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Your favorite .38 special load for CAS.


Deuce Stevens SASS#55996

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17 minutes ago, Billy Boots, # 20282 LTG-Regulator said:

No doubt sufficient for our distances.  Old habits are hard to shed sometimes for me in my accuracy desires.  And, my 4.25" barrel revolvers may have just not liked the TB as much as yours..  Certainly the ability to verify levels is a plus for TB, and not for 3 grains of Clays..  

Yes, I have read of unburned powder in Clays use and see the hint of it on occasions with 105s..  I would like to try some Clay Dot some time but for now have  a supply of Clays to do around 20K rounds which should get me into next summer.

Good shooting.

At the rate I currently shoot , 20K would just about get me to my 100th birthday.:lol:

Rex :D

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1 hour ago, Rex M Rugers #6621 said:

At the rate I currently shoot , 20K would just about get me to my 100th birthday.:lol:

Rex :D

You probably shot more in IHMSA than CAS....but younger then.

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Powder
Cartridge
Bullet Wtin Gn
Bullet
Max Charge (Gn)
Velocity
OAL
Pressure
Primer
Load Source
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 125 125 GR. HDY XTP 4.6 1010 1.45 15600   hodgdon
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 140 140 GR. HDY XTP 4.2 919 1.45 15800   hodgdon
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 148 148 GR. HDY LHBWC 3.3 908 1.16 11800   hodgdon
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 158 158 GR. HDY XTP 3.9 798 1.45 15900   hodgdon
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 90 90 GR. CAST LRNFP 3.5 969 1.32     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 110 110 GR. HDY XTP 4.8 1109 1.45     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 125 125 GR. CAST LRNFP 3.8 985 1.44     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 125 125 GR. HDY XTP 4.6 1010 1.45     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 130 130 GR. MEI CAST LRNFP 4.2 1018 1.46     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 135 135 GR. CAST LRNFP 3.6 927 1.41     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
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38 Special - 110gr bullet loading data:

2400 From 10.0 grains to 10.1 grains

CCI-550 Primer

3N-37 From 6.8 grains to 8.4 grains

CCI-550 Primer

700-X From 3.7 grains to 5.5 grains

CCI-550 Primer

800-X From 6.2 grains to 7.2 grains

CCI-550 Primer

AA-2 From 4.5 grains to 5.8 grains

CCI-550 Primer

AA-5 From 5.8 grains to 9.3 grains

CCI-550 Primer

AL-7 From 9.0 grains to 9.8 grains

CCI-550 Primer

American Select From 4.0 grains to 4.4 grains

CCI-550 Primer

AP-70N From 4.6 grains to 6.0 grains

CCI-550 Primer

AS-30N From 3.2 grains to 4.2 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Blue Dot From 7.8 grains to 11.3 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Bullseye From 3.4 grains to 6.0 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Clays From 4.0 grains to 4.2 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Green Dot From 4.5 grains to 4.8 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Herco From 4.6 grains to 8.2 grains

CCI-550 Primer

HP-38 From 4.2 grains to 6.0 grains

CCI-550 Primer

HS-6 From 6.3 grains to 9.8 grains

CCI-550 Primer

HS-7 From 10.2 grains to 11.2 grains

CCI-550 Primer

IMR-4227 From 13.9 grains to 14.2 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Longshot From 6.6 grains to 7.6 grains

CCI-550 Primer

N-100 From 4.0 grains to 4.4 grains

CCI-550 Primer

N-320 From 4.5 grains to 6.4 grains

CCI-550 Primer

N-340 From 5.5 grains to 7.3 grains

CCI-550 Primer

N-350 From 7.1 grains to 8.0 grains

CCI-550 Primer

N-1020 From 11.6 grains to 12.6 grains

CCI-550 Primer

PB From 4.6 grains to 8.5 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Power Pistol From 5.6 grains to 7.5 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Red Dot From 3.2 grains to 4.7 grains

CCI-550 Primer

S-1000 From 4.0 grains to 4.4 grains

CCI-550 Primer

SR-4756 From 5.8 grains to 7.5 grains

CCI-550 Primer

SR-7625 From 5.1 grains to 5.5 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Titegroup From 4.0 grains to 5.4 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Trap-100 From 4.2 grains to 5.2 grains

