How quickly can the U.S. defend itself?

[Father Kit Cool Gun Garth]

Ann had a dream yesterday that entailed visions of our area of Central Florida being invaded by some foreign country.
Squadrons of planes firing down where she was standing. People running everywhere. Later her dream had a vessel on some body of water that was shooting at small local water craft.
Our discussion in the morning entailed a general issue:
Could this actually happen before our defenses, such as NORAD kicked in?

[Images of a Pearl Harbor attack on Florida came to mind.]

 

This is not meant to be a

        

             discussion. 

[Chantry]

For a military attack in your scenario, it is extremely unlikely that they would be allowed to get that close.  Satellites and radar* weren't available at Pearl Harbor and we didn't have the ADIZ:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_defense_identification_zone.

 

For a terrorist attack or drug cartel attack, it would (initially at least) be a law enforcement issue and the response may take a little longer as things went up the ladder of civilian leadership.

 

 

 

 

*Yes I know there was a radar site near Pearl Harbor and that it picked up the inbound Japanese aircraft.  However, radar was in it's infancy and not trusted.

[Texas Jack Black]

23 minutes ago, Father Kit Cool Gun Garth said:

Ann had a dream yesterday that entailed visions of our area of Central Florida being invaded by some foreign country.
Squadrons of planes firing down where she was standing. People running everywhere. Later her dream had a vessel on some body of water that was shooting at small local water craft.
Our discussion in the morning entailed a general issue:
Could this actually happen before our defenses, such as NORAD kicked in?

[Images of a Pearl Harbor attack on Florida came to mind.]

 

This is not meant to be a

        

             discussion. 

NO

[Ozark Huckleberry]

WOLVERINES!

 

Why would anyone go to the expense and danger of using military force to beat us when for the price of a few ‘influencers’ and some social media whizz kids they could get us to do it for them?

[Capt. R. Hugh Kidnme]

Tell her to sleep soundly. The next war will be fought with and over data, and the manipulation and control of same........

 

Now if she starts having dreams that one day she can't get the lights on, or water from the tap, ...........

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

Any real threat will come in some way or somewhere that we are not prepared.

[Cypress Sun]

 

The US is already under attack...from within. They are slow, but methodical in their attack. They are called Democrats and have been at the destruction of the US and the Constitution for many years.

[Texas Maverick]

2 hours ago, Father Kit Cool Gun Garth said:

Ann had a dream yesterday that entailed visions of our area of Central Florida being invaded by some foreign country.
Squadrons of planes firing down where she was standing. People running everywhere. Later her dream had a vessel on some body of water that was shooting at small local water craft.
Our discussion in the morning entailed a general issue:
Could this actually happen before our defenses, such as NORAD kicked in?

[Images of a Pearl Harbor attack on Florida came to mind.]

 

This is not meant to be a

        

             discussion. 

Red Dawn, they came up from Mexico just like all the illegals are doing right now. I think they would have their hands full with the 2A's getting all their guns out and having an open season with no bag limit on them.

 

TM

[J-BAR #18287]

A client who worked in Memphis, Tennessee, told me of the time he heard on the radio that Grenada had been invaded by Cubans.  He thought it was Grenada, Mississippi, just south of Memphis.  He drove home to get his guns and ammo.  
 

His wife asked him what he was doing; "I'm gonna help defend Grenada!"  After she stopped laughing, she explained the difference.

 

I give him credit for bravery, if not knowledge of geography.

 

But to the point of the topic, I'm sure Florida, or any other state, would have a large civilian militia that would quickly mobilize, probably faster than government troops, if foreign boots were on USA soil.

[Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984]

51 minutes ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

A client who worked in Memphis, Tennessee, told me of the time he heard on the radio that Grenada had been invaded by Cubans.  He thought it was Grenada, Mississippi, just south of Memphis.  He drove home to get his guns and ammo.  
 

His wife asked him what he was doing; "I'm gonna help defend Grenada!"  After she stopped laughing, she explained the difference.

 

I give him credit for bravery, if not knowledge of geography.

 

But to the point of the topic, I'm sure Florida, or any other state, would have a large civilian militia that would quickly mobilize, probably faster than government troops, if foreign boots were on USA soil.

Russia is also holding onto territory in Georgia, the OTHER Georgia.

[Cypress Sun]

58 minutes ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

But to the point of the topic, I'm sure Florida, or any other state, would have a large civilian militia that would quickly mobilize, probably faster than government troops, if foreign boots were on USA soil.

