Chevy mechanics..... ?

[Grumpy Old Man]

My older brother graduated high school in 63. Dad had a 56 GMC with a tall boy engine, 3 on the tree. I heard from several people that he outran almost everything in the county.

[BLACKFOOT SASS #11947]

I like the heated tailgate on Toyota pickups.

 

Blackfoot

[Sloe Moe]

Well, I don't know much about this Ford vs. Chevy vs. Dodge thing, having never owned any of them. but I do know sumthin about the Toyota thing...

My newest vehicle, a Toyota LandCruiser, just turned 44 years old in December. I've owned it these last 32 years. Sure, it's on it's second engine rebuild and I don't know how many miles are on it, replaced or rebuilt the speedo 3 times. It came from the factory with a hand-crank that I can start the engine with, I usually use it just to win bets that I can, but I have used it twice when I needed it. Also comes in handy when adjusting the valves. 

Yup, the old Jeep straight sixes are very good, Toyota straight six pretty good too. Japanese copy of the old Chevy.

I go places many jeeps can't. Like the Rubicon Trail.

 

[Captain Bill Burt]

13 hours ago, Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770 said:

 

Jeep's old inline 6 was/is pretty good. It started out in the late 50s, and lasted until 2006 in one form or another. 

There's an old saying that Jeepers have: You might be able to go fast, but I can go anywhere!

You got me there. Heck I almost got stuck at the last Cowboy match and that was just wet grass. 

[Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967]

2 hours ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

You got me there. Heck I almost got stuck at the last Cowboy match and that was just wet grass. 

 

I recall once at 5 Dogs, Burly Bear having to winch Eve Nenjoy off wet grass... with the 5th wheel trailer, her truck just couldn't get enough traction to begin to move.  

 

Wet grass can be terrible~!  

[J.D. Daily]

11 hours ago, Blackwater 53393 said:

 

Actually, I finally had the transmission repaired last year, at 381,000 miles!!  It is a 1997 3500 HD with the Vortec 454 with the 4L80E transmission and the 14 bolt Dually rear end.  I broke the torque converter pulling a friends house trailer out into the woods, (busted the torque converter clutch) and it quit locking up. Replaced the converter and put a fresh pump and a paper and rubber kit in while we had the transmission out.  Ol’ Green has been far and fast!!

 

By the way!! The 4L80E is one of the most durable automatics in the industry!  I worked in that particular industry for over 15 years and I would rather have the 4L80E than the Allison in a big pickup anytime except perhaps behind a diesel.  And I wouldn’t have a diesel if ya melted it down and poured it on me!!  I just don’t like ‘em!!

It was the transmissions in the light duty (1/2 ton PU's that were weak).  As for diesels in Detroit iron it was GM who until the Isuzu engine who got a black eye.  Their 1st light duty compression ignition (diesel) was an attempt to cash in on the the customer looking for fuel economy in the late 70's high gas prices.  The were in a hurry to offer a diesel option; so, they converted a mouse motor.  Any engineer that is familiar with CI vs SI combustion knows you can't go that way.  The combustion forces on a CI engine are much higher than SI.  To be durable the CI engine has larger dia. & forged crank.  The block also has more metal in the bottom end.  Also, to contain the higher cylinder pressure there are larger or more cylinder head studs or bolts.  GM's 1st LD diesel broke the cast cranks.  When cranks were replaced with forged cranks they would blow cylinder head gaskets.  another idiot thing GM did was not supply fuel/water separators which the mfg, Stanadyne, strenuously recommended.  The injection pump is fuel lubricated & diesel absorbs H20.  At the time I had a neighbor who was a GM zone mgr. in Fremont CA & his co. car was a diesel Cadi.  I give him a CAT (Stanadyne) FW separator to have the shop that did his maintenance to install it before he had to have the car towed when the pump failed.  This problem was eventually eliminate by the addition of FW separators on production vehicles.  That diesel was replaced by the 6.2-6.5 in 1982.  This engine was a weak competitor to the Cummins B & Navistar Powerstroke diesels available in Dodge & Ford vehicles.  CI technology took a quantum  leap with the introduction of digital controlled FI.  1st with variable injection timing.  Then with with variable pressure & timing control.  And now additionally multi strike injection. 

