Are the new Vaqueros worth the price?

[Cool Name TBD]

Hey everyone - I'm new to cowboy shooting and looking at what I'll need.  I've had a couple of shooters recommend Vaqueros due to them being better built, stronger, etc.  

 

Here's where my questions come in:  are the Ruger new Vaqueros worth the premium price?  From what I've seen they are almost twice as much as some of the other popular models (Uberti, Cimarron, etc).  

 

I know the old Vaquero was made on a beefier frame but the new ones seem to be more in line with everything else.  I've also noticed the springs are coiled as opposed to flat but dont know if this is better or if it even matters.

 

Luckily the group I'll be shooting with has some people who will loan me some stuff so I can get shooting but I want to be getting my own so as not to take advantage of their good will.  I'll be keeping an eye out for used stuff as well.

 

Ultimately trying to figure out if it's a buy once cry once thing or if I'd be better off going with a different brand and using the savings towards other stuff I'll need.

 

Thanks in advance

 

 

[Cholla]

The Ruger Vaquero is built like a tank. It takes a licking and keeps on ticking. I have four and I would not trade them for anything else. And, they are made in the USA which means something to me.

 

The coil springs break less than flat springs.

[Cool Name TBD]

Just now, Cholla said:

The Ruger Vaquero is built like a tank. It takes a licking and keeps on ticking. I have four and I would not trade them for anything else. And, they are made in the USA which means something to me.

 

The coil springs break less than flat springs.

 

Are yours the new Vaqueros?  I know the originals were over built but wasn't sure about the new ones.  

[John Barleycorn, SASS #76982]

The New Vaquero has become the workhorse revolver of our game. They are every bit as strong as the original large frame Vaquero.

One exception.
The only thing you can’t do is shoot high pressure loads out of a New Vaquero 45 Colt the cylinder walls are too thin. 

[Cholla]

Yes. They are the New Vaqueros. The Vaquero is the most used revolver is SASS from what I have seen. And there's a reason.

 

Just an FYI, I got two of them from John (above).

 

 

[Cholla]

Here are some older catalog pages as well as some photos I took for an article in GUNS. You can see the comparison of the original Vaquero, New Vaquero, and a first-generation Colt Frontier Six Shooter.

 

According to Ruger, they have never stated that the old Vaqueros could handle anything beyond SAAMI spec pressures. That is the work of folks like John Taffin and others.

[Warden Callaway]

I had a pair for about 6 months.  Worked out the problems then traided them to Kid Rich.  I understand he sent them off to be worked on.  

 

[Hashknife Cowboy]

To answer your question, yes they are. I have several and have no regrets.  They just work, they are tough and if you are willing to spend some money a quality smith can make them into an exceptional shooter.  I just wish they offer a NMV in 44-40 and bring back the .44 Special.  They are my go to pistolas.

[Currahee]

Is Ruger currently making NMV's?

[John Barleycorn, SASS #76982]

3 minutes ago, Currahee said:

Is Ruger currently making NMV's?

Yes, but it’s not even a trickle, more like a slow drip. 

[Cool Name TBD]

27 minutes ago, Warden Callaway said:

I had a pair for about 6 months.  Worked out the problems then traided them to Kid Rich.  I understand he sent them off to be worked on.  

 

 

What problems did you have?  Are there any widely known issues or do you think you were just lucky and got some with some issues?

[Cool Name TBD]

5 minutes ago, John Barleycorn, SASS #76982 said:

Yes, but it’s not even a trickle, more like a slow drip. 

 

Is this why they're so much more than the others?  I've seen them on gunbroker and they are real proud of them 

[John Barleycorn, SASS #76982]

1 minute ago, Cool Name TBD said:

 

Is this why they're so much more than the others?  I've seen them on gunbroker and they are real proud of them 

Supply and demand. I’m paying well over retail just to have some to sell, not really a great business model. I’ve received 3 from my wholesalers in the last couple years. Blued seem to be a bit more available, but most everyone wants stainless, I don’t blame them. I like stainless too.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

They will outlast you 

Plus, 100% USA  made.

[SGT. ELI 35882 GUNFIGHTER]

Prices are high because new ones aren't being produced at a steady rate. Supply and demand. As a gunsmith Ruger, Ruger, Ruger. If something does break, parts are inexpensive. 

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

CN, like others said, Rugers are durable, reliable revolvers.  However, these are not the only considerations.    Also important is how revolvers feel in your hand when you shoot.  Try many revolvers, Ruger and Colt pattern with various barrel lengths and grips (birdshead, Bisley and plowhandle).  Once you discover what you prefer then start shopping.  Some shooters don't like the feel of Rugers.  You can thank those who help you by handing them a box of AA, low noise low recoil shotgun shells or buying them lunch.

 

All my Rugers functioned reliably out of the box though really improved after a race job by a CAS gunsmith.  The two most important things for me early on were getting the grips checkered so I could hold the revolvers reliably when my hands were damp and opening the cylinder/barrel gaps enough to handle black powder fouling.

