Trigger Mike Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 my son uses a M1carbine to hunt due to his size and skinny shoulder. he hit his first buck today in the shoulder, it jumped, ran , stopped and looked back thru the bushes where he hit it in the head. it kept running and after an hour and a half running him down i het him with my 3006 to finish him. i had thought the soft lead round carbine would have done better.
Linn Keller, SASS 27332, BOLD 103 Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 I'm with you, TM, I would've thought so too!
Utah Bob #35998 Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 To each his own, but I would not trust a carbine as a hunting arm for large game.
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 30 Carbine is almost equal to a .357 mag in 'punch'. Where was the deer hit with the carbine round? Placement is everydangthing as I have seen .22 L.R. do 1 shot kills on dear. OLG
Chantry Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 my son uses a M1carbine to hunt due to his size and skinny shoulder. he hit his first buck today in the shoulder, it jumped, ran , stopped and looked back thru the bushes where he hit it in the head. it kept running and after an hour and a half running him down i het him with my 3006 to finish him. i had thought the soft lead round carbine would have done better. I don't hunt, but I wonder if the 110 Jacketed Soft Point might have expanded too fast and failed to penetrate deep enough to bring the buck down
Noz Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 To each his own, but I would not trust a carbine as a hunting arm for large game. +1 The M-1 Carbine is a very efficient wounding weapon. It's killing capability has always been in question.
Bugs Bonney SASS # 10171 Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 In archery, since the broadhead does not expand, the two critical factors are placement and penetration. With a marginal round like the Carbine I expect one of these two was lacking. Either the placement was poor or the round failed to penetrate to the vital organs. Since you said the shot was in the shoulder my guess is lack of penetration. You may well find the bullet was stopped when it impacted a bone. I think the solution to your dilemma is changing him to another caliber that doesn't have heavy recoil or make sure he only takes shots to the ribcage preferably just behind the shoulder. If he is not able to place his shots precisely more power is required to insure a clean kill. More practice and experience will also help. With a bow a shoulder shot is rarely lethal so a ethical bow hunter will only shoot into the chest from the side or quartering away. That means he must have the discipline to let many deer pass without taking a shot. Since this was your sons first shot at a deer I assume he is fairly young or very inexperienced. With proper guidance from you he will learn and and improve. The fact that you took the hour and a half to hunt the deer down tells me you have the skill and ethics to make a good hunter out of him and I salute you for your following up on a wounded deer. Many wouldn't have bothered. Sorry, to many years as a hunter education instructor and riding along with our local conservation officer and seeing the reality of hunters that just don't care.
Trigger Mike Posted October 31, 2015 Author Posted October 31, 2015 it hit right where he should have so it failed to penetrate. there was no exit wound and the head shot was right by the ear. I doubt it went far. he did stay close by and when he moved he did not go far, we did keep stirring him to move again and finally got him out in the open. i wish he could use a 3006. I have an SKS that does not recoil much i might see how he does with that. i also have my fathers' 35 remington marlin. the stock is a little long for him though on that one.
Pulp, SASS#28319 Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 The best part of this story is y'all didn't give up and eventually recovered the deer. Much better than a lot of folks would have done. Hats off to you and your son.
Tom Bullweed Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 That .35 Remington would be a great option. You can find another stock and cut it short for your son. As he grows, you can add spacers under the buttplate and finally put the original stock back on the gun. 200 and 220 grain bullets from the .35 Remington have brough down a great number of deer and hogs. Recoil and muzzle blast are manageable. The .30 Carbine is a marginal round in a great gun and requires exceptional bullet placement or luck to be effective. A shot in the mid- to high neck will hit spinal cord, windpipe and/or major blood vessels. This is a difficult shot with the iron sights and variables that make hunting interesting. It requires experience and pratice, or a ton of luck. Good choice to stay after injured game. Excellent example.
Chili Ron Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Howdy, How about a win or marlin in .44 mag? Not much recoil and hitting power verified by Bill Ruger in Africa. Check up on that. Best CR
Alpo Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Both CZ and Zastava make a sweet little "Mini Mauser" in 762x39. I've got a CZ, and like the heck out of it. Just wish extra magazines weren't forty bucks each. The Zastava does not use detachable, but has a built-in five-rounder, like a full-size one.
Charlie Whiskers Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 it hit right where he should have so it failed to penetrate. there was no exit wound and the head shot was right by the ear. I doubt it went far. he did stay close by and when he moved he did not go far, we did keep stirring him to move again and finally got him out in the open. i wish he could use a 3006. I have an SKS that does not recoil much i might see how he does with that. i also have my fathers' 35 remington marlin. the stock is a little long for him though on that one. The SKS round has about the same ballistics as a 30-30. When I was living in Minnesota I knew several folks that took deer with an SKS.
guitar_slinger Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 One of my buddies always hunted with a M1 Carbine. I always knew when Tim shot a deer. bang-bang-bang. He always made 3 very rapid shots and always got a deer. Every year for about 10 years he put meat on the table with that little carbine. I never saw one run more than about 50 yards before going down for the count after he shot it. Jeff
Trigger Mike Posted October 31, 2015 Author Posted October 31, 2015 he can't hold the SKS, too front heavy for him. I have an AR with a cheap Nustar scope on it and sighted it in. will go back out with the 35 marlin. My father also gave me a Rossi 44 mag i think he could handle it just fine.