The CI's primary advantage over a SI is part load fuel efficiency.  Besides getting better mileage you notice that the under hood temperature is much lower.  A gasoline car gets hot quickly at idle & a diesel takes forever to warm-up.  For an SI engine to approach the CI engine efficiency deviations from the Otto cycle, turbocharging, direct cylinder injection & cylinder deactivation are required.   Another advantage of CI over SI is the power output is only limited by materials technology where the SI is limited by the detonation limit of air/fuel mixture.  If at any location in the combustion chamber the mixture reaches the pressure/temperature limit you get detonation.  Detonation melts pistons.  The power output can be increased by lowering the combustion air temperature (intercooling), direct injection, miller cycle, EGR & lean mixture.  Lean mixtures are very effective with turbocharging & intercooling.  However, automobile mfg's don't use it because to meet EPA the NOX emission limit it requires the same blue tech as used with CI engines.  Another testament to CI superiority is the lack of SI engine prime movers in class 7 trucks.  You only find SI engines in medium duty & day cab trucks.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

7 hours ago, Sloe Moe said:

Well, I don't know much about this Ford vs. Chevy vs. Dodge thing, having never owned any of them. but I do know sumthin about the Toyota thing...

My newest vehicle, a Toyota LandCruiser, just turned 44 years old in December. I've owned it these last 32 years. Sure, it's on it's second engine rebuild and I don't know how many miles are on it, replaced or rebuilt the speedo 3 times. It came from the factory with a hand-crank that I can start the engine with, I usually use it just to win bets that I can, but I have used it twice when I needed it. Also comes in handy when adjusting the valves. 

Yup, the old Jeep straight sixes are very good, Toyota straight six pretty good too. Japanese copy of the old Chevy.

I go places many jeeps can't. Like the Rubicon Trail.

 

Oh-Really...... 

My 1985 Jeep CJ-7, that I bought new in March of '85 and still drive it daily. Has been over the 'Ruby' 12 times.

The 'Hammers' in Lucerne Vly are much 'tuffer' trails.

OLG

[Blackwater 53393]

5 hours ago, J.D. Daily said:

It was the transmissions in the light duty (1/2 ton PU's that were weak).  As for diesels in Detroit iron it was GM who until the Isuzu engine who got a black eye.  Their 1st light duty compression ignition (diesel) was an attempt to cash in on the the customer looking for fuel economy in the late 70's high gas prices.  The were in a hurry to offer a diesel option; so, they converted a mouse motor.  Any engineer that is familiar with CI vs SI combustion knows you can't go that way.  The combustion forces on a CI engine are much higher than SI.  To be durable the CI engine has larger dia. & forged crank.  The block also has more metal in the bottom end.  Also, to contain the higher cylinder pressure there are larger or more cylinder head studs or bolts.  GM's 1st LD diesel broke the cast cranks.  When cranks were replaced with forged cranks they would blow cylinder head gaskets.  another idiot thing GM did was not supply fuel/water separators which the mfg, Stanadyne, strenuously recommended.  The injection pump is fuel lubricated & diesel absorbs H20.  At the time I had a neighbor who was a GM zone mgr. in Fremont CA & his co. car was a diesel Cadi.  I give him a CAT (Stanadyne) FW separator to have the shop that did his maintenance to install it before he had to have the car towed when the pump failed.  This problem was eventually eliminate by the addition of FW separators on production vehicles.  That diesel was replaced by the 6.2-6.5 in 1982.  This engine was a weak competitor to the Cummins B & Navistar Powerstroke diesels available in Dodge & Ford vehicles.  CI technology took a quantum  leap with the introduction of digital controlled FI.  1st with variable injection timing.  Then with with variable pressure & timing control.  And now additionally multi strike injection. 

