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Grouchy Spike

Cowboys/Cowgirls - what would attract you to Wild Bunch?

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17 hours ago, Assassin said:

Everyone does not have a love affair with 1911's and the many have a problem with the rules. When WB started it was a period game, guns of that particular era, not just 1911's and Winchester pump guns. Most guns of the era were allowed. Believe it or not WB was shot for many years before SASS got their hands on it and made it what it is today. It's tough enough for CAS shooters to get enough time for cowboy matches. I'd prefer to spend my time promoting cowboy shooting.

Ditto. I inquired about what guns I needed for a WB match. I was told I "needed" a 1911 and a '97. I have neither and intend by buy neither at this time so until I do, no Wild Bunch. I may never buy them but who knows.

 

If WB were shot using the guns from the movie, then perhaps I could / would shoot it now.

Here is a link to the "Guns of The Wild Bunch":

http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Wild_Bunch,_The

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3 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Ditto. I inquired about what guns I needed for a WB match. I was told I "needed" a 1911 and a '97. I have neither and intend by buy neither at this time so until I do, no Wild Bunch. I may never buy them but who knows.

 

If WB were shot using the guns from the movie, then perhaps I could / would shoot it now.

Here is a link to the "Guns of The Wild Bunch":

http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Wild_Bunch,_The

That ought to reopen a can of worms.

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4 minutes ago, Yul Lose said:

That ought to reopen a can of worms.

Not trying to stir trouble. Just saying that perhaps if WB were more open to the guns of the movie there might be more interest...except for the Browning M1917 and the hand grenades, of course...but how cool would that be...?

 

 

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24 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Not trying to stir trouble. Just saying that perhaps if WB were more open to the guns of the movie there might be more interest...except for the Browning M1917 and the hand grenades, of course...but how cool would that be...?

 

 

Yep, as I pointed out double and single shotguns in there.  While a 1917 Browning would be a blast maybe change it to a Thompson.

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11 hours ago, PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L said:

 

Here's an excellent example of "pre-WBAS" rules & regulations (OOWSS "Turn of the Century Shooting Society" rules were similar up until we started to incorporate many of the WBAS restrictions):

Sand Creek Raiders "Professionals" Rules

Now THAT looks like serious FUN!!!

 

 

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I have to agree with OLG. I carry a 1911 every day. The WB rules don't work with my training.

Also, I detest trombone guns.  The only rifles I have larger than 40 are in 45acp and 45-70.

I don't see them allowing my acp as it is semi-auto and the 45-70 might damage the targets.

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1 hour ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Not trying to stir trouble. Just saying that perhaps if WB were more open to the guns of the movie there might be more interest...except for the Browning M1917 and the hand grenades, of course...but how cool would that be...?

 

 

 

I think shooting a M1917 on a stage or two would really up the fun factor. Maybe PWB would loan us his. :ph34r:

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I haven't had enough coffee yet to catch up on responses yet but I see good comments on what is not liked about WBAS.  And with good reason, some CAS shooters have no interest at all in shooting a 1911.  Understandable.

 

I'm thinking that I should have asked "What must WBAS offer to attract CAS shooters?"  Some will answer "nothing" and that's OK.

 

For instance, the restricted rifle caliber, shotgun gauge and type is an objection so I'd conclude that WBAS must open up those restrictions.  That's fixable in local matches with an open category.  If that is resolved, would you who object to the restrictions join WBAS matches?  Or are there more objections perhaps not stated?

 

If you're not burned out on this thread, include in your responses the answer to the question above.

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1 minute ago, Grouchy Spike said:

I haven't had enough coffee yet to catch up on responses yet but I see good comments on what is not liked about WBAS.  And with good reason, some CAS shooters have no interest at all in shooting a 1911.  Understandable.

 

I'm thinking that I should have asked "What must WBAS offer to attract CAS shooters?"  Some will answer "nothing" and that's OK.

