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Ideas to Grow SASS Membership and expand the Sport


Buckaroo Bubba

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29 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

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Now I said all this to say that nearly every newcomer that comes on here hears something like this;

"That gun won't cut it. It's not fast enough."

"You'll never win a match shooting that thing, you need a Winmarlinchester 76.5"

"Those things are slow."

 

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Pat:

     Thank you for pointing that out.

     Since funding is a big issue for those wanting to get into CAS, purchasing firearms that fit the bill but at a lesser cost, will enable them to do so.

     If their mind-set from the get go is to shoot as fast as those who have already attained that level, they will never be happy with the lesser firearms.

     FUN, dressing cowboy, and Comradery should come first to the sport.

     Case in point, why would 333 cowboys, cowgirls, buckaroos and buckarettes show up at End of Trail last year if only a handful were going to be the fastest shooters? I would wager that well over 60% of them know they will never win anything for speed, but they most likely will be the happiest in the end going in with no expectations but to enjoy the experience.

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A lot of good points all around about advertising, equipment, etc.  To expound on the equipment issue.  We have quite a few people with interest show up at our club meetings.  Almost all of them have 1- SA pistol of one type or another and a WInchester Model 94 rifle in 30-30.  The first question they ask is about equipment and costuming.  All of the "experienced hands" at the meeting pipe up and welcome the interested party and offer the use of equipment.  Someone invariably has to go through the explanation of yes, your Ruger SA in .357 is fine, but you will need a second one.  And of course the Winchester 94 in 30-30 won't work because you need a pistol caliber lever rifle.  And of course you'll need a shotgun.  Why yes, you do need two holsters and a belt and a shotgun belt and a cowboy hat and boots, no, your workboots with the vibram soles won't work. And you might want to consider something to drag all that stuff around with.  By the time their done, they're adding up an additional $2000-$3000 just to get started.  Despite the offers of equipment to use, they never show up again.

 

 If we had a new shooter category where the new person only need say 1 pistol and a rifle to get started; give them some leeway on costume, say jeans and lonsgleeve shirt, away you go.  By the end of the first year, they are going to have mentors take them under their wing.   I think most of up by now know where to find deals on equipment, but we didn't know that when we first started.  It took some time to build  those connections.   

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38 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Oh, by the way 10 -20 years ago EVERY manufacturer was focusing marketing on SASS.

What happened to them?

 

SASS is the first shooting sport in which I ever participated.   I learned about SASS watching a television show (produced by Wofbane.)  I suspect a lot of SASS members in the second or third generation learned about CAS from that show.   

 

This year the CAS coverage on the outdoor channel has been OK, but nothing like a weekly show.  Talking to people who put TV shows on cable, it is all about the right sponsorship.   If you can show a sponsor that they can sell product by sponsoring a show they will pay your freight.   Hell most of the shooting shows are little more than long infomercials.  Midway USA sponsors a whole night on Outdoor Channel, but the shows they sponsor all tie in somehow with the products they sell.     

 

On its face CAS would be a perfect topic for a cable show.  Old time guns, costumes, lots of smoke etc, make for interesting TV.  But a CAS show doesn't tie in with  the latest conceal carry holster or the M&P Shield.  There are no Glock's in either Cowboy shooting or Wild Bunch.   You will notice that shotgun shooting doesn't get much play on cable as well for some of the same reasons.   It doesn't even have the attractions of costuming and smoke.  CAS and shotgun games such as Sporting Clays are far more popular with the general public than IDPA, USPSA, or three gun, but those sports help move a lot of product to non-participants.  

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1 minute ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

SASS became what it is now...interest waned.

As I said, I am not sure general interest waned, but I want to hear from others as well.  

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10 minutes ago, Bart Solo said:

As I said, I am not sure general interest waned, but I want to hear from others as well.  

Interest by manufacturers, magazines, sports writers, businesses has waned. Why? IMO because something has been lost in regards to SASS.