The CI's primary advantage over a SI is part load fuel efficiency.  Besides getting better mileage you notice that the under hood temperature is much lower.  A gasoline car gets hot quickly at idle & a diesel takes forever to warm-up.  For an SI engine to approach the CI engine efficiency deviations from the Otto cycle, turbocharging, direct cylinder injection & cylinder deactivation are required.   Another advantage of CI over SI is the power output is only limited by materials technology where the SI is limited by the detonation limit of air/fuel mixture.  If at any location in the combustion chamber the mixture reaches the pressure/temperature limit you get detonation.  Detonation melts pistons.  The power output can be increased by lowering the combustion air temperature (intercooling), direct injection, miller cycle, EGR & lean mixture.  Lean mixtures are very effective with turbocharging & intercooling.  However, automobile mfg's don't use it because to meet EPA the NOX emission limit it requires the same blue tech as used with CI engines.  Another testament to CI superiority is the lack of SI engine prime movers in class 7 trucks.  You only find SI engines in medium duty & day cab trucks.

 

I still wouldn’t have a diesel if you gave it to me!!!  They are fine for tractors and semis, but those stinking, rattling, overweight boat anchors just aren’t for me!!  Even the new Mercedes and Audi examples STILL stink to high heaven won’t start half the time on a really cold morning!! 

 

I won’t go into the years of maintaining large displacement diesel engines and the coming home smelling like a refinery.  Just leave it at I ain’t EVER gonna have a diesel anything in my personal stable so long as they still make gas burners!!

 

Oh!! Even the 4L60Es were better than the average pickup tranny offered by the other manufacturers!!  Remember? I worked in the transmission repair industry for 15 years and I pulled, repaired, and replaced them ALL for all those years and more!!

[Dirty Dan Dawkins]

I’ve always found the 4L80E dependable. Myself and every danged contractor around here with a Chevy van ( all usually loaded 7-8500 # all of the time) can depend on them to fail between 175,000 and 225,000 miles. Half the time it’s the torque converter, rest of the time the planetary gear.

[Blackwater 53393]

My son, Hatfield, works for a pet grooming company, maintaining their fleet of Mercedes vans.  There are eight of those junk heaps in the fleet. They had to have one of the transmissions replaced a couple of weeks ago.  Mercedes won’t sell the parts to even qualified repair facilities and they refuse to program the new transmission unless it is installed at their facility.  

 

Having worked in the industry for years and with connections to several reputable repair shops in the area, I know that this job would NORMALLY cost about $2,000.00 if the parts were available and the programming, in all fairness, should be about $150.00!

 

When Hatfield picked up the van, the bill was $10,000.00!!

 

GIMME THAT CHEVY VAN EVERY TIME!!!!

[Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001]

on quiet nites , ya can hear the Chevys rust 

 

 drag em in with an old FORD big block 

 

  in other news , I her DOdGe ' rusting also 

 

  CB 

 

LOL 

[Finagler 6853 Life]

On ‎1‎/‎1‎/‎2019 at 2:05 PM, J.D. Daily said:

It was the transmissions in the light duty (1/2 ton PU's that were weak).  As for diesels in Detroit iron it was GM who until the Isuzu engine who got a black eye.  Their 1st light duty compression ignition (diesel) was an attempt to cash in on the the customer looking for fuel economy in the late 70's high gas prices.  The were in a hurry to offer a diesel option; so, they converted a mouse motor.  Any engineer that is familiar with CI vs SI combustion knows you can't go that way.  The combustion forces on a CI engine are much higher than SI.  To be durable the CI engine has larger dia. & forged crank.  The block also has more metal in the bottom end.  Also, to contain the higher cylinder pressure there are larger or more cylinder head studs or bolts.  GM's 1st LD diesel broke the cast cranks.  When cranks were replaced with forged cranks they would blow cylinder head gaskets.  another idiot thing GM did was not supply fuel/water separators which the mfg, Stanadyne, strenuously recommended.  The injection pump is fuel lubricated & diesel absorbs H20.  At the time I had a neighbor who was a GM zone mgr. in Fremont CA & his co. car was a diesel Cadi.  I give him a CAT (Stanadyne) FW separator to have the shop that did his maintenance to install it before he had to have the car towed when the pump failed.  This problem was eventually eliminate by the addition of FW separators on production vehicles.  That diesel was replaced by the 6.2-6.5 in 1982.  This engine was a weak competitor to the Cummins B & Navistar Powerstroke diesels available in Dodge & Ford vehicles.  CI technology took a quantum  leap with the introduction of digital controlled FI.  1st with variable injection timing.  Then with with variable pressure & timing control.  And now additionally multi strike injection. 