 

For instance, the restricted rifle caliber, shotgun gauge and type is an objection so I'd conclude that WBAS must open up those restrictions.  That's fixable in local matches with an open category.  If that is resolved, would you who object to the restrictions join WBAS matches?  Or are there more objections perhaps not stated?

 

If you're not burned out on this thread, include in your responses the answer to the question above.

Fair enough Grouchy Spike.

 

  • Opening up the restrictions in Wild Bunch to include more of the guns in the movie. Like the S&W model 10, for instance. If the stage called for 7 shots and a reload, then so be it.

I think Wild Bunch is a fantastic concept and would be a lot of fun. On another note I was very interested in Zoot Shooters competitions but I am not buying a Thompson to play and that seems to be the "gun of choice" for that shooting sport. When shooting a concept genre but only catering to one type of small arm people limit the expansion of it. Yes, there must be restrictions and rules but opening things up a bit more to include "safe" and realistic guns of the era might attract more enthusiasm. How many people would shoot CAS if one could only use Colt revolvers, '73 Winchesters & clones and 97 shotguns?

 

Being one that has never shot WB maybe I am "all wet" and don't have a clue, but I might have a clue if things were a bit more open. I would never want to see WB turn into something that it was never intended to be but to my understanding it didn't start out as "you can only use 1911's and 97's and model 12's and large caliber pistol cartridge rifles." But like I said, maybe I am "all wet".

 

Just trying to be clear before I step off this soap box. Apologies for the long answer.

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1 minute ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Yes, there must be restrictions and rules but opening things up a bit more to include "safe" and realistic guns of the era might attract more enthusiasm. How many people would shoot CAS if one could only use Colt revolvers, '73 Winchesters & clones and 97 shotguns?

Pat, Thanks for stepping onto the soap box.  You offer a valid point.  I'd probably still shoot CAS with the restrictions that you mention but I enjoy it more because of a selection of weapons available to maintain interest.  The very fast shooters always seem to use the same weapons every match, and that familiarity is one of many reasons that they are so fast (not to belittle their intense practice regimen).  However, my match fee commands the same value as their match fee so CAS caters to my desire to shoot different weapons. 

 

If I were involved in marketing a product  and wanted some growth in sales,(WBAS for example) I'd want to include features that more potential customers would see as benefits. And SASS wants to sell memberships, affiliations, and matches.

 

To me the clarity of your statement is a most valuable contribution!  Worthy of consideration by the PTB (Powers That Be).  Certainly your idea can be implemented at many monthly matches should the management allow it.

 

Just had a thought that perhaps club organizational structures should include a Vice President CAS and a Vice President WBAS to lend support to both disciplines  If there existed any bias against WBAS or toward CAS within a club, that change could be an equalizer.

 

Now I've just strained my shoulder from patting myself on the back for such creativity!:lol:

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12 hours ago, Taquila Tab, Sass #25048 said:

1.  I am a COWBOY action shooter.  There's nothing cowboy about WB.

2.  I am a member of the Single Action Shooting Society.  There's nothing single action about a 1911.

3.  I am trying to emulate the time period 1866-1900.  I don't think the 1911s were around during that time period.

4.  I too dislike the Wild Bunch movie.

5.  I don't like trying to find the brass that is thrown around.

6.  In my area they tried implementing WB as part of the regular match inter mixing WB shooters in the same posse during the regular match. IMHO if folks want to shoot WB at a separate time more power to them but it really left a sour taste in my mouth after driving a couple of hours one-way to attend a cowboy match only to have WB thrown into the match.

 

Actually a 1911 is a single action...