 

Hence Bubba's article in the Chronicle and this thread.

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Interest by manufacturers, magazines, sports writers, businesses has waned. Why?

There is only one thing that interests manufacturers, magazines, sports writers and related businesses, money.   They just think there is more money selling conceal carry guns to people who put them in drawers and forget about them.  

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What's wrong with a timed, but not scored, beginner's category?  There has been a lot of call for it over the years, but invariably, it's been shot down by the "old hands", saying "it's not as bad as a boat, or not as bad as a really good set of clubs...". 

But, we are the ones with dwindling membership, so it's time to come up with a a fresh approach and a new mindset.

 

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22 hours ago, J. Mark Flint #31954 LIFE said:

SASS is a weird version of a business.  We are customers, and we are here talking about how to grow the "Membership" aka customer base.  What other business does that?

 

So to address the OP

 

SASS needs to take the reins on membership/customer growth-like any other business and spend money advertising and promoting SASS.  Alternatively, they could change the structure of SASS to a true membership organization, which would give members a real reason to promote the sport.

 

Now as to promoting club level membership (Now I am not talking customers, but true club members that vote and are heard and have influence in what really goes on),  Word of mouth, dressing up for gun shows and giving away flyers, renting a booth and running videos and promoting local matches all make sense.  Other things like a food drive, a coat drive thanksgiving dinner for Veterans etc are all things that members can do to get in a position to make that initial contact.

 

 

I agree, great ideas. It's that time of year for us to start handing out a new batch of flyers, to gun and pawn shops obviously, hardware stores/seed & feed, garage and tire shops, auto parts stores, barber shop, marinas, sports shops, building material supplies....etc..etc. I've been to our local Jr. shooting classes all dressed up with guns to show and tell...I make em' watch Grizzly Dave's video;). Another group to target is the new NRA Women On Target.

   And I think SASS needs to get us back on TV, maybe once month or several times a year, that's where I found out about SASS. CFDA has been doing a good job promoting themselves on TV. And of course we need to make sure we greet and help new shooters. J. Mark Flint and Bat Masterson were the first two to come up and ask if we needed anything, and J. Mark stayed long enough to helped us with some shooting tips.....it's all good;)......Good Luck:)

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1 hour ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

What you wrote right there makes my point in a round about way....why are we having this conversation again?

 

Oh, by the way 10 -20 years ago EVERY manufacturer was focusing marketing on SASS.

10-20 years ago; the game was growing. 

And NEW shooters need new guns.

With the leveling off of growth/ participation in our game; the NEED for new equipment levels off as well.

 

The limitations on equipment (which is a good thing), also works against us being attractive customers for manufacturers as there is no drive to replace last year's model because of this year's new upgrade.

 

So even the entry level Gunner in modern shooting games shooting his "box stock" pistol is more attractive to manufacturers; as he will "need" and will purchase new magazines/ sights/ guiderod/ carbon fiber underwear when his are outclassesd by this year's new super wahooie version.

 

But selling to the CAS customer without that equipment drive becomes harder every year as their need for new/ additional stuff diminishes every year.  Only need so many guns, leather rigs, gun carts, reloaders, pairs of boots, 100x beaver hats, etc.  And last year's (or even 10 years ago) version is still perfectly competitive.

 

As for the game not being about speed; this game came into existence from the basis of speed shooting.  IPSC shooters using single action revolvers.  It didn't spring to life to honor the old west or silver screen heros.  It has morphed to include that; but don't mislead yourself, the game is and always has been about the ability to run your guns.

 

The game has always preferenced and revered the fast shooter over the accurate shooter.  That's why we score simple hits, not scoring rings.  If you were not fast at the beginning; you would not win.  The same holds true today.

 

There have been clubs and match directors that have attempted to change the balance to accuracy over speed; with 10 second miss penalties and small distant targets.  Take a look and see how many of those clubs and match directors are still around.

 

People like to go fast.  Period.