 

 

[Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967]

Well... we HAVE been invaded.  The number of people here who've illegally  crossed our southern border is the equivalent of aproximately one-third the population of california.  

[J-BAR #18287]

18 minutes ago, Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967 said:

Well... we HAVE been invaded.  The number of people here who've illegally  crossed our southern border is the equivalent of aproximately one-third the population of california.  

... and the only thing stopping the armed citizenry from taking action is our own government.

[Subdeacon Joe]

 

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

11 hours ago, Texas Jack Black said:

NO

Are you willing to bet on that?  

 

We have a few million potential "enemy soldiers" who have gotten in under our "umbrella" in the last few years already....and we're footing the bill to get them here and make them feel right at home..

[Texas Jack Black]

5 minutes ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said:

Are you willing to bet on that?  

 

We have a few million potential "enemy soldiers" who have gotten in under our "umbrella" in the last few years already....and we're footing the bill to get them here and make them feel right at home..

  Yes

 

8 minutes ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said:

Are you willing to bet on that?  

 

We have a few million potential "enemy soldiers" who have gotten in under our "umbrella" in the last few years already....and we're footing the bill to get them here and make them feel right at home..

 Not what the OP asked

[John Kloehr]

For a nation like our's there was no doubt we are activating. We spent months positioning for Iraq and Afghanistan. Maybe a little less time for Kuwait, but that was an even faster buildup and in we went.

 

I don't recall Red Dawn being Mexico, thought is was more a vague reference to maybe Nicaragua but backed by Soviets. Anyway, that movie presented a surprise attack.

 

There is no way the buildup would not be noticed months in advance. The actual attack day might not be predictable, but at a certain point an action would be assured as the cost of buildup would not be walked away from (stood down).

 

Nor could I imagine such a buildup against the US without a set of demands (refused pf course).

 

We would be no more surprised than the invaders of Kuwait, or Saddam, or the ruling council of Afghanistan. They were certainly not surprised; preparations for such an assault today can not be hidden from orbit. We might not know the day, but the preparations can not be hidden.

 

Well, nukes, but that will not go well for anyone. MAD is still the international expectation. I also do not think it would be a surprise.

 

We will have plenty of time to consider events when the sky does start falling, it is not tonight. Ann may sleep well tonight.

[Trailrider #896]

Abraham Lincoln said that if America were to fall it would be from within and not by an invading army!  Not sure if that was before or after Ft. Sumter.  What worries me is the number of people who say they won't vote in the coming election because they don't like either candidate. To me, that is just leaving it to someone else to choose or attempt to choose our leaders! I don't want to start a family fight, but I think one member is being stupid! 

[Badlands Bob #61228]

I don't fear being invaded by some foreign power.  We have the most advance military in the world and we have more guns in civilian hands than we have civilians.  My fear is a nuclear weapon being smuggled into this country and being set off.  Pick your scenario, Super Bowl, State of the Union, Olympic Games opening ceremony.    The more 3rd world countries that get the nuclear bomb (Iran, North Korea, India, Pakistan), the higher the chance that one of those things will get turned over to a terrorist group.

[Marshal Dan Troop 70448]

Lets see, we had a Chinese Balloon go over the USA for what purpose, (what if it had been a missle). We have Chinese and Russian planes recently flying into our air space. Testing us. Russians have sent several warships to Cuba.

We have let across the border known terroist, some caught, some not. 

From within we have young and old praising Hamas and flying their flag and protest from college students who may well in the future be our leaders and continue their belief. From within, withthe laws protecting them or being released with no punishment gives more power to them.

This election this year will tell if the 2nd Admendment will still be there.

This election maybe as it stands now and how a nominee was annointed may very well be a trend, were a president will at last moment drop out and put the parties heir in place.

Remember also, if you attend a school board meeting for concern of the teaching method of your children, you may well be considered a Terrorist and have the FBI investigate you.

With some illegals now put on Social security, given Drivers Licenses, being signed up to vote, and given room and board, credit cards, etc. College Debts forgiven (anyone catch the one of a Doctor having his debt forgiven and lives in a million Dollar home). We the taxpayers will be taxed to pay for these, while our Homeless and Veterans were never given the same treatment unless we stepped in to give the help.

If we can't defend our Borders, how will we defend our states, our country and who will you look upon to give the order to retaliate?

Edited July 28 by Marshal Dan Troop 70448

[Ozark Huckleberry]

12 hours ago, John Kloehr said:

We will have plenty of time to consider events when the sky does start falling

In some ways, the sky has been falling. The problem is that too many people won’t care until it’s falling on them

[Dubious Don #56333]

I felt safer in the 80's with SAC on alert 24/7. Having served during that time in Europe, I was starkly aware that as a troop on the ground in West Germany, my life expectancy should the Red Army come storming through the Fulda Gap was measured in minutes.

