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Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619

Ammo Shortage Easing?

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I drift weekly around the stores looking for a bit of ammo. Everything has been empty except one small shop that has kept me in a couple of calibers.

 

I went to Bass today; as I do once a week. I was just going to buy a shirt; I almost didn't walk over to the ammo-- but I did.

 

The main shelves were still bare, but they had a big steel roller shelf with a bunch of ammo. A mountain of 40 S&W, stacks of .38 spl (over 50 boxes), quite a bit of .357 mag., and they had a whole bunch of 9mm. 50 round boxes and 250 round boxes. 

 

Limit of 5 total, combined. I bought 4 boxes of 50 of .38spl, one caliber I was a little behind on inventory-wise. This was Remington, 130 gr. FMJ. Per box: $19.95-- a very good price in the best of times. They do straight retail pricing-- no 'shortage' price increases.

 

A very good sign indeed!

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Bass Pro is nearly an hour drive, each way, so I don't haunt them except for an advertised sale.
They had a huge deal on 12 gauge STS, so I bought 6 cases over two days.
Three case limit, per day.

It takes about 2.0 hours to buy 3 cases, with the driving, and the waiting in line, DROS paper work, cage log, etc.
I'd like to find a couple Buckets of Bullets in 22LR, but they are all long gone.

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I can only speak to my city's Bass this afternoon. Where there has been nothing, there was now a large quantity of several major calibers. Obviously, a great many calibers weren't there, but the ones that were were in significant piles of boxes. Though I don't shoot 9mm, I saw a large supply, and I know this is in much demand.

 

This was at 2:30 pm. If the local Bass had it, so I assume that their other stores get their share.

 

I see it as a 'straw in the wind'. The manufacturers have been going full blast. Like toilet paper, which was gone for months, the supply chains start to fill up again.

 

So keep checking; don't assume anything. We always get a lot of doom and gloomers with this stuff....but it's just supply and demand, and the demand is obviously bringing out the supplies once again.

 

Here in Washington there are no ammo lines (as opposed to guns), no paperwork-- put it in the cart and take it to checkout.

Edited by Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619

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Not going to ease for awhile yet. Biden wins then it ain't going to ease for years. Current president wins then it will ease up in a few to several months.

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If you only shop advertised salesduring these uncertain times by the time you get there, it will be gone.

In some cases, sale items are in hot demand and it is sold before it is shelved.

 

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I was in my reloading store the other day and overheard the owner say that a Bass Pro in California had received a pallet of primers and a few pallets of handgun ammo. 
 

It was NOT the the BP by me so he must have been referring to the one in Manteca. 
 

I am sure it went quick. 

Edited by Pat Riot, SASS #13748

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Also, I meant to say that when I lived in Oregon a few years ago and we had the Obama Admin. induced ammo shortages (every federal agency buying billions of rounds of ammo at the same time is not a coincidence) the thing that got me were people exacerbating the situation by buying up every box of ammo, box of primers, container of popular powder they could even if they didn’t need it. Some would actually go to stores with their buddies and group buy everything “they were entitled” to buy regardless of need so they could resell it. (I put quotes around the above because I had a guy use those words when I questioned his ethics about what he and his butthole buddies were doing)

 

I can guarantee this will happen again and drive the shortage even further. 
 

I had a guy I worked with tell me he had a variety of boxes of ammunition for sale, if I was interested. He took his family to Sportsman’s Warehouse, Walmart, Cabela’s and a couple of other places. He told his kids and their kids in his 15 passenger van to each store and they bought up every box and type of ammo they could solely for the purpose of reselling it at double and triple what they paid. 
This guy literally owned 2 guns. A Ruger Blackhawk .41 Magnum and Winchester model 70 in .300 Win Mag. No one else in his family owned guns. “Guns that  aren’t for hunting are evil.” He told me once. 
 

 

I am sure we will be seeing a lot of that. 

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Ammo is trickling in around here, most stores are limiting purchases to one box per caliber. I bought a box of Federal 9mm for $22.00 FMJ, .38's were too expenseive as well as .357's, $50-$65 a box!! I reload .38's and I can reload .357's so it meant nothing to me.

 

I bought 4 boxes of WIN AA Low noise Low recoil from a friend who picked them up at WalMart for $7.50 a box!!

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2 hours ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

I bought a box of Federal 9mm for $22.00 FMJ

That's actually good compared to here. Winchester white box was $35 per box the other day at LAX Ammo. That's 70 cents a  round. Case of 1000 was $619.00. 62 cents a round.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

Ammo is trickling in around here, most stores are limiting purchases to one box per caliber. I bought a box of Federal 9mm for $22.00 FMJ, .38's were too expenseive as well as .357's, $50-$65 a box!! I reload .38's and I can reload .357's so it meant nothing to me.

 

I bought 4 boxes of WIN AA Low noise Low recoil from a friend who picked them up at WalMart for $7.50 a box!!

That is a better price for AAs at WalMart than I paid this summer.  I bought 5 cases at $7.87 a box at WalMarts in Colorado and New Mexico.  My local WalMarts are still well stocked with shotgun shells.