 

[Texas Maverick]

I bought 2 new slicked up NMV stainless in 357 in 2018 when I started this game and paid $1900 then. You can usually find singles for around $750 to $800 on here every so often that have not been tuned. But you will pay around $2000 for a pair of tuned ones when you can find them. Just keep your eyes open. I have never regretted getting my pair and they have not caused me any issues in the 5 years I have been shooting them. I feel I can always get my money back from them if I ever decided to sell them.

 

That all being said, some like the other options better because of cost or they just feel better to them. Try others to see what YOU like and what feels good to you. There are less expensive revolvers that will do you a good job.

 

TM

[Captain Bill Burt]

I'm guessing the round count on my two Jimmy Spurs NMVs is somewhere close to 20,000 each at this point.   Zero issues.

[Warden Callaway]

4 hours ago, Cool Name TBD said:

 

What problems did you have?  Are there any widely known issues or do you think you were just lucky and got some with some issues?

 

Widely know, I say.  Cross latch spring that holds the base pin too weak,  lets base pin jump forward so transfer bar jams. No clearance between cylinder and barrel,  drags after a couple shots. Cylinder throats too tight.  Stainless steel not polished in same areas. Look like they were built by the sheltered workshop labor. It appears to me, most who brag them up have sent them off somewhere to get slicked up.  

 

I was so use to running a Colt, I found the Rugers clumsy and awkward. 

 

[Cool Name TBD]

4 minutes ago, Warden Callaway said:

 

Widely know, I say.  Cross latch spring that holds the base pin too weak,  lets base pin jump forward so transfer bar jams. No clearance between cylinder and barrel,  drags after a couple shots. Cylinder throats too tight.  Stainless steel not polished in same areas. Look like they were built by the sheltered workshop labor. It appears to me, most who brag them up have sent them off somewhere to get slicked up.  

 

I was so use to running a Colt, I found the Rugers clumsy and awkward. 

 

 

Ok follow up questions:  do the other manufacturers have a similar list of known issues?  Have you found any that more closely feel like your Colt?  From what I've seen, most people send their guns off to be slicked up - do the Rugers require more work to be done?  

[Cool Name TBD]

Oh also - I'll be shooting as many as I can to figure out what feels best to me.  I may not know what I like at this stage so was thinking of going with a standard/common setup and shoot that for a while until I figure out what I like and don't like.  Usually experience is the best teacher for that

[Captain Bill Burt]

21 minutes ago, Cool Name TBD said:

 

Ok follow up questions:  do the other manufacturers have a similar list of known issues?  Have you found any that more closely feel like your Colt?  From what I've seen, most people send their guns off to be slicked up - do the Rugers require more work to be done?  

Nope. Most people are quite happy with a set of NMV with Wolff reduced power springs in them.  There are a subset of cowboy shooters who look down their noses at Rugers for a variety of reasons.   I own a few Colts including a SAA, and there's no way I would buy a matching Colt SAA and then use them in place of my Rugers.  That would be a HUGE step down.

 

Spring kits for NMV cost around $20-$30 or so and takes maybe 15-20 minutes per pistol to install.  

[Rye Miles #13621]

54 minutes ago, Warden Callaway said:

 

Widely know, I say.  Cross latch spring that holds the base pin too weak,  lets base pin jump forward so transfer bar jams. No clearance between cylinder and barrel,  drags after a couple shots. Cylinder throats too tight.  Stainless steel not polished in same areas. Look like they were built by the sheltered workshop labor. It appears to me, most who brag them up have sent them off somewhere to get slicked up.  

 

I was so use to running a Colt, I found the Rugers clumsy and awkward. 

 

I couldn’t agree more! I’ve tried them in fact my first single actions were a Blackhawk and an OM Vaquero. I I switched to Ubertis a long time ago and then moved up to Colts. I now have 5 Colts and an Uberti. 
Ruger builds a good gun but the feel of a Colt is incomparable! 

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

1 hour ago, Warden Callaway said:

 

Widely know, I say.  Cross latch spring that holds the base pin too weak,  lets base pin jump forward so transfer bar jams. No clearance between cylinder and barrel,  drags after a couple shots. Cylinder throats too tight.  Stainless steel not polished in same areas. Look like they were built by the sheltered workshop labor. It appears to me, most who brag them up have sent them off somewhere to get slicked up.  

 

I was so use to running a Colt, I found the Rugers clumsy and awkward. 

 

 

 

This happened to me at a match yesterday.  After I figured out what happened and pushed the base pin back into place I shot a clean stage.  But my stage time was sixty seconds - a horrible time.  Fortunately this was just a local match.

[Possum Skinner, SASS#60697]

Almost all of the top shooters in our sport use Rugers exclusively and with good reason.  Of course, there are always exceptions.

 

When was the last time the Top EOT shooter shot anything else?

