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Smaller targets with less speed !


Rooster Ron Wayne

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Have ya eva looked at a car door target? 90% of tha hits are in tha 14" center. I don't know a fast guy who ain't tidy an wins with any regulairty (SP?)

 

 

RRR

+++++

The simple fact is if you look at the scores of any large match, as you near the top of the list, the percentage of clean shooters increases. For some reason, the far-and-awayers have always lacked the ability to pick up on this easily verified fact. RRR, I don't remember exactly how you worded it in an earlier post, but essentially as the match is made more difficult, the margin between the top shooters and the rest of the pack increases. It increases exponentially as you move down the list. Yet again, an easily verified fact. Facts are not always popular, especially when they differ from someone's opinion.

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Back in the old days we had to walk uphill in the snow to every stage.

 

The targets were so small they would only last for about 3 shots before they had to be replaced.

 

The targets were so far away that cap and ball shooters would shoot a round, run down to where it hit the ground, pick it up, reload it and shoot it again. .36 shooters had to do it 3 times usually before they were in range. .44 shooters only twice.

 

We had stages where you had to carry a horse through a mud bog, stick a burr under his saddle and then get on him whilst he was buckin to shoot.

 

If you didn't cast your own bullets you got a SOG penalty.

 

We ran so much you'd wear out two pair of boots in a match.

 

The RO made you disassemble your gun on the clock to make sure it wasn't modified.

 

Yup. It was great. :rolleyes::P

UB, that's funny. I'm certain the game changed all because of those .36 caliber gamers! :D Thanks for the smile!

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I think things can vary a bunch from one club to another. And definitely from region to region.

 

I started shooting cowboy at an older SASS club in Nebraska about 8 years ago. Then started going to an old NCOWS club also. Both shot pretty similar types of stages. Stories with the stages, maybe something extra to do before or after the timed shooting. We tried to have a few matches at our own "rifle" club modeled after these two great clubs. Couldn't get any locals to join in the fun but a few from the other clubs came and shot with us. Then another club started and sort of broke from the first. They played the game just a bit different, fast and close stages no stories, same game just felt different, but still fun. The new club now has the State match instead of the first one.

Then we moved to Arizona. I've shot with a couple of great groups out here so far. "blast fast SASS" I call it. Still fun for me but I miss the variety of the stages and target layouts. I miss the stories. I miss not getting hit by splash-back almost every stage.

Somewhere along the line I heard about the Grand Army of the Frontier (GAF). An international CAS group that has roots in SASS, NCOWS, NSSA, rendezvous, and living history. Honoring the military from the end of the civil was to just before WWI. They have whats called Musters. Action shooting with old style guns but the targets are a bit farther out sometimes (10 to 100yrds). There are still some close ones as well. Using military rifles or hunting rifles or SASS rifles and one handgun. Classes for soldiers and civilians alike. I find it a great contrast from the blast fast SASS game. I love both, wish I could do both more. Very little interest in GAF out here where many of the soldiers of the late 1800s spent time. If your looking for something different than the current SASS game.checkout the GAF. If your enjoying SASS just like it is ,then I hope to shoot with you someday.

remember,we'er allin this together.

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Guest diablo slim shootist

OK here's my 2 cents...take it for what it's worth

WE have Three types of matches at the Texas Ten Horns.

One weekend we have close and fast(Pistol-4yrds...Rifle 12-15yrds)

This week end we had wild bunch on sat (Pistols 7yrds-Rifle 14yrds

Sunday we had Xtreme SASS...Pistols 7yrds Rifle 25 -35 yrds.

 

If you can't find something you like to shoot at our club I don't know

where you would go...May be we need Western 3 gun too? only kidding! :lol:

 

Branch out and have some different types of shoots at your club...you might like it

once in a while.It breaks up the same o same o. ;)

Diablo Slim"who likes to go fast most of the time"

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Well,

 

Well if BIG & CLOSE is boring and not very challenging, try shooting it Double Duelist with Cap & Ball pistols. That should keep you entertained. :rolleyes:

 

Hasta Luego, Keystone

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Nope you got it all wrong .

I just would like to see some Marksmanship .

And I am not alone .

I'm just saying it.