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12 hours ago, Taquila Tab, Sass #25048 said:

1.  I am a COWBOY action shooter.  There's nothing cowboy about WB.

2.  I am a member of the Single Action Shooting Society.  There's nothing single action about a 1911.

3.  I am trying to emulate the time period 1866-1900.  I don't think the 1911s were around during that time period.

4.  I too dislike the Wild Bunch movie.

5.  I don't like trying to find the brass that is thrown around.

6.  In my area they tried implementing WB as part of the regular match inter mixing WB shooters in the same posse during the regular match. IMHO if folks want to shoot WB at a separate time more power to them but it really left a sour taste in my mouth after driving a couple of hours one-way to attend a cowboy match only to have WB thrown into the match.

 

Actually a 1911 is a single action...

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Grouchy Spike,

 

If you're looking for a 'wish list' for WB changes to entice more shooters, I will give you my thoughts.  (Note: these are just my 'wishes', as I am going to shoot WB either way)

  • Drop the caliber requirement for the rifle to include the .3X calibers.  I sure would like to run my cowboy '73 in .357 to be more competitive in WB.  I have a '73 in 45 for WB, but it's not setup the same as my Cowboy rifle.  Some don't have .40 or larger to even meet the minimum rule.
  • At least for Modern: (this will allow a lot more 1911's to get pulled from the safe or carry holster to be used in WB)
    • Drop the min. barrel length on the 1911.  I, like many I imagine, have carry 1911's we would like to shoot that are Commander or smaller length.
    • Drop the bull barrel restriction.  Why is this even a restriction?  Same as above.  A higher end 1911 someone wants to use may have a bull barrel.
    • Drop the extended mag release and the Slide release restrictions.  
    • Drop the mag base pad restriction.  Why make shooters buy new mags just to shoot WB?

Totes

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7 minutes ago, Totes Magoats said:

Grouchy Spike,

 

If you're looking for a 'wish list' for WB changes to entice more shooters, I will give you my thoughts.  (Note: these are just my 'wishes', as I am going to shoot WB either way)

  • Drop the caliber requirement for the rifle to include the .3X calibers.  I sure would like to run my cowboy '73 in .357 to be more competitive in WB.  I have a '73 in 45 for WB, but it's not setup the same as my Cowboy rifle.  Some don't have .40 or larger to even meet the minimum rule.
  • At least for Modern: (this will allow a lot more 1911's to get pulled from the safe or carry holster to be used in WB)
    • Drop the min. barrel length on the 1911.  I, like many I imagine, have carry 1911's we would like to shoot that are Commander or smaller length.
    • Drop the bull barrel restriction.  Why is this even a restriction?  Same as above.  A higher end 1911 someone wants to use may have a bull barrel.
    • Drop the extended mag release and the Slide release restrictions.  

Totes

 

In addition to this list (my 1911's don't qualify as they are set up for USPSA Limited 10, I'd like to see those allowed, along with 10 round mags - again it's all I have):

- change the rules to remove the requirement to shoot to slide lock

- change shooting strings to take better advantage of the capabilities of a 1911, break the SASS paradigm of 5 and 5. 

- Allow shooters that are interested to use a 10 round mag and engage rifle targets with their 1911 (I'd really like this)

 

WB is a different game from normal CAS.  Embrace that.

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44 minutes ago, Smokestack said:

Actually a 1911 is a single action...

Technically you are correct of course, but it clearly is not in the same ilk as the Colt SAA and clones where the hammer has to be manually cocked before firing each shot.

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1 hour ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Fair enough Grouchy Spike.

 

  • Opening up the restrictions in Wild Bunch to include more of the guns in the movie. Like the S&W model 10, for instance. If the stage called for 7 shots and a reload, then so be it.

I think Wild Bunch is a fantastic concept and would be a lot of fun. On another note I was very interested in Zoot Shooters competitions but I am not buying a Thompson to play and that seems to be the "gun of choice" for that shooting sport. When shooting a concept genre but only catering to one type of small arm people limit the expansion of it. Yes, there must be restrictions and rules but opening things up a bit more to include "safe" and realistic guns of the era might attract more enthusiasm. How many people would shoot CAS if one could only use Colt revolvers, '73 Winchesters & clones and 97 shotguns?

