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Kid Death 6683

I Got A Procedural On A "NO PROCEDURAL STAGE", WHY??

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The last stage of the match was a "No Procedural" stage. 10 pistol, any order, 10 rifle, the same, 4 shotgun also the same. I shot my 10 pistol & instead of reholstering them, I laid them down on the counter in front of me, empty pointing safely down range. I had a new double holster rig on that day that I'd been having trouble reholstering all the match, so here's a "No Procedural" stage I thought I'd save a few seconds. I had no chance of out shooting ANYONE that match. What do yall think?

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Posted (edited)

That is a SASS convention, you must re-holster the revolvers before moving to the next firearm. Procedural! Its OK to leave one on the prop while you are shooting the other, but at the end of the string (string is both revolvers) they must be returned to leather unless the stage instructions calls for them to be  re-staged on the prop.

 

TB

Edited by Turquoise Bill, SASS #39118
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As you described it, you get a P for not following SASS conventions (revolvers are returned to leather at end of that shooting string).  Not for target order, which is just one of several reasons for a P.

If you wanted to get NO P, you probably could have shot revolvers as LAST gun type.

Good luck, GJ

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Did the stage instructions actually say "You may not be called for a Procedural on this stage " ?

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And you get another P for the illegible font.

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Posted (edited)

And now you know & you'll never do it again, right?  The pistol thing, not the font.

Edited by MizPete
'cause I wanted to.
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I found that font easier to read than the usual small print seen here.  But I am on a PC, not a phone.

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43 minutes ago, Kid Death 6683 said:

The last stage of the match was a "No Procedural" stage. 10 pistol, any order, 10 rifle, the same, 4 shotgun also the same. I shot my 10 pistol & instead of reholstering them, I laid them down on the counter in front of me, empty pointing safely down range. I had a new double holster rig on that day that I'd been having trouble reholstering all the match, so here's a "No Procedural" stage I thought I'd save a few seconds. I had no chance of out shooting ANYONE that match. What do yall think?

A few years ago it was a Minor Safety.

 

Randy

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Atz why I like it when the stage instructions say "make ________________ safe"  :)     Sometimes, saving those 2 or 3 odd seconds can get really expensive   :blink:

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, Colorado Coffinmaker said:

 

Atz why I like it when the stage instructions say "make ________________ safe"  :)     Sometimes, saving those 2 or 3 odd seconds can get really expensive   :blink:

I'm not sure if that instruction would allow you to ground pistols.

 

SHB page 15 Revolvers are returned to leather (re-holstered in a safe condition) at the conclusion of the shooting string, unless the stage description specifically directs otherwise (e.g., “move to the next position and set gun on table or prop”). A shooting string is defined as shots from one type of firearm prior to the next type of firearm engaged.

 

I don't think 'make revolvers safe' is specifically directing you to do something other then reholster. But, I could be wrong

 

I don't like make safe as an instruction.  I prefer the instructions tell you how to shoot the gun, then tell you how to shoot the next one.  No mention of what to do when you're finished.  That leaves it up to you, so long as you don't break a convention.  So - with rifle shoot a Nevada Sweep.  Move to table, with shotgun...blah, blah.  That leaves it up to you where you ground that rifle.  To me 'make safe' is superfluous, what are you going to do without that instruction, make the gun unsafe?

Edited by Captain Bill Burt
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Posted (edited)

I'm with the Capt...….tell me how to shoot the stage and I'll figure out where to put the gun. The only time I write in where you have to put it after using it is when safety is an issue.....otherwise it's up to the shooter. 

Edited by Cowboy Junky
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I like this font, maybe yall can read this size. This was a club monthly match & I did the exact same thing the month before with no procedural & NOBODY told me anything about not doing it again.

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Just now, Kid Death 6683 said:

I like this font, maybe yall can read this size. This was a club monthly match & I did the exact same thing the month before with no procedural & NOBODY told me anything about not doing it again.

 

Better but still sucks on a phone or tablet.

 

Were pistols shot last the month before?

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Just now, Kid Death 6683 said:

I like this font, maybe yall can read this size. This was a club monthly match & I did the exact same thing the month before with no procedural & NOBODY told me anything about not doing it again.

If the stage instructions said no Ps, then I would say it's a bad call.  If they simply gave you shooter's choice on gun order and where rounds went then you earned a P for not returning to leather prior to firing the next gun.  SHB page 15.

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Pistols were first both matches.

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3 minutes ago, Kid Death 6683 said:

Pistols were first both matches.

 

Like has already been stated, unless the stage specifically stated you could stage your holsters instead of holstering then you should have gotten a P both times. I know that may sound harsh for a monthly, but it'll save you at a bigger match.

 

Pg. 14 of the shooters handbook:

 

Revolvers are returned to leather (re-holstered) (in a safe condition) at the 
conclusion of the shooting string, unless the stage description specifically directs 
otherwise (e.g., “move to the next position and set gun on table or prop”). A 
shooting string is defined as shots from one type of firearm prior to the next type 
of firearm engaged.

 

Also on pg. 33 of RO1.

