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Turkey Flats Jack

Participation Ribbon

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How many of you shoot at clubs that give ribbons for each category regardless of how many shooters were in it that month? Most of the ones I shoot at do. You hear a lot of "pick your category wisely" comments. I've even said it as I was getting my 1st place ribbon and there was no 2nd place to be given that day. I recently started shooting at a smaller club and they only hand out clean match, 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place ribbons for overall. That got me to thinking on the subject. I've always disagreed with kids getting participation trophies feeling that it takes away from the ones that excelled. So I recon with that line of thought I should probably start declining my participation ribbons unless I actually have competition. At least for monthly matches anyways. 

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Gee, I want a ribbon!  :)

 

The clubs in Central Texas all have clean match pins for monthly shoots, but that's it.

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Clubs in my area only give clean match pins, no category ribbons and that's fine with me.

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26 minutes ago, Turkey Flats Jack said:

How many of you shoot at clubs that give ribbons for each category regardless of how many shooters were in it that month? Most of the ones I shoot at do. You hear a lot of "pick your category wisely" comments. I've even said it as I was getting my 1st place ribbon and there was no 2nd place to be given that day. I recently started shooting at a smaller club and they only hand out clean match, 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place ribbons for overall. That got me to thinking on the subject. I've always disagreed with kids getting participation trophies feeling that it takes away from the ones that excelled. So I recon with that line of thought I should probably start declining my participation ribbons unless I actually have competition. At least for monthly matches anyways. 

 

I usually accept the "trophy" but give it back after the awards so as not to rain on someone else's parade. Some folks like getting a trinket from a match. I don't begrudge them, if it makes them feel good....more power to them.

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Posted (edited)

At our monthly matches (2x a month actually), our club doesn't  give out awards, ribbons, or pins of any type, not even for clean matches.  We have a fun match and then later that day the scores are sent out by email and posted on our webpage and Facebook page.  Even just the idea of having participation or clean match awards has never been mentioned, and it is not likely to be.  We like it the way it is.

Edited by Hellbender
typo
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29 minutes ago, Hellbender said:

At our monthly matches (2x a month actually), our club doesn't  give out awards, ribbons, or pins of any type, not even for clean matches.  We have a fun match and then later that day the scores are sent out by email and posted on our webpage and Facebook page.  Even just the idea of having participation or clean match awards has never been mentioned, and it is not likely to be.  We like it the way it is.

 

^^^^^ This.. Only we shoot once a month..

i've thought it would be nice if we gave out clean match pins?? But..

if you have a clean match you shoot free at our next match..

 

Rance ;)

Thinkin I don't need no stinkin participation ribbon:D:wacko:

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Yeah, they call it a receipt for paying your range fees B)

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54 minutes ago, Cypress Sun said:

 

I usually accept the "trophy" but give it back after the awards so as not to rain on someone else's parade. Some folks like getting a trinket from a match. I don't begrudge them, if it makes them feel good....more power to them.

Dont get me wrong i'm not saying anyone should or shouldnt take the prize. I just realized that by taking it when i'm the only one in that category that i'm being a bit of a hypocrite to my own personal feelings.  

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The local clubs I shoot at only provide ribbons at their Annual matches not at monthly matches . The monthly match scores are posted for bragging rights and clean match pins awarded.

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Immediately after Illowa Irregulars matches, each clean shooter receives a custom poker chip noting the achievement.  Category winners are then announced, with an appropriately designed poker chip going to the top shooter in any category that has more than one competitor.  Traditionally, as each winner of a single-entrant category is announced, the assembled crowd calls out in unison "No Chip!"  As a continued reward for achievement, once a shooter has accumulated five (5) chips, he/she may turn them in for a free match - a $10 value.  The chips have been popular since we instituted them a few years ago, haven't seen anyone turn them down.

 

CS

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For a monthly??

NO.

They give a little something for a clean match.

