Ripsaw Posted October 8, 2015 Posted October 8, 2015 Wondering about the B-Western category, thinking I might try it. Just been shooting as a senior so far. I think I've fixed my Rossi '92 with the advice you guys provided a couple weeks ago. So I have a gun for that category. I started watching some of the old westerns on TV (encore western channel on DirecTV rocks) and for the first time, I'm noticing the outfits on the actors on all these shows--Wyatt Earp, Gunsmoke, Bat Masterson, Chyenne, Dead or Alive, etc.--the ALL seem to be wearing vests and scarves. Nobody wears suspenders and everybody has the drop holster set up. So the question is this--is this the source of the rules for B Western? Only problem is, none have the fancy embroidered shirts that are required for this category. Also, the reason for the rifle rule? I see plenty of what look like '73s in these shows. I guess I'm just curious, how the rules for B Western evolved, and why there is even a "costume" category at all. I'm guessing it's just for fun? Seems that way to me. Thoughts?
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted October 8, 2015 Posted October 8, 2015 Coyote Calhoun was the force behind B Western,,, it is to be more like Roy Rogers as far as dress is concerned.. you are expected to dress "flashy". the rifle,,, I have no clue as to why,,, just because....
Goody, SASS #26190 Posted October 8, 2015 Posted October 8, 2015 Coyote Calhoun (RIP) was the driving force behind this category. And yes, it was to honor the westerns we grew up watching.
LostVaquero Posted October 8, 2015 Posted October 8, 2015 Not sure as to rifle but when most of these came out and a lot of Wayne movies the rifle was a 92. I believe in Paladin the few times a rifle showed up it was a Marlin 94.
Rye Miles #13621 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 I agree, it's mostly a Roy Rogers, Gene Autry type thing! Flashy, loud and "nancy" like! Ya know just like Cheyenne!!
Marauder SASS #13056 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 We also already had the Classic Cowboy category for the older style rifles, so Coyote wanted a category for the newer model rifles. And the majority of films & tv used 1892 models - even dolled up as Henry's, model 66's, etc.
J-BAR #18287 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 If they made shirts with smiley pockets in my size, I would probably play! 😀
Ace_of_Hearts Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 If they made shirts with smiley pockets in my size, I would probably play! B Western shirts are not required to have smiley pockets.
Smokestack SASS#87384 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 B Western shirts are not required to have smiley pockets. Who would want to wear one with frowny pockets?
Red Cent Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Calhoun, along with San Quentin, invented the "choose your category wisely".
Smokestack SASS#87384 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Calhoun, along with San Quentin, invented the "choose your category wisely". Taking digs at people who are not around to defend themselves is bad form, IMO.
Four Bucks #36386 Life Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 If you want to see the impetus for the B Western category...find and watch "Rustler's Rhapsody". 4 Bucks
J-BAR #18287 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 B Western shirts are not required to have smiley pockets. My B Western shirts would have to have smiley pockets. 😉
Ripsaw Posted October 9, 2015 Author Posted October 9, 2015 OK, what exactly is a smiley pocket? From my avatar, at age 4, you can see I was wearing a Roy Rogers outfit. If you go to my profile page, the picture is bigger and shows more of the outfit.
Smokestack SASS#87384 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 OK, what exactly is a smiley pocket? From my avatar, at age 4, you can see I was wearing a Roy Rogers outfit. If you go to my profile page, the picture is bigger and shows more of the outfit. http://lmgtfy.com/?q=smiley+pocket+western+shirt+picture
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Taking digs at people who are not around to defend themselves is bad form, IMO. Gee, I din't take that as a dig,,, pretty much fact. and a line that continues still and accompanied with a smile...
Smokestack SASS#87384 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Gee, I din't take that as a dig,,, pretty much fact. and a line that continues still and accompanied with a smile... Maybe I read more into it than was there. If that is the case I apologize.
Blackey Cole Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Gee, I din't take that as a dig,,, pretty much fact. and a line that continues still and accompanied with a smile...thats the way I took it. I always thought of it as good advice. San Quentin is no longer with us, I missed that loss.
Boon Doggle Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 I always thought that "B-Western" was created to lure guys off the golf course. Or, it was for guys that already had all the guns they ever wanted and still had money left over.
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 thats the way I took it. I always thought of it as good advice. San Quentin is no longer with us, I missed that loss. well unless I missed something, SQ is still with us and is still part of the ROC...
Tame Bill #30699 Life Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Don't forget Colonel Shep. He was B-Western long before there was a B-Western category.
Griff Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Wondering about the B-Western category, ...I guess I'm just curious, how the rules for B Western evolved, and why there is even a "costume" category at all. I'm guessing it's just for fun? Seems that way to me. Thoughts? I ain't, or never have been a member of the Rules Committee, but, from a long term perspective and reflecting back, looking in from the outside, so to speak, here's my take on the history. From way back in the beginning, the Wild Bunch allowed Hollywood cowboy costuming. I wasn't there to recall the very beginnings, but by EOT of 1986 there was a costume contest category that recognized the best dressed "Silver Screen costume." IDR if it was that year or 1987, might've been as late as 1988, that a cowboy from Las Vegas won it by dressin' up as the "Electric Cowboy". (Give me a few days & I'll remember his alias, for he was one to ride the river with, maybe even find a picture of him!) For a few years, there were both "Working Cowboy" and "Working Cowgirl" along with, I believe, a Hollywood costume contest that was judged during the shooting... These were EOT specific. Local clubs had a hard enough time getting folks to dress appropriately, not everyone, just a few... (oh how things haven't changed!) By the early-mid 1990s, shooting style categories started to emerge and demand their own category and rules were developed. First among these was duelist. At least one Wild Bunch member didn't like the "shooting with one hand" thing, and fought them. Then came Frontiersman, a rebirth of the old BP category and required shooting duelist style. Then came Gunfighter. The rules regarding Classic Cowboy and B-Western were made to both distinguish the two costume categories by both costume and firearms normally found during their respective timeframes in western history. In reality, how many times have we seen an 1892 Winchester made up to look like an 1860 Henry, 1866 or 1873 and even described as a .30-30 mdl 94 Winchester! 1892 Winchesters are the end-all, be-all of B-Western. Timeline wise, and for a fair number of shooters, including the 1894 Marlin made sense as it was introduced shortly after the 1892, and if looks from the left side, less the wood, it has a more 1860 Henry looking profile than the 1892. While the 1873 was in production into the Hollywood B-Western era, it wasn't the ubiquitous, almost omnipresent firearm that the 1892 was. There, you have this cowboy's take on B-Western.