Lets see some small targets and accuracy not just speed

 

You want some marksmanship........go do some benchrest rifle. Not too speedy for ya. It's really hard to shoot a bullet through the hole of the previously fired bullet. It's also really hard to stay awake. -_-

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:wacko::wacko::FlagAm: Heee Haaa Rooster.. I haven't seen ya at many other shoots.. Did you go to the state shoot last year.. How did you do? :unsure: I really don't know where you are comeing from on this. :huh: As I recall the last time I shot with you ,You shot Joesy Wales..Did you shoot that match clean :unsure: , you were useing pistols at rifle targets..LOL..How'd your markmanship go for ya.. :lol: I really don't understand you point,do you NOT have fun at the matches..If your trying to "level the playing field" forget it..In case you haven't noticed All the "FAST" shooters miss very few targets..and no matter the target distance they are going to hit them even if they slow down, ^_^ you have to slow down too..Thats my two cents..

 

Heeee Haaaa Crazy Mingo

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Well, this is an interesting topic that comes up from time to time.

 

I have to admit that I am sympathetic to the basic idea, but the reality of the sport is that that is not the way it is. Ultimately, for all of its flaws, I think SASS is just fine the way it is, and does not need any modification.

 

Does not *need* any modification.

 

But what about the possibility of some tweaks to add variety now and again?

 

The occasional stage with 1 or 2 targets farther away would probably not hurt.

 

The occasional reload on the clock, no more than 1 per match, and probably not even at every match, would be nice.

 

When I first started out, it was quite common to see a "bonus" target on some stages. It was usually smaller and farther away, but not unreasobably so. Heck, I even remember when the bonus targets were quite far away, but they were rather HUGE. (Those were fun) You had to shoot at it, but if you missed, no penalty involved, but if you hit it, you got five seconds off your time. Been a few years since I saw this. Would be nice to see it return every now and again. What was interesting was the even the super fast shooters didn't just dump a round in the general direction of the target and move on. Everyone legitimately *tried* to hit the dumb thing, and the cheers when someone did were a lot of fun.

 

This might venture into "new category" territory, but I'll toss it out as an example of thinking outside the box. Leave the game alone. Leave all the categories alone. But, add a +R notation to every category. Any shooter who chooses the option of +R will also shoot at 5 targets that are farther away (but I'd say not smaller) with somethig like a .30-30, .45-70, etc. Adds another bit of flavor, and more shooting, and is totally voluntary. There might be interest. If not, drop the +R idea and move on. But you never know if it is not tried.

 

Ultimately, I think that's the key. We should not be afraid to occasionally *try* something unusual while still leaving the basic parameters of the game alone. If these ideas don't work, no harm in trying them. But if they do work, they will catch on. Or at least become a feature of that particular club. For example, there is a club near me that almost always includes 1 or 2 shots from a single shot rifle in at least 1 stage per match. Most folks know to bring said rifle to the match. Don't have one? Many will offer to loan. Don't fell comfortable shooting someone else's gun/ammo? You have the option of using your main match rifle as if it were a single shot at the appropriate time. It works. It has not spread beyond this club, but people like going there, knowing it has this funny little modification.

 

 

 

And finally, I have to say that I don't think the comparison to NCOWS is a fair one. There are many things about NCOWS that sound good to me, and a many things that don't. It is a different game, and even if it was just as common/popular as SASS, I doubt that I'd shoot it because of the specifics that don't appeal to me. I have a feeling that a lot of folks may have similar opinions.

 

Take it for what it is worth, and then leave it at that.

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:wacko::FlagAm: Heee Haaa Rooster.. I haven't seen ya at many other shoots.. Did you go to the state shoot last year.. How did you do? :unsure: I really don't know where you are comeing from on this. :huh: As I recall the last time I shot with you ,You shot Joesy Wales..Did you shoot that match clean :unsure: , you were useing pistols at rifle targets..LOL..How'd your markmanship go for ya.. :lol: I really don't understand you point,do you NOT have fun at the matches..If your trying to "level the playing field" forget it..In case you haven't noticed All the "FAST" shooters miss very few targets..and no matter the target distance they are going to hit them even if they slow down, ^_^ you have to slow down too..Thats my two cents..

 

Heeee Haaaa Crazy Mingo

 

 

More like a dollars worth :lol: ...missed ya at the 2-day in Rockford pard...folks were askin' ya :)

 

GG ~ :FlagAm:

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Somethin' else everyone’s over looking......after you have yer' turn at the reins it's still fun to watch others work the stage and shoot. If you backed the targets way out there and "slowed" it down too much it would be a long boring day for the rest of the time away from the trigger.

 

I used to run long distance and they made our events in the mi-day and the sprinting events were in the evening. The crowds were always smaller to watch us than when the sprinters showed up..... Also have you ever seen a big crowd at a NRA rifle event? Or, any slow fire events? While challenging for the shooter it bores the dickens out of everyone else.

