travel so far out of state.

Just my 2 cents.

Choctaw

I started shooting CAS out at Cota De Caza in So Cal in 1985.  Sometime in early 1986 someone handed me the timer (stopwatch) and said, "...time to learn how to do this."    Down load the course material and run thru it with the Handbook in hand and like Phantom said, "...work it out!"  It ain't rocket science.  Taking the courses with an instructor doesn't "certify" you to be an TO.  For some folks could take the courses hundreds of time and still never be a good TO.  Others have never had a course and are excellent TOs, (fewer nowadays).  

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Sometimes I'm sorry that I post on some of these Discussions.

                                                                                                                Largo

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8 minutes ago, largo casey #19191 said:

Sometimes I'm sorry that I post on some of these Discussions.

                                                                                                                Largo

Why????

 

What's wrong with getting thoughts out and...heaven forbid...have a debate?

 

I was having a nice talk with China Camp (my mentor), about me getting my ROI pin about 20 years ago. He looked at me and ask what RO pin he had. I just looked at him kinda...lost like...and he said he didn't have an RO pin. He ran Posses at EOT and WR for many years and was perhaps the best PM/RO/TO that I've ever met.

 

And then I've met folks with ROII pins that have their heads up their...don't know squat...can't run a posse to save their lives...oh, but they DO have an ROII pin.

 

Oy...

Phantom

Edited by Phantom, SASS #54973
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13 minutes ago, largo casey #19191 said:

Sometimes I'm sorry that I post on some of these Discussions.

                                                                                                                Largo

 

Don't feel to bad....... Sometime EVERYONE is sorry that I posted

on some of these discussions..... ;)

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7 hours ago, Eyesa Horg said:

How many more things can we come up with to scare people away?! Sometimes they whom wrote the line don't remember it. How does "shooter ready" compared to a different line create an advantage? Geez Louise.

I've had a very good local shooter (who used to say the line) tell me that he was told by another shooter that having to remember and say a start line kept you from thinking about the shooting sequence.  And that's why AT LEAST SOME shooter's always just say something like, "Ready."  So, at least some out there THINK it is an advantage.  However, I am of the opinion it doesn't create an advantage and perhaps only detracts from THAT shooter's stage experience.  That said, I am strongly against penalizing a shooter for not saying the written start line.

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Post a long list of memorable lines from Western movies, and conduct a poll save the top 50 for use as opening line.  Who is going to forget "You gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?' and similar.

Edited by Rip Snorter
Typo
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Once upon a time a man (SASS # 5XXX)  and his wife, with the help of CAS friends, built a cowboy town/range on their farm and hosted a monthly match (WASA rules).   

 

Every match was like chapters in a western novel.  The story line from stage-to-stage was intertwined and always culminated on a "final showdown" with the bad guys for the last stage.  

 

Those matches were, bar none, the most fun I've ever had in this CAS game.

 

The start lines were never complicated or long, but if you did not say it... no beep.

 

I can hear the roosters crowing now.  "Wahl, by god! I'd never shoot there again!"  That's fine.  You would have never been invited to shoot there.

 

Now back to the program...

 

 

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1 hour ago, largo casey #19191 said:

Sometimes I'm sorry that I post on some of these Discussions.

                                                                                                                Largo

Don't be! I think everybody has something to add, even if others don't agree. That's just the way folks are. You'd be surprised how many agree and I suppose by responses I've gotten, some don't. But hey, this is the Saloon! Pull up to fire and have a conversation with great folks, nobody ever said we have to agree with every statement presented.

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3 minutes ago, Stump Water said:

You would have never been invited to shoot there.

What?

 

An invitation only match?

 

:mellow:

 

And this is not in response to your post. But isn't it interesting how some folks want others to play the game the way They want it played (rhetorical question;)).

 

Phantom

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