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Rancho Roy

SKB / Ithaca help needed

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I recently bought a beautiful Ithaca 100, 12g shotgun for my wife. Today I finally got to the range to shoot it. 

 

Everything went fine except when I try to open it, the firing pins don't retract so it is very difficult. You need to "break" it on your knee to get it to open.

 

Once the action is opened about an 1/8", you can see the pins retract.

 

Before I tear into it, anything I should be looking for?

 

Thanks

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If you have to ask "what to look for" DON'T!

Send it to a qualified gunsmith. Parts for it are too hard to find and It's too nice a gun to screw up. JMHO.

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You don't know me very well..........Most of the fun I get out of this sport is gunsmithing. The only gun I won't mess with is the 1897 and only because I don't have the time. And it has 101 parts...my limit is guns with 100 or less parts!  :P

 

I'm sure I could figure this out without any damage but I figured I'd see if there was a "helpful hint" from the peanut gallery.....

 

Some of the gun projects I've done:

 

http://rvbprecision.com/firearms

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Call Johnny Meadows or Goatneck  Clem for help.

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57 minutes ago, Beartrap SASS#57175 said:

If you have to ask "what to look for" DON'T!

Send it to a qualified gunsmith. Parts for it are too hard to find and It's too nice a gun to screw up. JMHO.

You can get SKB parts at 

SKB Shotguns Omaha NE.

http://www.skbshotguns.com

 

I ordered parts for my 100 and came in a few days and even sent me a new catalogue.

They even have an exploded schematic of the shotgun.

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My old 100 did the same because the firing pin tips were peened from use, too big to slide back out of the primer after ignition. If you can, post a close up photo of the firing pins and the impressions they make in the primer.  I was able to smooth out the firing pins and resolved the problem.  But taking one of those apart is scary!!

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I too had one that the firing pins stuck in the primers. A little polishing by a qualified gunsmith fixed her right up.

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This shot gun is brand new. Firing pins are not hanging up. Nice and round and move freely.

I took the whole receiver apart and it is a timing issue. If I put a thin shim under the cocking levers to engage the hammers a split second sooner when opening, everything works fine.

now I just need to figure out the best way to attack this issue

The forend is serial numbered to the receiver. So a switched forend iscruled out.

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Thought you might like to see the little jig I made to depress the hammer springs

IMG_2413.JPG

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Try different shells, mine did the same thing with a box of feather lights, tried reloads worked fine, tried a different box of feather lights worked fine, so you might try that

 

AO

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Interesting....I was using Featherweights........I’ll try others but this will create another issue as the shotgun is for my recoil sensitive wife.

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RB .... It sounds like you may need to weld some material to the cocking levers to shim them up....

Its not a common problem with SKB's ....

Many cheaper SxS 's yes, but on SKB's its rare, especially one as clean as you described.

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The problem with increasing the area on the cocking levers is that the forend doesn’t fit any longer because the cocking levers are now too close to the barrel.

 You’d have to see it to understand what I mean. 

 Strange issue

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unscrew that auto safety connector in the pic & throw it in the trash, You dont need that for CAS !

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2 minutes ago, Roy B said:

Interesting....I was using Featherweights........I’ll try others but this will create another issue as the shotgun is for my recoil sensitive wife.

Friend can not use factory WW but reloads with WW primers is OK     GW

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Quote

unscrew that auto safety connector in the pic & throw it in the trash, You dont need that for CAS !

 

It’s  on the ToDo list. Got to get it to open easily first.

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12 minutes ago, Roy B said:

The problem with increasing the area on the cocking levers is that the forend doesn’t fit any longer because the cocking levers are now too close to the barrel.

 You’d have to see it to understand what I mean. 

 Strange issue

 

Not on the bottom of the cocking levers.... on the top.

If its doing as you described, the there would be a space between the levers and the hammers that will need to be shimmed.

IF there is no slop there, then your problem is somewhere else and then Yes shimmed levers would indeed interfere with both the bottom plate and the forearm

 

 

 

 

 

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Understood.....that is where I put the shims for the test. There is still plenty of room under the bottom plate. 

 

But the shims hits cause issues with forearm fit.

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I would peen the lever's sides where you want contact to 'grow' just a bit, and see what that doez....