For most, those ribbons got thrown out. Maybe only a few folks might keep them.

 

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If I earn some ribbon or award, I'll accept it to avoid looking unappreciative...but in my heart I really only try to get clean match (never happens) or top 5% overall regardless if there's an award for that or not. 

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One club I shoot at gives you a nice plaque when you shoot your first clean match along with a little wooden tile that hangs below with the year and another with the month. They are designed so that the tiles will link together like a chain.

 

Each additional clean match you get another tile with the month on it.   The following year you get a new year tile in addition to the month tile.

 

Mine all mean something to me as I feel I earned them as the clubs targets are neither big nor close.  The first one I earned is extra special as it was at the annual buzzards and coyotes match. On one stage all the rifle and pistol targets are shaped either like Buzzards sitting on a roost or Coyotes howling at the moon. The targets challenging as they are very narrow by almost any clubs standards and definitely require using your sights.

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23 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

One club I shoot at gives you a nice plaque when you shoot your first clean match along with a little wooden tile that hangs below with the year and another with the month. They are designed so that the tiles will link together like a chain.

 

Each additional clean match you get another tile with the month on it.   The following year you get a new year tile in addition to the month tile.

 

Mine all mean something to me as I feel I earned them as the clubs targets are neither big nor close.  The first one I earned is extra special as it was at the annual buzzards and coyotes match. On one stage all the rifle and pistol targets are shaped either like Buzzards sitting on a roost or Coyotes howling at the moon. The targets challenging as they are very narrow by almost any clubs standards and definitely require using your sights.

Shooting clean is one thing. Shooting Fast and Clean is another thing.

 

Take away the timer and shooting clean is easy regardless of whether the targets are SASS Big and Close or SASS Smaller and Farther.

 

To me, Clean Match awards basically promotes mediocrity.

 

"Participation" awards don't offend me...

 

Phantom

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Around here it's mainly poker chip awards.  One of the five monthlies I shoot doesn't give any awards, which is fine with me.

 

The only award I really care about is 1st overall.  With all the World and National Champions running 14 and 15 second stages we have roaming around North Georgia I don't win that one very often. 

 

At our local clubs it's pretty hard to win if you don't shoot clean.  Fast Eddie can miss once and still win the overall.  He's probably the only one. 

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Posted (edited)

There are always two ways to look at "participation" trophies/ recognition.

 

One way is, without a competitor to compare your score too - the award is meaningless. 

The mindset being:

A competitor will always seek out a category to find competition.

 

The other is, the shooter shot the match to the best of their abilities and deserves whatever position that performance places them.

The mindset being:

It is not the responsibility or fault of the existing shooter that no one else chose that category on a given day. 

 

Neither school is wrong and neither is entirely right either.

 

But I lean on the side of trophies/ ribbons/ etc. are cheap and while for some they may mean nothing - for others, they are important.

 

I always try to avoid diminishing or minimizing another shooters accomplishment regardless of my personal opinion.  

 

As a fellow local shooter often said, when a shooter would train wreck, crash and burn their match...

"Look around you - there are a million plus people who could have been here today - but for whatever reason, they are not.  You beat every single one of them that didn't show."

 

 

 

Edited by Creeker, SASS #43022
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This was on another posting, but fits this one !

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15 minutes ago, Hells Comin said:

This was on another posting, but fits this one !

LiquidPartBigCrop.jpg.299bc91a4e43f2ad920216ae12845748.jpg

 

I've earned a few of those in my younger days. I'm 100% confident that i'll pass on those ones anymore. lol

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Im not a fan of participation awards. In any form. 

 

  If you practice and work hard at your category, doing your best to perfect your craft.  it's not your fault if nobody else shows up.  Take your prize and be proud because you earned it. 

 

 If they only reason you have an award is because you choose a less populated category just to earn a shiny buckle... well it says a lot about your integrity...or lack there of.  