CCI-550 Primer

True Blue From 6.8 grains to 7.1 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Unique From 4.6 grains to 7.5 grains

CCI-550 Primer

Universal From 4.0 grains to 6.3 grains

CCI-550 Primer

W-231 From 4.4 grains to 6.3 grains

CCI-550 Primer

W-540 From 8.2 grains to 8.7 grains

CCI-550 Primer

W-630 From 12.1 grains to 13.6 grains

CCI-550 Primer

WAP From 6.8 grains to 7.3 grains

CCI-550 Primer

WSF From 5.2 grains to 6.0 grains

CCI-550 Primer

ZIP From 5.2 grains to 5.6 grains

CCI-550 Primer

 

VARIOUS WEIGHT BULLETS LOADING DATA .... http://stevespages.com/357p_7.html

 

Copyright 1998-2014 Stephen
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7 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

I thought this thread was about YOUR favorite 38 load...

 

<_<

It was. But hand wringing is running a bit rampant right now. 

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11 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

I thought this thread was about YOUR favorite 38 load...

 

<_<

As usual, some people don't really READ what the OP is all about! :o

 

 

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On 10/7/2018 at 9:28 PM, John Boy said:
Powder
Cartridge
Bullet Wtin Gn
Bullet
Max Charge (Gn)
Velocity
OAL
Pressure
Primer
Load Source
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 125 125 GR. HDY XTP 4.6 1010 1.45 15600   hodgdon
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 140 140 GR. HDY XTP 4.2 919 1.45 15800   hodgdon
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 148 148 GR. HDY LHBWC 3.3 908 1.16 11800   hodgdon
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 158 158 GR. HDY XTP 3.9 798 1.45 15900   hodgdon
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 90 90 GR. CAST LRNFP 3.5 969 1.32     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 110 110 GR. HDY XTP 4.8 1109 1.45     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 125 125 GR. CAST LRNFP 3.8 985 1.44     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 125 125 GR. HDY XTP 4.6 1010 1.45     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 130 130 GR. MEI CAST LRNFP 4.2 1018 1.46     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data
Hodgdon Titegroup 38 Special 135 135 GR. CAST LRNFP 3.6 927 1.41     Hodgdon Web - Pistol data

Why are you posting data for jacketed bullets? That could confuse new shooters. 

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Why are you posting data for jacketed bullets? That could confuse new shooters. 

Why?  Because all tables are prepared for jacket & lead bullets that are used in different shooting disciplines .  And as you say, 'could confuse new shooters' ... if they don't know the difference between a HDY XTP and a LRNFP bullet, then they should be banned from RELOADING , PERIOD, or enroll in one of the NRA RELOADING COURSES before they ever post ' what's the best load' on the SASS WIRE

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1 hour ago, John Boy said:

Why?  Because all tables are prepared for jacket & lead bullets that are used in different shooting disciplines .  And as you say, 'could confuse new shooters' ... if they don't know the difference between a HDY XTP and a LRNFP bullet, then they should be banned from RELOADING , PERIOD, or enroll in one of the NRA RELOADING COURSES before they ever post ' what's the best load' on the SASS WIRE

Bull

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I use to shoot lighter stuff like 2.8 grains of clays under a 105....then I kept the light loads in the pistols and used nickel brass as an identifier and 3.6 grains/105 of Clays for the rifle with brass cases since they tend to split less. 

 

I really good shooter talked me outta' the light stuff and now I just shoot 4 grs of Clean shot and a 105. No knock down loads needed or rifle pistols stuff etc.....they get down range quick and really ring the steel. IMHO you get use to the recoil and it's not an issue. 

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10 hours ago, John Boy said:

Why?  Because all tables are prepared for jacket & lead bullets that are used in different shooting disciplines .  And as you say, 'could confuse new shooters' ... if they don't know the difference between a HDY XTP and a LRNFP bullet, then they should be banned from RELOADING , PERIOD, or enroll in one of the NRA RELOADING COURSES before they ever post ' what's the best load' on the SASS WIRE

 

"Sometimes, the amount of self control it takes to not say what's on my mind is so exhausting that I need a nap afterwards."