[Dantankerous]

I use the original or "Old Model" Ruger Vaquero Bisleys. These fit my hand and shooting style much better than the NMVs do. I have installed spring kits in mine but otherwise no smithing or tuning done. They have thousands and thousands of rounds through them and not one problem. Love 'em! Built tough and last and last. 

[Badlands Bob #61228]

21 minutes ago, Possum Skinner, SASS#60697 said:

 

 

When was the last time the Top EOT shooter shot anything else?

1969?

[Tequila Shooter]

I love my Rugers but they’re Old Armies, had a pair of NMVs, got tired of them collecting dust so I sold them. 

[Warden Callaway]

1 hour ago, Tequila Shooter said:

I love my Rugers but they’re Old Armies, had a pair of NMVs, got tired of them collecting dust so I sold them. 

 

Got a few myself. 

 

[Matthew Duncan]

My pair of Ubertis have been to 24 years of SASS matches.  Broke one flat spring during those years.  Normal wear and tear had me take them to a gun smith a few years back.  This year they have been retired with two new vaqueros taking their place.

[Cholla]

I was talking to Widder a year or two ago and if memory serves me, he used Vaqueros to set his speed record. If I recall correctly he fired his Vaqueros over a million times in practice leading up to his record. That is an amazing feat for a set of pistols. Perhaps @Widder, SASS #59054 can fill in or correct the failings of my memory.

[Frontier Lone Rider]

6 hours ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

 

Spring kits for NMV cost around $20-$30 or so and takes maybe 15-20 minutes per pistol to install.  

 

I have been buying them from Wolff and Midway USA from between $9 and $11.00.  The cylinder latch pin extra strength spring also comes in this set.

[Old Man Graybeard]

I had a couple pairs of Uberti revolvers. They weren't too bad...until they came out with the safety firing pin. It is JUNK...personal experience. I no longer have the Uberti's. If you have the standard Uberti...you can still get the hammer and trigger to put them back. If you have the short stroked ones...which is what I had. I now have Rugers...old model pair of Bisley 45 colt...old model Bisley 357...old model 44-40...two pair of 357 new model...a pair of 357 and a pair of 32. Uberti Rifles...fine

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

All of the cowboy guns sold today will have problems that need to be worked.  The work varies by which maker and model you are looking at.

 

Rugers often have overly tight chamber throats, or at least unequal diameters between the 6 chambers, or between throat and barrel.   The base pin retention cross pin and the base pin sometimes need work to keep them in place.

 

Ubertis have flat springs for some small mechanisms (like cylinder latch bolt) that break easily.  Actions are often fairly rough.  Restrictive import regulations drive lots of Ubertis decisions to make guns that are legal, rather than useful.

 

Piettas have perhaps better work now than Uberti, but not comparable to the hand tuning and fitting work done on Colt and S&W handguns in the last half of the 19th century.

 

Consider all cowboy guns that you will buy as "preassembled  parts kits" on which the minimal amount of work has been performed that it takes to get the gun put together.  If you expect a smooth gun like a Colt Single Action, Diamondback, Cobra, or Gold Cup,  you will be sorely disappointed.  THAT is why almost all folks who are serious practitioners of the sport either do their own gun work, or have a gunsmith "on retainer" to do it for them.

 

So, "are they worth it" can be answered as they have the value that a roughly-assembled, but (usually) functional and safe firearm can be assigned.  If no one evaluates that price tag as reasonable, no guns would be sold now.  If EVERYONE thought the current price tags reasonable, then 250 million Americans and many other folks around the world would be beating a path to the maker's doors.   Except for a few jewels that Ruger built years ago, none of the current manufacturers are making guns that will have any collector's value, just utilitarian value, and that increases greatly when our current crop of guns are expertly deburred, fitted, re-sprung and tuned.    Is any one gun going to be head and shoulders more satisfactory than any other, right out of the box?  That is so difficult to answer because 1880's level of quality control is so universally expensive to build into today's guns.

 

If you are not aware of the current values of cowboy guns, find a pard who is and take his or her advice about the "better guns" in the sport.

 

good luck, GJ

 

 

[High Spade Mikey Wilson]

I have a set of SASS consecutive serial number old model Vaqueros in 38/357 I purchased about 10 years ago for my wife. She no longer shoots so I take them out now and then. I don't know what it is but I just cannot shoot them very well. I have three sets of Uberti Cattleman in 38/357, 45 Colt/45 ACP, and 32-20 that I can shoot all equally well. I have large hands. I don't know if it's the Ruger grips, which I have replaced with thicker ones, the weight of the pistol, or the balance of the pistol. I shot them yesterday and had one of the worst matches I can remember. All my misses were with those Ruger pistols and I'm not talking just one miss a stage. I'll take my Uberti pistols any day. I'm retiring the Ruger Vaqueros to the gun safe, and maybe if one of my two grandson's decide to take up CAS I'll give them to him.