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Rancho Roy

COWBOY 45 Special...It's Heerrree!

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My conversion cylinders will not take a Schofield Case. They do take the Colt 45 Special Case, and it's a terrific round! Also, I don't load a full case of BP to take down a target that's right in front of me. What a waste of powder, (which is a waste of $$). I don't load grits, seems like a waste of time.

I've load a C45S case full of BP, top it off with a 200gr bullet, and I have a powerful, flat trajectory round that rolls the pistol up in my hand for the follow-up shot, without the pounding,

 

I've been loading the same 500 C45S cases since they were first available, when I shoot ca'tridge outa my C&B pistols, . Although they are still usable, it's time to buy some more!

 

I'm ordering the C45S in the morning for use in my ROA's many 45 Schofields won't fit in my conversions cylinders. Since I'm using them in pistol only I won't worry about the brass pickers not finding them all. 500 ought to last awhile.

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Gimme a BREAK!!! Everybody moaning and lamenting and whining the brass wasn't available. Now, it's available. So now, everyone starts moaning and groaning and whining at the price.

 

Coffinmaker

Actually I made a bunch today, and am ordering 250 tomorrow! Like I stated earlier, the .36 cents apiece is high, but like Widder points out, they do last along time!

CC, there are those that will "moan " if the price was .01 cent apiece.... ;)

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CC, there are those that will "moan " if the price was .01 cent apiece.... ;)

 

Some folks would moan if they given the ammo in nice, tidy boxes of 50. They would moan that the boxes weren't 100 rounds.

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I would believe it is proper to be wary of a 100% price increase from the last time cases were available. Sure, the new owners of the brand deserve a profit. But if they are gouging (which this kinda looks like, especially now that raw materials for brass are the lowest cost in 10 years, and Starline is caught up with all their standard brass production, and Starline will direct ship you .45 Schofield cases at 19 cents apiece in 1000 quantities), they don't deserve my business.

 

Just my view from the trail.

 

Good luck, GJ

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Pards,

 

Ya just have to ask yeowndangself: "What would Ben Cartwright do"?

 

;)

 

..........Widder

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As for why buy 45 Cots instead of just buying 38 special guns, the answer is, I ain't picking out all those small cases from inside my large cases. I do 44-40 in BP and my wife does 45 Colt in smokeless, just 'cuz she can. So my kids are also starting out with 44-40(my daughter just started centerfire, decided she likes BP also!) and my son will do whichever one he feels like. No small cases for us. Just because I have a big truck doesn't mean i have to go around with it floored all the time, going slow in town works also, don't need to buy a smaller car. I already have 500 45 CS cases from a few years ago, use them sometimes, work fine. Don't remember how much they cost, didn't care, they were the only game in town without doing a lot of work.

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I don't understand why cowpokes buy 45s (which IMHO are meant to go BOOM) just to download them to lite poof loads.

 

 

I'm with Matthew on this, if you want to shoot "Sub Loads" shoot "Sub Caliber" guns...

I think that CC should require a minium PF of 150 or more...

 

Flame away ,,, it's Winter and I could stand the heat ...

 

 

Jabez Cowboy

One of the great things about this game is a person can pay their money and play it how so ever they want! You want to shoot full power loads, you certainly may! Next person wants to shoot a much lighter load, they paid their money, they certainly may! Next person wants to to shoot something in the middle, they can, too.

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I have to chime in here.....A few years ago when Adirondack Jack was selling the Cowboy 45 Special business, I was in serious contemplation in buying it. I had a number of conversations with him and the deal we put together was more than fair, but I was simply too involved with another start up, high tech, business and didn't feel I could put the time into CB45S that it would need to make it financially viable.

 

I did an analysis on what Jack had sold and the price he was paying and the price he was charging. Looking at the total investment it was clear, on a limited production, nitch item like this, the price had to go up.

 

When the next owner took over and advertised her pricing, I was surprised they did not come to the same conclusion. Knowing what I knew, I ordered 1000 cases from her...before they might never be available again....since I never lose a case as I only use them in my revolvers, this was enough for a few lifetimes. I've reloaded the same cases at least 50 times and have never experienced even one split case.

 

Now...Why do we shoot CB45S instead of 32/38.......Because we like big holes in the end of the barrel! And 45LC, at the pressures we shoot , are incredibly dirty. When I pick brass at a match I'm always amazed at how dirty the brass is. It simply doesn't expand too seal the chambers at CAS pressures. I finally switched every long gun to 38-40 and my 1860 Conversions to CB45S.....And I rarely clean my guns when shooting smokeless. Maybe one after every 15-20 matches....Or if I'm bored on a rainy day.

 

When shooting BP, the CB45S really shines. a full case has manageable recoil with a 160g bullet and shoots VERY clean.(but cleaning is still required immediately)

 

I'm glad it is available again. All the folks screaming about price are being a bit foolish. It is a onetime purchase that costs much less than attending a regional event. You don't need to buy reloading dies if you have 45APC dies and you can use the same bullets you use in 45LC or 45ACP........