 

My point is IMO the "speed" of the game IS the entertainment value that makes the rest of the day go by for the other people waiting to take their turn. If you slow it down too much and make folks watch slow boring stages and folks laying on the ground under wagons reloading a pistol for five rounds........it'll be like watching paint dry for the other folks that aren’t shooting.

 

Being bored for 3 to 3.5 hours to have a 120 seconds worth of “fun” will probably be an unsuccessful way to grow a sport.

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I guess I'm in the minority but I avoid the matches where the targets are all big and close because I find the whole thing pretty boring.

 

I like a good mix. Some stages that are big and close, some with smaller or farther targets and some with moving targets and some with other things thrown in.

 

I mostly write the stages for our match and our attendance has grown each year. A number of shooters tell me they think our match is one of the most fun they attend.

 

We do unusual things with the Texas Star and have a Polish Plate Rack and a rolling target that drops a weight when hit.

 

Sage Creek Gus

 

Bigfork Buscaderos

Bigfork, Montana

 

You can read past stages at Bigfork Buscaderos

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Guest Winchester Jack, SASS #70195

if I hit a small and far away target it isn't skill its bloody luck. Nothing spoils the fun (for me) more than a steady diet of difficult targets. Now having said that I shot a stage last month with a target thet was out there a ways. I hit it all 4 times but MISSED the close up targets :lol:

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Ever since the Yankees insisted on joining us..:rolleyes: .

 

 

Yankees? Heck, this thing started in California, not the south. If you want to call us Californians "Yankees" then it was you who joined us. :)

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:ph34r: Smaller targets, further away, requiring sight picture.... I was under the impression this was addressed with SIDE MATCHES for the benefit and pleasure of those so inclined. Have I been laboring under a misapprehension all this time?
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I guess I'm in the minority but I avoid the matches where the targets are all big and close because I find the whole thing pretty boring.

 

I like a good mix. Some stages that are big and close, some with smaller or farther targets and some with moving targets and some with other things thrown in.

 

I mostly write the stages for our match and our attendance has grown each year. A number of shooters tell me they think our match is one of the most fun they attend.

 

We do unusual things with the Texas Star and have a Polish Plate Rack and a rolling target that drops a weight when hit.

 

Sage Creek Gus

 

Bigfork Buscaderos

Bigfork, Montana

 

You can read past stages at Bigfork Buscaderos

 

If Sour Kraut and I ever make it up to your neck of the woods we'll DEFINITELY be shooting with you. :)

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If Sour Kraut and I ever make it up to your neck of the woods we'll DEFINITELY be shooting with you. :)

 

 

You might find interesting the first stage at our October shoot in 2008.

 

Those who like big, close, stationary targets should NOT follow this link as it may be hazardous to your health.

 

http://www.bigforkbuscaderos.com/2008/october/octoberstages.html

 

Sage Creek Gus

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You might find interesting the first stage at our October shoot in 2008.

 

Those who like big, close, stationary targets should NOT follow this link as it may be hazardous to your health.

 

http://www.bigforkbuscaderos.com/2008/october/octoberstages.html

 

Sage Creek Gus

 

 

Holy cow!!!!! I'd sure like to give THAT one a try..................or three. :lol:

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You might find interesting the first stage at our October shoot in 2008.

 

Those who like big, close, stationary targets should NOT follow this link as it may be hazardous to your health.

 

http://www.bigforkbuscaderos.com/2008/october/octoberstages.html

 

Sage Creek Gus

That sound like a good time ! :wacko:

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Holy cow!!!!! I'd sure like to give THAT one a try..................or three. :lol:

 

I've just added my "Contraption Match" which I put on in the 5th week end of July, 2010.

 

It featured all the contraption targets we have or I have built over the years. We had three Texas Stars along with a lot of other stuff.

 

I put it on for those who like these kind of stages and didn't expect a large turn out because, supposedly, Cowboy Action Shooters don't like these kind of stages. But I had 24 shooters and several told me it was the most fun they have ever had at a match.

 

There was not a regular target in the whole match. If you want a real challenge try shooting the Texas Star with the top half covered so you have to shoot all the targets off the bottom.

 

Notice that the last stage involves 2 rifles, 3 handguns and a shotgun along with a suction cup gun.

 

Contraption Match

 

Sage Creek Gus

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All I know is my wife and daughter are going to be shooting soon and I want them to have fun and that means hitting targets the best they can.

 

GG...posting will drinking beer at Founders.