Chantry Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 he can't hold the SKS, too front heavy for him. I have an AR with a cheap Nustar scope on it and sighted it in. will go back out with the 35 marlin. My father also gave me a Rossi 44 mag i think he could handle it just fine. Maybe take a look at something chambered in 6.5x55 Mauser. Mild recoil, very accurate, great penetration with the right ammo. It kicks less then a 44 Magnum or 30-30
Trigger Mike Posted October 31, 2015 Author Posted October 31, 2015 and those are still around. I see them advertise 6.5 at AIM sometimes.
Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001 Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 A 6.5 x 50 Jap , is a nice little round , CB
Utah Bob #35998 Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 A 6.5 x 50 Jap , is a nice little round , CB I ssupect an Arisaka might be a bit long for the boy. Although those little sons of Nippon could use them effectively as i understand.
Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001 Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 Yes a full sized one would be , But they made a handy little carbine also the one I hav always wanted it the type 44 Cav carbine , had a nifty UNDER folding bayo CB
Utah Bob #35998 Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 Yes a full sized one would be , But they made a handy little carbine also the one I hav always wanted it the type 44 Cav carbine , had a nifty UNDER folding bayo CB How bout the Type 2 Paratrooper? Break er down and pack it.
Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001 Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 got to look that one up , if memory is correct , the Type 2 was a break down 99 in 7.7 probley wrong on that CB
Tom Bullweed Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 That 6.5 and 7.7 Jap ammo is Exxxxpensive! I have never in anything but full metal jacket versions. The 6.5x55 Swede is a great round but most rifle have 29" barrels. Carbines are quote pricey. That Marlin in .35 Remington with an added short stock still sounds like a good option. Many young shooters start hunting with a .243 bolt gun. Light recoil and very effective ammo options.
Trailrider #896 Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 Years ago a neighbor's boy was pretty small for his age. He had a Remington 600 in 6mm Remington. He took a nice mule deer with one shot. If you can find a 600, that might be a good one. The Rossi .44 Magnum shouldn't kick all that much and the 20" barrel should balance nicely for him.
Trigger Mike Posted November 1, 2015 Author Posted November 1, 2015 the Jap paratrooper might be too pricey for him to use, but he would be the talk of the neighborhood.
Trigger Mike Posted November 1, 2015 Author Posted November 1, 2015 I let him shoot one round supported on a tripod out of my 3006 Weatherby. he said he liked it but it hurt.
Noz Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 That 6.5 and 7.7 Jap ammo is Exxxxpensive! I have never in anything but full metal jacket versions. The 6.5x55 Swede is a great round but most rifle have 29" barrels. Carbines are quote pricey. That Marlin in .35 Remington with an added short stock still sounds like a good option. Many young shooters start hunting with a .243 bolt gun. Light recoil and very effective ammo options. Be careful on the ammo selection for the 6mm/243. Some of the bullets offered are too hard. I lost a nice doe due to a perfectly placed pencil sized hole in and out. She went into dense brush with no blood trail. I didn't find her until she was long spoiled.
Marshal Dan Troop 70448 Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 Just to add. Back when I still hunted, I always used an M1 Carbine. I may have missed several times, because I seen a branch break below or above the deer, or dirt fly nearby but not close to the deer. But when I hit it, it went down. Never had an unsuccessful season due to the carbine. I took a deer each season. 1 hit shot each time. MT
Chantry Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 That 6.5 and 7.7 Jap ammo is Exxxxpensive! I have never in anything but full metal jacket versions. The 6.5x55 Swede is a great round but most rifle have 29" barrels. Carbines are quote pricey. That Marlin in .35 Remington with an added short stock still sounds like a good option. Many young shooters start hunting with a .243 bolt gun. Light recoil and very effective ammo options. There are a number of commercial rifles chambered in 6.5 x 55, Tikka, CZ and Steyr make one and I am sure there are others out there as well.
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted November 1, 2015 Posted November 1, 2015 I don't hunt, but I wonder if the 110 Jacketed Soft Point might have expanded too fast and failed to penetrate deep enough to bring the buck down What 110 JSP bullet? The man said it was a soft lead bullet. I've taken two muley bucks with a carbine back when I didn't have anything else. Wouldn't be my choice, but the little gun will kill if properly loaded and competently used.
Trigger Mike Posted November 2, 2015 Author Posted November 2, 2015 JSP might be a better way to word it.
Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001 Posted November 2, 2015 Posted November 2, 2015 I have always loaded , my hunting ammo , for the war horses , found ammo hard to find and not what I wanted try to keep the dies , just in case , I ever end up with another in that cal most likely have dies , in the shop to guns that are long gone CB
RIDGE WALKER Posted November 3, 2015 Posted November 3, 2015 The good news here is that the animal was not wasted!! Glad to hear that you finally got it down in the end.
Trigger Mike Posted November 3, 2015 Author Posted November 3, 2015 yes Ridge Walker, that alone helped him learn a few things, and he suddenly became motivated and out ran me some while usually I have to urge him to keep up.
Yellowhouse Sam # 25171 Posted November 3, 2015 Posted November 3, 2015 The Model Seven Remington is pretty dang light and comes in several recoil friendly calibers. I've an older walnut stocked with 18.5 barrel in 222 and its become a favorite varmint rifle where shots aren't in the next county.
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