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Null N. Void

Corona Virus and Matches

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The Ides of March in Florida is next week.  I'm 67.  The CDC is recommending I don't travel to these type of events.  Where is the Organization at on running these events?  I'd love to shoot them, but maybe they should be rescheduled.

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I would not think an outdoor event would be a high risk situation. BUT I know nothing of such virus's. I Would go if I was entered,

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I'm not changing my habits.   But I'll only "swap spit" with one other shooter.  :lol:

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My personal option: SASS is not a public health organization and should defer to local health authorities regarding whether events should be held.  I am registered for two events in April and will attend unless match organizers cancel them.  I think outdoor events are safer than indoor events as wind currents will disperse virus droplets more quickly outside.  I intend to continue participating in matches but am dropping indoor events for the immediate future.

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For this one, it's a little too late. You're not gonna get a refund for the match, hotel or travel (if it is a commercial carrier).  I'm going to go, but won't be shaking hands, hugging the ladies (that's are tough one), going to crowded restaurants or getting close to people. It really wouldn't matter, to me, if it was the Covid or Flu....I just probably wouldn't survive another respiratory event like I had in October. You'll have to forgive me if I don't shake hands with anyone and maintain my distance from you and everyone else.

 

I'm going, but I would understand if some folks didn't.

 

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My main concern is at the motel/hotel more than at the match 

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Come on, people!  Symptoms are like the common cold and a 103-yr-old Chinese lady survived it.  Do not buy into the media hype.

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17 minutes ago, MizPete said:

Come on, people!  Symptoms are like the common cold and a 103-yr-old Chinese lady survived it.  Do not buy into the media hype.

Sypmtoms are more flu like.  Covid 19 is a corona virus and related to SARS.

The R0, pronounced R naught, which indicates the rate of infectivity is around 1.3 for influrnza A and B.  For Covid 19 it is around 2.3 to 3.1.  Basically an infected individual infects 1.3 avg other for influenza A and B, Covid 2 to 3 people.

The death rate from influenza after years of study hovers around 0.1%.

Death rates so far from Covid 19 is running about 2%. However it is very skewed in its age cohort data from WHO shows that individuals over 70 it is around 8%. 

Panic no, but also realize this pandemic is just starting and taking precautions is wise.

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25 minutes ago, MizPete said:

Come on, people!  Symptoms are like the common cold and a 103-yr-old Chinese lady survived it.  Do not buy into the media hype.

 

Perhaps you'd like to go to the nearest large airport and shake hand with the first 100 people you meet. What the heck, it's just a common cold. 

 

I don't buy into the "media hype". I'm also not going to risk another 9 days in the hospital or 2 weeks in lock down.  So go on down to the airport and shake a few hands, come back and post in three weeks, tell me how it went.

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What I have read is that events of 5000 or more should consider cancelling.  

Use common sense and an extraordinary amount of hygiene  (hand wipes, wash your hands thoroughly,  etc). 

 

Good luck, 

BS

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2 hours ago, Null N. Void said:

The Ides of March in Florida is next week.  I'm 67.  The CDC is recommending I don't travel to these type of events.  Where is the Organization at on running these events?  I'd love to shoot them, but maybe they should be rescheduled.

 

Good grief :rolleyes: you have a much higher chance of being in a car crash because of a drunk driver, than getting that 'bug'.

OLG 

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23 minutes ago, LostVaquero said:

Sypmtoms are more flu like.  Covid 19 is a corona virus and related to SARS.

The R0, pronounced R naught, which indicates the rate of infectivity is around 1.3 for influrnza A and B.  For Covid 19 it is around 2.3 to 3.1.  Basically an infected individual infects 1.3 avg other for influenza A and B, Covid 2 to 3 people.

The death rate from influenza after years of study hovers around 0.1%.

Death rates so far from Covid 19 is running about 2%. However it is very skewed in its age cohort data from WHO shows that individuals over 70 it is around 8%. 

Panic no, but also realize this pandemic is just starting and taking precautions is wise.

Kinda where I'm at.  I'd hate to loose my match fees and other associated $, but this is worse than the flu both from the death rate and the ease of transmission.  The NCAA will play the rest of the tournament without spectators.  It makes one think about traveling, hotels, restaurants and banquets.  If a couple of months of delay could be worked out, that might be best.  If it appears to be getting worse and I'm in the defined risk group, I'll probably have to pass.