 

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Here is an idea-in addition to matches, have organized range days devoted to skills development.  Experienced shooters would get practice, new shooters would get a chance to learn from experienced shooters outside of a competitive environment and  those who can't afford a full set up could practice and learn until such time as their finances allowed.  It is not a match, but  a range fee would help clubs to generate additional income.

 

I would envision a rifle practice stage, a pistol practice stage, a shotgun practice stage and a transitions practice stage that used all guns

 

Time it all and record all misses and penalties so that shooters can determine a baseline and develop from there

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It's amazing...The question was asked what do we need to do to attract new shooters. If we need to attract new shooters something is wrong or something is broken.

Continuing to use the same mindset that has been prevalent for the past decade or so only means one thing. Membership will diminish as people quit or can no longer shoot CAS.

 

Do you all frequent other forums besides the Wire? If so perhaps you have come across folks making comments about SASS and CAS calling it the "geezer shooting sport". I have also seen it referenced as "wannabe 3 gun with antiques"...Really? CAS has been around a hell of a lot longer than 3 Gun but that shows that SASS and CAS is now viewed.

 

image.jpeg.c1fcdbac20a509d8c173f984fdd78d71.jpeg

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I think any kind of advertising or social media would help. There are 4 clubs within 120 miles of where I live including the local club and until I happened to run across some videos on the net I had never heard of CAS or SASS. Most of the people I have told about it have never heard of it either. All of the ideas on here sound good but it looks to me like if we don't keep the discussion going across all clubs that we will be fighting a losing battle. Just an opinion from someone new to SASS. I wish I had heard of it a lot of years ago so I sure want it to keep going and growing now!!!!!!

 

Jax T

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On 4/10/2018 at 2:01 PM, J. Mark Flint #31954 LIFE said:

SASS is a weird version of a business.  We are customers, and we are here talking about how to grow the "Membership" aka customer base.  What other business does that?

 

So to address the OP

 

SASS needs to take the reins on membership/customer growth-like any other business and spend money advertising and promoting SASS.  Alternatively, they could change the structure of SASS to a true membership organization, which would give members a real reason to promote the sport.

 

Now as to promoting club level membership (Now I am not talking customers, but true club members that vote and are heard and have influence in what really goes on),  Word of mouth, dressing up for gun shows and giving away flyers, renting a booth and running videos and promoting local matches all make sense.  Other things like a food drive, a coat drive thanksgiving dinner for Veterans etc are all things that members can do to get in a position to make that initial contact.

 

 

what J. Mark hit the nail on the head....

his first point: maybe its time to make remake the national organization to a true membership organization....

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13 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

If we need to attract new shooters something is wrong or something is broken.

 

perhaps you have come across folks making comments about SASS and CAS calling it the "geezer shooting sport". 

 

As current participants age out of the game (die) or lose interest/ find other pursuits there is always a "hole in the bucket" that drains away your base.

 

All consumer goods must continually find ways to replenish those losses.

 

IF your product is strong enough; you can continue to sell the same thing you did 20 years ago.  But even Coca Cola has had to add items to their portfolio to support the core product because interests and attitudes change.

 

Cadillac has changed styling, performance and advertising because their core customers were dying off.

 

Harley Davidson is on the verge of disappearing because of their adversity to change and unwillingness to adjust their product to current market realities.

 

And we ARE currently the Geezer shooting sport (and to many within our game, sport is a dirty word - they prefer game or social gathering) 

 

We continually stress the age/ gender  inclusiveness of our stage writing.  Marketing ourselves as a Geezer event.

Our motto of "come for the shooting; stay for the people", tells everyone the importance we place upon the competition aspects of the game.

We have allowed the T Ball mentality of ever increasing categories to ensure everyone gets a participation trophy.  

A quick read of our postings show the outside world the disdain we have for folks that take the competion part of the game seriously.

 

I have never seen modern shooting sports market themselves as the warm, fuzzy, bonding experience of your dreams. 

