So...what the he$* is Wilder Bunch Shooting????

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

 

I would ask on the Wild Bunch Wire...but...it's not Wild Bunch Action Shooting...it's...WILDER!

 

 

Phantom

[Silver Sam, SASS #34718L]

Never heard of it.... But I do know what Mild Bunch Shooting is And It's Fun!

 

here are the Loosey Goosey Rules.........

 

Lone Star Frontier Shooting Club

Comanche Valley Vigilantes

New Category for CAS Monthly Matches only

category name: PIKE

The ONLY difference is instead of 2 Revolvers the shooter carries

One 1911 Pistol

in any caliber
and at least two magazines with 5 rounds each

The match is shot and scored exactly the same as written for CAS There is no change in how both Rifle and Shotgun are loaded and shot

**All 1911 magazines loaded with a maximum of 5 rounds each**

START: Magazine loaded, slide closed with Hammer down on Empty Chamber. Pistol holstered or staged, per stage instructions

FINISH: Slide locked back, pistol open and empty
or Slide forward with Hammer down on Empty Chamber then re-holster or stage

Lead bullets only, per SASS Rules All Safety Rules still apply.

** In the case of an “On The Clock” pistol reload,
Shooter must have a magazine ready loaded with only One Round

This is not Wild Bunch.... It is Cowboy Action with a 1911

This category is not intended to replace Wild Bunch. It is for fun only.

If you’re interested in starting a Wild Bunch group at LSFSC or CVV please feel free to bring it up to one of the Club Officers

 

 

 

preview0.pdf

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

15 minutes ago, Silver Sam, SASS #34718L said:

Never heard of it.... But I do know what Mild Bunch Shooting is And It's Fun!

 

here are the Loosey Goosey Rules.........

 

Lone Star Frontier Shooting Club

Comanche Valley Vigilantes

New Category for CAS Monthly Matches only

category name: PIKE

The ONLY difference is instead of 2 Revolvers the shooter carries

One 1911 Pistol

in any caliber
and at least two magazines with 5 rounds each

The match is shot and scored exactly the same as written for CAS There is no change in how both Rifle and Shotgun are loaded and shot

**All 1911 magazines loaded with a maximum of 5 rounds each**

START: Magazine loaded, slide closed with Hammer down on Empty Chamber. Pistol holstered or staged, per stage instructions

FINISH: Slide locked back, pistol open and empty
or Slide forward with Hammer down on Empty Chamber then re-holster or stage

Lead bullets only, per SASS Rules All Safety Rules still apply.

** In the case of an “On The Clock” pistol reload,
Shooter must have a magazine ready loaded with only One Round

This is not Wild Bunch.... It is Cowboy Action with a 1911

This category is not intended to replace Wild Bunch. It is for fun only.

If you’re interested in starting a Wild Bunch group at LSFSC or CVV please feel free to bring it up to one of the Club Officers

 

 

 

preview0.pdf 32.88 kB · 2 downloads

Well someone in Texas must know about the Wilder Bunch Action Shooting...

 

[John Kloehr]

Might have to join the facebook group to find out what Wilder Bunch is.

 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/928402084279710/discussion/preview

 

I was curious so took a moment to google it, and since I did, I'm sharing what I found. And otherwise the trail went cold.

 

On edit: I applied for group membership. Assuming I am approved, I will post about this thread so a representative can answer directly.

 

 

[Lone Spur Jake SASS #7728]

Hey Sam, sounds like something clubs in the Northwest used to do in the late 90's.   Other CAS shooters loved watching the 1911 folks shoot the stages.

And at the end of the day, everybody went home after having a FUN day at the range.

Isn't having fun why we spend so much time and money playing OUR game.

Played golf once, didn't like it.

 

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

8 minutes ago, John Kloehr said:

Might have to join the facebook group to find out what Wilder Bunch is.

 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/928402084279710/discussion/preview

 

I was curious so took a moment to google it, and since I did, I'm sharing what I found. And otherwise the trail went cold.

 

On edit: I applied for group membership. Assuming I am approved, I will post about this thread so a representative can answer directly.

 

 

Yep - that's as far as I got...seems rather...un-inviting.