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Apparently, Walmart in CA has stopped selling ammo altogether.
The Walmart in Reno, NV is selling $50 cases of Federal trap shells for $70.

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I almost never go into a Walmart anymore, but this morning I need something that I can't find anywhere else locally.  They had .243, .30-06, and .270 at about $16.00 a box of twenty  Had a few boxes of .308at about $55.00 a box.

 

No .44 Russian or .44 Special, but I didn't expect any handgun ammo.

 

No .22 rf anywhere to be seen.

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Yesterday I winced at paying $30 per box for some S&B .45ACP ammo. Unfortunately it was the only stuff I could even find locally. I hope this crap ends soon because wintertime is when I spend my weekends at the indoor range shooting.

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Per Pat's posts, last ammo shortage people were determining shipment times to the big box stores, either figured them out or had someone who worked at the store tip them. Then they would show up with buddies/family and buy as much ammo as allowed so they could resell at double or triple the price. Heard from my brother that at one local walmart a single guy would show up everytime a truck with ammo came in and he would buy every single box of ammo on the truck and he did that for going on 6 months. Reportedly said he wasn't reselling it but was stocking up. 

 

Just like last time you can get ammo, but you either need to get lucky and find it as soon as it is in stock before it sells out, or you can pay premium prices two to three times over normal. If you are real lucky you may have a local dealer who sells a box at a time to regular customers at reasonable costs.

 

But just like toilet paper and such, panic buying leads to shortages, shortages lead to other individuals seeing a way to making an extra buck, which increases demand even more, which continues and/or increases the shortages until eventually demand drops once people stop panic buying and then the bottom drops out of the reselling market.  Fun fun fun.

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I just wish I could find some H4350. I have plenty of everything else, including about 5500- 6000 rounds of 22LR.

Edited by Dirty Dan Dawkins
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My FFL has an 8lb tub of 4350 at $217,
Can't remember if H or IMR..
I will be there picking up my '06 on Friday or Monday, will take a peek.

I was thinking I wanted H4350, but after running the numbers, it looks like I need H4895, 4064, H414 or Varget.
These cover the bullet weight I"m interested in for 223, 243 and 30-06.
Probably a toss-up between H4895 and Varget.

 

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couple locations here got a load in - its all gone now , we are on the cusp of deer season , hope most hunters thought ahead or have leftover from last year ...its not much available in most sources i know of , 

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12 hours ago, bgavin said:

My FFL has an 8lb tub of 4350 at $217,
Can't remember if H or IMR..
I will be there picking up my '06 on Friday or Monday, will take a peek.

I was thinking I wanted H4350, but after running the numbers, it looks like I need H4895, 4064, H414 or Varget.
These cover the bullet weight I"m interested in for 223, 243 and 30-06.
Probably a toss-up between H4895 and Varget.

 

 

There's a lot of overlap in these powders. 

I keep the following rifle powders: IMR 3031, H4198, H4895, IMR 4350, H4350,  Reloader 15, and Accurate 5744.  I like IMR4350 in 06 with 180 grain bullets  and H4350 in 260 with 120-130 grain bullets (maybe its a pressure thing in 06 vs 308 size cases)

 

I could honestly narrow it down to  two powders, either one of the 4350's  and then pick H4895 or IMR3031 and call it a day.

 

But for a general all around powder, that shoots most bullet weights reasonably well it would be Varget  or 4895. I do believe they are the two most versatile rifle powders out there, since they seem to be work from 223 to 45-70, aside from maybe magnum and overbore applications.

Edited by Dirty Dan Dawkins
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17 hours ago, Raylan said:

Per Pat's posts, last ammo shortage people were determining shipment times to the big box stores, either figured them out or had someone who worked at the store tip them. Then they would show up with buddies/family and buy as much ammo as allowed so they could resell at double or triple the price. Heard from my brother that at one local walmart a single guy would show up everytime a truck with ammo came in and he would buy every single box of ammo on the truck and he did that for going on 6 months. Reportedly said he wasn't reselling it but was stocking up.

 

There are those who defend the actions of people like him, saying they're simply free-marketers capitalizing on the system. I'd like to know what the IRS would have to say about that.

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1 hour ago, Dirty Dan Dawkins said:

But for a general all around powder, that shoots most bullet weights reasonably well it would be Varget or 4895.

I have come to the same conclusion for my specific uses.

I have found the tie breaker:  size of grains and ease of metering.
H4895 is 0.771 x 1.21mm
Varget is 0.861 x 1.42mm

At my LGS, I have not (yet) seen huge price markups on powder.
The free market will certainly let a guy take a risk on stocking up on products, scalping ticket sales, or shorting stocks.
One can do well... or one can get royally burned.

Edited by bgavin
edited for typos

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I have heard several "reasons" why there is a shortage.

Let's see.

The unrest/riots/looting/vandalism, in the northwest, and across the country.

Over five million new, first-time, gun buyers, this year, so far.

The virus pandemic.

The upcoming election, and the fear of the leftists coming to power.

Uncertainty about the future, and where the country is going.

Panic buying, and hoarding. (At least I can buy toilet paper pretty readily now.)

 

I am sure there are more "reasons".  Perhaps it's all of the above, and more.