They market themselves as fast, exciting, high adredeline.

To draw shooters from those disciplines (which is by far the most likely pool of possible participants) will take something vastly different than our current path.

 

The youth want excitement and speed and us?

We are continually bragging  about ways to simplify our events, ease the effort it takes to participate and ensure that the lowest common denominator is never made to feel left out. 

We never have too many shotgun - after all, the barrels get too hot or the recoil is excessive.

We dont move and shoot; we openly acknowledge our shooters are incapable.

We won't make you manipulate a prop; it might make a special snowflake shooter feel unsafe.

 

John Wayne is dead.

This games future (if one exists) requires priorities that place excitement and competion far above honoring dead movie stars, creating social events and attempting to remember a version of history that never really existed.

And that future (if it exists) will likely require leaving some of our current ideals, practices and shooters behind

 

Or maybe we need to acknowledge our game has run it's course.  That the participants are dinosaurs that are no longer valid or driving forces in the shooting sports arena.  And will only be attractive to other dinosaurs.

 

But our game in it's current configuration is shrinking and more of the same or slight variations on a theme will not draw shooters from other venues.

 

I am well aware my opinions will not be popular; but what we are doing now is NOT working. 

And the op asked for input.

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When did SASS go from 10 sec for a miss, to 5 sec?

One of the other costs to entering this game(or any shooting game),is the the need to be able to reload all the ammo you will burn up.

From what I have seen-ALL shooting sports are taking attendance 'hits'. Not just CAS.

OLG

 

 

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10 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

When did SASS go from 10 sec for a miss, to 5 sec?

One of the other costs to entering this game(or any shooting game),is the the need to be able to reload all the ammo you will burn up.

From what I have seen-ALL shooting sports are taking attendance 'hits'. Not just CAS.

OLG

 

 

I thought it always had been 5 seconds.

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This will not be a popular viewpoint. 

 

The things that drew me in are gone.  This game has turned into one of "how fast you can manipulate the action of your gun".  And before you mention it, yes, I do know that Bordertown sells out in just a few days.  But a lot of us just aren't interested in that format.  Frankly, it's boring.

 

Robbing the bank, saving the damsel in distress, transporting the gold shipment.  On the clock activities.  Stuff like moving the bag of rocks (gold) from one position to the next without dropping it, or carrying the stuffed animal through the stage (save yer horse).  That's really what used to set this game apart.  Those stages are gone.  I really miss them.  Monthly matches aren't near the fun they used to be.

 

Stages with rifle targets actually at 25 or 30 yards, pistol targets really at 8 to 10 yards.  I miss those days.  One local club used to have a rifle target that was about 2 inches wide and 18 inches tall at 25 yards.  Those "bacon strips" were sure a challenge and a real joy to shoot. 

 

If I want a speed match I can go shoot any number of other sports.  Now I shoot Steel Challenge once a month just to shoot a pistol target that's not big and close. 

 

In addition, I'm dismayed to see people unholster revolvers and put them in their carts after shooting a stage.  That doesn't seem safe to me.  At least holstered they are essentially cased.  No other shooting sport allows this, and for good reason.  This alone has chased off at least 2 shooters that I've brought out.

 

Perhaps we ought to look at what we offer for entertainment.

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5 hours ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

It's amazing...The question was asked what do we need to do to attract new shooters. If we need to attract new shooters something is wrong or something is broken.

Continuing to use the same mindset that has been prevalent for the past decade or so only means one thing. Membership will diminish as people quit or can no longer shoot CAS.

 

Do you all frequent other forums besides the Wire? If so perhaps you have come across folks making comments about SASS and CAS calling it the "geezer shooting sport". I have also seen it referenced as "wannabe 3 gun with antiques"...Really? CAS has been around a hell of a lot longer than 3 Gun but that shows that SASS and CAS is now viewed.

