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Alpo
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We have a vaccine for a disease. The vaccine is rushed into production, and is basically untried. The government insists that you get vaccinated. To prove what a wonderful idea this is both the president and the vice president get shown on television getting vaccinated.


Are you a cynical as I am? Do you suppose that, just possibly, they got injected with distilled water, or maybe normal saline?

 

 

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NO.  Not Cynical.  The Vaccine(s) for COVID are free life insurance.  Those whom believe otherwise are fools.

 

Your Call . . .  However we're a Lighthouse Mate.

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11 minutes ago, Alpo said:

We have a vaccine for a disease. The vaccine is rushed into production, and is basically untried. The government insists that you get vaccinated. To prove what a wonderful idea this is both the president and the vice president get shown on television getting vaccinated.


Are you a cynical as I am? Do you suppose that, just possibly, they got injected with distilled water, or maybe normal saline?

 

 

Or a spring activated needle that never penetrates skin?

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11 minutes ago, Alpo said:

We have a vaccine for a disease. The vaccine is rushed into production, and is basically untried. The government insists that you get vaccinated. To prove what a wonderful idea this is both the president and the vice president get shown on television getting vaccinated.


Are you a cynical as I am? Do you suppose that, just possibly, they got injected with distilled water, or maybe normal saline?

 

 

 

Depends on the politician, I believe that the former President did get immunized and that he was probably being given drugs even prior than that in an effort to prevent him from coming down with the disease.  The VP may not have gotten the shots as a precaution against a drastic reaction.

 

The current occupants of those positions, probably not, but I also recognize I am not completely objective.

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Posted (edited)

I believe such inaccurate speculation and innuendo are beneath even the semi-low standards of conversation found here in the Saloon. 
 

I’m sure there are conspiracy sites more suited to your question. 

Edited by Charlie Harley, #14153
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If Freedom is to work, then the government cannot force anyone to get a vaccination.  But if Freedom is to work, individuals must bear the consequences of their choices.  Get the government out of the Health Care business, allow insurance companies to write policies specifically tailored to the individual's risks.  You don't want the vaccine, fine, but then your health insurance premium goes up a bit to reflect the increased risk you face for the expenses if you get the disease.

 

My wife and I are beyond reproductive age.  Why should we be charged a health insurance premium that includes having a baby?  We don't smoke.  Why should our health insurance premium include the risk of smoking associated conditions and diseases.  We are not obese.  Why should our health insurance premium reflect the risks associated with obesity?

 

If insurance companies could truly compete without the government mandating coverages, then the overall price of health care would be reduced.

 

To the original question:  my decision to get vaccinated did not depend on the endorsement of any other person, politician, celebrity, etc. Freedom means they make their decisions, I make mine, and we accept the consequences of those decisions.

 

Which may go to show how unfree we are. 

 

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I find it amazing that I had the Moderna injections (both of them) and I haven’t turned into a raging leftist tree hugging Communist! I even had both injections at Disneyland, which should had sent me over the edge. I did, however catch myself looking at a pair of Birkenstock’s a while back so perhaps the vaccine is very slow acting. It does work with your RNA which will definitely alter your DNA and I am hoping that this change results in my becoming a Velociraptor. I mean, if you’re going to convert to something why not convert to something badass, right? With my new bitchin’ razor sharp talon hands I will definitely be able to reach the triggers on my large frame Glocks so not only will I have tremendous speed, agility and senses I will have a head full of teeth and a brace of evil black guns to dance with. 
Man, I hope I turn fluorescent green with red pinstripes. How cool would that be?

 

My name is Pat Riot and I approve massages…:P

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32 minutes ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

If Freedom is to work, then the government cannot force anyone to get a vaccination.  But if Freedom is to work, individuals must bear the consequences of their choices.  Get the government out of the Health Care business, allow insurance companies to write policies specifically tailored to the individual's risks.  You don't want the vaccine, fine, but then your health insurance premium goes up a bit to reflect the increased risk you face for the expenses if you get the disease.

 

My wife and I are beyond reproductive age.  Why should we be charged a health insurance premium that includes having a baby?  We don't smoke.  Why should our health insurance premium include the risk of smoking associated conditions and diseases.  We are not obese.  Why should our health insurance premium reflect the risks associated with obesity?

 

If insurance companies could truly compete without the government mandating coverages, then the overall price of health care would be reduced.

 

To the original question:  my decision to get vaccinated did not depend on the endorsement of any other person, politician, celebrity, etc. Freedom means they make their decisions, I make mine, and we accept the consequences of those decisions.

 

Which may go to show how unfree we are. 

 

 

The basic precept of insurance is to spread risk widely among as many insureds as possible, lowering the cost of insurance to an affordable level.  If you allowed people to exclude the cost of the risks that they believe they will not incur, you basically end up as a self-insurer, or as an uninsured person, if for any reason you do become ill.  Taking your example, you don't smoke so you want to exclude lung disease from the risks you are insured against.  But many people become ill from lung conditions other than smoking; will your insurer now refuse to pay for your treatment?  Can you imagine what a patchwork of specialized policies would need to be created, and how much litigation there would be over coverage disputes?  If only folks who might become pregnant buy coverage for preganancy, you are reducing the pool of available premiums by at least 50%, making such coverage twice as expensive, forcing many folks to go without such coverage because of its prohibitive cost.  Be careful what you wish for; if such "custom" policies were available, and many folks excluded coverage for uncommon disorders from their policies, you could find yourself paying exhorbitant premiums if you suffer from an uncommon disease that requires expensive meds; in effect, a death sentence if you can't pay the premiums.

