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Guest Texas jack Black SASS#9362

target distance

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Guest Texas jack Black SASS#9362

 Just a question,  what side by side distance between plates do you usually see, what is target size and how far are they set from shooter.? This is not to start a rant just info for reference. 

 

 Thank You

         :FlagAm:

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The objective is to preclude a target "miss" to become a hit on the adjacent target. Some judgement is involved, including distance to the targets and complexity of the stage.  Personally, I like to see about 1 target width between targets at a minimum.  

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Posted (edited)

Well by all means put them close and at the same distance cuz everybody shoots sxs shotguns<_<

 

Sometimes it's nice to move SG targets around for astetics... And having to swing a little to the next target.

 

Phantom

Edited by Phantom, SASS #54973

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I've observed the further SG targets are separated the frequency of reshooting SG targets diminishes substantially. 

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Guest Texas jack Black SASS#9362

   This is about edge to edge distance for plates  pistol and rifle.

 

 Thanks  :FlagAm:

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I think folks are confused because you stated:

what side by side distance”

and assumed you were refering to SG targets. I think you are wondering about target spacing for rifle and pistol targets?

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Guest Texas jack Black SASS#9362
18 minutes ago, Too Tall Bob said:

I think folks are confused because you stated:

what side by side distance”

and assumed you were refering to SG targets. I think you are wondering about target spacing for rifle and pistol targets?

  Yes side by side meaning edge to edge of rifle and pistol targets.

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1 minute ago, Texas jack Black SASS#9362 said:

  Yes side by side meaning edge to edge of rifle and pistol targets.

Thank you for clarifying for folks

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The way our target stands are made there is about 18" between the normal targets, pistol targets are shorter and in front or rifle.  I mix them up for our one stage with the knock down rack, sometimes using knock downs with pistol and sometimes rifle.

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A minimum of twelve inches from target edge to target edge with 18" targets set at 7 yds. for pistol and usually double that for 21" targets set at 14 to 15 yards

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At least ½"!   The largest caliber we can use is .45... so ½ oughta work... no?

 

Okay, Okay... I know...

 

There's often target wobble when clanged with those heavy, slow movin' bullets... so maybe it needs to be at least ¾"  But no more... really!!  :ph34r:

 

Personally, it seems as tho' we spend at least 100 times the time and effort to analyse every aspect of this game than we do shooting!   A hit on the wrong target in a sequence is either a "P" or it's a hit.... squabblin' about "how much" space needs to be between targets for a "clear miss"... is begging for someone to end up asking... hey it was less than ½ the required distance between targets for a "clear miss"... shouldn't that be counted as a HIT?

 

Unintended consequences... remember those?   Show up, pay the entry fee... shoot, don't hurt anyone, have fun... isn't that the POINT of this whole thing?

 

 

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I'm sure you've seen it, but just in case, I'll suggest you look at the SASS Match Design Manual.  I don't recall it giving target separation distances, but it does provide guides for shooting distances.  It also pretty clearly explains the rationale for properly separating plates. 

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15 minutes ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

I'm sure you've seen it, but just in case, I'll suggest you look at the SASS Match Design Manual.  I don't recall it giving target separation distances, but it does provide guides for shooting distances.  It also pretty clearly explains the rationale for properly separating plates. 

Guidelines that aren't even used at their (SASS), match.

 

Throw the suggested distances out the window!!!

 

Phantom

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As close as an inch, as far apart as 15 yards. It varies. Which is a plus. Shooting the same array over and over gets old quick. 

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Doc Shapiro said:

As close as an inch, as far apart as 15 yards. It varies. Which is a plus. Shooting the same array over and over gets old quick. 

X100. I personally get bored at matches where the targets are set the same. Some are close, some are far some are a few inches apart and some are all across the bay. 

 

If the targets are big enough I'll even share R/P out to 10 yards or so. Don't get caught up into 5 yard pistol/ 8 yard rifle all in a pretty row...…...that's fun for a stage but it's boring as a match. 