 

image.jpeg.c1fcdbac20a509d8c173f984fdd78d71.jpeg

We had the same debate, with exactly the same arguments 5 years ago.   In the meantime we haven't changed much, except the stage times have gotten faster and faster.  Personally I have shot several other shooting sports, and CAS is still my favorite.  

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A couple of us went to a NCOWS match this past weekend and had a great time. They have a new match director that's trying to revive the club so an invitation was extended to our SASS club to come out with our cowboy guns and give it a go. It was a nice break to have to slow down and use that little sight thingy on the end of the barrel and actually have to aim. As a result we're planning on incorporating a few of their designs into our matches just to make things a little more challenging. While I've only been in the game less than 5 years I have to admit the in your face, burn it down stages we typically see are getting boring. I agree we need to dial back the calendar and make the stages more entertaining and challenging for the average shooter.

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I don’t know but maybe there needs to be a wholesale change of thinking regarding  Cowboy Action Shooting. Maybe it is a speed sport meant for those that can burn through a stage in sub 10 seconds. Maybe we need to go back to the old days where a fast stage is anything under 60 seconds with lots of props to navigate and manipulate. Where’s the middle ground? The clubs around here with the old school mentality aren’t around anymore or they are dying a slow death. If I had to carry my old model Vaqueros around in my holsters on my belt I wouldnt be back for the next match, my back just won’t take it. Pala closed up in December and even though they were 8 miles from my house I rarely shot there, it wasn’t fun. They were using handwritten stages from 20 years ago and the targets were from the same vintage, if you don’t change and adapt you’re going to die and they did, sadly. We’ve got another club down here that is standing on the banana peel, any new recommendations are met with scorn and “We can’t do that”. I don’t know maybe it is time for folks like me to hang it up. How do we grow the sport? It’s up to us plain and simple.

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I like options in shooting.  For example, add a small circle to the corner of a target...hit that for a time bonus.  This lets folks go for either accuracy or speed on the same stages.  Same concept for rifle targets:  have a second set farther back that count for a time bonus.

 

I realize this requires more hardware and more diligent observers, but those are both prices I would pay to get to make more choices on the firing line as to what would be the most fun for me.

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Looking back 10 years the times were just starting to break into the teens. The shoots had high attendance. The targets were out a couple more yards and around 16 x 16 inches. Then, someone decided to get rid of Modern and Traditional and create 49r, Wrangler, and Cowboy, this created heartburn for many that shot in the Modern class. No one likes to get things shoved down their throat and this was the final straw for some. 

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Something I have always wondered about was a “stock” class. Factory unmodified guns, just like a cowpoke would have bought a general store back in the old days. Obviously I am not talking about original Colts and Winchester’s but new guns, be they Colts and Winchester’s, clones or modern adaptions of an old design like a Vaqueros and such.

A Stock Class would mean less money for newcomers as the need or perceived need to “slick up” their guns would be diminished.

I believe this idea was floated many years ago but the consensus was “How would one know that a stock gun wasn’t modified internally?”. My response then and would be now “It would be an honor system”.

What Cowboy or Cowgirl doesn’t have a code of honor, right?

 

Speaking of “codes”, it wouldn’t hurt if we in SASS didn’t have a list of codes that set CAS apart from all other shooting sports. Kind of like Gene Autry’s or Roy Rogers’ or The Lone Ranger’s codes. Just a thought.

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11 hours ago, Sarge2 said:

 If we had a new shooter category where the new person only need say 1 pistol and a rifle to get started; give them some leeway on costume, say jeans and lonsgleeve shirt, away you go.  By the end of the first year, they are going to have mentors take them under their wing.   I think most of up by now know where to find deals on equipment, but we didn't know that when we first started.  It took some time to build  those connections.   

Our club has a Sod Buster category.  New shooters have the choice of a pistol and a rifle or a pistol and a shotgun.  We accept DA revolvers if shot single action.  Shotguns can be single barrel, double barrel, slide action, lever action, even semi-auto if singly loaded.  Rifles can be single shot, lever, or pump in pistol caliber.  Frankly, we get very few new shooters that use this category.  Despite us continually telling new shooters to try our guns for a few matches to find out what they really like or want, they still run right out and buy something to shoot with.