 

 

Phantom

[Hoodoo Brown, SASS #30515]

Since SASS, in their infinite wisdom, has changed WBAS from a shooting competition to a fantasy game, several former WBAS shooters have started shooting Wilder Bunch. We took the SASS WBAS rule book and threw it in the trash. Many of our rules were taken from 2 and 3 gun rules. Shooter may start up to and including condition one. May move with loaded and cocked gun, as long as finger is out of the trigger guard. Still have the 170 rule. Finger out of the trigger guard during magazine changes. Violation of these rules is a match DQ. There are no minor safety penalties or stage DQs, either you are safe or you aren't. Still have modern and traditional categories. Doughboy, Teddy Roosevelt, Audie Murphy and Bootlegger are additional categories. Basically if a firearm or caliber existed by the end of WorldWar2, there is a place for it in Wilder Bunch. Targets are engaged at distances similar to current WBAS distances. Seven plus yards for pistol and shotgun, 25 plus yards for pistol caliber rifle and 40 yards on out for rifle calibers. Our rule book is about 3 pages. We have been shooting Wilder Bunch at the Texas Doughboy's club in Bowie, Texas since April. We know that this is not for everybody and that's okay. But those of us who prefer a shooting competition to a fantasy game enjoy it very much. There are a few clubs around the country shooting this game. That's about as brief as I can make it. So read it fast before it gets pulled. 

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

10 minutes ago, Hoodoo Brown, SASS #30515 said:

Since SASS, in their infinite wisdom, has changed WBAS from a shooting competition to a fantasy game, several former WBAS shooters have started shooting Wilder Bunch. We took the SASS WBAS rule book and threw it in the trash. Many of our rules were taken from 2 and 3 gun rules. Shooter may start up to and including condition one. May move with loaded and cocked gun, as long as finger is out of the trigger guard. Still have the 170 rule. Finger out of the trigger guard during magazine changes. Violation of these rules is a match DQ. There are no minor safety penalties or stage DQs, either you are safe or you aren't. Still have modern and traditional categories. Doughboy, Teddy Roosevelt, Audie Murphy and Bootlegger are additional categories. Basically if a firearm or caliber existed by the end of WorldWar2, there is a place for it in Wilder Bunch. Targets are engaged at distances similar to current WBAS distances. Seven plus yards for pistol and shotgun, 25 plus yards for pistol caliber rifle and 40 yards on out for rifle calibers. Our rule book is about 3 pages. We have been shooting Wilder Bunch at the Texas Doughboy's club in Bowie, Texas since April. We know that this is not for everybody and that's okay. But those of us who prefer a shooting competition to a fantasy game enjoy it very much. There are a few clubs around the country shooting this game. That's about as brief as I can make it. So read it fast before it gets pulled. 

Are you listed as a SASS Wild Bunch Club?

 

Are you really having an annual during the same week as the WBAS club is having the SASS WBAS State Championship?

 

Phantom

[Dusty Boddems]

Gee Phantom I’m sorry you felt un invited when you went to the Texas Doughboys page. What made you feel that way? 
 The Texas Doughboys will not be a sass affiliated club in 2024.  Using world wars won 3 gun rules we have taken a different path that would not be available to us using sass rules. 
we had our date for our big match The Texas International March 22,23,24 way before the other club announced they would be doing the 24’ state match.  Shame they are both on the same dates. As Hoodoo said earlier about what we do and how we do it.  With 6 divisions  and a truck load of side matches ,banquet with a big prize table. starting up to condition 1 and moving with chamber loaded firearms yes , we are the wilder bunch. 

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

8 minutes ago, Dusty Boddems said:

Gee Phantom I’m sorry you felt un invited when you went to the Texas Doughboys page. What made you feel that way? 
 The Texas Doughboys will not be a sass affiliated club in 2024.  Using world wars won 3 gun rules we have taken a different path that would not be available to us using sass rules. 
we had our date for our big match The Texas International March 22,23,24 way before the other club announced they would be doing the 24’ state match.  Shame they are both on the same dates. As Hoodoo said earlier about what we do and how we do it.  With 6 divisions  and a truck load of side matches ,banquet with a big prize table. starting up to condition 1 and moving with chamber loaded firearms yes , we are the wilder bunch. 

Hmmmm...

 

Well, everyone seems to have their own interpretations of what transpired. 

 

Don't think the name "Wilder Bunch" will last. 

 

Cheers!

Phantom

[Flying W Ramrod]

1 hour ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Hmmmm...

 

Well, everyone seems to have their own interpretations of what transpired. 

 

Don't think the name "Wilder Bunch" will last. 

 

Cheers!

Phantom

Thinking the "mystique" of Wilder Bunch will live on, as we are planning on going.

 

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

4 minutes ago, Flying W Ramrod said:

Thinking the "mystique" of Wilder Bunch will live on, as we are planning on going.

 

Don't you think it's kinda bad form to be using what SASS started and is trying to grow for their own benefit?

 

Why not just leave SASS...name your little game something completely different...??

 

Too me at least, this kinda seems rather childish.

 

Phantom

[DeaconKC]

So Hoodoo, you could use a Luger or 1917 S&W even in this match?

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

And now the people that'll piss on SASS...the very organization that gives them this forum...for their own gratification.

 

Gotta love the Cowboy Way...

 

Phantom

[watab kid]

i cant say i disagree with you at all 

[Cholla]

So, can you dress as the different characters from Gene Wilder movies?

