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Wild Horse John

Reloading technique for a 73

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This is a thread started on Facebook...let's see if the wire discussion gets more interesting...

 

Hello

Question to discuss.

Reload over the top or through the gate with the -73???

In my opinion, over the top is faster, but more can go wrong.

Through the gate is safer, but little slower.

I have always done the reloads over the top, and in this video I'm shooting the shot off agains the second overall winner Austin Black at Border town.

We are so equal, that up to the last rifle shot we pick the reloads at the exactly same time, but after the reload I'm ahead and winning the shootout against Austin Black.

Those of you whom load through the gate, do you still believe that is better after seeing this video??

Personally I'm surprised what a different a split second does!!

Ray Heartless

https://youtu.be/WTdSPcYToac

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I have seen people mess up both methods with probably the same frequency. If both are done correctly, in the top is much faster.

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I prefer over the top but you got to remember its much simplified if your reload is shorter that your regular rifle ammo. My .38 rifle ammo is 1.500 but my reload off the belt is 1.355

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I have been practicing over the top, but I am still a bit fumble fingered with it, so for now, I play the safe route and go through the side when it counts

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I have seen people mess up both methods with probably the same frequency. If both are done correctly, in the top is much faster.

I agree. It takes practice, lots of practice for either method.

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I am not fast anyway but when I had my right shoulder worked on I could not hold my rifle up with my right arm.I started loading over the top.If a person took a tape and got someone to measure how far his left hand had to move when loading through the gate and then open and close, fire and open to lay the rifle down.Then measure how far your right hand move when loading in the top,close,fire and open to lay down.You will see that it would be impossible to load through the gate as fast as you can load in the top.I have see some cowboy work on loading in the top and say that it is faster but when they are shooting in a match they go back to loading through the gate.I never could load through the gate and I watched Long Hunter load through the top while I was waiting for my shoulder to heal.Like said above I made up some 1.33 OAL rounds for reloads.

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I have seen people mess up both methods with probably the same frequency. If both are done correctly, in the top is much faster.

Plus it helps if you can get the ammo out of your belt and to the gun faster than the other guy

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For years I have used the through the gate method, loading with my left hand as taught to me by the Dooly Gang. For some strange reason, the other day., I loaded through the gate with my right hand keeping the gun on my shoulder. For me, it was very smooth and fast.

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For years I have used the through the gate method, loading with my left hand as taught to me by the Dooly Gang. For some strange reason, the other day., I loaded through the gate with my right hand keeping the gun on my shoulder. For me, it was very smooth and fast.

Works fine as long as the lever stays up

 

CR

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For years I have used the through the gate method, loading with my left hand as taught to me by the Dooly Gang. For some strange reason, the other day., I loaded through the gate with my right hand keeping the gun on my shoulder. For me, it was very smooth and fast.

Sassy, from the git-go started the reload thru gate with right as left steadied the 73 to shoulder. Her learn was something she picked up by accidental need at one of her very first matches. I was busy as TO and saw that the stage called for reload and I knew that had not been discussed by myself or Non Stop in her very few lessons. However, while at loading table she just turned to another loader, Ruidosa, and asks what to do....bingo, she did it well, including a "jack out" recovery on same stage. It has worked for her since.

 

I still use the method of continuing the hold in right hand and feeding cartridge thru gate with left. As Dee pointed out, one must practice, I do and believe my method works best for me and is competitive against most. As Smokestack mentioned, both methods get their share of fumbles. I like to watch a smooth over the top onto carrier load, but think it works best for those who have the proper reach and flexibility in shoulders, of which, we all do not possess.

 

It might should be mentioned that the load over top onto carrier is facilitated if the top "sharper, center points" on carrier are honed down a tad so cartridge slides into chamber easily when lever is closed. Option helps to avoid the "stove pipe" incident with round standing up in front of carrier.

 

IMO, one is competitive when the reload can be loaded and fired in under three....the more under three, the more competitive. Of course, knowing the reload is coming is one thing, mastering it because of "jack out" requires more practice due to involvement of mental quickness. Just the "Oh S__t" thought cost you a fraction.

 

Good post John.

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I reload through the gate with my left hand, works well if I do my job. I learned it from Buck Dodgers.

 

Randy

How do you reload through the gate with your left hand? Are you canting the rifle to the left, or coming up from the bottom? I would love to see a video of this.

 

As for loading over the top on the carrier, is this something that can be done with large calibers? I am sure it can, but effectively? Or is it a small caliber option only?

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How do you reload through the gate with your left hand? Are you canting the rifle to the left, or coming up from the bottom? I would love to see a video of this.

 

As for loading over the top on the carrier, is this something that can be done with large calibers? I am sure it can, but effectively? Or is it a small caliber option only?

Look for a video of T-Bone Dooley. Basically the rifle is tilted to the left and the round is pressed straight down into the loading port. The trough in the loading gate forces the nose of the bullet into the carrier.

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How do you reload through the gate with your left hand? Are you canting the rifle to the left, or coming up from the bottom? I would love to see a video of this.

