Taos Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 At a local shoot last month there was a stage scenario where one of the targets could not be double tapped. Pistol and rifle scenario was the same. A Gunfighter double tapped the pistol target that we were told NOT to double tap. None of the spotters gave him a P. I questioned the shooter. He said he did not double tap the target, he shot it once with one pistol then once with the other pistol. He said a double tap has to come from one gun. I do not agree with this. So what do all y'all think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taos Posted July 18, 2023 Author Share Posted July 18, 2023 The scenario was something like this: 5 targets. Instructions: Hit each target twice, do not double tap the center target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shepherd Book Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 As a relatively new shooter, and only RO I qualified, I would likely have asked for clarification, because the instructions as read would seem to imply that the center target was shot twice, but not in succession. i.e. could be shot something like: 2 on 1; 2 on 2; 1 on center; 2 on 4; 2 on 5; then final shot on center. Two on each target, not two in succession on the center target. Not sure that a gunfighter should get a pass for two shots, one from each revolver... $0.02--but with inflation, probably worth little to nothing...SB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 Gunfighters use the revolvers as if they are rifles. No difference between one gun and the other as far as sequence of shots. And a DOUBLE TAP is two sequential HITS on a single target, regardless if a GF switched guns. If he did that sequence of shots, it's a double tap. BTW - a two-handed or duelist can make the same error if last shot from first revolver is fired on a target and the first shot from the second gun is also fired on same target. That's a double tap. Even if 60 seconds lapse between one and the next shot. It's all the "revolver string" The EXCUSE does not hold water. GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 double tap means hitting the same target twice in a row. Nothing about having to come from the same or the other pistol is mentioned. P for not following intructions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 If it was hit twice in a row, it's a double tap. We had a scenario recently that stated, "No double taps", yet the instructions said to triple tap center target... ... I don't know how you can triple tap a target without double tapping it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 43 minutes ago, Three Foot Johnson said: If it was hit twice in a row, it's a double tap. We had a scenario recently that stated, "No double taps", yet the instructions said to triple tap center target... ... I don't know how you can triple tap a target without double tapping it... Here we go! If I had heard those instructions, I would have shot it as follows.... Left Pistol 2 one 1, 2 on 2, 1 on 3. Right Pistol 2 on 5, 2 on 4 , 1 on 3. Works just fine if you do it, duelist, double duelist, or gunfighter. Remember, gunfighters don't HAVE to alternate pistols each shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrel Cody Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 1 hour ago, Three Foot Johnson said: If it was hit twice in a row, it's a double tap. We had a scenario recently that stated, "No double taps", yet the instructions said to triple tap center target... ... I don't know how you can triple tap a target without double tapping it... We should ask @Tennessee williams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennessee williams Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 3 minutes ago, Tyrel Cody said: We should ask @Tennessee williams The TOTAL number of hits in a ROW on a SINGLE target with a single firearm TYPE is 1=single tap 2=double tap 3=triple tap 4=quad tap So, if you shoot a target with a firearm 2 times and then 1 more time you have triple tapped it. You have not double and single tapped it. Therefore you do not double tap in order to triple tap. You have only triple tapped. Dang you Tyrel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Barleycorn, SASS #76982 Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 1 hour ago, Taos said: At a local shoot last month there was a stage scenario where one of the targets could not be double tapped. Pistol and rifle scenario was the same. A Gunfighter double tapped the pistol target that we were told NOT to double tap. None of the spotters gave him a P. I questioned the shooter. He said he did not double tap the target, he shot it once with one pistol then once with the other pistol. He said a double tap has to come from one gun. I do not agree with this. So what do all y'all think? He fed you a load of BS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Barleycorn, SASS #76982 Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 1 hour ago, Three Foot Johnson said: If it was hit twice in a row, it's a double tap. We had a scenario recently that stated, "No double taps", yet the instructions said to triple tap center target... ... I don't know how you can triple tap a target without double tapping it... you can’t, poorly written and should have been caught at the walk through Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrel Cody Posted July 18, 2023 Share Posted July 18, 2023 9 minutes ago, Tennessee williams said: The TOTAL number of hits in a ROW on a SINGLE target with a single firearm TYPE is 1=single tap 2=double tap 3=triple tap 4=quad tap So, if you shoot a target with a firearm 2 times and then 1 more