OLG

 

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Just now, Roy B said:

Understood.....that is where I put the shims for the test. There is still plenty of room under the bottom plate. 

 

But the shims hits cause issues with forearm fit.

Then if there is zero gap between the cocking levers and the forearm on one end

and zero gap between the cocking levers and the hammers on the other end.......

What you're describing as your problem cant happen.

 

So Yes, I guess I would Have to see whats going on to understand it.

 

Good Luck Pard !!!!!!!!

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I should have said ..NOS....new old stock...they haven’t made these in years. I was lucky enough to find one in this condition.  

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OK - I understand SKB is now making some shotguns in Turkey; not sure which ones. They advertise trap guns.

 

Just looked at their website. They do make SXS's. Lowest price starts at $2500, upper model $6500. Don't guess we will see many of them in CAS.

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Factory Winchester AA primers are very soft. Look at fired ones. They flatten out and try to grab the firing pins. The Winchester reload primers are harder and don't flatten as much. I have a BSS that does the same thing. Winchester reload primers or factory Remington STS work fine but it will hang up on factory AAs

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17 hours ago, Roy B said:

I recently bought a beautiful Ithaca 100, 12g shotgun for my wife. Today I finally got to the range to shoot it. 

 

Everything went fine except when I try to open it, the firing pins don't retract so it is very difficult. You need to "break" it on your knee to get it to open.

 

Once the action is opened about an 1/8", you can see the pins retract.

 

Before I tear into it, anything I should be looking for?

 

Thanks

 

When reading your very first post I assumed, the gun opens easily with out shells when the hammers are down but not with shells in it. Can you clarify... is it hard to break open every time, loaded or unloaded, hammers cocked or uncocked?

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Ok....this comes under the title of ...”Duh!”

 

today at the club club shoot I was using my SKB shotgun and realized that the firing p8ns on my gun don’t retract.....EXACTLY like my wife’s new Ithaca!

 

i then checked another SKB and same thing. The firing pins are extended until the action is opened a good 1/8 to 3/16”.......

 

i think the the issue with her gun is the hammer springs are much stronger than on my shotgun and simply don’t allow the firing pins to be pushed back when the action is opened.

 

learn something new every day!

 

Tomorrow I’m going to swap hammer springs and see what happens.....fun stuff!

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Btw....easy to open with no fired shells in chamber.

 

hard to open once fired with fired shells in chambers.

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14 hours ago, Roy B said:

.easy to open with no fired shells in chamber.

hard to open once fired with fired shells in chambers.

 

Firing pins sticking in the primers.  Look at a fired hull that you had to get out by breaking action of your knee, and you probably will find the primer cup is not just normally dented, it will almost be mangled, wallowed out in one direction where the firing pin tried to hold onto the primer as the action was opened.

 

Good luck, GJ

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Thanks....firing pin hits look exactly like on the properly working SKB. I don’t think the issue is with primers or firing pin shape.

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4 hours ago, Roy B said:

Thanks....firing pin hits look exactly like on the properly working SKB. I don’t think the issue is with primers or firing pin shape.

 

So did you try some Remington STS's? I would think it was worth $8.00 or so to rule out the primer/shell issue.

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Rainy Sunday...good day to play with guns in the shop. Took the Ithaca totally apart again........relieved the hammer springs. Gun now opens much easier.

 

will test tomorrow with live ammo....

 

 

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Cocking levers.   Tig weld or braze material to the front and retime.   As SOON as the breach is starting to open the firing pins should start retracting.  You'll know if there's too much material when you feel it slap the fore end.  5-10 thousandths usually is all that is needed.  This is assuming your mating surface on the fore arm is good. 

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Thanks Jay, but I was able to look at two other SKB shotguns and both had the firing pins not retracting until the action was opened about a 1/16-1/8".

It appears the design is fine for field hunting where you really don't need the shotgun to just drop open for a couple follow-up shots like you do ion our sport. 

 

If you open the gun manually, you wouldn't even notice that there is an issue. When you want it to drop open by simply pushing the action lever, that is where the design shows it needs tuning.

 

I tried shims and no mater where I placed them, the forend could not be reinstalled. Those Japanese gunmakers work in very close tolerances.

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