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Ace_of_Hearts

B-Western - Your thoughts on changes

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I added the Ed Hardy design comment when writing about boots but it should apply to shirts, as well. Also, I don't think dragons on shield shirts are appropriate either, although I believe those shirts are Scully shirts.

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Shirts - snap shirts with either or all of the following: smiley pockets, embroidered yokes, contrasting yokes, embellished yokes, piping.

boots - traditional leather soled boots with any or all of the following: inlaid leather, multicolored leather, embroidery, (no Ed Hardy tattoo flash, etc.) elaborate stitching, snip toe, pointed toe. No lacing (that would rule out some Earthwalker styles) and no Ariat Fatbaby type boots. ( I am gonna catch hell for this.)

Skirts - should have some quality of B-western design, (riding skirts, split skirts) with either or all of the following: keystone belt loops, fringe, gores, leather composition, conchos, or other embellishment.

 

Dresses - should have the same qualities as shirts.

 

Ranch Pants/jeans - traditional 5 pocket denim jeans with felted seams and belt loops. (SASS already address designer jeans.) Ranch style pants should have any or all of the following: keystone belt loops, flap pockets that snap, embellishments on the outer side seams, piping.

 

Shield shirts may be allowed if bib is embroidered with a western design.

 

Okay, let 'er rip!

 

shirts, that ok, not much changes, but almost why bother....? but why mandate snaps, if they "fancy" shouldn't that be enough?

 

jeans, gotta have 5 pockets? and what is a felted seam???

 

bibbed shirts, what is a western design? that would, could be troublesome to explain all the time... never did agree with just piping.....

 

leather soles,,, no, no and no! lots of the newer boots with leather soles don't last a season on limestone rocks... whats ed hardy flash?

dint agree with earthwalkers either....but I carry as much weight as a hungry flea.....

 

 

I gotta ask, why bother?

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looked it up,,, no ed hardy is good!

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Felted seams are those doubled over seams on the outside of jeans, keeps spandex out of the equation.

 

tattoo flash: A French designer named Christian Audigier is marketing Ed Hardy designs, a SoCo tattoo artist, in Rockmount style shirts. These designs have skulls and banners, etc. and they glitter and sparkle. Now, I am not against tattoos, I sport several but, it isn't western and it certainly isn't western on shirts, although they certainly are "flashy and fancy." And, agreed, "western design" puts us right back to "flashy and fancy". I guess I am just muddying the water some more.

 

Here is the deal with me . . . I know what B-Western is supposed to look like and I will adhere to that standard.

 

I think I have done all the damage I can do here . . .

 

Lil.

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I dress it well too, as anyone who has shot with me will attest too,

 

when it first came out, and since, I tell people it is a great place to start, easy to outfit clothing wise and rifles are generally cheaper.

 

enforce the rules we have now with the addition of the dress stuff and we're good,..

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I like the earth walkers as long as they meet the "flashy" part !! Lol

They are comfortable and look good , not to meantion the fact that I have several pair that cost me $600-$1200 each. :)

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I should be getting my new Earthwalkers next week. The B Western boots I have now were killing my legs. Should be worth every penny.

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this will fix complaints, to complain you MUST have rulebook in hand, you MUST show which requirement is not being met.

 

any questions?

this will fix complaints, to complain you MUST have rulebook in hand, you MUST show which requirement is not being met.

 

any questions?

I am match director for local wild bunch matches

I apply what you state above because I can not comit to memory, then perfectly quote the rule back, on spur of the moment, which is required by folks on the range, I even supply the printed rules so they can do the research while I continue on with other match director chores, no one has asked for the book yet, to much work for most I would have to guess

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I am match director for local wild bunch matches

I apply what you state above because I can not comit to memory, then perfectly quote the rule back, on spur of the moment, which is required by folks on the range, I even supply the printed rules so they can do the research while I continue on with other match director chores, no one has asked for the book yet, to much work for most I would have to guess

+1

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I like the way you think, Lil, except maybe on the boots and only leather soles. Most of mine are, as it is, because when we first started that was in the rules. I don't know when it was removed though.

