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Dusty Devil Dale

Video recording

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Late last shooting season I started a Facebook group called Pittsburgh CAS it’s content is 99% shooting videos it’s all to spark interest. I hope to have a lot more content this season. Check it out.  Clubs that can’t keep up with technology will all eventually peter out. 

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2 minutes ago, John Barleycorn, SASS #76982 said:

Late last shooting season I started a Facebook group called Pittsburgh CAS it’s content is 99% shooting videos it’s all to spark interest. I hope to have a lot more content this season. Check it out.  Clubs that can’t keep up with technology will all eventually peter out. 

Bingo.

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1 hour ago, Cat Brules said:

As I said, I think a body-worn camera could be a SAFETY HAZARD.  So, I think they should be disallowed.

 

Cat Brules


How would they become a safety hazard?

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Here's a follow up question. 

 

Has anyone encountered a situation in which fellow shooters objected to being on video?  With a body mounted camera, everyone on the posse is likely to show up in the video unless it is turned on only during shooting.  

 

I'm likely to tell our shooter it is legal, but to do his best to be discrete and turn the camera off when he is not shooting, or at least not video other people without their permission.   People are becoming sensitive, with all the facial recognition controversy today.  

  

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2 hours ago, Ramblin Gambler said:

 

 

I'd be willing to allow them as long as there's a penalty for sweeping me with it. 

But no penalty for sweeping themself - - right? 

(bad joke? ) 

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1 minute ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

Here's a follow up question. 

 

Has anyone encountered a situation in which fellow shooters objected to being on video?  With a body mounted camera, everyone on the posse is likely to show up in the video unless it is turned on only during shooting.  

 

I'm likely to tell our shooter it is legal, but to do his best to be discrete and turn the camera off when he is not shooting, or at least not video other people without their permission.   People are becoming sensitive, with all the facial recognition controversy today.  

  

That’s a good point and as far as I know out here it hasn’t been an issue. Probably needs to be some club oversight if some have an issue with it.

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4 minutes ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

Here's a follow up question. 

 

Has anyone encountered a situation in which fellow shooters objected to being on video?  

 

I frequently take video of my family and others at a couple different clubs. 

 

I have had one person ask of me to not record video of them, to which I have respected their wishes. No big deal.

 

If you read the fine print of the release forms at 2 clubs round here that I know of, in the release form you grant permission to be recorded or photographed, and grant release of that imagery...

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Most club are video recording you anyhow.  Unless you’re living in s cave you are being video recorded every time you go out in public. Facial recognition, that train left the station. Your DL pic is linked into law enforcement data bases Further it you have Alexa it other foolishness you are being recorded in your own home.

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We take posse pictures all the time, don’t we?  Most folks enjoy watching themselves and their pards shooting.  Anyone so camera shy that they don’t want to be in a photo or video should consider a different pastime.

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1 minute ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

We take posse pictures all the time, don’t we?  Most folks enjoy watching themselves and their pards shooting.  Anyone so camera shy that they don’t want to be in a photo or video should consider a different pastime.

Unfortunately, I don't think it is quite that simple nowadays.  Recording unwilling subjects recognizably can get a person into both criminal and civil court.   I've heard there are some exceptions for recording in "public places".  

I don't know if a club-owned or privately operated CAS range would qualify as "public". 

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Just in the last 24 hours, I thought about all the cameras that tracked me.

Neighbors cameras (including Ring doorbells).

DOT cameras on interchanges.

My stop for gas.

The school where I sub.

The Casey's convenience store a block from the school.

Pharmacy after school, and grocery store.

Health club entrance.

And then back home.

Not counting countless dash cams on personal or fleet vehicles.

 

I'm sure I missed some.

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When someone asks me what CAS is I don't give a verbal description.  I show them a few clips on YouTube and the sport becomes understandable.

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8 minutes ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

Unfortunately, I don't think it is quite that simple nowadays. 


Yes it is just that simple.  Cameras are all over the place at every match I have ever been to.  Worry about something else.

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1 hour ago, Kid Curry, SASS# 2924 said:


How would they become a safety hazard?


I envision safety issues win manipulating the shotgun. I can see that movement/manipulation of the shotgun may bump into the camera possibly causing the shooter to pull the trigger and fire a wild round.

 

Same thing with the rifle. Shouldering the rifle while cocking it enroute to the shoulder, could cause the same type of “accidental discharge“.