Edited by Cowboy Junky
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With some of the current stand and deliver matches I've seen it appears the targets are all at the same level and close to touching on the sides.

We are fortunate our range has large bays and varying height stands. Spread them out and stagger the stands. Bad guys didn't stand in line and they weren't all the same height.

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11 minutes ago, Assassin said:

With some of the current stand and deliver matches I've seen it appears the targets are all at the same level and close to touching on the sides.

We are fortunate our range has large bays and varying height stands. Spread them out and stagger the stands. Bad guys didn't stand in line and they weren't all the same height.

Hell, I'm still trying to catch my breath from your match last weekend:o

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15 minutes ago, Assassin said:

With some of the current stand and deliver matches I've seen it appears the targets are all at the same level and close to touching on the sides.

We are fortunate our range has large bays and varying height stands. Spread them out and stagger the stands. Bad guys didn't stand in line and they weren't all the same height.

 

Apparently I need to travel out west so I can shoot some of these stand and deliver matches some of y'all talk about; they don't seem to exist in the TN, KY, AL, GA area.

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1 minute ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Hell, I'm still trying to catch my breath from your match last weekend:o

I'll have oxygen available at HOW. :lol:Your younger than me, back when I was your age I could..........................................................

You and I need to get together and set up a match.

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Tyrel Cody said:

 

Apparently I need to travel out west so I can shoot some of these stand and deliver matches some of y'all talk about; they don't seem to exist in the TN, KY, AL, GA area.

Just saw the videos from the Alabama state match, not picking on their match. There was very little movement. If that's what they like good for them, I know not all ranges allow for maximum movement. 

Edited by Assassin

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Tyrel, come on out to Hell On Wheels and check out my stand and deliver stages. 

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, Assassin said:

Just saw the videos from the Alabama state match, not picking on their match. There was very little movement. If that's what they like good for them, I know not all range allow for maximum movement. 

I missed that one, but I did shoot KY state and although there was no down range movement, their was horizontal movement on every stage. TN State is usually a mix of downrange, horizontal and a couple of stand and deliver. Fire 'n Fallback about ran us to death at his Iron Cowboy match, and that is not meant as a complaint; I love Cowboy ACTION Shooting :D

 

 

3 minutes ago, Assassin said:

Tyrel, come on out to Hell On Wheels and check out my stand and deliver stages. 

One of these years I will; kids in school keep us tied up quite a bit. Both play sports and the dead period is only 2 weeks in the summer.

Edited by Tyrel Cody
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1 hour ago, Assassin said:

With some of the current stand and deliver matches I've seen it appears the targets are all at the same level and close to touching on the sides.

We are fortunate our range has large bays and varying height stands. Spread them out and stagger the stands. Bad guys didn't stand in line and they weren't all the same height.

And maybe even have, oh I don't know, a NO-Shoot target. "What did he say?" Oh the horror! A target in front of another that you're not supposed to shoot? How could this be? Like bad guys never took hostages? And a plate rack was mentioned; not the horizontal plate rack, but the one-behind-another rack. You know if you lean to the side just a little, the plates are all overlapping!

For our monthlies, I usually have two stages with no movement, two with one move and two with two moves... but not always. Never more than two stand and deliver stages; they're fun but get old. And I don't want the same old, that's why I started writing stages in the first place.

If you have targets that overlap, just shoot the right one at the right time. I don't make it a habit to set them up this way, but what do they say about variety?

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I hate stand and deliver stages. I always write stages so that there is at least one movement side to side. We don't yet have the right kind of stands, etc. to stage empty guns for downrange movement, so I make it side to side. My pistol targets are generally set at 7(ish) yards with about six inches between them and my rifle targets are generally set at 10 to 12 yards with the same spacing between targets. We have a few short stands and a couple of tall stands so I also have been known to include various heights in my target setups as well as setting them at different distances within a set of targets.