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I’m seriously considering staying home. This virus is dangerous, not like the flu or a common cold. It’s break my heart to make the decision not to go south, but I’ve got elderly parents 81, 90, & 97 years of age that I prefer not to bring anything back home to. Plus, I’ve lived for awhile with a weakened immune system. Do your research folks. This was supposed to be my year to redefine myself since Hollywood Dave’s death, maybe I’m just not up to the task yet. Best wishes to each of you no matter what you decide or believe:FlagAm:.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, MizPete said:

Come on, people!  Symptoms are like the common cold and a 103-yr-old Chinese lady survived it.  Do not buy into the media hype.

You could regret discouraging your friends from taking due caution, before this is done.  COVID-19 is in its infancy as a communicable disease and today, the WHO has declared it a pandemic.  Neither you nor me, nor anyone else really knows how broadly and rapidly it will spread, once a substantial number of infected people are out there circulating through communities. 

 

 As yet it has not reached that point, but the number of new verified infections increases each day, and their individual spheres of contacts, prior to knowing they are infected, is literally dendritic and exponential. 

 

Further, as hospital Intensive Care Units get filled up with COVID-19 patients,  many people with unrelated illnesses, such as cardiac events or even simpler things like burst appendix, will die from their illness, due to unavailability of an ICU unit, or equipment nonavailability--things like respirators.   

 

We're hearing several different now-heavily-politicized versions of what is really happening.  And again, nobody really knows, as yet. But make no mistake about it, the virus is very highly contagious, very prone to quickly invade the lungs and deep respiratory system, and it is killing a very large number of very real people.  

 

As for me, I have temporarily  restricted many of my former group contact activities.  I'm still shooting outdoor matches, but avoiding close gatherings, like match associated banquets and ceremonies.  I am advising my friends to exercise maximum caution and prioritize isolation insomuch as possible.  Caution is clearly indicated, no matter whose politicized version of the disease risk you listen to and choose to believe. 

 

With regard to matches, I just don't think we have enough information yet to guide our decisions, but we will soon.  Our club has an annual match in mid April.  If the medical advice at that time is not to assemble large crowds, then I have no doubt that we will follow that guidance, and offer whatever refund options we can come up with. 

 

Anyone who thinks COVID-19 infection  cannot happen to them is showing ignorance of principles of public health medicine and infectious disease.   It is real, and it certainly can change peoples' lives. 

The risks are significant, as compared to those associated with temporary curtailment of part of our recreation.. 

Edited by Dusty Devil Dale
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From University of Chicago:

How does the COVID-19 spread?

This virus is really transmissible and can spread easily from person to person even before a person develops symptoms. It’s carried on respiratory droplets when we talk, sneeze, and cough and these can land on surfaces or in someone’s mouth or nose.  When it comes to respiratory droplets, 6 feet is the magic distance. That’s how far these tiny, infected droplets can travel.  Being within 6 feet of someone who is sick can get you or your personal space contaminated with COVID-19.  

When droplets land on surfaces, we can pick them up with our hands and transfer them to our eyes, mouth, and nose when we touch our faces. This is why hand hygiene is so important.  Respiratory secretions (like snot and sputum) are also infectious so cover your coughs and sneezes.

 

Looks like I'm safe when shooting since no one comes closer than 6' when I'm shooting FCD. Just ordered more 2F from Graf's (free hazmat)

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3 hours ago, Warden Callaway said:

I'm not changing my habits.   But I'll only "swap spit" with one other shooter.  :lol:

DITTO!

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27 minutes ago, Trooper Ozzy said:

From University of Chicago:

How does the COVID-19 spread?

This virus is really transmissible and can spread easily from person to person even before a person develops symptoms. It’s carried on respiratory droplets when we talk, sneeze, and cough and these can land on surfaces or in someone’s mouth or nose.  When it comes to respiratory droplets, 6 feet is the magic distance. That’s how far these tiny, infected droplets can travel.  Being within 6 feet of someone who is sick can get you or your personal space contaminated with COVID-19.  

When droplets land on surfaces, we can pick them up with our hands and transfer them to our eyes, mouth, and nose when we touch our faces. This is why hand hygiene is so important.  Respiratory secretions (like snot and sputum) are also infectious so cover your coughs and sneezes.

 

Looks like I'm safe when shooting since no one comes closer than 6' when I'm shooting FCD. Just ordered more 2F from Graf's (free hazmat)

 

To be on the safe side, don't take a bath or change cloths for a week!:rolleyes:

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In real life I'm a Respiratory Therapist. IMHO if you are any age and have under lying medical conditions. (COPD, Emphysema, Asthma, Kidney or heart disease) I would think about staying home. If you are over 70 in good health I would think about staying home. If you are under 70 and in good health, go but practice good hand washing and take bottles of hand sanitizer along. After this passes there will be other shoots. 