 

Revolvers? Probably not so much, if any, issues.

 

So, the safety issue is that the camera is in the way and could cause the problems 

I mentioned above.

 

I see these problems is likely, not just “possible“.

 

Cat Brules

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1 hour ago, J-BAR #18287 said:


Yes it is just that simple.  Cameras are all over the place at every match I have ever been to.  Worry about something else.

Believe what you care to believe.  You may be right - - maybe.   I'm still going advise our shooter to try to avoid putting unwilling subjects on video.   

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1 hour ago, J-BAR #18287 said:

We take posse pictures all the time, don’t we?  Most folks enjoy watching themselves and their pards shooting.  Anyone so camera shy that they don’t want to be in a photo or video should consider a different pastime.

Maybe so. 

Personally don't really want to tell anybody to put up with cameras or go elsewhere.   I'll leave that one for you big guys.  

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5 minutes ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

Believe what you care to believe.  You may be right - - maybe.   I'm still going advise our shooter to try to avoid putting unwilling subjects on video.   


Your profile says you shoot with the Kings River Regulators.  The club’s website has a lot of photos and videos which are fun to watch.  Good luck getting a signed release from everyone you are already showing!  ;)

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1 minute ago, J-BAR #18287 said:


Your profile says you shoot with the Kings River Regulators.  The club’s website has a lot of photos and videos which are fun to watch.  Good luck getting a signed release from everyone you are already showing!  ;)

Glad you saw the website.  We have a very fun club with great people.  Why don't you come shoot with us at our Annual Ft. Miller Shootout in April.  It's a very fun, low key event. Bring lots of ammo this year.  Our side matches are going to be FUN! 

 

Regarding the graphics, in most (maybe all) cases the subjects knew they were being recorded and they either gave consent or at least voiced no objection. 

 

My issue is really just about trying to be courteous and treat our people as they would prefer to be treated.  I have no desire to force my video camera onto anyone who objects to it.  It's pretty easy just to ask and respect others' wishes.  Is that unworkable, in your view? 

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In Australia there are a few clubs that dont allow even photo's to be taken without specific permission (on the firing line, or of people shooting).

 

Its not safety its more about not drawing attention to what we do. Yes its sad and yes there is plenty of video and photo's on the net but its their club so I play by their rules.

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7 hours ago, Cat Brules said:


I envision safety issues win manipulating the shotgun. I can see that movement/manipulation of the shotgun may bump into the camera possibly causing the shooter to pull the trigger and fire a wild round.

 

Same thing with the rifle. Shouldering the rifle while cocking it enroute to the shoulder, could cause the same type of “accidental discharge“.

 

Revolvers? Probably not so much, if any, issues.

 

So, the safety issue is that the camera is in the way and could cause the problems 

I mentioned above.

 

I see these problems is likely, not just “possible“.

 

Cat Brules

Some of these cameras now are no bigger then the SASS badges that some folks have pinned to their chest.

 

Do we need to get folks to stop wearing those too?

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7 minutes ago, Branchwater Jack SASS #88854 said:

Some of these cameras now are no bigger then the SASS badges that some folks have pinned to their chest.

 

Do we need to get folks to stop wearing those too?

Probably so. We might need to outlaw spurs as well, folks have been known to trip over them. Your black powder smells bad, so it probably has to go too. Some of the guns are to loud and hurt my ears so that needs to be stopped, safety hazard ya know.

 

I only want to be recorded on my good looking side, which I’ve been told is very hard to find (I’m not sure why cause Mom always tells me how handsome I am). So you better not record my bad side or I might have to sue or pitch a fit or something.

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13 hours ago, Ramblin Gambler said:

 

 

I'd be willing to allow them as long as there's a penalty for sweeping me with it. 

 

Stage DQ for closing the camera door on an empty mini-SD card chamber.

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I just filled out an application for a SASS sanctioned state match and signed agreeing to the following...

 

Quote

I further understand that commercial photography (still, video or motion) may occur during the course of some shooting events. Should I wish not to be included in any photography that may occur, I understand that it is my sole responsibility to remove myself from the area to avoid being photographed. Absent such action on my part, I hereby grant the club hosting the match, its sponsors and beneficiaries the right to use my photographic image in the promotion of Cowboy Action Shooting, so long as such conforms with normally accepted journalistic standards.

