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WTC double cocking GF

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As a side note, of the timers I have worked with, (and read about)  they only discern shots .08 and greater.

 

So even if a shooter fired their shots .07 apart, most of the timers we use in SASS will not catch each shot.

 

..........Widder   (Thanks everyone for the nice B'day thoughts and wishes)

 

 

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19 minutes ago, J. Mark Flint #31954 LIFE said:

Happy birthday you double cocking gunfighter!

 

 

Thanks J.Mark...... :D

 

I've spent my day giving our government more blood.  As a GF, I had to give them blood from both arms..... :lol:

Then I celebrated my 68th with a DQ cheeseburger and a 

large Heath Blizzard.......... mmmmmmm good!

 

..........Widder

 

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1 hour ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said:

 

Thanks J.Mark...... :D

 

I've spent my day giving our government more blood.  As a GF, I had to give them blood from both arms..... :lol:

Then I celebrated my 68th with a DQ cheeseburger and a 

large Heath Blizzard.......... mmmmmmm good!

 

..........Widder

 

 

With a healthy supper like that, you should make it another 68 years, Widder!   BTW, you didn't "pump" your arms while donating, did you?

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20 minutes ago, Marshal Hangtree said:

 

With a healthy supper like that, you should make it another 68 years, Widder!   BTW, you didn't "pump" your arms while donating, did you?

 

Marshal,

No pumping for me.   Actually, my pistols are kept in front of me and never pump.   And actually, I'm as far removed from

being a double cocker as there is.   I strictly alternate.

 

The Blizzard was not only a BDay gift to myself, but I have been going for 3 months with little or no sugary foods, taters, fries, etc.....   But after my blood test this morning, I decided to feed my temptations of having a Heath Blizzard.

 

..........Widder

 

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Happy Birthday you 97 wizard.

 

Sun

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14 minutes ago, Cypress Sun said:

Happy Birthday you 97 wizard.

 

Sun

 

Thanks Sun.

I think I might be getting too old to keep racing these young whippersnappers.

 

Red Knee's waiting for me to take up the rocker to whoop up on me..... :o

 

..........Widder

 

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24 minutes ago, Tyrel Cody said:

Happy Birthday Widder!

Happy Birthday as well Widder. I can't believe there is  only 4 pages on a rule that is spelled out in the book! :D

 

Randy

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2 minutes ago, Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903 said:

Happy Birthday as well Widder. I can't believe there is  only 4 pages on a rule that is spelled out in the book! :D

 

Randy

I think that's why he mentioned his Birthday; he knows that'll push it to 7, maybe 8 pages :P

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5 hours ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said:

I celebrated my 68th with a DQ cheeseburger and a 

large Heath Blizzard.......... mmmmmmm good!

 

..........Widder

 

  When I got off the phone with you I celebrated your birthday with a banana split hold the strawberries and add caramel. I mentioned your name and they gave me a discount. Gertrude said to tell you hey and something about you forgetting to call her.:ph34r:

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1 hour ago, Randy Saint Eagle, SASS # 64903 said:

Happy Birthday as well Widder. I can't believe there is  only 4 pages on a rule that is spelled out in the book! :D

 

Randy

Randy, I think you just celebrated one the 25th. Happy Birthday. Yall keep getting older, I keep getting prettier.

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1 minute ago, Tennessee williams said:

Randy, I think you just celebrated one the 25th. Happy Birthday. Yall keep getting older, I keep getting prettier.

 

I would like some of whatever you're drinking :P

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On 3/3/2019 at 8:41 PM, Wyatt said:

TO said 10 shots end of discussion. Next shooter 

 

^

GG ~ :FlagAm:

 

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14 hours ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said:

 

Thanks J.Mark...... :D

 

I've spent my day giving our government more blood.  As a GF, I had to give them blood from both arms..... :lol:

Then I celebrated my 68th with a DQ cheeseburger and a 

large Heath Blizzard.......... mmmmmmm good!

 

..........Widder

 

 

Happy Birthday - my 50th last year and I enjoyed a greasy pizza - danged good!!