The CI's primary advantage over a SI is part load fuel efficiency.  Besides getting better mileage you notice that the under hood temperature is much lower.  A gasoline car gets hot quickly at idle & a diesel takes forever to warm-up.  For an SI engine to approach the CI engine efficiency deviations from the Otto cycle, turbocharging, direct cylinder injection & cylinder deactivation are required.   Another advantage of CI over SI is the power output is only limited by materials technology where the SI is limited by the detonation limit of air/fuel mixture.  If at any location in the combustion chamber the mixture reaches the pressure/temperature limit you get detonation.  Detonation melts pistons.  The power output can be increased by lowering the combustion air temperature (intercooling), direct injection, miller cycle, EGR & lean mixture.  Lean mixtures are very effective with turbocharging & intercooling.  However, automobile mfg's don't use it because to meet EPA the NOX emission limit it requires the same blue tech as used with CI engines.  Another testament to CI superiority is the lack of SI engine prime movers in class 7 trucks.  You only find SI engines in medium duty & day cab trucks.

My dad bought one of those miserable Oldsmobile 88s (I think) with the diesel engine back in the early 80s.  What a turd.  He had the fuel/water separator installed.  Then a block heater and then a fuel tank heater.  He had nothing but trouble with it.   A small block GM engine is not an adequate platform to convert to a diesel system.  Can it be done?  They did it.  Should it have been done?  GM was embarrassed to find out that it was not their finest design.   Then the transmission started acting funky.  Someone in the industry told me. back then, that the transmission was the same one used on the Vega and the like.  Great big torque married to an itty, bitty tranny.

Best thing GM ever did was to put the Isuzu diesel in their trucks.  Then the morons tried to copy it and cheapen it up.  Ended up putting the original design parts back in.  Ford did the same thing when they tried to copy the International engine.  There is a reason why those parts are big, heavy and made of metal.  I knock on wood that my diesels keep on going.  They can pull like no ones business.

 

Arr, arr, arr!  More power!

[Dirty Dan Dawkins]

1 hour ago, Blackwater 53393 said:

My son, Hatfield, works for a pet grooming company, maintaining their fleet of Mercedes vans.  There are eight of those junk heaps in the fleet. They had to have one of the transmissions replaced a couple of weeks ago.  Mercedes won’t sell the parts to even qualified repair facilities and they refuse to program the new transmission unless it is installed at their facility.  

 

Having worked in the industry for years and with connections to several reputable repair shops in the area, I know that this job would NORMALLY cost about $2,000.00 if the parts were available and the programming, in all fairness, should be about $150.00!

 

When Hatfield picked up the van, the bill was $10,000.00!!

 

GIMME THAT CHEVY VAN EVERY TIME!!!!

 

 

Then there's the fuel pump issues the Mercedes Sprinters had for years......

[Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062]

 

 

 

 

  ……… well I like Maryanne,  'cause she's pretty ………… and she can cook   

[Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062]

 …….. an' I drive a Toyota HiAce van.

[Dirty Dan Dawkins]

4 minutes ago, Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062 said:

 …….. an' I drive a Toyota HiAce van.

 

 

Now that's plain sexy.

But not as sexy as Mary Anne

 

[Wallaby Jack, SASS #44062]

Yer right about Maryanne 

 

 

 …….. but my van is the earlier '99 model …. and not a minibus

[J.D. Daily]

2 hours ago, Finagler 6853 Life said:

My dad bought one of those miserable Oldsmobile 88s (I think) with the diesel engine back in the early 80s.  What a turd.  He had the fuel/water separator installed.  Then a block heater and then a fuel tank heater.  He had nothing but trouble with it.   A small block GM engine is not an adequate platform to convert to a diesel system.  Can it be done?  They did it.  Should it have been done?  GM was embarrassed to find out that it was not their finest design.   Then the transmission started acting funky.  Someone in the industry told me. back then, that the transmission was the same one used on the Vega and the like.  Great big torque married to an itty, bitty tranny.