 

 

 

[Lone Spur Jake SASS #7728]

Cholla, as Larry the Cable Guy would say, "Now that's funny, I don't care who you are."

[Lone Spur Jake SASS #7728]

If these folks want to pull away from SASS, then they need come up a name that is not affiliated SASS.  Wilder Bunch, Milder Bunch, etc. still sounds like affiliated with SASS.  If they want to go their own way, fine.  Come up with a name that doesn't sound like or look like "Wild Bunch."

How about "1911 Western Shooting"  or something similar.  Just the first thing came to my mind.  Rest of you folks run with it.

[DeaconKC]

We see one thread complaining about SASS numbers declining, then when someone tries something new to draw folks in others want to bash them.

If this can draw more shooters in, more power to them. Dates collide all the time in this sport, usually good folks having to work around other dates that might or might not be available at a range.

But maybe, just maybe, SASS should start including other divisions similar to Wild Bunch that allow recognized side matches for folks to shoot other WW1 guns or the prohibition Era guns like ZOOT Shooting. Yes, our primary sport would remain pre 1900 guns, but let's not destroy others just because it's not your particular like or dislike.

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

7 minutes ago, DeaconKC said:

We see one thread complaining about SASS numbers declining, then when someone tries something new to draw folks in others want to bash them.

Well this isn't what's happening...but nice try.

 

Fact is that "they" started with WBAS and made it drift more towards those elements of the game that has kept WBAS from succeeding. This format is not marketed to bring in new shooters. It's the exact opposite and the last 15 or so years have proven this. But "they" want the game to be exactly what "they" want it to be...and there are very few of them.

 

So while you may like the format...don't kid yourself into thinking it's the type of format that'll be attractive to an approachable market. You're naive to think that they are trying to "Draw" in new folks. The only thing that is really going on here...for the most part...is a rejection of what SASS is trying to do with WBAS. This is a PERFECT example of SASS WB folks screaming "DON'T COWBOY MY WILD BUNCH".

 

Phantom

[Hoodoo Brown, SASS #30515]

DeaconKC,  yes Lugers and 1917 revolvers are acceptable in Bootlegger class. We had guys today shooting Hi-powers and 1917 Smith and Colt revolvers.

[Scarlett]

I agree with @Phantom, SASS #54973 saying things like it is. At the Land Run Wild Bunch Banquet, the folks presenting the NON SASS Wilder Bunch match were given the opportunity to invite everyone present to their NON SASS event in March. As a Wild Bunch shooter and Junior Wild Bunch Sponsor, I was shocked. 
 

I am a 100% SASS girl. I understand all the WBAS stuff that has transpired. I’m not naive or uninformed. If you want to do your NON SASS games, more power to you.  Start your own organization and your own Forum.  
 

This is THE SASS WIRE. 

 

Hugs!

 

Scarlett

[Choctaw Kid Tulsa]

Honestly, as a gen x’er having seen the WB movie and then learning WB rules and restrictive equipment list, I wasn’t interested in following in the footsteps of the movie.
 

This wilder format could really be on to something as it’s more period focused. I’d give it a shot.

[Sedalia Dave]

until phantom brought it up the Bowie club has never posted their non-sass events on the sass wire nor the WB wire. 

 

the only events they have ever posted on either forum were SASS sanctioned events. 
 

 

 

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

29 minutes ago, Choctaw Kid Tulsa said:

Honestly, as a gen x’er having seen the WB movie and then learning WB rules and restrictive equipment list, I wasn’t interested in following in the footsteps of the movie.
 

This wilder format could really be on to something as it’s more period focused. I’d give it a shot.

Originally, Wild Bunch was a Side Match where you can shoot just about anything pre-WWI. Problem with this format is that it's hard to tailor a competition around such wide parameters.

 

The thing that has kept WB from not succeeding is not the "Period Focus", but other components that have pretty much nothing to do with the firearms. 

 

Now if you like the idea of being more focused on Period Correctness, look into what a pistol was considered good for...particularly by the Military. Neither the original game of WBAS nor the name stealing Wilder Bunch pay any attention to this "correctness".

 

Phantom

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

5 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said:

until phantom brought it up the Bowie club has never posted their non-sass events on the sass wire nor the WB wire. 

 

the only events they have ever posted on either forum were SASS sanctioned events. 
 

 

 

Yeah...whatever.

 

They're listed as a SASS WB Club...fair game. 

 

And they are all B-Hurt that folks don't want to play the WB game they way they want to..."We shoot full blown genuine 100 proof wild bunch!". 

 

Good lord...all that's missing is a gif of a gorilla beating his chest.

 

 

Phantom

[Hells Comin]

 

1 hour ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Good lord...all that's missing is a gif of a gorilla beating his ches

 

[Griff]

Phantom, did you miss this:  

Quote

 The Texas Doughboys will not be a sass affiliated club in 2024.