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 I've never tried to dress the category, but on the general subject of B-Westerns, I see the term not as referring to the TV Westerns of the '50s and '60s so much (though they contain B-Western elements)as the second-feature Westerns cranked out in huge numbers by Republic and other studios in the 1930s through the mid-1950s. There are some good websites out there devoted to B-Westerns and B-Western stars; it's amazing how many of those movies were made and how many regular B-Western star actors and actresses there were!
Ripsaw Posted October 9, 2015 Author Posted October 9, 2015 Thanks so much for all the thoughts and comments. I never thought about the second feature movies of the 30s and 40s, though that makes perfect sense. Found some on line. Being new to SASS, the historical perspective is nice to have. Might just have to put on those spurs and that embroidered shirt and give it a whirl. Only problem I see is keeping the pants up with the weight of the gun belt hanging low without suspenders!
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Those fancy B-Western shirts are surprisingly available. Most shops selling to modern, rodeo cowboys have a rack or two of these shirts. When ones I like go on sale I sometimes buy one.
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Everything you need to know about "B" Westerns. The Old Corral
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Everything you need to know about "B" Westerns. The Old Corral Yep, The Old Corral is the place; you can get lost in that site!
Wyatt Hurts SASS#72737 Posted October 9, 2015 Posted October 9, 2015 Hummmmmmmmmmmmmm what is this B-Western thing you speak of :D
Irish Pat Posted October 10, 2015 Posted October 10, 2015 Rockmount in Denver is the real Thing for pearl snap button shirts
Scarlett Posted October 10, 2015 Posted October 10, 2015 When I fell in love with SASS, I had no idea about categories... I was at the Southeast Regional. Jackson's Western store had red/black holsters on the table and a white Scully shirt with heavy black embroidery (sale rack $20)! A friend said, "what category are you gonna shoot?" I said, "huh?" She said, "you have to have a category." I said, "the category I want is the one I can shoot this in" as I held up the holsters and shirt! People say, choose your category wisely...I say, B Western chose ME! I love dressing up, the smiley pockets, the embroidery. Sometimes shirts can be hard to find...check out eBay...search vintage western shirts. Plus, my first gun was a Marlin 1894 Carbine... Love it! Love this game! Love B Western!
Yul Lose Posted October 10, 2015 Posted October 10, 2015 Thanks so much for all the thoughts and comments. I never thought about the second feature movies of the 30s and 40s, though that makes perfect sense. Found some on line. Being new to SASS, the historical perspective is nice to have. Might just have to put on those spurs and that embroidered shirt and give it a whirl. Only problem I see is keeping the pants up with the weight of the gun belt hanging low without suspenders! I had a gun belt built with suspenders attached, works pretty good. Gun belt doesn't fall down around my ankles anymore, I still catch it for that occasionally from my pards.
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted October 10, 2015 Posted October 10, 2015 I like Lily St. Cyr in B-Western, especially (I think this meets Wire standards, if barely): http://i2.listal.com/image/519805/600full-lili-st.-cyr.jpg Imaginative use of spurs. And drop holster, for that matter....
Ripsaw Posted October 10, 2015 Author Posted October 10, 2015 I assume if you meet the minimum requirements of B-Western costume (jeans, stitching on boots, spurs, drop holster rig with conchos and tooling, embroidered shirt, scarf, rifle) that you can shoot even if you are not "real flashy." Might not win a costume contest, but you can still shoot the category, even if the outfit is a little "drab." Is this correct? I'd hate to register as B Western then be told I wasn't flashy enough when I get there to shoot.
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted October 10, 2015 Posted October 10, 2015 I assume if you meet the minimum requirements of B-Western costume (jeans, stitching on boots, spurs, drop holster rig with conchos and tooling, embroidered shirt, scarf, rifle) that you can shoot even if you are not "real flashy." Might not win a costume contest, but you can still shoot the category, even if the outfit is a little "drab." Is this correct? I'd hate to register as B Western then be told I wasn't flashy enough when I get there to shoot. I wouldn't "assume" anything...especially if there are other BW shooters at any given match. They (as with Classic Cowboy/Cowgirl competitors) will usually judge and evaluate the outfits of other shooters in their respective categories. BTW - "fancy and flashy" is included in the "minimum" requirements...subjective though it may be. • All costumes are expected to be fancy and flashy. The “B” Western costuming must be worn during the entire match and awards ceremony with exception of evening formal occasions. SHB p.17
Ripsaw Posted October 10, 2015 Author Posted October 10, 2015 Since I've never been to a match with a B-Western competitor, I have nothing to judge "fancy and flashy" by. Umm... What passes at one match might not pass at another? That's interesting.
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