time you have triple tapped it. You have not double and single tapped it. Therefore you do not double tap in order to triple tap. You have only triple tapped. Dang you Tyrel! Thanks, I knew you could explain this one! We could really have a fun conversation here, but I think I'll not so we don't confuse folks. O.P. That Gunfighter is wrong and earned a P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Gator SASS #29736 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 The shooter can think whatever he wants. It's not up to him to make the call if some action should be a P or calling a miss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watab kid Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 a double tap is two from the same gun in a single occurrence , if you shoot it once in a sweep then come back and shoot it again in a second sweep its not a double tap - but then im a bit confused by the question to start with , so if i need clarification feel free Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 ^ Nope, a double tap is two hits in sequence on same target by the same gun type, not the same gun. If you have two revolvers out together or one at a time, it DOES NOT MATTER. Same as any other sequence you fire. If you are to shoot a Lawrence Welk (1-2-3-4), are you going to penalize a 2-handed or duelist revolver shooter because he changed guns after the first 5 shots? That's still a 3-shot sequence (aka, a triple tap) you have to shoot on the third target, even when using 2 revolvers to do it. You can't claim he did not shoot a triple tap due to "he changed to another revolver, so it's not a triple tap." good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taos Posted July 19, 2023 Author Share Posted July 19, 2023 Thanks everyone, I think we got it now. "Taps" are SEQUENTIAL hits from the same gun TYPE. Yesterday I looked for an hour through the Shooters Handbook and could not find the definition of a "tap". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 If it's not found in the "Definitions" at the back of the booklet, it's not "defined" by SASS. So, conventional action pistol definitions would apply. One can't have shot much without having heard and used the word "tap" or even "double tap". To complete the definition: Multiple Taps are SEQUENTIAL hits on a single target from the same gun TYPE. good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Equanimous Phil Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 And: Spotters are supposed to watch the targets and berm behind it for hits and misses, they can not know for sure which pistol each shot came from. As someone mentioned before, GF do not have to alternate each shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abe E.S. Corpus SASS #87667 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 Note to self when writing stages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shooting Bull Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 18 hours ago, Tennessee williams said: The TOTAL number of hits in a ROW on a SINGLE target with a single firearm TYPE is 1=single tap 2=double tap 3=triple tap 4=quad tap So, if you shoot a target with a firearm 2 times and then 1 more time you have triple tapped it. You have not double and single tapped it. Therefore you do not double tap in order to triple tap. You have only triple tapped. Dang you Tyrel! Soooooooooooooo...................If the stage instructions say to hit each target three times with no double taps I can triple tap them with no penalty, right? @Tyrel Cody Yeah, I'm THAT guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tennessee williams Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 1 minute ago, Shooting Bull said: Soooooooooooooo...................If the stage instructions say to hit each target three times with no double taps I can triple tap them with no penalty, right? @Tyrel Cody Yeah, I'm THAT guy. If you were shooting my stage, it would read: Using only single taps, place atleast 3 rounds on each target. Aint my fault, some stagewriters...shouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 3 hours ago, Equanimous Phil said: (spotters) can not know for sure which pistol each shot came from There is NO reason for the spotters to track what revolver fired what shot, but the TO should monitor that to be able to help the shooter use the gun with ammo still left to finish the string. Any writer who builds stage descriptions with "with first revolver.....then with second revolver" needs remedial training. Regardless of shooting style, it DOES NOT MATTER which of the two revolvers were used to fire each shot. Count the misses and look for sequence violations, if there might be some, or for round counts on targets, if that is what the stage is designed to have. TO - Help the shooter (if you are fast enough) with "One more from that gun" if a 2-handed or duelist shooter tries to put the gun away with a round left in cylinder, but don't stop them (they can actually recover from that mistake most of the time). good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeb Stuart #65654 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 21 hours ago, Three Foot Johnson said: If it was hit twice in a row, it's a double tap. We had a scenario recently that stated, "No double taps", yet the instructions said to triple tap center target... ... I don't know how you can triple tap a target without double tapping it... It was a 1-3-1 sweep, twice starting on the same target twice. The stage writer didn't want you to shoot it as follows 1-3-2-3-1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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