 

 There are matches that being clean is something to be proud of.  Matches with huge, danger close targets, it's meaningless. 

 

  I have several hundred buckles,  ribbons,  trophies,  awards, from one sport or another. Most are buried away in some forgotten corner.  The only one I truly cherish from this sport im not sure I deserved.  That is my Jedi buckle. 

 

 

 

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23 minutes ago, evil dogooder said:

There are matches that being clean is something to be proud of.  Matches with huge, danger close targets, it's meaningless. 

Why?

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50 minutes ago, evil dogooder said:

 

  If you practice and work hard at your category, doing your best to perfect your craft.  it's not your fault if nobody else shows up.  Take your prize and be proud because you earned it

I shoot the same category Everytime. I wouldn't care if there were 100 of us shooting it. But there's not many frontier cartridge gunfighters in my area. On a good day there might be 2 or 3 others shooting in my category but it's rare to even have 1 other at a monthly. I certainly didn't pick it because of the amount of people in it. I went from frontiersman to it so I could shoot gunfighter. That and it takes me so long to load my cap guns I felt like I was cheating the posse by not helping as much as I felt I should. Maybe I'll give regular gunfighter a go some day but I enjoy the smoke and boom to much. 

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1 hour ago, evil dogooder said:

Im not a fan of participation awards. In any form. 

 

  If you practice and work hard at your category, doing your best to perfect your craft.  it's not your fault if nobody else shows up.  Take your prize and be proud because you earned it. 

 

 If they only reason you have an award is because you choose a less populated category just to earn a shiny buckle... well it says a lot about your integrity...or lack there of.  

 

 There are matches that being clean is something to be proud of.  Matches with huge, danger close targets, it's meaningless. 

 

  I have several hundred buckles,  ribbons,  trophies,  awards, from one sport or another. Most are buried away in some forgotten corner.  The only one I truly cherish from this sport im not sure I deserved.  That is my Jedi buckle. 

 

 

 

I think that's exactly backwards.  The faster the stage, the more a miss hurts.  When I'm shooting against one of our top shooters (who shall go unnamed) the harder the stage, the bigger the gap between us.  On a really tough stage he might beat me by 3 seconds.  If he misses, I'm ahead by 2.  On a big and close stage that gaps narrows.  He might shoot it in the mid 14s, I might run low 16s or even high 15s.  If he misses once I'm probably up by 3 seconds or so. Given a steady diet of those type stages, one miss might make the difference.  Given harder stages he can probably miss twice, maybe even three times and still win. 

 

If you're giving it your all and trying to win, shooting clean is never meaningless. 

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2 hours ago, Turkey Flats Jack said:

But there's not many frontier cartridge gunfighters in my area. On a good day there might be 2 or 3 others shooting in my category but it's rare to even have 1 other at a monthly. I certainly didn't pick it because of the amount of people in it. I went from frontiersman to it so I could shoot gunfighter.

Used to be there were a fair number of BP shooters, but our numbers seem to be diminishing more every year. At our state shoot last month, there were only four black powder shooters, and all four were in different categories. We didn't plan it that way, it just happened - one Frontiersman, one Frontier Cartridge, one Frontier Cartridge Duelist (me), and one Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter. :mellow:

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1 minute ago, Three Foot Johnson said:

Used to be there were a fair number of BP shooters, but our numbers seem to be diminishing more every year. At our state shoot last month, there were only four black powder shooters, and all four were in different categories. We didn't plan it that way, it just happened - one Frontiersman, one Frontier Cartridge, one Frontier Cartridge Duelist (me), and one Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter. :mellow:

I went to the north east territorial bp championship this year. I got 3rd in FCGF. There were 3 of us lol

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I took the first one that was offered and hung it on the wall for the novelty.  But I don't accept them anymore.  I shoot the category I want (funfighter) and if no one else wants in, it don't bother me.  If I shot BP I would probably be willing to switch to the smokeless category if as smokeless gunfighter wanted some competition, but it's really not that important to me. 