 

LL

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On the other hand, if there were only self- insured people and health insurance did not exist, the costs of medical treatment would go down radically.  If doctors and hospitals kept their present exorbitant fees without insurance claims they would quickly go out of business.  I think a free market solution without government intervention would find a way to balance patient needs with enough compensation for doctors and nurses and pharmaceutical research.  Why are not-for-profit hospitals always adding facilities?  They have to spend all the money coming in to maintain their not-for-profit status.  Medical bills are high because insurance will pay for it, not the other way around.

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I got my shots Cause they where made by Pres Trump 

I did get a black eye from the second shot 

I was drooling over some very cute young nurses and GF smacked me 

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1 minute ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

Medical bills are high because insurance will pay for it, not the other way around.

Not exactly.

 

When I was thinking about having cataract surgery, I asked the doctor what it cost. Was going to have it done and cut him a check. He asked if I had insurance, and when I told him no, he advised me to get insurance. So I got health coverage at work solely to pay for my eye surgery.

 

When I got the bill the surgery for one eye was $2,200. The cost of the surgical suite was $1,200. So $3,400 to have one eye done. Then I got the notice from Blue Cross.

 

THE DOCTOR CHARGED $2,200. WE OFFERED HIM $850. HE ACCEPTED IT. BILL IS PAID IN FULL. THE SURGICAL SUITE CHARGED $1,200. WE OFFERED $410. THEY ACCEPTED IT. BILL IS PAID IN FULL.

 

The next time I went to see the doctor, I asked that if they were willing to accept $850 for the surgery, why didn't they just charge $850 for the surgery. It would have been almost cheaper for me to cut him a check to have my eyes fixed then to pay for the damn medical insurance. They told me that if they charged $850 for the surgery, Blue Cross would pay them $200. To get the $850 they actually need to cover expenses and make a profit, they have to charge $2,200. Because that's the way medical insurance works.

 

I have occasionally gone to see the doctor and paid with insurance. And every single time I got a similar notice from Blue Cross. DOCTOR CHARGED X AMOUNT OF MONEY, WE OFFERED HIM (BASICALLY 30% OF THAT), AND HE TOOK IT. PAID IN FULL.

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Posted (edited)

It’s important to note that healthcare providers artificially inflate prices. Insurance companies discount the charges, so the providers jack the price higher to get the higher amount that insurance will pay as an agreed percentage.


The healthcare providers won’t give you the same rate as that they offer a big insurance company!

 

THESE  are the things that need reform in the healthcare and insurance industries!!

 

 

 

Edited by Blackwater 53393
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2 hours ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

We are not obese.

This is an area that genetics come into to play. Many studies have shown many people are predisposed to coronary issues even though they are not obese! I have two friends who take cholesterol meds. They are thin, eat well and exercise. One is even on a special diet to maintain her weight. As in she's too thin. My family are all big Germans with a tendency to lay on fat even if we eat right, genetics. None of us have ever had any heart issues. 

Insurance is meant that the many help offset the few who need it. Same with car insurance.

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Posted (edited)

I believe, I’m not cynical at least not with this topic.

Edited by Rye Miles #13621
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3 hours ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

I find it amazing that I had the Moderna injections (both of them) and I haven’t turned into a raging leftist tree hugging Communist! I even had both injections at Disneyland, which should had sent me over the edge. I did, however catch myself looking at a pair of Birkenstock’s a while back so perhaps the vaccine is very slow acting. It does work with your RNA which will definitely alter your DNA and I am hoping that this change results in my becoming a Velociraptor. I mean, if you’re going to convert to something why not convert to something badass, right? With my new bitchin’ razor sharp talon hands I will definitely be able to reach the triggers on my large frame Glocks so not only will I have tremendous speed, agility and senses I will have a head full of teeth and a brace of evil black guns to dance with. 
Man, I hope I turn fluorescent green with red pinstripes. How cool would that be?

 

My name is Pat Riot and I approve massages…:P

Run for Congress, Pat!

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For those that want to take the shot(s), that is fine. Your health, so far, is up to you, and you make the decisions as to what to do.

For those that have not had the shot(s), that is fine, as well. Some prefer to see what the short, and perhaps the long term side-effects are, if any.

Some would like to see how effective the shot(s) is/are against the disease. 

Some wonder how effective a treatment is, that has only had months to formulate, test, and put out there. Most vaccines takes longer to develop. 

Some, who were affiliated with the government, either employed by them, or who were in the military, simply do not have a lot of faith, and/or trust, in anything to do with the government. 

Bottom line is, so far, a lot of treatments are up to us to either accept, or reject, or to put-off for a wait and see. 

If anyone disagrees with someone else's decision, that is fine, we are all free to disagree. One might not wish to be disagreeABLE, however. 

If I don't take the shot, and the shot works great, then those that have taken the shot should not be worried.

If I don't take the shot, and the shot turns out to not work, very well, or at all...or, there are tough side effects, then me not taking the shot won't matter either.

If one believes enough in the vaccines, to take the shot(s), then it should not matter what anyone else decides to do. If what you believe is true, then you're protected.

 

My Two Bits.

W.K. 

 

  

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8 minutes ago, Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 said:

Maybe this explains Biden's dementia and Kamala's idiotic laughing.  Vaccine side effects?

They had those things way before Covid!!

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Some folks are "naturally" vaccinated. ;)

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