 

;) GG

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Happy belated birthday Widder!

 

Howdy all, 

 

This has nothing to do with the original posting, just me pissing and moaning a bit.

 

There is nothing like shooting GF, yet when you feel that you just shot the perfect stage, separated your shots, completed the scenario as described, shot it faster than you thought you could,  then you turn around and see all three spotters shrug their shoulders because they aren't sure what just happened is such a let down. Many times people tend to want to give a penalty only because they can't say what just occurred. This is when a good TO, especially a GF TO is nice to have, because they understand what the shooter did. Now add BP to the equation as a FCGF and it really adds to the confusion.

 

Unfortunately the lack of a noticeable pause between the first five shots and the second five shots when shooting two guns seems to mess with a lot of people.

 

The rules are there for a reason, I don't believe many try to circumvent them, but I do believe a good GF can confuse the "weak minded" :) leading to controversy. Don't be offended, It's only a joke folks.

 

Tully

 

 

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3 hours ago, Tully Mars said:

Happy belated birthday Widder!

 

Howdy all, 

 

This has nothing to do with the original posting, just me pissing and moaning a bit.

 

There is nothing like shooting GF, yet when you feel that you just shot the perfect stage, separated your shots, completed the scenario as described, shot it faster than you thought you could,  then you turn around and see all three spotters shrug their shoulders because they aren't sure what just happened is such a let down. Many times people tend to want to give a penalty only because they can't say what just occurred. This is when a good TO, especially a GF TO is nice to have, because they understand what the shooter did. Now add BP to the equation as a FCGF and it really adds to the confusion.

 

Unfortunately the lack of a noticeable pause between the first five shots and the second five shots when shooting two guns seems to mess with a lot of people.

 

The rules are there for a reason, I don't believe many try to circumvent them, but I do believe a good GF can confuse the "weak minded" :) leading to controversy. Don't be offended, It's only a joke folks.

 

Tully

 

 

A good TO is a good TO. 

 

Stating that there might be a difference between them furthers the myth that there's a difference between GF's and everyone else.

 

There's not.

 

Phantom

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What Phantom said.  If you can count for a quick rifle shooter, you can count for a quick gunfighter.

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45 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

A good TO is a good TO. 

 

Stating that there might be a difference between them furthers the myth that there's a difference between GF's and everyone else.

 

There's not.

 

Phantom

 

I'm not going to buy into a myth that all TO's and spotters are the same either. So we'll just have to agree to disagree.

 

Tully

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1 hour ago, Tully Mars said:

 

I'm not going to buy into a myth that all TO's and spotters are the same either. So we'll just have to agree to disagree.

 

Tully

Please show me where I said that all TO's and Spotters are the same???

 

Too funny:lol:

 

:lol:

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1 hour ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

A good TO is a good TO. 

 

Stating that there might be a difference between them furthers the myth that there's a difference between GF's and everyone else.

 

There's not.

 

Phantom

 

Phantom,

 

Apparently I misinterpreted the above, my apologies. I do not believe there's a difference between GF's or shooters from any other category. I do however believe a good GF shooting within the rules of the game can cause confusion at times with some spoters and TO's, for whatever reason that maybe. Many here on this post have said the same thing. Some have out right said they don't like spotting for GF's especially the one's that double cock.

 

That's not saying there's a difference between GF's and everyone else, just that it can be a bit more tricky for some to follow the shooting order.

 

Tully

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4 hours ago, Tully Mars said:

Happy belated birthday Widder!

 

Howdy all, 

 

This has nothing to do with the original posting, just me pissing and moaning a bit.

 

There is nothing like shooting GF, yet when you feel that you just shot the perfect stage, separated your shots, completed the scenario as described, shot it faster than you thought you could,  then you turn around and see all three spotters shrug their shoulders because they aren't sure what just happened is such a let down. Many times people tend to want to give a penalty only because they can't say what just occurred. This is when a good TO, especially a GF TO is nice to have, because they understand what the shooter did. Now add BP to the equation as a FCGF and it really adds to the confusion.