I've shot with this group since before they organized.  Well before their most recent innovations, they were uninvited from the SASS club several of them are life members of...  and had been instrumental in its growth and  helped initiate Wild Bunch shooting there.  There are probably circumstances and issues I'm not aware of, nor do I have an interest in.  I do know they've tried the SASS version of Wild Bunch and found it lacking... as do other folks.  They're attempting something that might appeal to a wider audience than just the cowboy action crowd.  Criticism is easy, but not very productive.  They are a fun bunch to shoot with, and generally supportive of SASS and it's games... even if not current participants.  If one doesn't try new things, one tends to stagnate, leading to withering and dying.  

[Captain Bill Burt]

I like to shoot. This club likes to shoot. From my perspective we already have a lot in common. I would rather focus on our common interests rather than focus on where our interests diverge.

 

When I received the email about the WBAS rules change my initial reaction was very positive. I didn’t realize that those changes wouldn’t be welcomed by some. Naive I guess. After hearing all the actions the nay sayers were going to take I almost changed my mind and went back to writing WBAS off. I’m still a bit miffed at the reaction but I’m going to focus on local shoots run by pards I know and trust.

 

I guess my point is that as shooters we already have tons of obstacles to overcome in the form of ‘progressives’ who would happily shut down ALL shooting sports. We are already seeing attendance at matches declining.

 

Do we really need division in our ranks over Wild Bunch vs Wilder Bunch? Should we as shooters be trying to damage ANY shooting sport?
 

 

Having said all that, if Misty came in and said ‘hey this name is infringing on WBAS’ then I would support the idea that a different name should be chosen.

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

9 hours ago, Griff said:

I do know they've tried the SASS version of Wild Bunch and found it lacking... as do other folks.  They're attempting something that might appeal to a wider audience than just the cowboy action crowd.  Criticism is easy, but not very productive.

First, criticism is the first step in a productive dialog...poopoo it all ya want. 

 

Secondly, I'd LOVE to hear about the things "lacking" in the SASS version that they have solved. 

 

I'll be waiting.

 

Phantom

[Griff]

3 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

First, criticism is the first step in a productive dialog...poopoo it all ya want. 

Secondly, I'd LOVE to hear about the things "lacking" in the SASS version that they have solved. 

Phantom

Constructive criticism, yes... derision, no.  Solved?  Not sure, but they've sure put a bit more action in their version, think the differences between SASS & W3Gun.  Incorporated a wider variety of firearms.  Removed a couple of penalties that SASS maintains.  As a 1911 carrier my entire adult life, their rules fit much more closely to my EDC and nearly 30 years of professional use.  Will they be successful?  Who knows, but without an attempt, there is no chance that it will happen.  As the Judge once said to me, (paraphrasing as this was nearly 40 years ago), 'even if no one else shows up, I'm still going to play my game'.  The comradery of like minded folks is a bonus, but not entirely necessary.

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

6 minutes ago, Griff said:

Constructive criticism, yes... derision, no.  Solved?  Not sure, but they've sure put a bit more action in their version, think the differences between SASS & W3Gun.  Incorporated a wider variety of firearms.  Removed a couple of penalties that SASS maintains.  As a 1911 carrier my entire adult life, their rules fit much more closely to my EDC and nearly 30 years of professional use.  Will they be successful?  Who knows, but without an attempt, there is no chance that it will happen.  As the Judge once said to me, (paraphrasing as this was nearly 40 years ago), 'even if no one else shows up, I'm still going to play my game'.  The comradery of like minded folks is a bonus, but not entirely necessary.

Constructive...so you are the arbiter of what is "Constructive"?? So this horribly derisive criticism has lead to no betterment of understanding???

 

Whatever...you seem quit bias to make this statement.

 

This false narrative about "them" bringing so much into the genre of Wild Bunch Action Shooting...if you will...is a Strawman. This club could work on bettering the SASS game of WBAS from within SASS...but NOOOOOO, they decided to take their ball and go home. Fact is...and this is the true crux of what's going on, is that they don't like lower PF's, less than .40's and Closer Targets...prove me wrong.

 

Phantom

[Tell Sackett SASS 18436]

On 11/17/2023 at 9:30 PM, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Don't you think it's kinda bad form to be using what SASS started and is trying to grow for their own benefit?

 

Actually, THSS invented Wild Bunch!

46 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

2 minutes ago, Tell Sackett SASS 18436 said:

Actually, THSS invented Wild Bunch!

You mean WB as it was when it was a Side Match?

 

Phantom

[Tell Sackett SASS 18436]

1 minute ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

You mean WB as it was when it was a Side Match?

 

Phantom

Couldn’t say.

But they CLAIM to have invented it. And it was certainly the first place I ever heard of it .  Long ago