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If I’m reading the OP correctly the “No Procedural” statement wasn’t a get out of jail free card for everything. It pertained only to gun order and shot placement. Unless specifically stated in the stage instructions all SASS conventions still apply.

 

P for not reholstering pistols prior to next gun. 

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If a stage is called a "no procedural stage" then any P at all for anything is disingenuous.  Pistols must be reholstered unless stage instructions state otherwise, yeah? Well the stage instructions of no P says otherwise. Better to call it a any firearm any target stage or something along those lines.

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OP-What was the Posse Leader's interpretation of the 'no-P' at the shooters meeting, before the stage started?

OLG

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Fer gawds sake...Do you think that the Stage Writer was just enjoying the writing process by saying "No P Stage" because there was no order to the shooting strings?????

 

You have to reholster before the next gun unless the stage indicates otherwise...Perhaps you'd like a SOG???

 

And writing "Make gun safe" is silly...I mean...as opposed to "Make gun unsafe"??? Totally useless instructions.

 

Seriously, it's stuff like this that makes for Stage Writers wanting to quit...or folks not ever even wanting to volunteer for the job.

 

Phantom

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11 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

...

And writing "Make gun safe" is silly...I mean...as opposed to "Make gun unsafe"??? Totally useless instructions.

 

Seriously, it's stuff like this that makes for Stage Writers wanting to quit...or folks not ever even wanting to volunteer for the job.

 

Phantom

OMG! I agree with Phantom! :o ;)

 

Next thing you know we'll wonder WWPD!

 

(As in WWWD or WWJW do. :) )

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1 hour ago, El Hombre Sin Nombre said:

If a stage is called a "no procedural stage" then any P at all for anything is disingenuous.  Pistols must be reholstered unless stage instructions state otherwise, yeah? Well the stage instructions of no P says otherwise. Better to call it a any firearm any target stage or something along those lines.

 

You can call it anything you want. What a stage is called means nothing. The stage instructions are what matters. And as has been said, SASS conventions apply unless specifically stated otherwise. 

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22 minutes ago, Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 said:

OMG! I agree with Phantom! :o ;)

 

Next thing you know we'll wonder WWPD!

 

(As in WWWD or WWJW do. :) )

Trust me - that ain't gunna happen.

 

:P

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25 minutes ago, Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 said:

OMG! I agree with Phantom! :o ;)

 

Next thing you know we'll wonder WWPD!

 

(As in WWWD or WWJW do. :) )

Hahahahahahahaha

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3 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Trust me - that ain't gunna happen.

 

:P

I think it just did!

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I can tell you WWWD...... he wouldn't use up all his orange ink on such a trivial thread.

 

He would dish out all his 'P's in bold black ink..... :D

 

...........Widder

 

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Next thing you know there will be a no safety penalty stage. I don’t want to be there for that one.

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3 minutes ago, Yul Lose said:

Next thing you know there will be a no safety penalty stage. I don’t want to be there for that one.

Me either.

 

On another note, if I ever write any stages I'm going to scatter some 'make rifle unsafe' comments in there to see what's paying attention...

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1 hour ago, Tyrel Cody said:

Me either.

 

On another note, if I ever write any stages I'm going to scatter some 'make rifle unsafe' comments in there to see what's paying attention...

Dang...so if I make my Rifle/Shotgun unsafe...do I get a P or a MS...???

 

:o

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1 minute ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Dang...so if I make my Rifle/Shotgun unsafe...do I get a P or a MS...???

 

:o

Both. :D.

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I'm sorry I brought this up

If a stage is a no p stage, as far as I'm concerned, it's a no p stage, unless stated otherwise. Everybody ain't no walkin rule book. Safety is one thing, but I did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING UNSAFE.

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No comment.

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off topic:

11 hours ago, Tyrel Cody said:

And you get another P for the illegible font

On my computer the font looks like Comic Sans which is well readable while on my phone it is displayed as some kind of handwriting script font... :wacko: strange

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KID,

Let me put this 'No P' stage in prospective of rules/guidelines.

 

Lets say you have a stage where there are "NO MISSES".   But, somewhere during your shooting

string you have a gun problem and fail to fire a few rounds.   You will earn a 'Miss' for every round

not fired.   To qualify for having No Misses, you are required to at least Fire your guns at the targets.

 

In our game/sport, the same works for having a 'No P' stage.   Unless its written otherwise in the 

stage instructions, the qualifying factor for the 'No P' deals with the shooting aspect and you

are not exempt from 'convention guidelines'.

 

Anyhow, thats how I see it.

 

..........Widder

 

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11 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Fer gawds sake...Do you think that the Stage Writer was just enjoying the writing process by saying "No P Stage" because there was no order to the shooting strings?????

 

You have to reholster before the next gun unless the stage indicates otherwise...Perhaps you'd like a SOG???

 

And writing "Make gun safe" is silly...I mean...as opposed to "Make gun unsafe"??? Totally useless instructions.

 

Seriously, it's stuff like this that makes for Stage Writers wanting to quit...or folks not ever even wanting to volunteer for the job.

 

Phantom

I'm writing that in the next match.....lol. "From the left window shoot a progressive sweep and don't make the gun unsafe. Move to right table...………"

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