 

Just have to do the best we can, hunker down, and wait it out...and see what tomorrow brings.

I guess one could search for a source, and perhaps pay inflated prices.

Depends on what one wants, and how bad they want it, I suppose.

 

W.K.

 

 

 

 

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Not much on the shelves at all in my area, to include a Bass Pro, Cabelas and a Sportsman's Warehouse. Will have some scattered rifle ammunition, occasionally see the atypical handgun caliber. Haven't seen a rilfe or pistol primer on the shelves in these stores in months. I see a bit more at my local gun club...not sure if they are selling to the general public or just members right now (they did just re-start lane rentals to non-members). I did find some large rifle primers at the gun club a week ago...there were two 1000 primer boxes. I bought one and left the other for someone else...figure that box would last me for the coming year or possibly more, especially since my son borrowed my SCAR 17S and I don't think he is going to be in a hurry to return it ;p  I guess it is hard to know what may have come in and been gone within the hour. The construction is coming along on a new Scheel's store here in Colorado Springs and I suspect they will have stock of everything for opening day, whenever that may be. Not that it will last long!

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47 minutes ago, Waxahachie Kid #17017 L said:

I have heard several "reasons" why there is a shortage.

Let's see.

The unrest/riots/looting/vandalism, in the northwest, and across the country.

Over five million new, first-time, gun buyers, this year, so far.

The virus pandemic.

The upcoming election, and the fear of the leftists coming to power.

Uncertainty about the future, and where the country is going.

Panic buying, and hoarding. (At least I can buy toilet paper pretty readily now.)

 

I am sure there are more "reasons".  Perhaps it's all of the above, and more.

 

Just have to do the best we can, hunker down, and wait it out...and see what tomorrow brings.

I guess one could search for a source, and perhaps pay inflated prices.

Depends on what one wants, and how bad they want it, I suppose.

 

W.K.

 

 

 

 

Agree that all those reasons are factors at this time. If someone is desperate enough, there is always somebody overcharging on Gunbroker...I won't pay those prices!

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Academy Sports here occasionally gets 9mm, 5.56, 45 acp and prices it fairly. The stuff sells out almost as soon as it hits the shelf. One pretty much has to be in the store when the ammunition shelf is stocked to get any. Used to be you could still get the non popular calibers AKA general hunting rounds but now even those have dried up. And ironically enough the only thing on the shelf is 22 long rifle. :D

 

The online only ammo distributors are sold out of pretty much everything. And I have seen the cheap steel case Wolf brand 9 mm selling out in minutes at $29.95 per box of 50. :o

Edited by Dantankerous

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Went to a large gun store chain in the area. (6 or 7 stores). They had 9mm, 40, 45 and 5.56 but we're limiting to one box of any ammo per person per day. 22's were pretty bare with only magnum and birdshot available. They had 3 bricks of large rifle primers and a decent selection of powder. I picked up a 4 pounder of Red Dot for my brother in law who can't find it anywhere around where he lives. Lots of black rifles on the shelf. Not a great selection of pistols but if you weren't picky, you could get most any style. Shotshells and shotshell reloading supplies seemed plentiful. I still have bricks of Federal 22's with a $7.99 price sticker on them. I have always bought ahead and should be set on all components for 2-3 years. Hope it all blows over by then.

Edited by Sixgun Seamus
Fat fingers
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8 hours ago, Waxahachie Kid #17017 L said:

I have heard several "reasons" why there is a shortage.

Let's see.

The unrest/riots/looting/vandalism, in the northwest, and across the country.

Over five million new, first-time, gun buyers, this year, so far.

The virus pandemic.

The upcoming election, and the fear of the leftists coming to power.

Uncertainty about the future, and where the country is going.

Panic buying, and hoarding. (At least I can buy toilet paper pretty readily now.)

 

I am sure there are more "reasons".  Perhaps it's all of the above, and more.

 

Just have to do the best we can, hunker down, and wait it out...and see what tomorrow brings.

I guess one could search for a source, and perhaps pay inflated prices.

Depends on what one wants, and how bad they want it, I suppose.

 

W.K.

 

 

 

 

 

I'll add cost and supply of the raw materials used to make brass, powder & primers impacting the ability to produce ammo & components.

 

As to when the shortage will end depends on the election results.

If Trump wins and there is no change in control of the House or Senate, then things will ease up anywhere between December and March

If Trump wins but the Democrats control Congress, then things will ease up anywhere between late Spring to early Summer and March

If Trump loses, things become unpredictable and far too interesting (in a bad way)

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I was in a Walmart yesterday and was looking at the bare gun counter when they brought up a solitary brick of Federal Champion .22LR which was $17.50. It lasted on the shelf about 15 seconds. :D

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I just got back from a local store that had a shelf with a note that said " One box of 9mm per person per day".  There was one box of Fiocchi left.  I didn't buy it.  I was in the same store last week and there wasn't any 9 mm available and no note.  There must have been a shipment within the last week, which leads me to believe some ammo is getting through.  One other store, Fleet Farm, had plenty of rifle ammo, 308, 30-06, 300 Magnum, but no handgun ammo. 

 

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