Jump to content
SASS Wire Forum

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Black Angus McPherson

Loading .45 ACP - Small Primer

Recommended Posts

I've just started loading .45 ACP and I'm planning on using cases with small primers.  Why?  Because I have a bunch of small pistol primers and not so many large pistol primers.

 

The question:  Do you use the same loading data for .45 ACP with small primers as with large primers?  Right now I'm planning on loading 4 grains of Bullseye with a 200 grain RNFP (Cowboy) bullet.  I don't recall at the moment what reloading guide I got that from.  I think it shows pressure at ~9800 and velocity ~700 fps.

 

Next question:  I regularly size my .45's to .452".  Do I need to size them down to .451" for .45 ACP or does that extra .001" really make a difference.

 

I've got some Bullseye, Unique, W231 and Accurate #5 I may use for the ACP later.  What are some of your favorite loads.  Using the above 200 gr. RNFP.  I think I have a mold for a regular LRN I may try at some point, if I can find the mould.

 

Thanks,

 

Angus

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All else being equal, you will get slightly higher velocities with Large PP than you would with Small PP.

 

I say slightly, when I tested it last, load for load, the Large PP was about 1-3% faster than small PP.

 

The load I use now is 700x.

 

I don't have my numbers with me right now, but found someone else who ran the same test. These were his published results

 

Bullet Zero 200 grain SWC

4.7 grain 700-X

 

Small PP

Velocity 830 FPS

Spread 97 FPS

Std Dev 26 FPS

25 yard accuracy 1.75"

 

Large PP

Velocity 845 FPS

Spread 36 FPS

Std Dev 12 FPS

25 yard accuracy 1.31"

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Angus, please mark the bottom of your cases with a bright colored sharpie, and let others on your posse know.  You might get more brass back, but more importantly the others will be less likely to cuss you out for getting your brass mixed in with theirs and jamming their presses.  Thanks. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have exactly 1 .45 ACP case that uses a small primer.   Where it came from, I do not know.   Musta picked it up at random at a Wild Bunch match or something.   It is randomly mixed in with all my other .45 ACP ammo.   When I find it when reloading, I just chuckle, put in a primer and reload with the same amount of powder and bullet.   Obviously I notice no difference when it actually gets shot as I am always surprised to find that I still have it.   I'll continue to reload it until it splits or it gets randomly lost.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
41 minutes ago, Abilene, SASS # 27489 said:

Angus, please mark the bottom of your cases with a bright colored sharpie, and let others on your posse know.  You might get more brass back, but more importantly the others will be less likely to cuss you out for getting your brass mixed in with theirs and jamming their presses.  Thanks. :)

 

When I start a session of loading 45 ACP, I will deprime and resize about 100 cases and just set them aside in a small container.

 

Then, as I reload, I start the priming stoke very carefully. Any resistance, I take out the case and check the primer pocket. If it is a small one, I take one of those that I already deprimed and pop it back in the press to take the primer.

 

I actually thought, at one time, that there was a constitutional amendment proposed to ban small primer 45 ACP ammo. I guess I was mistaken. ^_^

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've segregated my small primer cases and use them in a recently acquired set of Ruger .45 acp Birdshead Vaqueros now. Same load as the 1911's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

.452 bullets work fine in my 1911's.  I use 200 gr. RNFP in my .45ACP and in .445Colt. rifle.

Blackfoot :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Black Angus McPherson said:

I regularly size my .45's to .452".  Do I need to size them down to .451" for .45 ACP or does that extra .001" really make a difference.

 

They will lead less and shoot better in most 1911s if the lead bullets are 0.452!

 

The SAAMI recommendations for the .45 auto cartridge are for jacketed bullets, 0.451" and for lead, 0.452".

 

Good luck, GJ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You are really going to make some friends at the range :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Black Angus McPherson said:

I've just started loading .45 ACP and I'm planning on using cases with small primers.  Why?  Because I have a bunch of small pistol primers and not so many large pistol primers.

 

The question:  Do you use the same loading data for .45 ACP with small primers as with large primers?  Right now I'm planning on loading 4 grains of Bullseye with a 200 grain RNFP (Cowboy) bullet.  I don't recall at the moment what reloading guide I got that from.  I think it shows pressure at ~9800 and velocity ~700 fps.

 

Next question:  I regularly size my .45's to .452".  Do I need to size them down to .451" for .45 ACP or does that extra .001" really make a difference.

 

I've got some Bullseye, Unique, W231 and Accurate #5 I may use for the ACP later.  What are some of your favorite loads.  Using the above 200 gr. RNFP.  I think I have a mold for a regular LRN I may try at some point, if I can find the mould.