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"Smaller targets, further away, requiring sight picture.... I was under the impression this was addressed with SIDE MATCHES for the benefit and pleasure of those so inclined. Have I been laboring under a misapprehension all this time?"

 

Wow. A target in a main match setting that requires a "sight picture" is too difficult and should only occur in side matches? Is this really what has become the definition of too difficult for main match shooting in SASS? Smokin Gator

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I'd like to point out to those that are so vehement about somebody expressing their wishes for a more difficult stage or two. I have noticed that only your opinion counts and if their's runs contrary to your's, you start heaving dung.

 

Truth be told, I also would love a stage or 2 with smaller further targets. Reason? I like them that way. You don't, that's fine but don't be such a patootie shouting about how it's gonna chase away people.... Especially if it's only a single stage. This game, and I agree with you all here, is for everybody, not just those that like the same targets as you or within your comfort zone.

 

I am not fast and never will be, especially with all the smoke thrown. I will not spray and pray if I cannot see what I am shooting at. This is my preference. I am not such a hypocrite to say that everybody should shoot as I do. I would however, like a consideration once in a while but if it don't come, it don't come. I am not going to be a spoiled little brat and not show up because the stages are different than what I am preferential to....

 

As I have said for a number of years.... I do not shoot this for prizes, placings, etc. and if you do, God bless. I can shoot anytime I want. I only compete with myself, and that is by shooting clean stages. I come to the shoots as a social exchange.... I can come to a shoot and not fire a shot and enjoy myself.... I once entered a match and first stage, first shot, my rifle went south on me. I was unable to fix it to continue and I was offerred a loaner by several good Pards. but I put my gear in the truck and picked brass. Why? Social interactions.... With my bad back, this was a poor choice for me physically but I did it, dealt with the pain and would do it again in a heartbeat.

 

Short answer is don't rip somebody a new one for asking for something other than a speed stage or a 5+5+10=4 stage... My last shoot was at St. Jude's Charity Shoot on the Memorial Day weekend and the course of fire had quite a few P traps.... I didn't take the time to write them so I just had to live with them.

 

To those wanting something different, as was mentioned by others here, ask your Match Director if you can design a stage. If he approves of your idea, you have won your battle but to get your wants injected, you must take time and effort working with those that are already doing it...

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Ok here the thing I have been shooting for around ten years or so I remember matchs with on and off the clock smal targets far and large targetsup close it seeem thatr the good shooters hit both target sizes equally but new shooters miss greater numbers on the small and far targets since it is more fun to hit targets the over all iddea it to have fun hitting is fun so there you have the reasoning for near targets. no small bonus targets far are also fun if youy don't have to many. If fun is the game then hitting targets is important etc. So if you have fun matches meaning matchs with enjoyable stages and targets then you have shooters coming to shoots Take Mountian Valley in HOtssprings ar. targets are a combination of small and large and they have over sixty shooters most shoots.

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I'd like to point out to those that are so vehement about somebody expressing their wishes for a more difficult stage or two. I have noticed that only your opinion counts and if their's runs contrary to your's, you start heaving dung.

 

Truth be told, I also would love a stage or 2 with smaller further targets. Reason? I like them that way. You don't, that's fine but don't be such a patootie shouting about how it's gonna chase away people.... Especially if it's only a single stage. This game, and I agree with you all here, is for everybody, not just those that like the same targets as you or within your comfort zone.

 

 

 

This is the part of the whole conversation that bothers me the most. It's the all or nothing attitude that a lot of folks on BOTH sides take. From day one I've said I enjoy variety. I enjoy big close matches, I enjoy small distant matches, but what I REALLY enjoy are matches that have an equal mix of every shooting style. A great philospher once said, "Can't we all just get along?" (Or maybe it was some scumbag who said it.)

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I started CAShooting in May of 96. Things have definitely changed. Some for the good, some not so good. The overwhelming proliferation of cookie cutter 10-10-4 matches are an example of the latter.

 

I do not see how anyone can disagree that the rifle targets are too close these days. I do not care how close you set the pistol or shotgun targets, I still can miss 'em with the best of 'em. But rifle targets set right behind the pistol targets is ridiculous. Come on folks, the purpose of the rifle is the projection of power over a distance, not to see who can toggle it the fastest.

 

I shoot every Saturday at one or the other of 3 different venues. At only one place do I have to use the rifle sights. It is also the only one with bonus targets or one round pistol re-loads. And yes, sigh, durn it it is the one with the least attendance. More a reflection of the mind set of modern CAShooters than the merits of the match which I enjoy as much or more than the others. It's all good. I like it all. These are the good ole days as we are fading away.