 

Being one that has never shot WB maybe I am "all wet" and don't have a clue, but I might have a clue if things were a bit more open. I would never want to see WB turn into something that it was never intended to be but to my understanding it didn't start out as "you can only use 1911's and 97's and model 12's and large caliber pistol cartridge rifles." But like I said, maybe I am "all wet".

 

Just trying to be clear before I step off this soap box. Apologies for the long answer.

This! 

Even the guys that I sometimes shoot IPDA have some safe queens like lugers or 1917 revolvers.  They would never take them to a IPDA match but given a chance to exercise them and have fun in a somewhat competitive environment they just might.  Enough shoot glocks, and 1911s already, the chance to perhaps have another venue to do something with some of these older ones might catch a few as well.

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We have a dedicated WBAS club at Diamond Dick's Cowboy Town, which is at a big range that is home to many shooting disciplines. We do not need to allow a WB category with this club existing.

 

Our WBAS club has some shooters that do not shoot CAS. I haven't been to a monthly in a while. Last time I was shot a monthly, there were three non-CAS shooters. One of them was a CAS shooter; but he sold his CAS pistols. One teaches CC classes. Another shoots an action pistol sport. Part of the draw could be that the MD is also the parent range's General Manager. So, he is out and about spreading the word. Every monthly match I've been too has had enough shooters for one or two posses.

 

Also, the MD allows folks to use different caliber guns at monthlies. This club, Gold Country Wild Bunch has been home to all of the CA State WBAS championships, which follow all WBAS rules. I do shoot the State match.

 

Regards,

 

Allie

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Thanks to all for your responses and contributions!

 

I do not recall any comments or objections from CAS shooters about target distance in WBAS which are usually set further out than for CAS.  Are there any objections by CAS shooters to the difference that would be a game killer?

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17 hours ago, Yul Lose said:

Exactly right. If you want to expand the WB match attendance it seems like you'd want people there that shoot cowboy and might want to try WB. I've also been told that I can't use a Lightning rifle at WB matches. 

That surprises me   I used my Lighting for WB at EoT last year.  And if there is anyplace that shoot WB very strictly to the SASS rules, it's there.

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16 hours ago, Church Key, SASS # 33713 said:

I actually prefer WB over CAS as it is far more difficult and unpredictable than a usual CAS match. It's easy to shoot clean matches in CAS (just slow down a bit), but almost impossible to do with WB, due to little targets set out a far distance. Love stoking the 97. And remember, what could possible go wrong using a 1911 and 97 in speed matches as they were state-of-the-art 100+ years ago?  I've never seen a <20 second stage in WB, while they happen all the time in CAS. Any malfunction with a 1911 can cause big time brain fades when remembering where you were/round count issues. Power factor's create recoil matters, and "no shotgun makeups" require a bit of aiming and heavy shells. The 6 rounds in a 97 issue is a smoke screen, as a $30 Wild Tom Body upgrade cures it. 

 

I agree that the .40 cal. rifle rule is a big issue. My local clubs (in MD, WV, and PA) have all changed to allowing <.40 cal. provided they make the power factor, e.g., 158 gr. at 1000 FPS. I sort of like the 5 round 1911 limit as it is much easier on my feeble mind to keep track of sequences. Perhaps a club could experiment with trying 7 and review the results and feedback. Finally, in my opinion, shooting a CAS match with WB rules is not WB; it's far too easy as the targets are too close. Also, WB is not a sport for those who are recoil sensitive or who have strength issues with racking 1911 slides. 

 

Church Key

 

 

 

A few comments...  

 

Other than at EoT where they did it very strict by the SASS rules, every other place that I have shot it has the targets at standard CAS distances and size, and I have seen people shoot the matches clean.  The only exception to that is has been that if your rifle was in a "rifle caliber cartridge" at places that use the "pre-Sass" rules and allow for it, those targets were a little farther out for safety reasons.  And even at places where they closely followed the SASS rules, EoT was the first time/place I ever shot WB that didn't allow you to reengage shot gun targets. 