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51 minutes ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Something I have always wondered about was a “stock” class. Factory unmodified guns, just like a cowpoke would have bought a general store back in the old days. Obviously I am not talking about original Colts and Winchester’s but new guns, be they Colts and Winchester’s, clones or modern adaptions of an old design like a Vaqueros and such.

A Stock Class would mean less money for newcomers as the need or perceived need to “slick up” their guns would be diminished.

I believe this idea was floated many years ago but the consensus was “How would one know that a stock gun wasn’t modified internally?”. My response then and would be now “It would be an honor system”.

What Cowboy or Cowgirl doesn’t have a code of honor, right?

 

Speaking of “codes”, it wouldn’t hurt if we in SASS didn’t have a list of codes that set CAS apart from all other shooting sports. Kind of like Gene Autry’s or Roy Rogers’ or The Lone Ranger’s codes. Just a thought.

 

Pat, I'm going to be honest.  While a "stock" class sounds like a good idea, it's really a "feel good".  There really are very few mods to the guns that actually can create a speed improvement, and that improvement is really small.  Mostly they're about what goes on between the ears.  The biggest impact mods are things like length of pull, and grips that fit your hands.  Not stuff like short strokes and light springs.  I've got data to back up that assertion as well.  Matter of fact, going to springs that are too light has a negative effect on speed.  Lock time is important, and heavier springs speed that up.

 

 

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One of the issues with SASS is that the general population still does not know who we are.   We live in a very small town.  As a family we have submitted newspaper articles of the family shooting in our local newspaper, being involved with town activities such a demonstrations using blanks during National Day of the Cowboy and leaving chronicles in uptown Sedona where tourism is big.   I get a lot of questions around town on how my kids are doing, yet few people understand what they are doing.  The headline of the last article in our local newspaper is, “Rootin’, tootin’, shootin’ Sedonan wins second title.”(refering to Cody’s overall title at Winter Range)  While catchy in the old west genre, I am not sure it captures the competiveness of what was accomplished and it may miss a portion of our market.

The beauty of SASS is that you can get involved in its many different activities.  Some shooters get involved in SASS for the dress, shooting the period correct firearms, the family atmosphere and/ or a flat out drag race to be the fastest shooter in the world.  I would not change this. I enjoy the fact it bring in folks for all kinds of reasons.  Maybe our advertisement is too diverse and doesn’t specifically promote membership in areas that appeal to the general public.  I am not advocating we change what SASS  looks like, but take a look at our marketing strategies to bring others into SASS.  Shooting USA has done an excellent job of showcasing SASS in the past,  but missed an opportunity to show the Top 16 shoot-offs.  It may have just been a time issue, but if you are interested in the competitive nature of SASS, the Top 16 is what gets the adrenaline pumping, even as a spectator.  Charity events like Police vs. Cowboys would be a great way to make the news as well as give back to those in need.  Would a head- to- head top 16 event in Vegas draw a crowd?  Several of our shooters, Matt Black, Lead Dispenser, Slick McClade, Holy Terror ,to name a few, have made it onto major network stations. While speed is just one aspect of SASS, all major media attention has focused on this. If this is where interest lies, it must be highlighted and promoted.  Affordability is another area of concern for families and younger shooters. SASS and local clubs has done a beautiful job with scholarships and its members have shown incredible generosity for younger families (EX:  Winter Range outpouring of support for the family of 7 with 4 shooters and the incredible donations received.)  This generosity should be publicized.    While SASS is a total package, and meets the needs of their individuals, it will take expertise in marketing to get an increase in enrollment and get the visibility it needs to grow.