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1 hour ago, LostVaquero said:

Sypmtoms are more flu like.  Covid 19 is a corona virus and related to SARS.

The R0, pronounced R naught, which indicates the rate of infectivity is around 1.3 for influrnza A and B.  For Covid 19 it is around 2.3 to 3.1.  Basically an infected individual infects 1.3 avg other for influenza A and B, Covid 2 to 3 people.

The death rate from influenza after years of study hovers around 0.1%.

Death rates so far from Covid 19 is running about 2%. However it is very skewed in its age cohort data from WHO shows that individuals over 70 it is around 8%. 

Panic no, but also realize this pandemic is just starting and taking precautions is wise.

 

Do you have a link to this information? 

OLG 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Cypress Sun said:

 

Perhaps you'd like to go to the nearest large airport and shake hand with the first 100 people you meet. What the heck, it's just a common cold. 

 

I don't buy into the "media hype". I'm also not going to risk another 9 days in the hospital or 2 weeks in lock down.  So go on down to the airport and shake a few hands, come back and post in three weeks, tell me how it went.

+1. Hope you remain safe

Edited by Mill City Maddog

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

 

Good grief :rolleyes: you have a much higher chance of being in a car crash because of a drunk driver, than getting that 'bug'.

OLG 

Caution and care is prudent, and washing hands and wearing masks can keep you safer while you compete. Joking about this is immature and acting carelessly is simply ignorant and puts those of us with health issues at greater risk

Edited by Mill City Maddog
Clarification
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im not changing my plans at 70 i can live or not any day , already outlived some predictions and not on medication yet , i just signed up for some of my favorite shoots and will show up with only shooting ad socializing expectations , ill wash my hands as always , its "THE FLUE" for cripes sake - it comes round every year in some form or another with an exotic strain every election year here so it will pass , if i pass ...at least i was doing what i like to do , 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

 

Do you have a link to this information? 

OLG 

You can dig it out from WHO.

This is a nice summary

https://www.livescience.com/new-coronavirus-compare-with-flu.html

 

As I said not to panic but take precautions.  The main take away is COVID-19, SARS-CoV-2 (now the name of the virus) seems to hit folks like and a lot of pards harder.  My only thought was to impress it is definitely a bit nastier than a cold or influenza A & B

Edited by LostVaquero
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I Had a doctors appointment Monday and he encouraged me to take every precaution that I could to avoid corona virus. With only one good lung and the other one limited to about 35% he said my chances aren’t good if I get it. For years I’ve been using hand sanitizer after gasoline fill ups and other public contact and will continue to do so. My wife and I both take L-lysine and have increased our dosages as well as other anti viral supplements. Taking prudent precautions may not be such a bad idea if you are in the risk groups. 

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Sunshine will destroy viruses in a very short period of time. 

Get out and enjoy the sunshine at a match near you!

 

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, watab kid said:

Its "THE FLUE" for cripes sake

 

Well, no, it's a new spin-off virus that no one on Earth has had before.   The last time influenza was this potent (because no one had it before) was the Spanish Flu in 1918.   Look that one up, over 25 million died from it around the world.

 

Really, take precautions that your state or local health departments are advising for your current situation.   I'd much rather shoot with you than mourn you.

 

Good luck, GJ

Edited by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708
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1 hour ago, Mill City Maddog said:

Caution and care is prudent, and washing hands and wearing masks can keep you safer while you compete. Joking about this is immature and acting carelessly is simply ignorant and puts those of us with health issues at greater risk

 

The sky is not falling! :rolleyes:

You're exposed to more hazards(lead dust)on a shooting range.

You're exposed to more dangers in traffic.

I have class 3 CHF. Nut'n I do will change the outcome. 

Carry on,

OLGU

 

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Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, Yul Lose said:

I Had a doctors appointment Monday and he encouraged me to take every precaution that I could to avoid corona virus. With only one good lung and the other one limited to about 35% he said my chances aren’t good if I get it. For years I’ve been using hand sanitizer after gasoline fill ups and other public contact and will continue to do so. My wife and I both take L-lysine and have increased our dosages as well as other anti viral supplements. Taking prudent precautions may not be such a bad idea if you are in the risk groups. 

Agree strongly.

Even if you are not in the higher "risk groups", decency would seem to dictate caring about whom you spread the virus to, and taking care not to advance the virus through the community, thus endangering others.  