 

In fact, the fact that it was apparenty impossible to shoot WB clean, cuz nobody did, at EoT last year was actually a turn off for me.  There's no way I'm gonna win any speed matches, but shooting clean is a goal I can at least try for.

 

I must also strenously disagree with the idea that the 6 round issue is a smoke screen.  $30 may not be much, but you have just required me to make a modification to one of my classic firearms.  I don't like to change my guns.   I like them in stock condition.  I like to use them the way they were designed and made.  To have a requirement where a shooter MUST modify his gun from the way it was made is a bad thing.

 

If you keep the pistol sequences in multiples of 5, (and have only 1 reload) it can indeed be shot concurrently with a standard Cowboy match with no problems,  Seen it done many times, and there was always a good turn out at the shoots that did it.  The scores are simply kep separate.    But to be honest, I don't like the 4, 5 or more mag changes with the 1911.  It gets a little tedious after a while.   (Although, I must at admit that doing it left handed does give me an edge over right handed shooters.)

 

Finally, the only reason to limit the round count 5 in the 1911 is if you also going to allow other early automatics and period DA reovlers so that everyone is assured of being able to shoot the same number of rounds.  If you're gonna go 1911's only ,there is no logica reason to not load 7 in the mag.   Just set out 7 targets instead of 5.  

 

 

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Our WBAS matches are very different than SASS. WB uses more KDs, Dueling trees, hostage/hostage taker, plate racks, tombstone racks, and rifle targets are farther out. We shoot rifle targets with the pistol too.

 

Most SASS matches use 4 SG KDs (lollypops) with an occasional 6. WBAS uses 6 SG KD and sometimes 8. On the stage with 8, there are 4 lollypops, two cowboy KDs that launch birds. The really fast shooters hit the cowboy, then a couple of lollypops, then the bird.

 

The folks who do not shoot CAS would likely be bored at a CAS match after shooting WBAS.

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1 hour ago, Grouchy Spike said:

target distance in WBAS which are usually set further out than for CAS

Truth be told I wish CAS targets were out further...but don't tell anybody that I said that...:rolleyes::D

 

To answer your question - "No".

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There are several factors keeping me away

 

1) I shoot .38s, I'm not interested in investing 1000s of dollars into another caliber rifle, reloading equipment for my Dillion, and brass.

 

2) most WB matches I've seen elevate the pistol round count by having you repeat the same shooting sequence multiple times, sometimes from multiple positions, but still the same sequence.  This repetitive shooting doesn't excite me

 

3) as a former (and still sometimes) moder uspsa/steel shooter, several of the rules seem unnecessary restricting, and confusing

 

examples like: 

a gun is safe with a round in the chamber, and 4 rounds in the magazine, however if you eject that magazine and insert a magazine with 5 rounds in it while that same  round is still in the chamber, it's a DQ????

 

 

Also I keep hearing "wild bunch isn't cowboy with a 1911". However the 5 round magazine limit sure seems like a holdover from cowboy. And requires more magazines, and magazine holders for a high round count stage. 

 

 

   In my humble opinion 

if WB continues to market to, and follow rules aimed at cowboy shooters, than that's all they will get, and when you figure the added expense, added skill sets, and added time involved, not many people will be willing to take up a second shooting discipline that is basically the same in the majority of ways as SASS.  They would rather just shoot more sass matches, or spend the time improving cowboy.  

 

 

  I personally believe that growing wildbunch will require making it "the next evolution" in a shooting career, not just a lateral step on the same ladder. It will need to be exciting enough to grab the interest of people who feel cowboy is getting stale, and are looking for a new challenge.  

 

 

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1 hour ago, H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 said:

That surprises me   I used my Lighting for WB at EoT last year.  And if there is anyplace that shoot WB very strictly to the SASS rules, it's there.