 

As for loading over the top on the carrier, is this something that can be done with large calibers? I am sure it can, but effectively? Or is it a small caliber option only?

https://youtu.be/89n-51foFqI

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Look for a video of T-Bone Dooley. Basically the rifle is tilted to the left and the round is pressed straight down into the loading port. The trough in the loading gate forces the nose of the bullet into the carrier.

 

 

Cool. Thanks for sharing.

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I load the extra from the top on my '66 and '73.

It took some playing around with the dummy rounds, lever position/firing pin & rod to develop some muscle memory to do it correctly but once learned, it's faster.

(Not that it really matters with my normal times!☺)

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Redwood

 

Reload is at like the 18 sec Mark

https://youtu.be/pdzD351rcO0

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I prefer over the top but you got to remember its much simplified if your reload is shorter that your regular rifle ammo. My .38 rifle ammo is 1.500 but my reload off the belt is 1.355

Yep, for me over the top with a short round is the quickest... I use .38 Long Colts for my reloads.

 

Practice makes Perfect.

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I loaded original 73s and 92s, plus a Marlin 1894, a Rossi 92 and several Uberti 73s thru the gate. I like to shoot different guns, so the gate was a common process.

My main rifle is now a Uberti 1860 Henry. I ain't found the gate yet so I am settling in on over the top.

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Since I shoot lefty I load Thur the gate with my right I can watch it in then lever and fire I'm not fast anyway

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How do you reload through the gate with your left hand? Are you canting the rifle to the left, or coming up from the bottom? I would love to see a video of this.

 

As for loading over the top on the carrier, is this something that can be done with large calibers? I am sure it can, but effectively? Or is it a small caliber option only?

This video is bad but it shows Buck with a reload.

 

https://youtu.be/k5Pw3S3wWmw?list=PL7A1C5D7BA0DCA6F4

 

Thanks

Randy

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Sassy, from the git-go started the reload thru gate with right as left steadied the 73 to shoulder. Her learn was something she picked up by accidental need at one of her very first matches. I was busy as TO and saw that the stage called for reload and I knew that had not been discussed by myself or Non Stop in her very few lessons. However, while at loading table she just turned to another loader, Ruidosa, and asks what to do....bingo, she did it well, including a "jack out" recovery on same stage. It has worked for her since.

 

I still use the method of continuing the hold in right hand and feeding cartridge thru gate with left. As Dee pointed out, one must practice, I do and believe my method works best for me and is competitive against most. As Smokestack mentioned, both methods get their share of fumbles. I like to watch a smooth over the top onto carrier load, but think it works best for those who have the proper reach and flexibility in shoulders, of which, we all do not possess.

 

It might should be mentioned that the load over top onto carrier is facilitated if the top "sharper, center points" on carrier are honed down a tad so cartridge slides into chamber easily when lever is closed. Option helps to avoid the "stove pipe" incident with round standing up in front of carrier.

 

IMO, one is competitive when the reload can be loaded and fired in under three....the more under three, the more competitive. Of course, knowing the reload is coming is one thing, mastering it because of "jack out" requires more practice due to involvement of mental quickness. Just the "Oh S__t" thought cost you a fraction.

 

Good post John.

Just wonder how good she could do with good teachers, but she hangs out with you and Non Stop.....😝

Knowing the reload is coming does help. Knowing when you accidentally jack one out helps in your mental state to make said reload easy.

I've been able to keep a reload just at 2 seconds. Occasionally just under.

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Just wonder how good she could do with good teachers, but she hangs out with you and Non Stop.....

Knowing the reload is coming does help. Knowing when you accidentally jack one out helps in your mental state to make said reload easy.

I've been able to keep a reload just at 2 seconds. Occasionally just under.

Under two seconds on reload is definably at top end of competitive…IMHO. Oh, but the speed of the younger set….not that you are that much younger than I, but certainly younger. Ha. I do have great consolation in knowing that just a small part of your CAS “spawning” came from the likes of Ol’BB. (gloat)

 

Interesting, an much to her credit, that Sassy learned the reload thing purely by accident (desperation at loading table before the need) and something NS or I had never gave mention to as she was so new in the game. I am really proud of how she learned the reload, and for someone who rarely has time to practice, how well she uses her technique, even in a jack-out situation.

 

Perhaps an hour after we got married, and minutes after Non Stop strapped a pair of single actions and a shotgun belt on Sassy (her first), he (Non Stop), her immediately acquired cowboy action instructor officially appointed by me….told her not to listen to anything I told her. Ha. Well, he paused and gave permission in regards to shotgun and rifle…..of course, not revolvers…me being such a die-hard duelist. So, does this mean I can blame NS for any negatives? Hey, I know you love us, brother.

 

I have learned or perhaps “relearned” from this thread. Watching Goody’s posted utube video of LH’s demonstrations, I was reminded that I am moving the butt stock away from my shoulder in my reload. I need to get more flexible and practice not doing that. Although my reload is of decent speed, bet I can improve by not letting 73 butt get away from the shoulder. Heck, I actually bring it down to about elbow height. Although I would not mind learning one of the other methods, I know that just improving my method of so many years will be difficult in itself. Ya know the saying about teaching an OLD dog new tricks……well I figure getting this OLD dog to improve an old trick may be a challenge enough.