Edited by Dusty Devil Dale

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10 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

 

The sky is not falling! :rolleyes:

You're exposed to more hazards(lead dust)on a shooting range.

You're exposed to more dangers in traffic.

I have class 3 CHF. Nut'n I do will change the outcome. 

Carry on,

OLGU

 

Nothing changes the "final outcome" for any of us.  But this virus certainly could change the timing.  Keeping perspective is good, but doing it properly requires us to have enough accurate information to make those decisions-- and we do not have that, as yet.  

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Posted (edited)
57 minutes ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

 

Well, no, it's a new spin-off virus that no one on Earth has had before.   The last time influenza was this potent (because no one had it before) was the Spanish Flu in 1918.   Look that one up, over 25 million died from it around the world.

 

Really, take precautions that your state or local health departments are advising for your current situation.   I'd much rather shoot with you than mourn you.

 

Good luck, GJ

Total agreement.  And no individual offense intended to WK, but right now I don't particularly want to shoot with you or anybody else who is disbelieving that you need to be taking the prescribed precauctions.   The risk to my family is waaay more than the shooting is worth to me. 

Edited by Dusty Devil Dale
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I have 2 teenagers who go to school and Boy Scout meetings, so  a shoot for me is probably safer than being around them. In any case. I'm 63 so technically in a high risk group, but I am not skipping the shoot this weekend. I'm not much of a hugger and kisser anyway, so I won't have to change my ways. :)

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47 minutes ago, Ace_of_Hearts said:

Sunshine will destroy viruses in a very short period of time. 

Get out and enjoy the sunshine at a match near you!

 

Actually, the evidence so far suggests that this virus may not be as vulnerable to UV light as other viral strains.  And when the organisms are replicating themselves deep within your lungs, the sunshine isn't hitting them.    Solar UV exposure MAY reduce initial transmittal risk, to a degree, but that hasn't been confirmed. 

 

 Today, multiple researchers published that the COVID-19 virus can remain viable and infective outside the body on various surfaces for up to three days. 

 

It really is time to discontinue the folklore that so many people are apparently believing, and make an effort to be sure all of the information making it into print is accurate.   Peoples' lives are literally dependent on receiving accurate and carefully stated info right now

 

  

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Springfield Slim SASS #24733 said:

I have 2 teenagers who go to school and Boy Scout meetings, so  a shoot for me is probably safer than being around them. In any case. I'm 63 so technically in a high risk group, but I am not skipping the shoot this weekend. I'm not much of a hugger and kisser anyway, so I won't have to change my ways. :)

Try to follow the six foot separation rule whenever you can.   Droplets from a cough can travel six feet in under 1. 5 seconds.  

Edited by Dusty Devil Dale

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To echo Dr. Fauchi in todays hearings, "It's going to get a lot worse before it gets better".  He went on to say that it is 10 times more deadly that the Flu.

He layed out common sense precautautions to take.  No large gathers.   If you are an older person and immunocomprimised., stay home.  

If you have people at home that you care about passing this virus on to.  Stay home.  I'mm and Elder Statesman who gets severe respitory complications from the Flu, or even a bad cold.  I don't think I want to put myself at risk for this, and drag it home to my wife, kids and grandkits... and whoever they expose.   

Daily, the victim and death numbers climb higher.   NBA players have come down with it.  Scientists at meetings have come down with it.  Someone who came in brief random contact with someone who tested positive, came down with it.

 

Live your life the way it is best suited to you... but ridiculing the advice of the President and the best medical minds in the world is foolish.

Us in the upper age brackets with serious under-lying conditions have to think long and hard about what's right for us.

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3 hours ago, Chili Pepper Kid, SASS #60463 said:

In real life I'm a Respiratory Therapist. IMHO if you are any age and have under lying medical conditions. (COPD, Emphysema, Asthma, Kidney or heart disease) I would think about staying home. If you are over 70 in good health I would think about staying home. If you are under 70 and in good health, go but practice good hand washing and take bottles of hand sanitizer along. After this passes there will be other shoots. 

Remember folks, it isn't just about YOU.  You may not personally be in a high risk group, but many of the CAS people and family members with whom you associate are at risk, and their life literally depends upon you being careful not to spread this virus to them, either directly or indirectly. 

If the "business as usual" attitude that I'm seeing posted here by some is also widespread in the general population, it will absolutely assure many more COVID-19 infections and human deaths.  So get ready for a lot more Prayer Posse requests.   

 

I am not saying not to gather and shoot, But I'm saying if you do, please do not be in abject denial refusing to take the pandemic seriously and rejecting the precautions being advised.   

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