I was told that since there were no Lightnings used in the WB movie that they weren't legal for the game. Jackaroo reiterated it in one of his posts on this subject. Why no 16 gauge 1897's, they'll stoke and knockdown targets just like a 12 gauge will? 

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Whether you like WB or not, this has been one of the most productive threads on the Wire in some time. No fighting or petty bickering......proud of ya'll




 




CS


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I have only shot WB one time but absolutely loved it. The reason I have only shot at one time is because most clubs in my area do not offer it as a monthly. I have to drive almost three hours to find a Wild Bunch match but after having tried it I will certainly do that now. 

 

I have always been a 1911 shooter so that's only a natural extension of my shooting interests but I would love to see seven round magazine loads instead of 5. 5 shots is simply antithetical to what 1911 shooters want and need. 

 

As I shoot Classic Cowboy I only have large calibers AND SO I needed either a 97 or Model 12 to play WB. I have no problem buying additional guns to compete in a different shooting sport. No, I am not wealthy at all. But they are guns, man! More guns is always good. So I bought a Model 12.  And then I bought another Model 12 just because the first one  was 103 years old and I did not want to beat it up and Wild Bunch. B) Even if I only use them once or twice a year. And hell yes I will buy a Thompson to shoot Zoot Suit because it's a Thompson (kind of). No problem there either (it's another gun after all) and I understand some of them are quirky as anything to get running sometimes. Would I like to see the Thompson is part of Wild Bunch? Not necessarily although I would not object. It was not in the movie so I don't really care. But using double action revolvers sure seems like it could be a positive addition to the game.

 

Wild Bunch could probably grow as its own standalone game if there was a little bit more flexibility in what the competitors could use within the rules. Why hamper something so stringently? Why only a 12 gauge? Why only a 45 ACP 1911? To keep things even for the competitors? Plenty of people shoot 45 Colt in Wrangler and Cowboy class against the 38 caliber shooters. Maybe allowing a 9mm 1911 might entice more shooters for various reasons.

 

I recently had an opportunity to buy a beautiful Winchester 97 shotgun and plenty of ammo ( swap meet at a recent Cowboy match from a fellow shooter.) What kept me from doing it was it was 16 gauge and I would not be able to use it in Wild Bunch which is why I wanted one. I don't remember anywhere in the movie The Wild Bunch where we were explicitly told that Pike and Dutch and the guys were using 12 gauges. 

 

A little flexibility in Wild Bunch might go a long way.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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A full mag! :D

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1 minute ago, Cypress Sun said:


Whether you like WB or not, this has been one of the most productive threads on the Wire in some time. No fighting or petty bickering......proud of ya'll

CS

Agree.  I'm still sorting through that information. 

 

The objection to rifle caliber requirement is probably most frequently mentioned.

 

Where no local Wild Bunch matches are offered, that may be a LOCAL solution.  If the SASS match design doesn't suit enough potential shooters, modify the requirements.  Brazos John at the Texas Historical Shooting Society describes that on Page 1.  Bring what you have and shoot it.  I'd bet that unless it's a collectible firearm the owner has intent to shoot it.  So why not make it easy and where better than on a range already set up for cowboy?  You can bet, cowboys being somewhat competitive shooters, that there would be an eventual justification for the purchase of additional weaponry to gain some seconds!  At the least, there would be some good fun.  The challenge is to capitalize on that locally and maintain that momentum.

 

That concept could give rise to a Military Match as compared to a Wild Bunch Match: military revolvers as well as semiautos and military rifles maybe through WW1 although if your run that out to WW2 it could include the P38 and Webley and Nambu etc and the BAMM rifles already in possession by many; military shotguns including the humpback Browning semi and modern clone as well as those SxS and pump SGs already in use. 

 

The Sand Creek Raiders (thanks to the cowboy who included that link in this thread) offer ideas to a successful concept.