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At my club here in oz, we had the club buy a Rossi in 357/38, pair of ruger vaqueros in 357 and a 12g boito ( stoeger) for the newbies that wanted to try the sport and they just have to pay for the ammo they are going to use and to get people in to try is basically word of mouth. All options are given on what type of guns can be used but we emphasise that you can buy second hand guns as a cheaper option and they are just as good. Also the same with reloading in terms of presses and accessories even to buying once fired cases.

 

  • And in terms for a category you could always go with Newbies or Cherry Poppers:D:P
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6 hours ago, Doc Shapiro said:

 

Pat, I'm going to be honest.  While a "stock" class sounds like a good idea, it's really a "feel good".  There really are very few mods to the guns that actually can create a speed improvement, and that improvement is really small.  Mostly they're about what goes on between the ears.  The biggest impact mods are things like length of pull, and grips that fit your hands.  Not stuff like short strokes and light springs.  I've got data to back up that assertion as well.  Matter of fact, going to springs that are too light has a negative effect on speed.  Lock time is important, and heavier springs speed that up.

 

 

Doc, that’s interesting and I can believe it. 

 

My idea for a “stock” or “factory” category is more about creating a situation where one didn’t feel they needed to pony up the money to modify guns that they just spent hundreds or thousands of dollars on.

 

Like I said in my first post in this thread “We are intimidating” when it comes to guns, gear, mods, prep, practice, reloading, costuming, accessories, carts....

 

Get my drift?

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not sure if this has be said,,,    have a supply of ammo on hand for visitors,,,  I know lots of shooters have extra and offer it up,, but someone may be more willing to try it if they don't feel like they are using someone's prized ammo.   maybe have an "ambassador" on each posse to sic on visitors

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14 hours ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

I thought it always had been 5 seconds.

It's always been 5 seconds since I remember for the last 20 years!

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2 hours ago, Pat Riot, SASS #13748 said:

Doc, that’s interesting and I can believe it. 

 

My idea for a “stock” or “factory” category is more about creating a situation where one didn’t feel they needed to pony up the money to modify guns that they just spent hundreds or thousands of dollars on.

 

Like I said in my first post in this thread “We are intimidating” when it comes to guns, gear, mods, prep, practice, reloading, costuming, accessories, carts....

 

Get my drift?

 

I do.  But I really think that this attitude is more a "Wire" artifact than what people experience when they come out to watch a match. 

 

Let's face it, this shooting game has unusually high start up costs. 

 

You can start Steel Challenge with a .22 pistol or rifle and 5 magazines.  You don't even need a holster!  That's less than $500. 

 

IDPA requires a gun, holster, a couple of mags, and some mag holders.  Easily done for under $1000. 

 

For CAS, even bone stock, 2 revolvers ($1200), a '73 ($1200), a shotgun ($500), leather ($650), and a gun cart ($500) adds up to $4000 real quick.  Heck, you can get a full bore IPSC race gun for less than that!  I expect this startup cost is the long pole in the tent.  And there really isn't a good way to deal with it.

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37 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

It's always been 5 seconds since I remember for the last 20 years!

Same here.

 

Does anyone know when SASS went to 2 revolvers? I recall when I was buying my guns for SASS I was under the impression you needed only one revolver. At that time money at my house was super tight. It took me 6 months to get the 2nd revolver so I could shoot CAS. At the time I didn't know folks were so friendly that someone would actually loan me a gun.

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I believe Kirk James has it right. Most folks have never heard of CAS. If they have heard of CAS they think of "quick draw" or the guys doing hokey reenacting in western towns. Some of the people that have come out and participated in our matches got intimidated and told me they would never be able to compete. Others enjoyed the guns and shooting, they did not like the attire. It's my opinion that the wax bullet shoots that were held at the conventions did not help our cause, folks that watched it

thought that was what CAS was all about and they just laughed and told me how they would not shoot wax bullets. First impressions last forever.

A video would be a nice tool, not the fastest shooters, maybe middle of the pack people. Not overly dressed and perhaps in their early forties. Get rid of minor categories and simplify the entire system including the rules. 

 

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