Widder, SASS #59054 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Basic stage instructions state firearms can be fired in ANY order but rifle not last. ALSO, Shotgun KD's engaged in any order AND MAKE UPS AT ANY TIME. Shooter starts with SG and fires off 4 quickies at the KD's. Quickly slams the SG down on the table and draws AND cocks first pistol. Somebody yells: 'UP'. Shooter runs his first 5 downrange (EDIT: on the targets) and then with 2nd Pistol, runs the other 5 rounds on the targets. picks up rifle and run 10 rounds on targets. THEN, picks SG back up and REengages the last SG KD. 'P' or No Call ? ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Tom Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 no call. guns any order don't finish with rifle he followed the instructions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diamond S Doug Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Shot gun was last and makeups were made at any time, Good run, next cowboy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Short Term Emory Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 No call, next shooter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT. ELI 35882 GUNFIGHTER Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 No call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dang It Dan 13202 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 I would insist that everyone else shoot it that way.......except for me of course. Next Shooter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major BS Walker Regulator Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 I assume that first pistol 5 shots downrange meant not on targets. The call is 5 misses and a P for fireing a different gun before finishing the previous string. Could throw in a SPG for the 5 shots downrange but 5 misses and a P are quite enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiowa Kid, SASS #69870L Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Basic stage instructions state firearms can be fired in ANY order but rifle not last. ALSO, Shotgun KD's engaged in any order AND MAKE UPS AT ANY TIME. Shooter starts with SG and fires off 4 quickies at the KD's. Quickly slams the SG down on the table and draws AND cocks first pistol. Somebody yells: 'UP'. Shooter runs his first 5 downrange and then with 2nd Pistol, runs the other 5 rounds on the targets. picks up rifle and run 10 rounds on targets. THEN, picks SG back up and REengages the last SG KD. 'P' or No Call ? ..........Widder my question is shotgun made up anytime during shotgun string or anytime during the shooting of the stage the clarification of the statement will make a world of difference. KK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 BS Walker, sorri for being alittle unclear. The 1st five rounds were to the correct targets. They were not fired just 'downrange'. I EDITED my OT. Hope that clarifies that. ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Bill Burt Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Basic stage instructions state firearms can be fired in ANY order but rifle not last. ALSO, Shotgun KD's engaged in any order AND MAKE UPS AT ANY TIME. Shooter starts with SG and fires off 4 quickies at the KD's. Quickly slams the SG down on the table and draws AND cocks first pistol. Somebody yells: 'UP'. Shooter runs his first 5 downrange and then with 2nd Pistol, runs the other 5 rounds on the targets. picks up rifle and run 10 rounds on targets. THEN, picks SG back up and REengages the last SG KD. 'P' or No Call ? ..........Widder As several have said before me I would read any order as exactly that, if you want to shoot split shotgun, do it, make up at any time means exactly that, any time. No call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted March 27, 2013 Author Share Posted March 27, 2013 my question is shotgun made up anytime during shotgun string or anytime during the shooting of the stage the clarification of the statement will make a world of difference. KK now that is a good question. and here is where the situation could become cloudy. The written stage instructions concerning the SG targets were: MAKE UPS AT ANY TIME. did it mean 'during the SG run' or did it really mean 'ANYTIME'. Because firearm order was non-specific, I took it to literally mean 'ANYTIME'. Personally, I wouldn't think shooting split SG would be any different than deciding to split the pistols on this kind of stage. If it trully is a shooters choice (except for rifle), then how can it be interpreted any other way? ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 how else can you define ANY TIME? no call cpbc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother King, SASS #69031 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 how else can you define ANY TIME? no call cpbc +1 seems clear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom, SASS #54973 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 No call...definitely no benefit to the shooter for doin what he did... Good for a few laughs...nice "stage management"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fillmore Coffins, SASS #7884 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 No Call. Heck, nothing in the instructions says the shooter can't shoot 2 SG, 5 pistol, 5 rifle, 5 pistol, 5 more rifle, and then pick up the other 2 SG targets. Used to see silliness like this "back in the day". Fillmore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graywolf Tate Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 No call Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Canyon Kid #43974 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 We see folks all the time trying to read something into stage instructions based on adding extra meaning that was not there. If it is not in the instructions do not try to add it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaky Molasses, SASS 20549 