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19 minutes ago, Charlie MacNeil, SASS #48580 said:

I hate stand and deliver stages. I always write stages so that there is at least one movement side to side. We don't yet have the right kind of stands, etc. to stage empty guns for downrange movement, so I make it side to side. My pistol targets are generally set at 7(ish) yards with about six inches between them and my rifle targets are generally set at 10 to 12 yards with the same spacing between targets. We have a few short stands and a couple of tall stands so I also have been known to include various heights in my target setups as well as setting them at different distances within a set of targets.

You could angle the long gun rests to the side (so yer not sweepin yerself) and use a hay bale for a forward stopping point and gun rest, if need be. Just an idea.

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A hay bale wouldn't survive at our range; too many bunnies gamboling about and no place to store it indoors. 

 

We could do something with some of our tables though...

 

Thanks for the reminder!

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We just get one or two for the match and chuck em. We also use a low table in front and if going with SG last, just bring it forward so you won't have to shoot over it.

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Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, Phantom, SASS #54973 said:

Guidelines that aren't even used at their (SASS), match.

 

Throw the suggested distances out the window

Then we ought to get them the hell out of the SASS manual series.  What's the point of a mis-guide series? 

Edited by Dusty Devil Dale

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6 minutes ago, Dusty Devil Dale said:

Then we ought to get them the hell out of the SASS manual series.  What's the point of a mis-guide series? 

The originator of those "suggestions" wishes he never put them in...but back in the day, folks starting up a new club had no idea what a CAS stage should look like ...so they went in...kind of like a starting point for the new club.

 

In today's world, they are not needed. All those "Suggestions" do is muddy the water. Folks think that they are requirements/rules/whatever...

 

Phantom

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Back when we were shooting smaller targets they were not as close together. Seldom was there an issue with hitting the wrong targets. 

Now with the larger targets and close distances there's less room to spread the targets. 

 

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Like target distance I like to vary movement as well...….I get tried of both...…..lol. Some are S&D, some L&R, some are forward, some are long and some are short...….IMO it just makes a more well rounded match when you have a little bit of everything. 

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On 5/22/2019 at 9:02 AM, Assassin said:

Just saw the videos from the Alabama state match, not picking on their match. There was very little movement. If that's what they like good for them, I know not all ranges allow for maximum movement. 

I assume that you saw the same videos that I saw which are all shot from the stages with the least amount of movement. Those same stages also happen to be the most open on the sides and therefore provide the best opportunity to video. We do have a common firing line on nine of ten stages and the stages are not really wide. The stages shot from multiple locations are typically through openings which do not make for good videos or else are shot in areas that are too narrow for a videographer to move with shooter without interfering with the shooter, TO, and/or spotters. While we try not to run our shooters to death, we are fans of movement and are in the process of building more tables in order to have more locations on some of the narrow stages. 

 

Here's a breakdown of the total match:

 

Stage 1: Start at one position and shoot at three others.

 

Stage 2: Starting position moving to a stand and deliver. - the location of some of the videos. 

 

Stage 3: Start at one position and shoot at three others.

 

Stage 4: Shot from two positions. 

 

Stage 5: A true stand and deliver - the location of some of the videos. 

 

Stage 6: Start at one position and shoot at four others.

 

Stage 7: Starting position plus one other. - the location of some of the videos. 

 

Stage 8: Shot from three positions with 15 yards of movement.

 

Stage 9: Shot from two positions with some fairly serious movement between the two. 

 

Stage 10: Shot from two or more positions with 15 yards of movement. - I did see one video from this stage.

 

 

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Since I shoot a Propellant that contributes copious amounts of target obscure-a, I like about 5 feet lateral dispersion.  Shotgun same same.  I prefer lots of movement even though it tough on an old guy.  Progressively moving forward is huge fun.  STAND AND DELIVER is a lot like kissing yer sister.  I really like contributions from new folks who obviously already know it all.  Enabling that is.  

 

Since we're not gonna go with 5 feet ...... PLUS ONE to GRIFF!!  You betcha. 

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