 

I just wish the pendulum would start swinging back the other way a little and the rifle targets would get pushed back a mite...

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For the folks that want smaller and further targets. You can get all the challenge you want, you can 'use' your sights for what they are ment to be. Just select a portion of the steel target at the distance the club sets them at and go for it. For example, selecdt a bullet splatter mark and see if you can hit it, or go for a head shot on the steel SASS man target, or head shoot on the animal target. Whatever part of the target you select, make up your own target within a target and 'use' your sights.

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All I know is my wife and daughter are going to be shooting soon and I want them to have fun and that means hitting targets the best they can.

 

GG...posting will drinking beer at Founders.

 

 

I don't really men to pick on you, and I wish you wife and daughter well, Honestly I do. BUT...and its a big one, if we follow the logic that SASS has to be so easy that beginning shooters can do well at it, we end up dumbing down the sport to the lowest common denominator. I have been shooting CAS since the mid 80s and been a member of SASS since 88 (if I recall correctly). When I started, all the CAS shooters were experienced shooters. IPSC, small bore, trap, hunters, something. Now we get people who have no experience at all who come to the range and want to play. In a way I think that is great, why shouldn't they? Its a good game and they can learn as they go. But, why should the rest of us have to dumb down the sport to their level?

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This is about the 20th time I've seen this brought up on the wire and pretty much goes the same way this thread has gone. What I'd like clarified is what is considered big and close? ie 2ftx3ft target at 3yrds. for pistol and 16"squares at 8 yards. for rife

 

On the other side what is considered small and far? ie16"x16" at 7 yards. for pistol and 16"x16" at 15 yards for rifle.

 

It does seem like most of the sport thinks that a 16"x16" at 7 yards has become an unfair and boring pistol target.

 

For top shooters the ragged edge that it takes to win does get thinner when targets are moved back to the distances they were in the early 2000's.

 

I've been fed such a steady diet of big and close targets I'm ready for more of a challenging match again.

 

By the way people can shoot clean on targets at sass's recommendations. For example Guns of August is about as up in your face as possible and had less clean shooters than the Michigan states match that runs a much more challenging match with targets out to distances of 6-8 yards for pistol and 12-15 yards for rifle. Plus the steel is smaller than the steel at Guns of August. Why is that?

 

It's funny I never hear women and children complain about target size and distance. It's always the men.

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So for those folks that want smaller targets, what diameter, 12 inch, 10 inch, 8 inch, 6 inch, etc. For those that want rifle targets at longer ranges, at what range do you want to see rifle targets, i.e. 15 yards, 20 yards, 25 yards, 30 yards, 40 yards, 50 yards. It would be a whole lot easier to understand each side if we had an idea of what smaller and further really means.

 

It really seems like some of the sentiment for this change is driven by some believing it will somehow slow down faster shooters to make it easier for slower shooters to compete. From what I have seen, it will slow down the fastest shooters a mite but it will really slow down the average and below average shooters. On those stages I have shot with one stage having a lot smaller, further targets, the same folks end at the top but the slower shooters are a lot more seconds behind the fast shooters, as much as 2 to 1 slower (i.e. on big close targets the fast shooters are shooting say 20 second stages and the average for the stage is say 35 seconds, when you have smaller further targets, the fast shooters are slowed by about 5 seconds maybe most, but the average shooters slow down a lot more for an average closer to 50 seconds or even more at the extremes). Why would average shooters enjoy shooting say 50 second stages with a lot more misses instead of 35 second stages and fewer misses)? Anyone have information that this is not true?

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Ya all Know that in all these type of threads the only Folk saying that the Folks wanting to increase the distances of some targets are trying " To slow down the fast folks " are those that don't want to even consider moving the Targets back an inch!!!

Futher they seem to be those that Attack Folks and any ideas besides 5-5 10 4+ .....

 

Flame Away !!!!

 

It's a little cool way up here North of the 49th............

 

 

 

 

Jabez Cowboy

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OK, I'll bite. Anything closer than 15 yards for 16 x 16 is too ridiculously close for rifle targets. Again, pistol and sg I do not care.

 

As for aiming for head shots or a bullet splat mark, get real. This is a competition and I am still competing (if ya call never practicin', never dry-firin' and basically being old and in the way competing), I am NOT about to handicap myself in such a manner.