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From my saddle I can tell you every complaint I've had on me is ONLY because that shooter did not completely know the clothing rules ( and yes I have always met BW requirements). I feel this is the case most of the times with the few complaints that has come up across the board. The only wording that needs to be added in the current guidlines is for "dress"allowance for women . If one would read the rules as written and follow them we would not need to change anything since "most" guys don't wear dresses !! Lol :)

+1

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I got to thinning, :blink: dangerous I know! :o , but anywho, maybe it's not the BWers that are tha problem :wacko: , but everyone else thit dunt dress period cowboy enuff, :huh: they look too BW whereas BWers have to really spiff up to stand out... :o

 

 

we taint tha problum, :wacko: thay iz!!!! :huh::huh::P;)

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It's always interesting that most of the people arguing about ladies costumes are men.

:lol:

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Ace may be right, do away with the 97 and require a certain number of pieces of bling on the side by sides

 

10517402_809985852347812_822152829048060

1556291_809985849014479_3653006476045643

Cool! :)

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Cheyenne, I have seen what you wear when it is hot. What you refer to as your minimum dress is far fancier than some of the B-Wesstern shooters that I shoot with. The problem does not lie with 95% of the guys/gals in this category, it is the other 5% that has brought about all the furor. The sentiment seems to be if you cannot tell a B-Western shooter no sight if they are dressed to the minimum requirements then the minimum is too low.

 

I agree with you in that when a shooter has a problem with the way a B-Western shooter is dressed, go to the match director and show them the page and paragraph where the shooter is in violation. This should go for all supposed rule infractions, maybe if people actually read the rule books they would not have so much to complain about.

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The problem does not lie with 95% of the guys/gals in this category, it is the other 5% that has brought about all the furor. The sentiment seems to be if you cannot tell a B-Western shooter no sight if they are dressed to the minimum requirements then the minimum is too low.

 

I agree with you in that when a shooter has a problem with the way a B-Western shooter is dressed, go to the match director and show them the page and paragraph where the shooter is in violation. This should go for all supposed rule infractions, maybe if people actually read the rule books they would not have so much to complain about.

 

+1

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I agree on the shotgun being left alone and I don't even own a '97.

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It really is a shame that a small number of shooters who do not follow the minimum guidelines can cause so much fuss. I am sure that a change in the rules for B-Western dress is on the way, it is important that those of us that shoot the category make our feelings and thoughts known to those in charge at the SASS headquarters.

 

The problem seems to be with the minimum dress being too plain, then raise the minimum. B-Western shooters should be easily identified by the way they are dressed. The dressing requirements should be the equal for both men and women; it should not matter if it is shirt, pants, jeans, bodice, blouse, skirt, dress or whatever. As long as it is fancy and flashy it should be good to go.

 

The rest of the requirements for equipment and varied shooting style seem to be fine and not in need of changes. I like the ability to switch shooting styles to help make shooting sequences easier. I can and do shoot a double, but I love to shoot my '97.

 

Just the view from where I sit.

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It really is a shame that a small number of shooters who do not follow the minimum guidelines can cause so much fuss. I am sure that a change in the rules for B-Western dress is on the way, it is important that those of us that shoot the category make our feelings and thoughts known to those in charge at the SASS headquarters.

 

The problem seems to be with the minimum dress being too plain, then raise the minimum. B-Western shooters should be easily identified by the way they are dressed. The dressing requirements should be the equal for both men and women; it should not matter if it is shirt, pants, jeans, bodice, blouse, skirt, dress or whatever. As long as it is fancy and flashy it should be good to go.

 

The rest of the requirements for equipment and varied shooting style seem to be fine and not in need of changes. I like the ability to switch shooting styles to help make shooting sequences easier. I can and do shoot a double, but I love to shoot my '97.

 

Just the view from where I sit.

If the problem is indeed a small number of shooters...isn't the real problem then the fact that someone in the majority is not calling them on their non-compliance????

 

Phantom

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Much ado about nothing! Personal agendas ("vision," whatever) make for poor decision making. <_< Just leave the category alone! The current rules are just fine, and are just as CC presented the concept. I suggest we try to recruit more folks to BW, rather than drive them away! :)

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If the problem is indeed a small number of shooters...isn't the real problem then the fact that someone in the majority is not calling them on their non-compliance????