Back in the world, south of my home town were two squadrons of Titan II missiles that pretty much circled Tucson, AZ. Each of those 18 missiles were topped with the W53 9MT warhead. Whatever it hits simply ceases to exist, be it city or underground command bunker. As high value targets they would have targeted multiple missiles on each one, large enough to destroy a facility designed to survive an attack. They would have used a ground burst, or maybe what the USAF calls a laydown. Bomb with a parachute, lands intact on the surface. When it goes off it digs a great big hole with mega-tons of radioactive fallout. In theory, the prevailing winds would carry that mostly east and north towards New Mexico/Oklahoma maybe and parts east. Phoenix, a couple hours north might catch the edges but that type of detonation produces extremely high-rad fallout. Not good.

 

Today the Titan's are gone. There's one remaining in Green Valley, site 571-7. It's a cool tour and if you go, be sure to combine it with the Pima Air Museum in Tucson.

Anyway.

 

This isn't the 1970's. Largest warhead in inventory is 1.2MT. They are far more accurate than they were. Drop the thing right down the chimney accurate. Supposedly. We have 450 Minuteman III up north-central CONUS, and unlike the Titans, which would have survived a near-miss but not a direct hit, these sites were designed for that. Each carries three separate warheads. Highly accurate and reliable. Then there's the submarines. The exact number is unknown (classified) that are on patrol at any time. The accepted figure is seven. Each with 18 Tridents. I think they were designed for ten warheads but the in use figure is less. I think. At any rate, that's a whole lotta canned sunshine love for someone. They took all the nukes away from the Army (don't blame them, LOL) so it's up to the USAF/USN. Any aircraft used for that mission would be way down the line from the opening salvo.

 

The USAF and Navy both maintain airborne command and control aircraft. Orders for nuclear must come from the President in a specific manner. The time needed to accomplish this, given that our adversaries are quite capable of firing from a submerged location just off the coast means flight time of an incoming missile could be less than five or ten minutes. Likely prevent that order from even going out but there are backup plans. For conflicts less than the strategic release of nuclear, commanders often have specific rules of engagement to cover most situations. Other responses go up the chain. Once it gets up there, with the current administration you might be able to see how THAT will negatively affect not only our response but how our adversaries react to us. We're sort of sitting ducks right now. If the election goes badly, you can change that by a factor of oh, twenty. In the negative. We'll ALL need God's Love and Protection then.

 

With the current admin we are VERY vulnerable to that. Is that likely? Dunno. So far our adversaries have been kept at bay by our military but they see as well as we do that our government is a paper tiger. Not even that.

Glad I'm not on the tip of the spear anymore.

God Bless

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

22 hours ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

... and the only thing stopping the armed citizenry from taking action is our own government.

And the government "WE" have elected will roll over like a puppy asking to gets its tummy rubbed.  

[Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933]

Depends on how fast the DEI, CRT and 1619 coordinators could get together.

[bgavin]

Defend ourselves from External threats, or Internal?

[Forty Rod SASS 3935]

On 7/27/2024 at 4:56 PM, Texas Jack Black said:

  Yes

 

 Not what the OP asked

Sorry, but that is EXACTLY what was asked.  Read the last sentence in the original post.

[Texas Jack Black]

On 7/27/2024 at 7:56 PM, Texas Jack Black said:

  Yes

 

 Not what the OP asked

 No more sneak attacks possible

[Texas Jack Black]

7 minutes ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said:

Sorry, but that is EXACTLY what was asked.  Read the last sentence in the original post.

 Sneak attack like Pearl is not possible and that is what he wrote??

[watab kid]

musta watched pearl harbor recently - and no i think they would get intercepted like the russian/chinese bombers did recently by both UUS and canadian , i suspect our recent political situation made them think it was worth trying ,  not really a good choice but hey i suspect they thought they saw a weakness - didnt realize thats mostly fake news , 

 

besides if they put boots on the ground there is a rifle behind every blade of g5rass in spite of the liberals attempt to cancel our constitutional rights , 

[Chicken Rustler, SASS #26680]

This thread really makes me wish the Republicans were still the party they used to be, and of course the Democrats aren't gonna change and get any better. There are things being said here that are on the edge of being political and I'm not gonna add to that, but the other "side" is not the only ones doing real harm to this country.