 

Thinking about Palewolf's M1917 Browning, wouldn't it be over the top to have that MG in a scenario - 5 to 10 rounds of bolt action military rifle to snipe at distant enemy, then blast 10 rounds from the MG at a couple of closer targets, then two magazines or cylinders of pistol at real close enemy, and finally a SG to knock the enemy from your trenches!

 

We must bring the citizens into the church before we can baptize them!  Crawl before walking, etc.

 

Continue with comments, cowboys and cowgirls!  I'll bet that the PTB are watching this thread and reading your comments.

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16 minutes ago, Whiskey_Kid said:

A full mag! :D

Hey cowboy, you are blazing fast with those cowboy guns.  Have you mastered that 1911 yet?

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3 minutes ago, Grouchy Spike said:

Hey cowboy, you are blazing fast with those cowboy guns.  Have you mastered that 1911 yet?

More of a Jack of all trades master of none!

 

You have posed the question, what would make it more fun...I say more rounds in the mag!  We always shoot 5 with Cowboy, because our guns hold 5 safely, why not 7 in the 1911 since it will hold 7?

 

WK

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On June 14, 2017 at 5:09 PM, Hoss said:

 

 

Loading 7 would make sense. I also wish they would allow shotgun make ups.

I agree. 

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This has been a very interesting post.  Without doubt some rule changes could be made to facilitate drawing a few more shooters.  However, a lot of the posts demonstrate one of the tenants of WB, i.e., to forestall an equipment race.  For example, from an earlier post:

 

"That concept could give rise to a Military Match as compared to a Wild Bunch Match: military revolvers as well as semiautos and military rifles maybe through WW1 although if your run that out to WW2 it could include the P38 and Webley and Nambu etc and the BAMM rifles already in possession by many; military shotguns including the humpback Browning semi and modern clone as well as those SxS and pump SGs already in use."

 

So, will the shooters be wearing Nazi uniforms or Japanese uniforms or British Tommy uniforms?  If the field of usable firearms is completely open what does it have to do with SASS?  At that point it is just a bunch of guys and gals out shooting guns.  I can go to a public range and do that any day of the week.  The WB rules may need tweaking but some of the suggestions made would completely destroy what WB is and was intended to be.  WB has a small but dedicated following.  An "anything goes" type of format would probably drive people out of WB rather than bringing new people in.

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You're welcome to run it like you think it should be run in many other disciplines. Go for your life. LOL

We don't all have to be the same? 

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59 minutes ago, Tony Crowe said:

I agree. 

May as well stay with cowboy then. You want the targets bigger and closer too? 

I think many have forgotten what the original concept was of WB was particular in NOT making like cowboy.!

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32 minutes ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

This has been a very interesting post.  Without doubt some rule changes could be made to facilitate drawing a few more shooters.  However, a lot of the posts demonstrate one of the tenants of WB, i.e., to forestall an equipment race.  For example, from an earlier post:

 

"That concept could give rise to a Military Match as compared to a Wild Bunch Match: military revolvers as well as semiautos and military rifles maybe through WW1 although if your run that out to WW2 it could include the P38 and Webley and Nambu etc and the BAMM rifles already in possession by many; military shotguns including the humpback Browning semi and modern clone as well as those SxS and pump SGs already in use."

 

So, will the shooters be wearing Nazi uniforms or Japanese uniforms or British Tommy uniforms?  If the field of usable firearms is completely open what does it have to do with SASS?  At that point it is just a bunch of guys and gals out shooting guns.  I can go to a public range and do that any day of the week.  The WB rules may need tweaking but some of the suggestions made would completely destroy what WB is and was intended to be.  WB has a small but dedicated following.  An "anything goes" type of format would probably drive people out of WB rather than bringing new people in.

Yup. And it probably will remain so. Not everything needs to be made "bigger and better".Look what they did to the Mustang and Corvette! :lol:

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