Best thing GM ever did was to put the Isuzu diesel in their trucks.  Then the morons tried to copy it and cheapen it up.  Ended up putting the original design parts back in.  Ford did the same thing when they tried to copy the International engine.  There is a reason why those parts are big, heavy and made of metal.  I knock on wood that my diesels keep on going.  They can pull like no ones business.

 

Arr, arr, arr!  More power!

Marrying an undersized automatic transmission to a higher torque prime mover only limits the usable torque because the torque converter will not transmit more torque than  its' rating.  That is why light truck mfg's require the vehicle have an automatic transmission with trailer hitches.  The torque converters limit the peak torque saving the pounding the gears, drive shaft & rear end get with manual transmissions.  The original Powerstroke was a Navistar (International) diesel that dates to the 1980's before microprocessors were applied to diesels.  Microprocessors allow injection timing to match all operating conditions.  With fixed timing, timing is a compromise between the advance required to reliably start and peak cylinder pressure at rated power.  This limits the maximum rated power.  So, engine series designed after 2000 have the highest output per unit displacement & weight.  Older designs that have been upgraded with latest technology are limited by the strength of their bottom end & head bolts.  An example of what adding digital injection control has done is the CAT 3512 which was introduced in 1981.   The initial "Standby" rating was approximately 1200 HP.  The current equivalent rating is approximately 2100 HP.  This while emitting 1/3rd the NOX emissions & 1/10th the particulates. 

[Dirty Dan Dawkins]

I think Widder just trolled everybody 

 

[Dirty Dan Dawkins]

On 1/1/2019 at 12:28 PM, Captain Bill Burt said:

You got me there. Heck I almost got stuck at the last Cowboy match and that was just wet grass. 

A 3/4 ton two wheel drive will do the same thing.....get stuck in wet grass.

[Captain Bill Burt]

THIS is sexy look at the boo.....tires on her.

[Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770]

34 minutes ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

THIS is sexy look at the boo.....tires on her.

Sorry, that's just a car. THIS is fun and will get you where you need OR want to go. And you're not penned in by a top and doors!

 

[Captain Bill Burt]

Well......it’s the right color anyway.

[Widder, SASS #59054]

1 hour ago, Dirty Dan Dawkins said:

I think Widder just trolled everybody 

 

 

Pretty close.   I was just wanting to know why a Chevy mechanic prefers to buy and drive a Toyota pickup truck.

 

I've owned Chevy trucks and liked em.   I've owned Mopar products and liked em.

I own a used Ford truck that was o.k..... but it did have rust problems.

At present, I own 2 Toyota Tacoma's.   One is a 2001 with 270,000+ miles.

The other is a 2017, factory with 3" lift, bigger wheels/tires, etc...."Toyota" front grill (no emblem).

 

But admittedly, this has been an entertaining and educational thread.

 

..........Widder

 

[Tennessee williams]

Ford is doing it right! They're giving a dog away with every new truck....so people will have some company on those long walks home.

[Grumpy Old Man]

Started out with Fords. 1st truck, 65 F250, Good truck. Bought 72 250 when I got out of Army. Engine went at 90,000. Been a Bow Tie guy ever since. 

[Widder, SASS #59054]

8 hours ago, Tennessee williams said:

Ford is doing it right! They're giving a dog away with every new truck....so people will have some company on those long walks home.

 

I heard they gave you a 3-legged dog with short legs..... 

 

..........Widder

 

[Dantankerous]

Y'all want a vehicle to bash for lack of QC? Get a Jeep. You'll quickly discover why Jeep is an acronym for

 

Just

Empty

Every

Pocket

 

And I ain't smart enough to not have one.  

 

I miss my old trucks.  You never really know how much you use a truck until you ain't got one. 

[Blackwater 53393]

This is the only Four Wheel Drive vehicle I have ever owned.  Currently under reconstruction!!  I drove it back and forth to work for a spell, but it needed some upgrades.

 

 

 

[Tennessee williams]

1 hour ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said:

 

I heard they gave you a 3-legged dog with short legs..... 

 

..........Widder

 

He was the only one I could keep up with. 

[Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001]

friends don't let friends drive/push chevys 

be kind throw em a chain so ya can drag em home with the Ford 

 

 worst truck I ever owned was an IH with a 345 v8 , giving it its due , IF ya could get it started , it would pull most anything 

 for about a hr , then ya be walking 

 

  CB 

[Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129]

I'm still a waiting for Ford to Come out with the heated end Gate ,,,, Pushing them up here in the Winter is hard on hands ....