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On 10/8/2018 at 11:10 AM, Rye Miles #13621 said:

As usual, some people don't really READ what the OP is all about! :o

 

Get a Dillion.

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On 10/8/2018 at 7:09 AM, Deuce Stevens SASS#55996 said:

It was. But hand wringing is running a bit rampant right now. 

 

Could be getting close

 

 

DERAILED.png

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2.8 gr Hodgdon TiteGroup

Fed Primer

127 gr RNFP Badman

O.A.L. 1.50

650 fps

122 ft lbs energy

4.5” barrel

 

Sometimes I load

 

3.2 gr Hodgdon HP38

Fed Primer

127 gr RNFP Badman

O.A.L. 1.50

657 fps

125 ft lbs energy

4.5” barrel

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  • 3 weeks later...
On ‎10‎/‎7‎/‎2018 at 11:15 PM, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

I thought this thread was about YOUR favorite 38 load...

 

<_<

Some folks are like politicians...…...lol. They'll make SURE they tell you what yer' favorite load is. 

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Howdy ;

Fill the case with a drop tube to the point where the 158 gr RNFP compresses the Goex, 3F 1/8 of an inch when seated to 1.54 ... I use bullets cast 1-22 tin -lead lubed with SPG, Lyman Gold ,DGL or the like ... I have been using Winchester primers as that is what I have the most of , I think primers are not an issue one way or the other as long as they Go bang...

 

Mostly I use .38-40, .44 Spl. and .45 Colt loaded in like mannor , using soft cast bullets of 181 grains in .38-40, 220 to 240 grains in .44 special and 255 to 270 grains in .45 Colt ....

 

All loads exceed the smoke standard by a bit ^_^:wacko:

 

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My .38 Special.

 

3.5 grains of Trail Boss behind a 125 grain Chey Cast TCFP coated bullet.  Minimum 1.450 OAL.  Federal primers.

 

This is both for my Ruger revolvers  and Uberti '73 rifle.  Had no problems with the rifle feeding or knockdown targets.

 

Don't own a chronograph.

 

I try to stick with Starline brass for match ammo.  

 

Not sure this is the best for what we do,  however it's been good for me. 

 

Sheriff Langston.

 

 

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32 minutes ago, Three Gun Cole said:

I use a 105 poly coat bullet with either 3.6 grains of N-320 or 2.7 grains of Clays 38 special brass

For pistol I like 2.2 grains of N-310 in 38 short colt brass and the 105 grain polymer bullet

 

20 minutes ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

.38 special 2.7 of Clays under a 125 grain TCFP.

.32 2.2 of Clays under a 100 grain RNFP.

 

Both crimped in the groove and with either Federal or Federal Magnum primers (whatever I have handy).

Morning C & B....I know you both shoot a tad longer barrel revolvers than I, but about what is your norm in velocity with the 2.7 gr Clays on 105 or 125 respectively?  I run 2.9 to 3 with coated 105s and 125s.  Suspecting you get around 620-635 fps, is that about right...according to barrel length versus my 4.25", you may get a little more.  Just wondering.  I think I would get a little unburned powder and dirtier cases with 2.7 on 105, maybe not so much with 125.  135 and 147s with 2.7 would probably be fine as with 2.9 but there is a smidget more of felt recoil as duelist.

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38 minutes ago, Billy Boots, # 20282 LTG-Regulator said:

 

Morning C & B....I know you both shoot a tad longer barrel revolvers than I, but about what is your norm in velocity with the 2.7 gr Clays on 105 or 125 respectively?  I run 2.9 to 3 with coated 105s and 125s.  Suspecting you get around 620-635 fps, is that about right...according to barrel length versus my 4.25", you may get a little more.  Just wondering.  I think I would get a little unburned powder and dirtier cases with 2.7 on 105, maybe not so much with 125.  135 and 147s with 2.7 would probably be fine as with 2.9 but there is a smidget more of felt recoil as duelist.

Hi Billy,   I shoot 4.62 Vaqueros and an 18.5 inch Uberti.  The only time I chronographed these loads the pistols were at about 570 fps and the rifle around 590 fps.

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17 minutes ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

Hi Billy,   I shoot 4.62 Vaqueros and an 18.5 inch Uberti.  The only time I chronographed these loads the pistols were at about 570 fps and the rifle around 590 fps.

thanks....lower than I expected but still a very respectable PF.

