Tom Bullweed Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 For you LEO out there: My local LEOs are allowed to carry .380s when off-duty and as a backup. My question is about ammo. Do you have directions about what kind of ammo is recommended? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Is this for you or the local LEO's? Most departments list what ammo is to be carried in off-duty/back-up guns. IMHO-I don't trust any .380 to save my life. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 I'm retired, so I can't talk about the current crop of Officers not the PDs. I am completely with OLG on this question. I would personally never carry a 380 as a personal defense side arm. For the time period I was involved in Law Enforcement, my off duty side arm was a slightly reduced 1911. My current CCW is still a 1911. The 380 is a real good way to really irritate a bad guy. A .45 on the other hand, will completely change his or her mind. Coffinmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 While I agree the.380 is not the optimas defense round, I do carry one when weather conditions simply make a larger pistol impractical. When I was working I carried a backup .380 which was light enough to be comfortable in an ankle holster strapped to my spindly birdleg. Here's an interesting article on. 380 cartridge performance. I carry Hydrashoks in my Colt. 380. http://shootingthebull.net/blog/final-results-of-the-380-acp-ammo-quest/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J. Frank Norfleet Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Not a LEO and I don't ever plan on carrying a .380. But if I did, this is the ammo I'd buy. http://g2rip.com/content/g2-research-proudly-introduces-rip-popular-380-defense-round Would probably be a lawyer's dream in court but at least you would have a chance of living. L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St. Louis Suomi SASS #31905 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Howdy: Not a LEO - However Hornady Critical Defense ammo will make a large hole and penetrate deeply. Anf it is defensie ammo making a lawyer work for the theory you have a Deadly horrible wound inflicting special ammo. STL Suomi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Barleycorn, SASS #76982 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Our dept issues on duty and off duty ammunition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Sarge Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 When I was an investigator with the MS Gaming Commission, we were issued the Sig P232 as our duty weapon. For the life of me, I can't remember what .380 ammo we were issued. They were later phased out and replaced by the Glock 19. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry T Harrison Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 I would much rather carry my .380 loaded with hydra shock ammo than that 9mm full metal jacket crap we issue our combat troops. As a plain clothes police officer I often carried a Colt Mustang on court or administrative days. In the office it was just more comfortable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar_slinger Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 Question: Is the 380 the only caliber authorized by your department for off-duty carry or just "one of" the calibers authorized? If it is "one of" I see no good reason to ever carry a 380 when pistols like the Kahr PM9 and S&W Shield 9mm are around. My personal carry firearm has become the Shield 9mm. As for the original question, can't help since I don't carry a .380 and have never been in a situation where I needed to shoot someone (Thank the Lord). All things being equal, the 9mm is more powerful and a .45 leaves a bigger hole. GS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 So GS... why'd ya chose the 9mm instead of the .40 "short 'n' wimpy" in that Shield? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar_slinger Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 So GS... why'd ya chose the 9mm instead of the .40 "short 'n' wimpy" in that Shield? Mainly because I'm already set up for 9mm with my Browning Hi Power. If I hadn't already had a bunch of 9mm stuff I may have looked at the 40 more closely. If I want to make a big hole, I carry my Kimber 1911 in 45acp. Between 9mm, 45acp, 38spl, 357 mag and 45 Colt, adding another caliber for a self defense round just didn't make a lot of sense. As for stopping a bad guy, I'm not worried about a 124gr bonded hollowpoint +p 9mm doing an adequate job. Heck, up until I really started appreciating the weight and size of the Shield, I carried either the above mentioned 1911 or a Model 60 Smith Stainless Steel J Frame 357 (with 38spl +p rounds). Honestly, not specific reason against the 40. I think they are a little more snappy in a self defense sized pistol than the 9mm in the same firearm, but recoil of the 40 isn't objectionable (357mag in a J-Frame light weight is objectionable). Hope this helps GS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967 Posted February 3, 2015 Share Posted February 3, 2015 It do. My son and my godson both have Shields in .40, and I'm thinking about getting one while I still can (told no more in California after April). Still trying to decide between 9mm and .40. And for what it's worth, about a year and a half ago I bought a Ruger LC380... 'cuz it was literally the ONLY pistol to be found in these parts at that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 It do. My son and my godson both have Shields in .40, and I'm thinking about getting one while I still can (told no more in California after April). Still trying to decide between 9mm and .40. And for what it's worth, about a year and a half ago I bought a Ruger LC380... 