 

Phantom

B...I...n...g...o

B...I.....n......g....o

And

Bingo was his name

 

 

Uniformly Enforce all current rules to the 100% of all CAS shooters, is the best for the whole of CAS and it's participants over decades of time

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B...I...n...g...o

B...I.....n......g....o

And

Bingo was his name

 

 

Uniformly Enforce all current rules to the 100% of all CAS shooters, is the best for the whole of CAS and it's participants over decades of time

+10000000000000

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Ok, time to revive the horse and then beat it again. I love shooting B Western and have put in more $$$ for costumes than some spend on guns and leather. The Only change I would want to see might be to not limit the type of soles on our boots.

 

Smooth leather soles on certain types of ground, especially wet ground, are extremely slippery. As we all know our 1st, 2nd and 3rd priorities for this game are safety, safety and oh yeah, safety. The risk of slipping with a loaded firearm is worth have a more liberal view of what type of boot sole is appropriate IMHO.

 

Wyatt Hurts

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Ok, time to revive the horse and then beat it again. I love shooting B Western and have put in more $$$ for costumes than some spend on guns and leather. The Only change I would want to see might be to not limit the type of soles on our boots.

 

Smooth leather soles on certain types of ground, especially wet ground, are extremely slippery. As we all know our 1st, 2nd and 3rd priorities for this game are safety, safety and oh yeah, safety. The risk of slipping with a loaded firearm is worth have a more liberal view of what type of boot sole is appropriate IMHO.

 

Wyatt Hurts

 

Smooth leather soles on boots have NOT been required in that category for quite some time.

It was clarified that only LUG SOLES are prohibited for both BW and Classic categories in 2010

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Smooth leather soles on boots have NOT been required in that category for quite some time.

It was clarified that only LUG SOLES are prohibited for both BW and Classic categories in 2010

 

Please define or descriibe "lug soles". Are Vibram (trade mark) soles considered "lug soles"?

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Please define or descriibe "lug soles". Are Vibram (trade mark) soles considered "lug soles"?

 

Some are...some aren't...

This one IS:

 

Vibram-Lug-1440-M.png

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I too, looked up lug soles, and as far as I can tell the only options are lug or smooth.

 

I hate to always see the "please define this, please define that" questions. But there are a lot of terms used in SASS that I have no clue what they are. For instance, I still don't know what a shady brady is. The only answer I ever got was a picture of some race car driver wearing a fancy cowboy hat, but never could figure out what it was about the hat that made it a 'shady brady'. To be honest, his hat didn't look like it provided much shade at all. Maybe instead of a definition, they should just include pictures or diagrams.

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I too, looked up lug soles, and as far as I can tell the only options are lug or smooth.

What exactly are you talking about?

There are innumerable options between what is considered a "lug" sole or smooth.

I'm NOT going to post pix of every type of boot sole that is NOT a LUG sole.

 

....

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IMO you can identify lug soles best from the side. Grooves and patterns on the soles may not be visible from the side. In this case they appear to be smooth, yet may have some non-slip capabilities.

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Soles must be non-grip enhancing (i.e., “NO Lug”) soles.

SHB p.16 / RO2 p.12

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Considering the age of most folks I've met shooting CAS, you'd think they'd want as much grip as they can get!

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Considering the age of most folks I've met shooting CAS, you'd think they'd want as much grip as they can get!

There are TWO categories out of all your choices that do not all grip enhancing souls.

B-Western and Classic Cowboy.

 

But those two are just costume categories.

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I too, looked up lug soles, and as far as I can tell the only options are lug or smooth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Lots of soles are between lugged and smooth.

 

Just check out Ariat Boots.

 

You won't find any slick smooth soles. Some have little lines

and things in the but are NOT lugged.

And some are lugged. If it looks like a off road tire. It's lugged. :o

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Some are...some aren't...

This one IS:

 

Vibram-Lug-1440-M.png

 

how about these? and who is the "judge"? The TO, the RO, the MD, posse concensus, the opponent?

 

  • image_52356.jpg

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