 

Unfortunately the lack of a noticeable pause between the first five shots and the second five shots when shooting two guns seems to mess with a lot of people.

 

The rules are there for a reason, I don't believe many try to circumvent them, but I do believe a good GF can confuse the "weak minded" :) leading to controversy. Don't be offended, It's only a joke folks.

 

Tully

 

 

Very nice.

I think all this is more about making the right call vs. getting rid of any rules. I don't Dbl shoot, but I double cock sometimes. But I have witnessed GF shooters get a 'P' because they got too close vs. trying to Dbl shoot and get away with it.

 

As for the TO making a call, I think that the TO can pay more attention to the shooter than the # of misses. They are in a better position to observe safety and procedure. If it's not his job, I think it should be.  In the OP, the call was 5 shots, 5 misses. The TO can better call 10 shots by watching the shooter than spotters listening to too many things at once. SO I support a TO making the final call.

 

Quote

Many times people tend to want to give a penalty only because they can't say what just occurred. This is when a good TO, especially a GF TO is nice to have,

My primary point.

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8 minutes ago, Tully Mars said:

 

Phantom,

 

Apparently I misinterpreted the above, my apologies. I do not believe there's a difference between GF's or shooters from any other category. I do however believe a good GF shooting within the rules of the game can cause confusion at times with some spoters and TO's, for whatever reason that maybe. Many here on this post have said the same thing. Some have out right said they don't like spotting for GF's especially the one's that double cock.

 

That's not saying there's a difference between GF's and everyone else, just that it can be a bit more tricky for some to follow the shooting order.

 

Tully

 

Gunfighters shoot sequence different than others (when allowed), because it is safer or just plain different with two guns out. If as a spotter your not looking at the next target to be shot, you may miss the call. No more than starting a sweep from the right to left vs. left to right for the most part. 

When I shoot with a bunch of GF'ers and a traditional shooter steps up, I get lost when they change guns sometimes. Why can't it be the other way around for any spotter?

 

My only reason for shooting GF is I want to be able to shoot weak hand as good as strong. I started as DD for a year till I was comfortable for GF. Not to take advantage of any other shooting style.

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18 minutes ago, Blast Masterson said:

 

In the OP, the call was 5 shots, 5 misses. The TO can better call 10 shots by watching the shooter than spotters listening to too many things at once. SO I support a TO making the final call.

 

My primary point.

 

Howdy Blast M.

Therein lies some of the dispute over the call.   If you double check the OP's thread, he clearly states that "There were no misses".

 

The call was that the Spotter only detected 5 shots and not 10........ then the TO determined all shots were fired and therefore, the TO made the final 'Clean' decision.   Whether the TO made his/her decision on hearing or seeing those 10 shots isn't known to us.

 

..........Widder

 

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5 minutes ago, Blast Masterson said:

 

Gunfighters shoot sequence different than others (when allowed), because it is safer or just plain different with two guns out. If as a spotter your not looking at the next target to be shot, you may miss the call. No more than starting a sweep from the right to left vs. left to right for the most part. 

When I shoot with a bunch of GF'ers and a traditional shooter steps up, I get lost when they change guns sometimes. Why can't it be the other way around for any spotter?

 

My only reason for shooting GF is I want to be able to shoot weak hand as good as strong. I started as DD for a year till I was comfortable for GF. Not to take advantage of any other shooting style.

It's not hard...GF's can't shoot sequences in any way that a non-GF can. 

 

I'm been shooting for a little while...kinda all over the West. I've never had a spotter try and give a GF a P cuz they couldn't keep up on the sequence. They usually just say that "I have no idea if it was shot right". But that never ends in a P just because a spotter or two or three couldn't figure it out.

 

This whole topic has become some weird Boogie Man topic...There ain't a problem here folks.

 

Phantom

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21 hours ago, Widder, SASS #59054 said:

The Blizzard was not only a BDay gift to myself, but I have been going for 3 months with little or no sugary foods, taters, fries, etc.....   But after my blood test this morning, I decided to feed my temptations of having a Heath Blizzard.