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 No call. Shooter did it exactly as the stage directions called for. I wonder what shooter would have done if he had not failed to knock down a SG target. Would have have split the pistols? Because the rifle was not allowed to be the last gun fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fingers McGee Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 +19 - no call, next shooter Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curly Red Ryder Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 No call. Shooter did it exactly as the stage directions called for. I wonder what shooter would have done if he had not failed to knock down a SG target. Would have have split the pistols? Because the rifle was not allowed to be the last gun fired. PO says:"Basic stage instructions state firearms can be fired in ANY order but rifle not last." nothing is forbidding to unsplit the pistols...so SG, pistol 1, rifle, pistol 2 (so GF in Double duelist) sounds fine for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bama Red Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Gotta agree - no call! Next shooter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Was the Stage titled "Create Your Own Train Wreck?" No Call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adirondack Jack, SASS #53440 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 It doesn't matter what he woulda done had he not missed on the SG. What matters is what was on the written stage instructions. I am told that in law, this is what is known as a "four corners" question. If it is NOT within the four corners of the paper, it doesn't exist, eg, in a contract..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Junky Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 how else can you define ANY TIME? no call cpbc +1 I use that all the time.......and I get ask the same thing.......lol. Anythime is anytime too me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cumberland Mtn John SASS#40593 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 No call Cumberland Mtn John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypress Sun Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 What if you wanted to make up the miss in the year 1886? Would that be your first shot or your last? Inquiring minds need to know. No call. CS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arcadia Outlaw, SASS 71385 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 We see folks all the time trying to read something into stage instructions based on adding extra meaning that was not there. If it is not in the instructions do not try to add it. + 1 , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger Clayton Conagher #43872 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Seems like a no call to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 You just know the shooter didn't plan to shoot the stage this way. I gotta admire his presence of mind to keep it all together without earning a P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison Bud Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 I'd personally give the guy a hand for making the most of the situation and thinking on the fly! No call is the correct answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 IMO...anyone arguing for a "P" on this one is in dire need of a refresher course...SHB/RO1/RO2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy Boots, # 20282 LTG-Regulator Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 now that is a good question. and here is where the situation could become cloudy. The written stage instructions concerning the SG targets were: MAKE UPS AT ANY TIME. did it mean 'during the SG run' or did it really mean 'ANYTIME'. Because firearm order was non-specific, I took it to literally mean 'ANYTIME'. Personally, I wouldn't think shooting split SG would be any different than deciding to split the pistols on this kind of stage. If it trully is a shooters choice (except for rifle), then how can it be interpreted any other way? ..........Widder o Agree...no call....neeeeeeext shooter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oklahoma Dee Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Oh I just gotta know,,,,,Who was the somebody that yelled "up" ?? Friend of foe? Where was they when the stage instructions were doled out? Sleepin or what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billy Boots, # 20282 LTG-Regulator Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Seems to me shooter AND TO had it together. Both knowing anytime for makeup meant to shooter to not be alarmed by late up call and he/she could continue in their flow making up at their convience. TO did not press NOR stop shooter at end of stage when they went for shotgun again understanding anytime for this shooter was at end. I am assuming TO was in position not to see target so he/she could call "up" to shooter when it happened. Now whether it was worth time to take the makeup is another question.....if only a step or two, possiblt three, to get back to shotgun, then yes if shooter was capable of a under three second make up.......of course shooter could have been thinking clean match, that syndrone will get you sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace_of_Hearts Posted March 27, 2013 Share Posted March 27, 2013 Fortunately for the shooter that he missed a shotgun target and could make it up AFTER HE SHOT HIS RIFLE LAST. Else he would have earned a P for hitting all the targets! An interesting follow up question would be.... Could he avoid the P by shooting an extra shotgun shot after he shot his rifle? To avoid this in the future.... Club stage conventions should be..... Shotgun targets can only be made up during the shotgun string. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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