Randingo Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 A few months ago I purchased a Pietta 1860 from Cabelas. I love the darn thing!! Would like to try shooting Frontiersman. But have a few questions . I am not a speed demon and have no chance of ever beating Matt Black. I like the feel of a hefty pistol with a longer barrel. With that said: I would like a reliable pistol that I can work on and learn to maintain on my own. I was thinking of the Colt Walker. Yes, huge and heavy but dam, I like em!! Would I be making a mistake? What do you all shoot and why? Thanks!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 I had a set of Walkers for awhile, but, damn... are they ever heavy. I made the belt out of a weightlifter's belt I found on eBay, as it had enough surface area to keep it from sliding down. As a rule, I don't sell guns, but I finally let 'em go four or five years ago. I like 1851's,1860's and ROA's when I'm shooting C&B's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diamond Curly SASS#57086 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 I like shooting a Walker and the cool factor is very high. The one I shoot I had a leather strap made to stop the loading lever drop often after firing a chamber. The dragoon is not much smaller and the loading lever stays in place. Once you get some cleaning up done and better nipple installed they all are great to shoot. Check with some local C&B shooters and they can suggest individuals locally to help keep your cap gus up and run in once they have been tuned. DC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Look for used Ruger Old Armys. They use 20th century firearms technology instead of 19th century technology. They are probably lighter than Colt Walker replicas and are very reliable. I can't imagine Matt Black shooting Colt Walkers in a major match. To use a train analogy, Matt Black drives bullet trains and not heavy, steam powered locomotives. I shoot ROAs locally in the Frontier Cartridge category. At major matches I shoot Ruger Old Model Vaqueros in the main match and Remington 1858 revolvers in Plainsmans side matches. (I don't shoot the Frontiermans category due to arthritis in my hands.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Here's a mod you can do, squaring the loading lever spring detent slightly to make it stay up. But don't overdo it, like this guy did the first time, or you can't get it down again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Henry Quick Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 I shoot the Pietta 1851 Navy revolvers in .44 - an ahistorical caliber, but they feel good and really ring the steel. I have a so-called "Sheriff Model" for goofing around with, but I shoot the 7-1/2" barrels in matches because the extra weight up front makes them feel more steady to me. The beauty of these guns is that Cabelas has a sale on them 4 or 5 times a year and you can get them for less than $200 - that's two guns for less than the price of a Walker. Also, speaking of ahistoric, I've read that Walkers were carried in holsters attached to a saddle because they are two heavy for practical carry, thus the term "horse-pistol." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 I like the Colt-Pattern pistols the best. I have a half dozen or so 1851s & a bunch of 1860s in barrel lengths from 3" - 12" Dragoons and walkers are too big for me, now that I'm old -- don't have the arm/shoulder strength to shoot them anymore I like ROAs, and have quite a few of them. My favorite way of shooting is Cap Gun GunFighter with my 3" snubbie 1860s -- Nuthin more fun than that. --Dawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randingo Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 3 hours ago, John Henry Quick said: I shoot the Pietta 1851 Navy revolvers in .44 - an ahistorical caliber, but they feel good and really ring the steel. I have a so-called "Sheriff Model" for goofing around with, but I shoot the 7-1/2" barrels in matches because the extra weight up front makes them feel more steady to me. The beauty of these guns is that Cabelas has a sale on them 4 or 5 times a year and you can get them for less than $200 - that's two guns for less than the price of a Walker. Also, speaking of ahistoric, I've read that Walkers were carried in holsters attached to a saddle because they are two heavy for practical carry, thus the term "horse-pistol." I like the 1860 for the same reasons. I will most likely purchase a Walker to test it out my self. Have never handled a ROA but plan to check them out as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Walkers will get you lots of style points, but man are they heavy! I picked one up at a pawn shop for $150, its fun to shoot every once in a while. For plainsman I use Pietta 1858 Remingtons. Everybody says the Ruger ROAs are better, and they probably are, but for a 3 stage plainsman match 3-4 times a year the Remmies do me fine. If I was going to shoot frontiersman I would have to have enough cylinders to just load 12 up the night before the match. I did get a Polish Capper, and they work very well. you can find them on the SASS merchants page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin' Dave Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 I have enough extra cylinders for my 51s and 60s that I load all the night before. Once a stage is over I can remove used cylinder, wipe down arbor and replace with a fresh cylinder within a couple of minutes. If you watch Cabela's you can catch the revolvers on sale that come with an extra cylinder. 51s and 60s will use the same cylinders. Frontiersman is Alot of fun. If I could give one piece of advice it would be to devote the entire year to shootin' this category. That helped me to learn and understand my guns. Have fun..