 

I hope this helps to put the situation into more focus................Let's help this fellow out and not slam him too badly.....He is only trying to run a business. In his best fantasy, he ain't going to get rich on CB45S sales

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I hope this helps to put the situation into more focus................Let's help this fellow out and not slam him too badly.....He is only trying to run a business. In his best fantasy, he ain't going to get rich on CB45S sales

 

 

 

 

+1 and he is trying to help us Cowboy shooters out.

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And for those who don't like poof loads, a 45CS case with most any fast burning powder is nothing to sneeze at. May even be faster than the normal 45 Colt Cowboy load. It just fills the case instead of being half empty. I don't hear any of you saying a normal 45 auto is a poof load! Same case with a rim. Consider that for a bit.

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It's my understanding that Star Line does not sell C45Spl brass in lots of less than 50K. So, in order for someone to offer this brass for sale they have to make a considerable up front investment. That said, if the price seems too high, simply order 50K and offer them for sale. Soon enough, we will see what the going price will be.

 

DD-MDA

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If I'm not mistaken, I believe for this special brass it was 100K minimum order............

 

But your point is well taken Dick....Thanks

 

(BTW...I was surprised you didn't buy the company from Jack......It would have dovetailed nicely with your other endeavors)

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I would believe it is proper to be wary of a 100% price increase from the last time cases were available. Sure, the new owners of the brand deserve a profit. But if they are gouging (which this kinda looks like, especially now that raw materials for brass are the lowest cost in 10 years, and Starline is caught up with all their standard brass production, and Starline will direct ship you .45 Schofield cases at 19 cents apiece in 1000 quantities), they don't deserve my business.

 

Just my view from the trail.

 

Good luck, GJ

But it ISN'T a 100% increase over the last time it was offered. It ain't even a 100% over the first time it was offered.

 

What you're all missing is the payment for the RIGHTS to the cartridge name. Cowboy45Special/C45S was trademarked by AJ, IIRC. I know Miss Cubbie paid a pretty penny for those rights, and I'd have to assume that this new owners of the rights did also. Starline ain't gonna sell a trademarked product to just anybody... they'd then be in violation of US law.

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But it ISN'T a 100% increase over the last time it was offered. It ain't even a 100% over the first time it was offered.

 

What you're all missing is the payment for the RIGHTS to the cartridge name. Cowboy45Special/C45S was trademarked by AJ, IIRC. I know Miss Cubbie paid a pretty penny for those rights, and I'd have to assume that this new owners of the rights did also. Starline ain't gonna sell a trademarked product to just anybody... they'd then be in violation of US law.

I sure did not suggest that Starline would sell C45S brass directly! Read it again.

 

I bought C45S last time around. I can pull my receipts if you would like. And the increase is pretty close to 100%.

 

Good luck, GJ

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I bought 3 lots of 500 and one lot of 1,000 since 2011, just looked at my records and each of the lots of 500 ranged from $110 - $185, and the lot of 1,000 was just under $300 with shipping. You must've got a lot better bargain than I did.

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Now...Why do we shoot CB45S instead of 32/38.......Because we like big holes in the end of the barrel! And 45LC, at the pressures we shoot , are incredibly dirty. When I pick brass at a match I'm always amazed at how dirty the brass is. It simply doesn't expand too seal the chambers at CAS pressures. I finally switched every long gun to 38-40 and my 1860 Conversions to CB45S.....And I rarely clean my guns when shooting smokeless. Maybe one after every 15-20 matches....Or if I'm bored on a rainy day.

 

Yeah, that.....and someone may have already invested in a 45 caliber set up and doesn't want to reinvest in a 38/32 cal setup. My rifle 45 Colt BP loads were a bit stout for my 72 Open Tops so I switched to Schofield loads for my pistols because the cases were more readily available at the time. A whole set of her brother's guns went to my daughter and she opted for the 45CS case to go with a 160 gr bullet.

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Yes doc, that was me. I converted the very first 1873 to 45acp. Not hard to do and not really that expensive. I shoot it in wild bunch so only have to load one ammo. Great conversion in the 73's there are now a fair amount of shooters with this conversion. Very first one I did was a Marlin to 45acp that was a bunch of work and very time consuming. Dusty Boddams

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Gents, as the old saying goes: "If you want to dance, ya gotta pay the fiddler."
So if 45 Specials are your thing that you have talked 'many times' you wanted - they're here now so pay for them!
If you think the price is steep ... I paid 'the fiddler' an average of $3.79 per case for 80 pieces for a Schuetzen rifle caliber that is obsolete!

 

This post was paid for by Roy B! :D

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So, let's see.....per thousand I will save $164 if I trim down new Starline .45 Colt cases. And if I shoot the new Starline for my 45 Colt needs, and trim down several-times-used .45 Colt cases that I can "repurpose" - probably more like $250 per thousand. OK, time to mount up the drill-press mounted Forster case trimmer and start cuttin'.