'cuz it was literally the ONLY pistol to be found in these parts at that time. Get the '40'. As the survivor of 2 gunfights. Trust me when I say you will never notice the recoil because of the Adrenalin rush. The LC380 is a very good, back-up/get off me gun. As a multi-course, Gunsite Academy alumni, I say this....Get some serious training. Not just to stay alive. But what to do when the smoke clears and the aftermath, including court. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 Get the '40'. As the survivor of 2 gunfights. Trust me when I say you will never notice the recoil because of the Adrenalin rush. The LC380 is a very good, back-up/get off me gun. As a multi-course, Gunsite Academy alumni, I say this....Get some serious training. Not just to stay alive. But what to do when the smoke clears and the aftermath, including court. OLG +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 I'm retired, so I can't talk about the current crop of Officers not the PDs. I am completely with OLG on this question. I would personally never carry a 380 as a personal defense side arm. For the time period I was involved in Law Enforcement, my off duty side arm was a slightly reduced 1911. My current CCW is still a 1911. The 380 is a real good way to really irritate a bad guy. A .45 on the other hand, will completely change his or her mind. Coffinmaker Its kinda funny how people say the 380 is NO Good for self defense. Its the #1 selling hand gun caliber bar none . And all the Naysayers say only a 45 will get the job done . I think they should study some real world shootings and stop reading Soldier of fortune magazine ! With todays ammo the 380 is a very good CCW caliber. Stand in front of me and let me pump few rounds of 380 in to you and see if you live to say 380 dont get the job done ! Thats just a bunch of BULL 5HIT ! No offence ment to you personally its just BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Bullweed Posted February 4, 2015 Author Share Posted February 4, 2015 To answer OLG, I am not LE but my question was based on ammo judgements made by people more knowledgeable than me. To answer some others, I agree that my 1911 .45 or 686 .357 is a better stopper, but they make lousy carry guns. I am willing to carry a J-frame or a .380 Bodyguard. I assumed the Hornady Critical Defense would be a good round, but every other main defense riound from Winchester, Corbon, Buffalo Bullets and Speer beats it, based on several articles and the recent FBI ammo report in American Rifleman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 To answer OLG, I am not LE but my question was based on ammo judgements made by people more knowledgeable than me. To answer some others, I agree that my 1911 .45 or 686 .357 is a better stopper, but they make lousy carry guns. I am willing to carry a J-frame or a .380 Bodyguard. I assumed the Hornady Critical Defense would be a good round, but every other main defense riound from Winchester, Corbon, Buffalo Bullets and Speer beats it, based on several articles and the recent FBI ammo report in American Rifleman. Just a brief note. The ammo that departments issue is sometimes the best available. But sometimes not, depending on their budget and the firearms people doing the research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Chains Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 Not a fan of .380, sure with modern bullets, it is better than it use to be. Same is true of the 9mm or any other defensive pistol. I have and tend to carry a 9mm Shield and it is a solid dependable choice. Is my .45 Kimber ProCarry II a better choice to shoot a bad guy with? I guess, but if I was expecting trouble and the cops weren't available/close enough/too busy with something else, I would have a shotgun or rifle in hand, not a pistol. The Shield is small enough and light enough that it sits on my hip with no comfort penalty at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Bird 61147 Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 I always carried a .25 Baby Browning in my cuff case. They didn't have a small enough .380 back then. As for carrying now I usually carry one of many 380's depending on the situation and they are all loaded with ball ammunition, no hollow points. I might be old school but when I do use it I want it to feed. The bottom line is this; No matter what you need at the time you wish you would have brought your .40, .357, 44, or .45. Just carry what you want and be proficient in that sidearm. Practice and take care of the weapon. As for our department "then" you could carry only .38 or .357 and that went for your backup. Off duty, that was up to you. We bought our own guns and the officers today do also. They have to meet certain criteria as to calibre, make that was established by the range masters. All off duty guns must be qualified with on a bi-annual basis. In the early 80's you could carry a semi automatic in .9mm, .40 or .45 but you had to attend a 40 hour class on semi automatics and pass with at least a 90 score. It might sound harsh but it was one of the best schools I ever attended. By the way you had to pay for the school yourself, buy your own weapon and attend on your own time. By then the new officers had already been trained on the semi autos in their own school or academy so the "school" was for us old time wheel gunners. One more thing, the officers back then could shoot. Today it seems they like to "spray and pray" a lot. A drawback of the high capacity autos. Finaly, I handled more homicides where the murder weapon was a .22 more than any other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry T Harrison Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 I still keep my baby browning close by. It's a great little pocket gun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 Not a LEO and I don't ever plan on carrying a .380. But if I did, this is the ammo I'd buy. http://g2rip.com/content/g2-research-proudly-introduces-rip-popular-380-defense-round