 

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One real ticklish point with creating YouTube videos containing kids.   YouTube has changed their rules because of new federal laws Children Online Privacy Protection Act COPPA.  Now when we upload a YouTube video we must declare that our videos don't appeal to or made for kids.   If you are found in infraction of the rules,  at the minimum they will remove the video, more drastic take down your channel.  They could de-monetize your channel if it's monetized.  Even worse, you could be facing federal prosecution.  

 

 

I can see that our hobby of Cowboy Action Shooting as appealing to the video game segment. How many gamers are under 13?  

 

 

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2 hours ago, Warden Callaway said:

One real ticklish point with creating YouTube videos containing kids.   YouTube has changed their rules because of new federal laws Children Online Privacy Protection Act COPPA.  Now when we upload a YouTube video we must declare that our videos don't appeal to or made for kids.   If you are found in infraction of the rules,  at the minimum they will remove the video, more drastic take down your channel.  They could de-monetize your channel if it's monetized.  Even worse, you could be facing federal prosecution.  

 

 

I can see that our hobby of Cowboy Action Shooting as appealing to the video game segment. How many gamers are under 13?  

 

 

Currently I know of 14 in this area.. I'm working with 6, only 2 are mine

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On 1/28/2020 at 8:56 PM, Dusty Devil Dale said:

Has anyone encountered a situation in which fellow shooters objected to being on video? 

 

Yes.  Me!  I wasn't kidding about wanting a penalty for sweeping me with it.  People need to ask permission before they film anyone.  If I'm spotting for someone who wants to be filmed, I will either find a place to spot out of the camera view (behind the camera is usually a good place), or find a new spotter.  I don't see a problem with the go pro's; it's easy enough to stay on a shooter's blind side.  They just need to shut them off once they're done and mingling around.  I don't always say no when asked, I do have a reasonable modeling fee, after all.

 

People think I'm joking, but I can feel it when a camera is on me and it hurts.  I think the aborigines have it right, camera's steal part of your soul to make the image.  As proof, look at models and actors.  Cameras on them all the time, and on the whole, there's no more messed up group of people anywhere.  Children seem to be more susceptible to the soul theft. 

 

Allright, maybe one of those paragraphs was tongue in cheek.  But only 1. 

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On 1/28/2020 at 6:32 PM, evil dogooder said:

I guess if you went strictly by the rules of what can be worn they are illegal. 

 

As someone who has videos taken as often as possible I see the advantage.   I don't wear one because it looks like crap.  Why go to the hassle of spending 10s of thousands of dollars on a range to make it look western, thousands of  dollars on clothes,  gear,  guns, just to strap a hunk of plastic on you.   Kinda defeats the purpose.  

 

  Im all for cameras/ videos/ drones  but keep big bulky cameras off the shooter.  

What he said^^^^^^^^^^^;)

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I've got no problem with people either wearing video cameras or videoing other shooters if they agree to it.  I do, however, draw the line at someone wanting to video with a camera in their hands and spotting at the same time.  If you are spotting then spot, if you want to video someone then hand off the spotting stick.

 

Kajun

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On 1/28/2020 at 10:10 AM, Dusty Devil Dale said:

After our last match, a new, young shooter (yeah, we have some of those!) asked me if it was acceptable to wear a Go

-Pro body cam recorder during competition, only to get video of him shooting. 

 

I didn't know the answer for certain.  I told him some categories, like B Western, would likely prohibit it but I couldn't make the call for open category shooters.  So here I am asking.  Are they being worn at other locations, and are they legal? 

 

I know they cannot be used to decide spotting issues, but can a person wear a visible video camera, say to observe their transitions or identify shooting improvements? 

Is it something we should welcome, or discourage?  

Thoughts anybody? 

A good place to start with that question would be your Territorial Governor..... since that is his job.

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I guess if you went strictly by the rules of what can be worn they are illegal. What rules are those? Otherwise leave your wristwatch at home, cellphone mounted on your gun belt.

Safety... I wear a neck knife which moves around when I'm moving, some shooters wear shoulder holsters with pocket pistols. Safety glasses, and ear plugs are authentic so....Bandoliers could cause a rifle, pistol or shotgun to hang up on it.

And finally about filming people without permission the Supreme Court has ruled that, 'no one in public can have an expectation of privacy'. The only issue is if the photo or video is used for commercial purposes, then they need to sign a waiver.

 

Always enjoy reading the new rules ya'll come up with that really don't exist.

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