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Yep, for me over the top with a short round is the quickest... I use .38 Long Colts for my reloads.

 

Practice makes Perfect.

Guess now I have an idea where that 38 Long brass is coming from in my reloading.

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Tried the over the top method today.. I think I'm switching much faster!

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I like over the top method and practice it often. I have never done that in a match. I use the most positive method that works 98% of the time for me.Make your seed up in transitions and your times down by NOT having a P or miss.

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I find over the top the most unreliable method, see many a cowboy botch it up many times.

Besides if you have to load more than one, it's way way slower going back to the belt twice.

I prefer the safe style off through the gate, rifle still in shoulder slightly tilted left to see the gate. If you know you have to reload you can be ready for it, leave the lever shut go straight in, also I can load two that way too, going to the belt once grabbing two rounds, far quicker. Also like TBones way of loading with the weak hand rifle 90 degs left, butt under your elbow, round vertical into the gate, tried that a few times but distance travel with the loading hand is greater than with the strong hand, and besides you have to reshoulder the gun..again.

Got my reloading time down to around 2.5 sec and under now. Best thing now is to bring that time down to zero.......by not jacking any out. LOL

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I prefer over the top but you got to remember its much simplified if your reload is shorter that your regular rifle ammo. My .38 rifle ammo is 1.500 but my reload off the belt is 1.355

For the match this past Saturday, I loaded my belt with shorter rounds for reloads. As luck would have I got a chance to test this idea. All went well over the top. Because I do shoot an 87 shotgun from time to time the over the top technique feels a little more natural. The shorter length cartridges reduce the fumble factor.

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For the match this past Saturday, I loaded my belt with shorter rounds for reloads. As luck would have I got a chance to test this idea. All went well over the top. Because I do shoot an 87 shotgun from time to time the over the top technique feels a little more natural. The shorter length cartridges reduce the fumble factor.

That is an interesting thought my friend. Since recently, I switched reloaders and as a result have rounds in every length from 1.42 to 1.6 something. No quality control...LOL.I think I will try your technique and keep the shorties for that occasional "in the filed" reload

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I had never loaded my 73 over the top before. Last match I decided to try it, without even practicing. I had already prepared the lifters in my 73s to do this (2 minute job) but never tried it. This match had you shooting 10 rounds then moving three times and loading/firing one from three different positions. Gosh that is easy and a lot faster. Your normal instinct is to leave the lever open after the last round and loading from the side requires a closed lever, not natural after several years of shooting.

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I spent a considerable amount of time practicing the over the top method yesterday, using a timer. Way too many times the lever moves just a little, & of course then I have a train wreck. My best time was thru the gate at 3.5 seconds. I know that's not fast, but it's the safest method for me.

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I spent a considerable amount of time practicing the over the top method yesterday, using a timer. Way too many times the lever moves just a little, & of course then I have a train wreck. My best time was thru the gate at 3.5 seconds. I know that's not fast, but it's the safest method for me.

 

I think 3.5sec is plenty fast enough.

 

In the case of jacked out rounds then;

If you can consistently do it by any method in under 5sec, then it is worth doing. If not; then taking the miss is the better option. (ignoring the desire for a clean match) If you find you're having to do this often, then you need to identify why you're jacking rounds and fix that!

 

In the case of mandatory reloads e.g. bonus targets;

The most 'lost time' I see is due to: 1. shooters having to search themselves for their ammo. or, 2. Having to be reminded by the T.O. to do the reload as their trying to discard the rifle.

 

The method you can perform consistently and on demand is much preferred over any other way that you can do it faster occasionally.

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I spent a considerable amount of time practicing the over the top method yesterday, using a timer. Way too many times the lever moves just a little, & of course then I have a train wreck. My best time was thru the gate at 3.5 seconds. I know that's not fast, but it's the safest method for me.

Whats the length of your cartridges that you were using for the over the top method? Has the sharp cornered area on your carrier been relieved?

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Success with any technique for our game is not about what you can do once, but you can do ten times in a row. When deciding on a method set a par time on your timer, come up with a goal or time you want to be at and try that technique with dummies for several runs.I like to start aimed and cocked dropping the hammer on the beep to replicate more of a match scenario. When under stress our mind is going to revert to muscle memory and what ever you have practiced. Breaking 1.75 for weak hand over the top with either a 73' or Marlin is very repeatable for me,but only after practice.

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I loaded original 73s and 92s, plus a Marlin 1894, a Rossi 92 and several Uberti 73s thru the gate. I like to shoot different guns, so the gate was a common process.

My main rifle is now a Uberti 1860 Henry. I ain't found the gate yet so I am settling in on over the top.[/quote

 

Never gave that a thought 😳

I load through the gate too but I now have a 1860 and never gave a reload a thought 😱

I better play with that a little .

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