 

Thanks,

 

Angus

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Abilene, SASS # 27489 said:

Angus, please mark the bottom of your cases with a bright colored sharpie, and let others on your posse know.  You might get more brass back, but more importantly the others will be less likely to cuss you out for getting your brass mixed in with theirs and jamming their presses.  Thanks. :)

 

That's my plan.  Mainly for my own benefit.  Right now I own fewer than 100 small primer .45's so I know I'll be loading "regular" .45 ACP, too.  Also, I don't shoot Wild Bunch so you guys that are sweating that you might get my cases don't have to worry.  :D   I had to buy some .45 ACP cartridges when I bought the gun.  I've never had a .45 ACP before now.  I guess I need to start paying attention to see who is selling .45 ACP with small primers.  BTW, if any of you guys are thinking about trashing the small primer .45's you have, you can send 'em to me.

 

39 minutes ago, Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 said:

 

They will lead less and shoot better in most 1911s if the lead bullets are 0.452!

Good luck, GJ

 

That simplifies things for me a lot.  

 

Thanks,

 

Angus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For years I have been using Federal Small Pistol Primers on the small primer .45   ACP with 200 Gr. semi wadccutter and 4.0 grains Bullseye.

In winter I go to Federal SP Magnum primers.  Along with this I use an 8 pound recoil spring in the Ruger.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, Deadwood Miner, SASS # 45575 said:

For years I have been using Federal Small Pistol Primers on the small primer .45   ACP with 200 Gr. semi wadccutter and 4.0 grains Bullseye.

In winter I go to Federal SP Magnum primers.  Along with this I use an 8 pound recoil spring in the Ruger.

8 lb. :huh:

Try 5.6gn of 231, and any sp primer.

OLG 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had to go look - Wolff actually makes 'em down to 7 pounds! :blink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Three Foot Johnson said:

I had to go look - Wolff actually makes 'em down to 7 pounds! :blink:

 

Close to what I run in my S&W model 41 .22 pistol :wacko:

OLG 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Blazer Brass 45 ACP have small pistol primers and the Federal Range load do also. I bought 6 boxes of each to break in my new Springfield. Now I have 600 cases as a starting point for loading.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I use to use sp 45 acp.  SP slightly lower velocities, but mag SP gave slightly higher than regular LP primer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I load the small & large primer cases with the same loads. I use 4.5 grs. Bullseye under a 230 gr. bullet. My Ruger SR1911 does not always cycle reliably with 4.0 grs. Bullseye.  Quit fiddling with 1911 springs when I stopped shooting bullseye matches and got rid of my tricked-out 1911's. Still have a cigar box of springs! Now only use the Ruger for Wild Bunch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Black Angus McPherson said:

Also, I don't shoot Wild Bunch so you guys that are sweating that you might get my cases don't have to worry.  :D    

 

Thanks,

 

Angus

 

Thanks for stating that you won't be shooting WB with the small pistol primers. Hopefully in time you'll join us in WB in the future. Enjoy your pistol!

 

Tully

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 hours ago, Black Angus McPherson said:

I've just started loading .45 ACP and I'm planning on using cases with small primers.  Why?  Because I have a bunch of small pistol primers and not so many large pistol primers.

 

The question:  Do you use the same loading data for .45 ACP with small primers as with large primers?  Right now I'm planning on loading 4 grains of Bullseye with a 200 grain RNFP (Cowboy) bullet.  I don't recall at the moment what reloading guide I got that from.  I think it shows pressure at ~9800 and velocity ~700 fps.

 

Next question:  I regularly size my .45's to .452".  Do I need to size them down to .451" for .45 ACP or does that extra .001" really make a difference.

 

I've got some Bullseye, Unique, W231 and Accurate #5 I may use for the ACP later.  What are some of your favorite loads.  Using the above 200 gr. RNFP.  I think I have a mold for a regular LRN I may try at some point, if I can find the mould.

 

Thanks,

 

Angus

 

 

The small primer pocket acp are easier to load as the primer pockets are more consistent than the large primer pocket cases. Could be due to the fact that there are fewer brands.

As far as people complaining about other folks using a case with small primer pockets I feel the same way when someone uses 44 mag when I'm using 45 Colt or 38-40 when I'm using 44-40. All depends on your perspective.

kR

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When i buy used brass I seperate the small primer from large. Most suppliers seperate them but you'll still find some small primer cases. I load the small primer brass when I've accumulated enough and use it at larger lost brass matches (USPSA). They are common enough now that shooters shouldn't be surprised when they find them. Not enough pf difference to matter.

 

Standard reloading practices should include inspecting your cases for rocks, dirt, tumbling media,  etc., that can be stuck in a case, even after tumbling, before dumping them in the casefeeder. You would find your small primer brass at the same time along with major dents and splits.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many of the police departments that use the range I supervise have switched to 45APC and use ammo with small primers. I have thousands of once fired cases with small primers.

 

But I don't use them in Wild Bunch as a courtesy to my fellow pards.

 

Getting a few  small primer shells mixed up with your large primer cases can be a bad day at the reloading bench. 

 

I use them for practice and plinking only. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.