 

:lol:

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Yes doc, that was me. I converted the very first 1873 to 45acp. Not hard to do and not really that expensive. I shoot it in wild bunch so only have to load one ammo. Great conversion in the 73's there are now a fair amount of shooters with this conversion. Very first one I did was a Marlin to 45acp that was a bunch of work and very time consuming. Dusty Boddams

Seems like 45acp would be easier than all this worry about the brass, 45acp is everywhere

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Seems like 45acp would be easier than all this worry about the brass, 45acp is everywhere

 

But not as clear if you're shooting cowboy with revolvers.

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But not as clear if you're shooting cowboy with revolvers.

At one time ( and maybe still?) EMF had 45 acp cylinders for their pietta revolvers, which are the ones I have.

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Just checking.

 

Has anyone bought brass or loaded ammo?

I have a thank you note and a tracking number for the 1,000 I just purchased. When Miss Cubbie had them, they were not much cheaper. I'm pleased to be able to increase my supply. According to the USPS, I should have them tomorrow.

 

CR

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At one time ( and maybe still?) EMF had 45 acp cylinders for their pietta revolvers, which are the ones I have.

 

I thought hard about getting ACP cylinders for my Cattleman and even talked it over with the nice ladies at Taylors and Company. They said the cylinders would normally drop in but if I wanted to ship them my guns, they would fit them at no extra charge. But I decided to go C45S instead after I got the Marlin 1894 Cowboy in 45 Colt.

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I have a thank you note and a tracking number for the 1,000 I just purchased. When Miss Cubbie had them, they were not much cheaper. I'm pleased to be able to increase my supply. According to the USPS, I should have them tomorrow.

 

CR

Did you get the new brass

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So, let's see.....per thousand I will save $164 if I trim down new Starline .45 Colt cases. And if I shoot the new Starline for my 45 Colt needs, and trim down several-times-used .45 Colt cases that I can "repurpose" - probably more like $250 per thousand. OK, time to mount up the drill-press mounted Forster case trimmer and start cuttin'.

 

:lol:

 

Oh boy, if you're serious I hope you have lots of free time. You're talking about trimming about 3/8" of inch off each case with a tool designed to trim a few thousandths per turn. Don't forget about the chamfering and deburring!

 

I did 500 cases in between Adirondack Jack and Miss Cubbie thinking it was the only way I would have any more. After all the work and time I spent, What Miss Cubbie was charging for the brass was very reasonable to me. The current prices I saw are only slightly higher than hers.

 

If you decide to go ahead with the DIY, I recommend that you make or have someone make you a jig out of a bar of steel. Cut the bar to .900" and drill a .480" hole in it to slip the case in up to the rim and use a band saw with a brand new very fine tooth blade to quickly cut the case close (watch your fingers) and then you can probably skip further trimming and just go straight to the chamfering and deburring.

Straight wall cases tend to shrink a little bit with repeating firing anyway.

 

If you're using Starline, Winchester, or Magtech brass they should work fine. Don't bother doing this to Remington brass, apparently the Remingtons are a little thicker down inside and would get really stuck on the expander. I had to toss all of those.

 

Good Luck!!!

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I'm with Matthew on this, if you want to shoot "Sub Loads" shoot "Sub Caliber" guns...

I think that CC should require a minium PF of 150 or more...

 

Flame away ,,, it's Winter and I could stand the heat ...

 

 

Jabez Cowboy

 

I have two words for your consideration!! Classic Cowboy!!

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I have two words for your consideration!! Classic Cowboy!!

Indeed....and still...rulez iz rulez...Some are willin'. I'd sure like to convert one of my '73's to 45 acp though.

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Indeed....and still...rulez iz rulez...Some are willin'. I'd sure like to convert one of my '73's to 45 acp though.

 

That's where the C45S could make a difference. You have a .45 rimmed cartridge. Should be perfectly fine for CC!! I've got a few and haven't tried 'em yet.

 

My regular .45 Colt combo works well with 160 gr all the way to 250 gr and almost as gentle as light .38s with the 160s, so I'll be interested as to how these compare.

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Did you get the new brass

It arrived on the 8th! Thank you!

 

CR

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It arrived on the 8th! Thank you!

 

CR

Let us know how well it loads. I had a few cases out of one batch I got from Miss Cubbie that had shallow pockets. A few by a lot - more but a little.

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Let us know how well it loads. I had a few cases out of one batch I got from Miss Cubbie that had shallow pockets. A few by a lot - more but a little.

Please provide a translation.

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Please provide a translation.

 

I started a topic on this back in September.

 

http://sassnet.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=241549&hl=pocket

 

I found some with a pocket depth of .110. More between that and .120. I used a pocket uniform tool on them all.

 

I've checked some from other batches and found all to be just fine.

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