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Rewards? Plaques? Ribbons? For regular monthly shoots? What are these things of which you speak? Ive never got to shoot somewhere that did
  We get to BS with some of our partners about how they suck , or we suck, or our guns being broken-or better get guns fixed...and then put in a 1/2 hour of lifting and moving to clean up.
Going by some of the arrogant replies to answers in here..Im damn glad I shoot where I shoot.

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You're all looking at this wrong. Think about it. When they pile all those trophies and ribbons (whether you think you earned them or not) at the foot of your casket, the only comment will be, "WOW, he musta been a good shot!" and not "Gee, was he the only one in his category?":D:P:D

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3 hours ago, Lunger Dan said:

Going by some of the arrogant replies to answers in here..Im damn glad I shoot where I shoot

Curious - what arrogant replies??

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Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, Turkey Flats Jack said:

I went from frontiersman to it so I could shoot gunfighter. (FCGF)

 

Must be a local rule?

 

Copied from page six of the Shooter's Handbook:

 

Gunfighter Style

  • -  Gunfighter style is defined as shooting with a revolver in each hand. Revolvers must be cocked and fired one handed, unsupported, one right-handed and the other left-handed. There is no set pattern as to how the revolvers are to be fired, but alternating revolvers is clearly the most efficient.

  • -  Gunfighter Rules:
    o Anymainmatchfixedsightrevolvermaybeused.

 

...and percussion revolvers are legal in every category.

 

It's up to the club to offer a "Frontiersman Gunfighter" category if they want to, but you should be allowed to shoot percussion revolvers in either Gunfighter or Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter categories.

 

 

Edited by J-BAR #18287
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Just now, J-BAR #18287 said:

 

Must be a local rule?

 

Copied from page six of the Shooter's Handbook:

 

Gunfighter Style

  • -  Gunfighter style is defined as shooting with a revolver in each hand. Revolvers must be cocked and fired one handed, unsupported, one right-handed and the other left-handed. There is no set pattern as to how the revolvers are to be fired, but alternating revolvers is clearly the most efficient.

  • -  Gunfighter Rules:
    o Anymainmatchfixedsightrevolvermaybeused.

 

...and percussion revolvers are legal in every category.

 

 

Frontiersman is a duelist style category.

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Frontiersman is a duelist style category.

 

Sure.

 

I read his post as saying he was not allowed to use percussion revolvers when shooting Gunfighter style.  Which is allowed under SASS rules.

 

And I edited my previous post for clarification while you were responding.

Edited by J-BAR #18287
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28 minutes ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

 

Sure.

 

I read his post as saying he was not allowed to use percussion revolvers when shooting Gunfighter style.  Which is allowed under SASS rules.

 

And I edited my previous post for clarification while you were responding.

I never said I couldn't use cap guns in gunfighter. Said I went from frontiersman to FC so I could shoot gunfighter. Frontiersman is a duelist category. If I'm gonna make up a new category I'll go CCFCGF. I know I can use cap guns in gunfighter but why would I? It would be a handicap IMO. Anywho not important.

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8 minutes ago, Turkey Flats Jack said:

 I know I can use cap guns in gunfighter but why would I?


Sorry I misinterpreted your post.  Why would you use cap guns in another category besides Frontiersman?  Maybe because you enjoy shooting cap guns.  I do it frequently.

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2 minutes ago, J-BAR #18287 said:


Sorry I misinterpreted your post.  Why would you use cap guns in another category besides Frontiersman?  Maybe because you enjoy shooting cap guns.  I do it frequently.

No worries, I shoot cap guns fairly often just not when there's a timer involved or chores to be done. I'm not fast at loading them or unloading them for that matter. I like them but now that I'm a little more familiar with the rules and category requirements I'll use BP cartridges when I'm at a match. Save my caps for plinking at the range. 

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