 

Try to always shoot clean? Not my cup of tea. I know some folks that that is what rings their chimes but I subscribe to the if ya ain't missin' some ye are shootin' too slow camp. Took me 13.5 years to shoot my first clean match, a coupla more years for the second and still lookin' for the third.

 

I'm with Colt. I have been fed such a steady diet of too big and too close too long. Even the most fun ya kin have with yer clothes on needs a little change up now and then. Just like shootin' 4 sg shells from the same position is really really gettin' very very old. I like to shoot my shotgun. More sg is better. 6 or 8 on most stages with the occasional 10 or so would be groovy...

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OK, I'll bite. Anything closer than 15 yards for 16 x 16 is too ridiculously close for rifle targets. Again, pistol and sg I do not care.

 

As for aiming for head shots or a bullet splat mark, get real. This is a competition and I am still competing (if ya call never practicin', never dry-firin' and basically being old and in the way competing), I am NOT about to handicap myself in such a manner.

 

Try to always shoot clean? Not my cup of tea. I know some folks that that is what rings their chimes but I subscribe to the if ya ain't missin' some ye are shootin' too slow camp. Took me 13.5 years to shoot my first clean match, a coupla more years for the second and still lookin' for the third.

 

I'm with Colt. I have been fed such a steady diet of too big and too close too long. Even the most fun ya kin have with yer clothes on needs a little change up now and then. Just like shootin' 4 sg shells from the same position is really really gettin' very very old. I like to shoot my shotgun. More sg is better. 6 or 8 on most stages with the occasional 10 or so would be groovy...

 

I am real about suggesting for folks wanting more challenge to go for head and splatter shots. For someone who confesses to minimal to no practice, just who are you competing against other than yourself? :blush:

 

Just a very few people can shoot fast enough to make up for a miss during a match. I don't think you are in that group. :huh:

 

Anoter way to get your wishes of further target placement is to get more involved with match/stage setup. Volunteer to be a Match Director for either a monthly, annual or regional match. Once you get into a postion of authority on what a match should be, then you can dictate your target size and distance wishes. You will get to know the smell of tar & feathers too. LOL.

 

Good luck,

 

 

Shooting a clean match is a huge challenge but shows more of a person who has control over their mental game. Controlling their emosions under mild stress of a match.

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I am real about suggesting for folks wanting more challenge to go for head and splatter shots. For someone who confesses to minimal to no practice, just who are you competing against other than yourself? :blush: Everyone, but mostly a select few. If I went for head shots or splatter shots I would never beat them instead of rarely beating them. Nope, not doin' that fer sure so you kin quit suggestin' it already.

 

Just a very few people can shoot fast enough to make up for a miss during a match. I don't think you are in that group. :huh: Slowing down slow enuff to shoot clean would make my total time a wash with my current method of blazing away.

 

Anoter way to get your wishes of further target placement is to get more involved with match/stage setup. Volunteer to be a Match Director for either a monthly, annual or regional match. Once you get into a postion of authority on what a match should be, then you can dictate your target size and distance wishes. You will get to know the smell of tar & feathers too. LOL.

 

My bunch ain't never gonna allow me to be MD. Never. No way. No how. They know better.

 

Good luck,

 

 

Shooting a clean match is a huge challenge but shows more of a person who has control over their mental game. Controlling their emosions under mild stress of a match.

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I am real about suggesting for folks wanting more challenge to go for head and splatter shots. For someone who confesses to minimal to no practice, just who are you competing against other than yourself? Everyone, but mostly a select few. If I went for head shots or splatter shots I would never beat them instead of rarely beating them. Nope, not doin' that fer sure so you kin quit suggestin' it already.Just a very few people can shoot fast enough to make up for a miss during a match. I don't think you are in that group. Slowing down slow enuff to shoot clean would make my total time a wash with my current method of blazing away.Anoter way to get your wishes of further target placement is to get more involved with match/stage setup. Volunteer to be a Match Director for either a monthly, annual or regional match. Once you get into a postion of authority on what a match should be, then you can dictate your target size and distance wishes. You will get to know the smell of tar & feathers too. LOL.

 

My bunch ain't never gonna allow me to be MD. Never. No way. No how. They know better.

 

Good luck,

 

 

Shooting a clean match is a huge challenge but shows more of a person who has control over their mental game. Controlling their emosions under mild stress of a match

 

 

 

 

 

Sounds like target size & distance is far enough for you already since you miss a lot.

 

Face it, you don't want a bigger challenge than you already have by declining to go for head shoots where you want to use your sights.

 

You stil consider a monthly as a do or die always must win type of match?

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