Would probably be a lawyer's dream in court but at least you would have a chance of living. L I suggest you read some independent testing before you spend too much hard earned cash.http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/02/daniel-zimmerman/g2-researchs-rip-ammo-ballistic-testing-phase-one/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 Its kinda funny how people say the 380 is NO Good for self defense. Its the #1 selling hand gun caliber bar none . And all the Naysayers say only a 45 will get the job done . I think they should study some real world shootings and stop reading Soldier of fortune magazine ! With todays ammo the 380 is a very good CCW caliber. Stand in front of me and let me pump few rounds of 380 in to you and see if you live to say 380 dont get the job done ! Thats just a bunch of BULL 5HIT ! No offence ment to you personally its just BS. Enough rocks will do the job too- "I think they should study some real world shootings" The two I was in, held great interest to me. I used a Colt 1911 .45acp. You carry what you want. I'll carry what has already saved my life. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat Brules Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 I have for carry an older, standard steel Colt Mustang .380acp. I load it with FMJ usually, and carry it in my pocket. My other carry is a Springfield 1911 in.45acp completely worked over by ClarkCustom years ago along with their Meltdown dehorning work. Easy to carry, disappears on your person. Always load with FMJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Sometimes Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 As an active Federal Agent, my off-duty is the SIG 230 in .380. We can only carry SIGs with the P229 in .357 SIG as my duty and P230 for off-duty. We're provided duty ammo for both, in hollow point +P rounds. I love the new mini SIG in 9mm but it's single action with a safety and forbidden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusty Hill, sass # 49256 Posted February 4, 2015 Share Posted February 4, 2015 For whatever it is worth, In the Sept. 2012 issue of "American Rifleman" they did some test on some of the various high tech cartridges using ballistic gel. It shows that the 380 is basically about equal to the 38 special.http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d110/dusty357/010.jpghttp://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d110/dusty357/007.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 First choice: Corbon 90 grain JHP Second choice: Federal Hydra-Shok 90 grain JHP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubious Don #56333 Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 For you LEO out there: My local LEOs are allowed to carry .380s when off-duty and as a backup. My question is about ammo. Do you have directions about what kind of ammo is recommended? Yes; have to qualify on a short course, 7 yards and in (opposed to standard course that goes to 25Y) issue ammo is 380 Gold Dot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Big Tree Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 For real world shootings review this data. http://www.handloads.com/misc/stoppingpower.asp?Caliber=18&Weight=230 Pick your caliber and bullet or "all bullets" and see how they faired in "Real World one shot stops" There is always doubt in any study but it's interesting information anyway. I for one ordered Hydra Shocks this week for both my .380's and with that said, if I knew I was going to a gun fight I'd carry my 1911. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 For real world shootings review this data. http://www.handloads.com/misc/stoppingpower.asp?Caliber=18&Weight=230 Pick your caliber and bullet or "all bullets" and see how they faired in "Real World one shot stops" There is always doubt in any study but it's interesting information anyway. I for one ordered Hydra Shocks this week for both my .380's and with that said, if I knew I was going to a gun fight I'd carry my 1911. Like Bull said in ElDorado, "If I thought I was gonna get shot, I wouldn't go" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 For real world shootings review this data. http://www.handloads.com/misc/stoppingpower.asp?Caliber=18&Weight=230 Pick your caliber and bullet or "all bullets" and see how they faired in "Real World one shot stops" There is always doubt in any study but it's interesting information anyway. I for one ordered Hydra Shocks this week for both my .380's and with that said, if I knew I was going to a gun fight I'd carry my 1911. Hope you ordered enough to confirm they will cycle 100% in those .380. I would run at least 50 rnds through each gun before I'd bet my life. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 The Hydra shoks cycle fine in my Colt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 The Hydra shoks cycle fine in my Colt. As they do in my PPK-S. But, I made sure they did. OLG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 As they do in my PPK-S. But, I made sure they did. OLG Eggzackly. Always test any new ammo in a semi auto. Especially hloow points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted February 5, 2015 Share Posted February 5, 2015 I for one ordered Hydra Shocks this week for both my .380's and with that said, if I knew I was going to a gun fight I'd carry my 1911. Like Bull said in ElDorado, "If I thought I was gonna get shot, I wouldn't go" Yep. Barring that, if I were going to a gun fight, I would carry more than a defensive sidearm. During my last deployment, sometimes I was required to carry the M9, other times I had the option of that and the M4, and sometimes the M4 was required. Given the choice, I invariably chose the M4, just because. I must admit, I've always wanted a PPK or PPK/S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.