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The Power factor on my .45 Colt load in my pistols is 249.48 .....

And my .38-40 load has a PF. of 231.68 in my 66

And my pistols in .44 spl. have a PF of 211.20

And my .38 spl. have a power factor of 147.57

 

Jabez Cowboy

 

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1 hour ago, Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 said:

The Power factor on my .45 Colt load in my pistols is 249.48 .....

And my .38-40 load has a PF. of 231.68 in my 66

And my pistols in .44 spl. have a PF of 211.20

And my .38 spl. have a power factor of 147.57

 

Jabez Cowboy

 

Which is too high for this game. Serves no purpose other than beats the bujuses out of club targets.

 

Phantom

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Phantom these loads duplicate the loads shot by REAL Cowboys in the 1880 - 1908 time frame ,,,,,,,

And they ain't hurt any of our targets .... Soft Lead ... And the REAL powder ..

 

Jabez Cowboy

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1 hour ago, Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 said:

Phantom these loads duplicate the loads shot by REAL Cowboys in the 1880 - 1908 time frame ,,,,,,,

And they ain't hurt any of our targets .... Soft Lead ... And the REAL powder ..

 

Jabez Cowboy

This isn't real life back in the late 19th century... This is CAS. 

 

And yes it does affect the targets. 

 

Phantom

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34 minutes ago, Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 said:

The Power factor on my .45 Colt load in my pistols is 249.48 .....

And my .38-40 load has a PF. of 231.68 in my 66

And my pistols in .44 spl. have a PF of 211.20

And my .38 spl. have a power factor of 147.57

 

Jabez Cowboy

 

If my math is right those bullets are moving purty fast. For the .45 Colt what grain bullet are you using?

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1 hour ago, Jabez Cowboy,SASS # 50129 said:

270 gr. in .45 Colt

All loads are with SASS guidelines ...

 

Jabez Cowboy

Didn't say they were illegal, just that they beat the crap outta targets... Something about mass... velocity... energy... But some folks don't care.

 

Cheers!

 

Phantom

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My favorite 38 Special load is:

 

3.7 grains of Titegroup, 125 RNFP from Georgia Arms, Winchester small pistol primer, Starline Brass, LOA 1.45

 

What I like about this load is the consistency.  Here are the results from 4 strings of 5 rounds in each pistol and rifle.

Pistols are 5.5-inch Uberti Running Irons:  average 829 fps with a 6.55 standard deviation and 15 fps extreme spread.

Rifle is Uberti 1873 20-inch barrel: average 1045 fps with a 10.12 standard deviation and 24 fps extreme spread.

 

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On 10/6/2018 at 12:59 PM, chestnut louie said:

I use 125 grain TC bullets and CLAYS powder.  Hodgdons web site says to use between 2.5 and 3.5 grains in a 38 special case and regular small pistol primers.  I have been using exactly the middle load of powder but get unburnt powder???  If I go up a bit I get less unburnt powder and some more recoil. I used to shoot a lot of Clays and I can't tell the difference in recoil between midpoint at 3.0 and say, 3.25. Is your difference in perceived recoil uncomfortable or does it adversely affect regaining your sight picture & grip for the next shot? If not, don't worry about it. I experienced the same thing about unburnt powder and just upped my load until it stopped. Never did get close to max load. I found Clays to be temperature sensitive in the cooler/cold months and switched to 4.3gr of HP-38/Win 231. A nice mid range load with a 125 gr TC bullet. Soft recoil (to me) but with enough oomph for knockdowns at our range.

 

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Full cases of 2f black powder in:

  .45 CS case w/180 Big Lube RNFP 

  .38 SP case w/125 Big Lube RNFP

  .44-40 case w/200 Big Lube RNFP

  24 gr spout w/.454 lead ball :D

 

Smokeless

  .45 CS case w/170 RNFP over 4.0 gr Trailboss

  .38 sp case w/125 TC over 4.3 gr HP-38/Win 231

  .44-40 case w/200 gr RNFP over 6.0 Trailboss

  .45 ACP case w/200 gr LRNFP over 4.6 HP-38

 

 

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