 

..........Widder

 

Happy Birthday Widder! If it makes you happy, you'll live longer than suffering! ;-) Just practice moderation! You deserve a reward for a good blood test.

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8 minutes ago, Blast Masterson said:

 

Gunfighters shoot sequence different than others (when allowed), because it is safer or just plain different with two guns out. ...

Can you explain this? It is my understanding that GF must shoot exactly the same sequence as other categories.

"A Gunfighter may utilize any sequence that is available for use by any other shooting category."

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2 minutes ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

It's not hard...GF's can't shoot sequences in any way that a non-GF can. 

But when they don't (ie. round count)...

 

I'm been shooting for a little while...kinda all over the West. I've never had a spotter try and give a GF a P cuz they couldn't keep up on the sequence. They usually just say that "I have no idea if it was shot right". But that never ends in a P just because a spotter or two or three couldn't figure it out.

Well your blessed. Do you shoot GF? If not, it dosen't affect what you do.

 

This whole topic has become some weird Boogie Man topic...There ain't a problem here folks.

Just because you haven't had a problem, shooting non-GF? I've seen two regional matches go south over bad calls. So what does that make the odds?

 

Phantom

 

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3 minutes ago, Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 said:

Can you explain this? It is my understanding that GF must shoot exactly the same sequence as other categories.

"A Gunfighter may utilize any sequence that is available for use by any other shooting category."

Round counts.

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9 minutes ago, Blast Masterson said:

Round counts.

That is the same sequence as available to any other shooter. None of the counters can know who is going to shoot in what order. So it is no different for a GF.

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1 hour ago, Blast Masterson said:

 

I'm done with you.

 

Make as many Boogie Men as you want.

 

:wacko:

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I think Blast is trying to say that when there is a round count stage the Gunfighter may CHOOSE to shoot it differently than a traditional shooter would choose to.  That I've seen many times.  For example, three targets 4-2-4 round count.  Most traditional shooter are going to shoot 4 shots out of one pistol on the outside target and 1 shot on the inside target, then the same with the second pistol.  Or a traditional shooter may shoot 1-4, 1-4 starting on the inside target each time.  I've seen gunfighters shoot that with by shooting the left outside target 4 times with one pistol while shooting the right outside target 4 times with the other pistol.  Then each pistol puts a round on the center target. Like Kevin Costner in Silverado.  I don't see how that creates a burden for spotters, but if I'm doing something a little different from what they expect I always say so to the TO so there's no confusion.  Never had a problem when I did that.

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Capt,

you make a good point and good example.

When given the opportunity, if we have 5 targets with a 'engage each target TWICE...NO Double Taps', I will

normally shoot it:   3-4-2-5-1-3-2-4-1-5

This sequence allows me to alternate each shot, starting with the left pistol on 3.

My left pistol never leaves targets 1,2,and 3.   And my right pistol never leaves targets 3,4 and 5.

 

And YES, I always tell the spotters what I am about to do before starting the stage.   It makes a good

side show.

 

..........Widder

 

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1 hour ago, Captain Bill Burt said:

I think Blast is trying to say that when there is a round count stage the Gunfighter may CHOOSE to shoot it differently than a traditional shooter would choose to.  That I've seen many times.  For example, three targets 4-2-4 round count.  Most traditional shooter are going to shoot 4 shots out of one pistol on the outside target and 1 shot on the inside target, then the same with the second pistol.  Or a traditional shooter may shoot 1-4, 1-4 starting on the inside target each time.  I've seen gunfighters shoot that with by shooting the left outside target 4 times with one pistol while shooting the right outside target 4 times with the other pistol.  Then each pistol puts a round on the center target. Like Kevin Costner in Silverado.  I don't see how that creates a burden for spotters, but if I'm doing something a little different from what they expect I always say so to the TO so there's no confusion.  Never had a problem when I did that.

 That is exactly what I got called on which I mentioned in one of my first posts. All traditional shooters shot before me, I got called on it when I didn't shoot it in a sweep like everyone else. By the way, the TO corrected all the spotters.

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