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jailhouse Jim, SASS #13104 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 The Walkers or Dragoons have that cool factor but are a workout do to size and weight. I personally run Pietta .36 caliber '51 Navies with 4.75" barrels for Frontiersman and Frontier Cartridge Gunfighter. I load on the gun with a Slix hand on the short rammers. They have been worked over by Rowdy Yates who added the Manhattan mods and have Slix shot/Treso nipples. The .36s get called for misses unfairly because they don't ring dead steel but are plenty adequate for knockdowns as long as you hit the upper half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.D. Daily Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 13 hours ago, Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 said: Look for used Ruger Old Armys. They use 20th century firearms technology instead of 19th century technology. They are probably lighter than Colt Walker replicas and are very reliable. I can't imagine Matt Black shooting Colt Walkers in a major match. To use a train analogy, Matt Black drives bullet trains and not heavy, steam powered locomotives. I shoot ROAs locally in the Frontier Cartridge category. At major matches I shoot Ruger Old Model Vaqueros in the main match and Remington 1858 revolvers in Plainsmans side matches. (I don't shoot the Frontiermans category due to arthritis in my hands.) The cost of used ROA's are almost as much as dealer quotes for new distributor special ROA's from Davidson's. Gun Genie quick quotes from Pueblo area dealers of $913- $1,107. They are available in blued & SS with 5.5" & 7.5" barrels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randingo Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 Like the idea of having extra cylinders loaded and ready. Cabelas has all there PW pistols on sale now. No extra cylinders though. May run up there this weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 29 minutes ago, Jailhouse Jim, SASS #13104 said: The .36s get called for misses unfairly because they don't ring dead steel but are plenty adequate for knockdowns as long as you hit the upper half. That's why I shoot mostly 44s!!! While I have 3 Colt 2nd generation 51 Navies, and several other .36s, I rarely shoot them for the very reason stated by JJ. --Dawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 8 minutes ago, Randingo said: Like the idea of having extra cylinders loaded and ready. Cabelas has all there PW pistols on sale now. No extra cylinders though. May run up there this weekend. Remember that you have to buy Treso or Slix nipples for them, and then you have tons of cleaning at the end of the day. I went that route once a long time ago. For me, I found it a better solution to get a Powder Inc cylinder loader I can wipe off fouling & reload my guns, while watching the unloading table, in about 4 shooters --Dawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randingo Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 said: Remember that you have to buy Treso or Slix nipples for them, and then you have tons of cleaning at the end of the day. I went that route once a long time ago. For me, I found it a better solution to get a Powder Inc cylinder loader I can wipe off fouling & reload my guns, while watching the unloading table, in about 4 shooters --Dawg What is the issue with the nipples that come with the gun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Randingo said: What is the issue with the nipples that come with the gun? They suck! They do not fit the caps properly & will give you fits. Treso & Slix nipples were specifically made for Remington #10 caps. If you replace your stock nipples with Treso/Slix and always use Remington #10s, all ignition problems will go away. I cannot stress how important this is if you wish to have a reliable cap gun. Also, all caps labeled #10 are not the same. There is no industry standard. Read this Cap Primer: http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=9093.0 --Dawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randingo Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 A lot to learn about these guns. Thanks!! Any hints, tips or info is greatly appreciated!! Guess I'll order me some nipples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Just remember that after you shoot you have to clean all those extra cylinders. Including removing and reinstalling 72 nipples P Dawg beat me to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 53 minutes ago, Jailhouse Jim, SASS #13104 said: They have been worked over by Rowdy Yates who added the Manhattan mods and have Slix shot/Treso nipples Yep, all my competition cap guns have either cap guards (Rowdy did several) or cap rakes & Treso or Slix nipples. Not that I'm super fast, in fact, "slow as molasses in winter" and "He could be timer with a sundial" have been said about me. But I do like smooth & reliable guns, so that is why I had it done --Dawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, Sedalia Dave said: Including removing and reinstalling 72 nipples I don't remove the nipples every time I clean. A toothbrush does a good job on the outside, & a pipe cleaner & nipple pick do a good job on the inside. I take 'em off aver few years or so, clean up the threads, re-coat with anti-sieze, and put them back in. But no need to remove them each time. --Dawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Remember, Frontiersman is shot duelist style. I shot an entire match once with a borrowed Dragoon and my 1860 Colt. By the last stage (5th) I was having a hard time holding the thing up and cocking the hammer. They're fun to play with occasionally, but I wouldn't recommend them for regular matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lead Monger Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 Get yourself another Pietta 1860 Army while their on sale. Install Slix nipples on both and polish the hammer nose so they will not pull the fired caps off the nipples. Do not install lighter hammer springs but wire bolt/trigger spring may be used. With practice, you can learn to load on the gun quite quickly so no real need for extra cylinders. A loading stand can be helpful as it will free up your hands. Only use Remongton #10 caps and seat them carefully with a wooden dowel. I run my guns well lubed and never suffer from binding or dragging cylinder rotation. I am a big fan of olive oil, beeswax and lard or crisco where black powder is involved. Lots of folks have terrific luck with Mobile 1 oil and grease. I also lube "over the ball" while lots of folks use wads under the ball. What ever works is fine. When the guns are running right you can't help but have fun. Your hooked! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randingo Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 As I am new to this, the idea of a second 1860 is most likely best. Will get the nipples as suggested and then just give it try. All the "Fixing" must come later. I do look forward to ringing steel with em!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Of all the "fixes", the aftermarket nipples are by far the most important. If you do nothing else, this will improve things dramatically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Be sure to coat the threads with anti-seize before you install the new nipples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 I shoot .36 cal 1851s, Colt's 2nd Gen with a backup pair. I can usually get thru a 12 stage match with just a wipe down between day 1 & 2. While I have been "dinged" for a miss here or there (10 in one stage once), I don't let a trifling thing like misses interfere with MY FUN! I had my .36s set up with Ruger hand springs, (coil), cap gates (commonly referred to as the "Manhattan Conversion), and filled the notch in the hammers. Been shooting these style guns in competition since 1986, and if something can go wrong, it's probably happened to me. All except a chain fire. I use lubed wads over the powder and under the ball. I make sure I get round balls that cut a little ring of lead as they're pressed into the chamber. I have an extra set of cylinders, but don't use them for match use. I tried, but dismantling the guns between stages seems like extra work I don't need. I just use a stand to load on. Quick, simple and easily accomplished at either the cart, or the unloading table while I watch that competitors after me clear their guns... seldom more than two or three. A snail capper is what I generally use at the loading table... tho' I have used a stick type and just stuck it in a pocket in case I need a reload. I once tried to use my snail capper as a watch fob, but... soon found out that having it tied to the chain was a little "restricting"! Enjoy your foray into the the most grown-up category! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 21 hours ago, Randingo said: As I am new to this, the idea of a second 1860 is most likely best. Will get the nipples as suggested and then just give it try. All the "Fixing" must come later. I do look forward to ringing steel with em!!!! If you end up with a Pietta, one thing you must do in addition to replacing the nipples is shape the cylinder stop bolt to fit the notches in the cylinder. From the factory, the bolt is too wide for the notches which results in peening the edges every time you cock the hammer. If left unaddressed, the cylinder will be ruined in relatively short order. It's easy to do and is described in Larsen E. Pettifogger's tutorial. Piettas -- http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=5659.0 Ubertis -- http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=7988.0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randingo Posted January 17, 2018 Author Share Posted January 17, 2018 Yes, I saw that. Tried to sign up for the Open range forum but new member registration is disabled. I will eventually tear into them for now I will be careful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Randingo, I saved them as pdfs several years ago. If you PM me with an email address, I can send them to you as an attachment. It's possible, but unlikely that the bolt in a Pietta will fit. I can't stress enough that this needs to be addressed immediately. "Being careful for now" has nothing to do with it. I bought a new pair a couple of years ago and the peening began the very first time I cocked the hammer. If you end up with an Uberti, you'll have the arbor issue. Based on the experience I've had with my Uberti '72 Open Tops, addressing that isn't as urgent, but it does take more effort to remedy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prairie Dawg, SASS #50329 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 The Open Range has been shut down for a few years. It is reference only now -- no signing up. Thanks to Hedley Lamar for keeping it up as a reference for us black powder shooters. John Boy too -- I don't know if he is part of the OR team, but he sure is a big part of the Open Range information highway. There's lots of great information on there! --Dawg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randingo Posted January 17, 2018 Author Share Posted January 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Abilene Slim SASS 81783 said: Randingo, I saved them as pdfs several years ago. If you PM me with an email address, I can send them to you as an attachment. It's possible, but unlikely that the bolt in a Pietta will fit. I can't stress enough that this needs to be addressed immediately. "Being careful for now" has nothing to do with it. I bought a new pair a couple of years ago and the peening began the very first time I cocked the hammer. If you end up with an Uberti, you'll have the arbor issue. Based on the experience I've had with my Uberti '72 Open Tops, addressing that isn't as urgent, but it does take more effort to remedy. Will do. Guess I better get fixin then. Thanks!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Dude, SASS # 51223 Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 The very best way to clean your dirty nipples; With a dental, in-between brush. Find them at your local Drug Store. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Henry Quick Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 39 minutes ago, Lefty Dude, SASS # 51223 said: The very best way to clean your dirty nipples; Brother, you're gettin' WAY too personal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Hangtree Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 27 minutes ago, John Henry Quick said: Brother, you're gettin' WAY too personal! I was afraid to finish reading his post for a moment! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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