My Nephew drives Tow Truck up here ,,, and here is his break-down of break-downs ,,,, Fords 38%  , Dodges  20%, Toyotas 12% ,Nissans 11%  Chevys 7%  All others 12%....

This is 3 Year average ....

 

Jabez Cowboy

[Blackwater 53393]

25 minutes ago, Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001 said:

friends don't let friends drive/push chevys 

be kind throw em a chain so ya can drag em home with the Ford 

 

 worst truck I ever owned was an IH with a 345 v8 , giving it its due , IF ya could get it started , it would pull most anything 

 for about a hr , then ya be walking 

 

  CB 

 

 

If yer gonna' throw chains at me, at least let me stop so I can hook them to Ol' Green.  It's getting hard to convince Schoolmarm that all those little dents are from Ford owners throwing chains at me when I don't drag 'em home!!! 

[Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967]

The pictures of that gorgeous red Camaro above brings back a memory...

 

Nineteen seventy-one, as I recall, while in college I was working the swing shift in a mailroom in San Francisco, across the Embarcadero from what is now Pier 39.

 

So I drove up one evening in my recently acquired two-year old Triumph Spitfire.  Fun and nimble, with a 1.3 litre (79 cu in) 4-cyl engine.  

 

One of the other student co-workers immediately set out to chide me mercilessly.  Most of the evening was spent listening to his derisive comments about my "Barbi car," my "Belchfire," the "Toy," the "Skateboard with seats," and so forth.  And of course, he interspersed these jibes with observations of how wonderful his Z-28 was ~ a REAL sports car.

 

I ignored him for the most part... and then, about mid-evening, someone suggested we have a rally type race.  Oh boy... that was like tossing kerosene on the campfire - "Yeah!  C'mon, 'foreign car boy,' how 'bout it?" 

 

Finally, I said "sure."

 

"Whaddaya wanna race for, Pink Slips?" he demanded with a grin.  "Paychecks? Fifty bucks?"

 

"Naw," sez I.  "How 'bout just braggin' rights.  But I get to choose the course!"

 

He scoffed and said "sure!"

 

"Alrighty then!  Rally-type race.  Timed.  I go first.

 

"And the course will be... from Mill Valley to Stinson Beach!"  [A route we were all familiar with]

 

Other than grumbles, that shut 'im up right quick-like, and the rest of the assemblage just smiled.  

 

 

 

[Dirty Dan Dawkins]

35 minutes ago, Hardpan Curmudgeon SASS #8967 said:

The pictures of that gorgeous red Camaro above brings back a memory...

 

Nineteen seventy-one, as I recall, while in college I was working the swing shift in a mailroom in San Francisco, across the Embarcadero from what is now Pier 39.

 

So I drove up one evening in my recently acquired two-year old Triumph Spitfire.  Fun and nimble, with a 1.3 litre (79 cu in) 4-cyl engine.  

 

One of the other student co-workers immediately set out to chide me mercilessly.  Most of the evening was spent listening to his derisive comments about my "Barbi car," my "Belchfire," the "Toy," the "Skateboard with seats," and so forth.  And of course, he interspersed these jibes with observations of how wonderful his Z-28 was ~ a REAL sports car.

 

I ignored him for the most part... and then, about mid-evening, someone suggested we have a rally type race.  Oh boy... that was like tossing kerosene on the campfire - "Yeah!  C'mon, 'foreign car boy,' how 'bout it?" 

 

Finally, I said "sure."

 

"Whaddaya wanna race for, Pink Slips?" he demanded with a grin.  "Paychecks? Fifty bucks?"

 

"Naw," sez I.  "How 'bout just braggin' rights.  But I get to choose the course!"

 

He scoffed and said "sure!"

 

"Alrighty then!  Rally-type race.  Timed.  I go first.

 

"And the course will be... from Mill Valley to Stinson Beach!"  [A route we were all familiar with]

 

Other than grumbles, that shut 'im up right quick-like, and the rest of the assemblage just smiled.  

 

 

 

 

There's horses for courses.....