The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 BEFORE meet with SoD...... WTH http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=marines+told+to+disarm&source=newssearch&cd=1&ved=0CC8QqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fsecurity.blogs.cnn.com%2F2012%2F03%2F14%2Fmarines-told-to-disarm-before-panetta-speech%2F&ei=iu1gT9-2ELCDsALJ5pGXCA&usg=AFQjCNGanmaCInX6QVnanxF9aGQY-GJ52A Just don't understand it.... LG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Very strange. Perhaps he thinks there might be another Maj Nadal in hiding. Basically this looks like an insult to Marines. Or any member of our armed services. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noz Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Nothing strange about it. the same type of crap that went on at the end of Vietnam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Harley, #14153 Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Seems to me that somebody did a risk/reward analysis, but came up with the wrong answer. Risks of have the SecDef speak to a bunch of armed Marines... 1. One of them has a screw loose and does a Hasan on the SecDef. Mitigation Strategy: Profile the potential problem and put him on KP, fire watch, or some other duty that will occupy him during the visit. Probability of Risk: Less than 1%. Risks of having the SecDef speak to a bunch of disarmed Marines... 1. A few thousand of our nation's finest hear the message, "We don't trust you." 2. The entire command and leadership structure hears, "Panetta's life is more important than yours." Mitigation Strategy: None. You can't fool a soldier/Marine/airman/sailor. Probability of Risk: 100%. No way around it. The damage is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Smokepole #29248L Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 What I have to say about the SoD is not printable here..... COWARD! If you are that afraid, keep your sorry ass in D.C. with the other politicians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Old Man Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I agree SS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I agree SS. Yeah, it's sad when you can't trust your own.... GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seldom Seen #16162 Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I would imagine that things are very tense right now between the Afgans and Americans. Disfusing the mistrust and anger between the two groups is going to be very difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Knee jerk reaction by General "There's a new sheriff in town" Mark Gurganus. Dumbass. He just sent a message to the troops. And not a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Curtis LeMay visited Cam Rahn Bay when I was there He was running for VP with someone...don't recall who... and we'd just come in from a convoy, dirty, tired and armed to the teeth, when the Secret Service guys told us to disarm LeMay came over and told them "Good God, these guys are on our side. Leave them be.", He got my vote, but I still don't remember who he was running with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted March 14, 2012 Author Share Posted March 14, 2012 Hav'n a son who is a "former' Marine I KNOW FOR FACT that there wouldn't be any place safer, anywhere, than being with a pack of armed Marines. WHO EVER told'm to "disarm" is a total fool Or worst....... Respectfully, LG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Curtis LeMay visited Cam Rahn Bay when I was there He was running for VP with someone...don't recall who... and we'd just come in from a convoy, dirty, tired and armed to the teeth, when the Secret Service guys told us to disarm LeMay came over and told them "Good God, these guys are on our side. Leave them be.", He got my vote, but I still don't remember who he was running with. George Wallace, who was running under the American Independent Party (1968) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Hand Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 The current PC answer is, there were Afgan troops there that had been disarmed, so the OIC felt it would be an insult to them if the Marines got to keep their weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 George Wallace, who was running under the American Independent Party (1968) That's the guy. Didn't he end up getting shot anyway? I don't think LeMay could have been shot. That brief encounter and the way he talked to the SS guys made me think he was bulletproof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S. Quentin Quale, Esq. SASS 9953 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Knee jerk reaction by General "There's a new sheriff in town" Mark Gurganus. Dumbass. He just sent a message to the troops. And not a good one. I suspect he's the kind of general who has to soak his socks in kerosene every night. He then puts them on in the a.m. The kerosene will keep the ants from crawling up his legs to get to his candy ass. God Save Us from political generals. SQQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apache Hawk 60642 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 HELL NO ! I WILL NOT DISARM ! :FlagAm: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Woodrow Cahill, SASS # 54363 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 The current PC answer is, there were Afgan troops there that had been disarmed, so the OIC felt it would be an insult to them if the Marines got to keep their weapons. Well, there's the official explanation, and then somewhere out there is the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Scatterbrain Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Similar incidents occurred during the Clinton administration. I was witness to a couple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Smokepole #29248L Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Yeah, it's sad when you can't trust your own.... GG ~ Or if you no longer have a pair of gonads ... The current PC answer is, there were Afgan troops there that had been disarmed, so the OIC felt it would be an insult to them if the Marines got to keep their weapons. So, insult your own troops because you are afraid of the Afghans?????? How PC.... I suspect he's the kind of general who has to soak his socks in kerosene every night. He then puts them on in the a.m. The kerosene will keep the ants from crawling up his legs to get to his candy ass. God Save Us from political generals. SQQ Not many non political Generals around anymore. They are ALL looking for "Just one more star before retirement"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.D.Ironsmith Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Pathetic!... My first thought is Fort Hood... A large contingent of unarmed U.S. troops assaulted by a radical, who knew they would be unarmed... This is compounded when in a war zone,where it is known hostiles will exploit every opportunity. So, while the troops were disarmed to protect public relations... who was protecting them?!!! My next thought is politics have no place in a war zone!... If the Afghan soldiers were not trustworthy to be armed (and I would have to say, from what I have heard, they would not be in that situation) so be it. Don't compromise the safety of our boys to gain political advantage! Read something like this and just have to wonder where the leadership of this Country is taking us... Pathetic... I am truly disgusted! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 That's the guy. Didn't he end up getting shot anyway? I don't think LeMay could have been shot. That brief encounter and the way he talked to the SS guys made me think he was bulletproof. Yeah, George got shot in '72 during his fourth run for Pres. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mo Hare, SASS #45984 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 From Wikipedia: Robert McNamara described LeMay's character, in a discussion of a report into high abort rates in bomber missions during World War II: One of the commanders was Curtis LeMay—Colonel in command of a B-24 group. He was the finest combat commander of any service I came across in war. But he was extraordinarily belligerent, many thought brutal. He got the report. He issued an order. He said, 'I will be in the lead plane on every mission. Any plane that takes off will go over the target, or the crew will be court-martialed.' The abort rate dropped overnight. Now that's the kind of commander he was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chantry Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 What I have to say about the SoD is not printable here..... COWARD! If you are that afraid, keep your sorry ass in D.C. with the other politicians. You are presuming it was the SoD who gave the order and not some general or colonel. Given the current adminstration and who he has to take orders from, Panetta has not been nearly the disaster I expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt. C.J. Sabre, SASS #46770 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 From Wikipedia: One of the commanders was Curtis LeMay—Colonel in command of a B-24 group. He was the finest combat commander of any service I came across in war. But he was extraordinarily belligerent, many thought brutal. He got the report. He issued an order. He said, 'I will be in the lead plane on every mission. Any plane that takes off will go over the target, or the crew will be court-martialed.' The abort rate dropped overnight. Now that's the kind of commander he was. Now THAT'S Leadership! Something that is vastly lacking today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seldom Seen #16162 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I know! I know! It's all George Bushes fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 From Congressman West: Having served in several combat zones, I know the proper procedure and it is called clearing your weapon. No one should ever be separated from their individual weapon in a combat zone, ever! The routine practice is to eject the ammunition magazine, place in your thigh cargo pocket, and clear the chamber of ammunition. This is inspected by first line supervisor or battle buddy. This is a regular standard for entering combat zone mess halls and common areas. If the Secretary of Defense cannot trust the Men and Women sent into combat, then perhaps he should not send them or not be the Secretary of Defense. However, this is not surprising since graduating Midshipmen at the US Naval Academy were told they could not have their ceremonial swords, due to President Obama addressing them. This happened in 2009...it was the first time ever in the history of the US Naval Academy. GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 However, this is not surprising since graduating Midshipmen at the US Naval Academy were told they could not have their ceremonial swords, due to President Obama addressing them. This happened in 2009...it was the first time ever in the history of the US Naval Academy. Yet another internet myth. And I doubt Congressman West ever said it. Snopes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Yet another internet myth. And I doubt Congressman West ever said it. Snopes It came straight from his official FB page. For those with FB: http://www.facebook....316120021774365 Keep in mind that SNOPES is a left leaning organization. Since this thread is getting political this is all I'll say. GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 It came straight from his official FB page. For those with FB: http://www.facebook....316120021774365 Keep in mind that SNOPES is a left leaning organization. That doesn't make his statement factual. Many politicians "mispeak", sometimes intentionally sometimes not. "...according to USNA spokeswoman Jennifer Erickson, the same restriction applied when President Bush gave the commencement address in 2005, and when Vice President Cheney spoke in 2006. In fact, the restriction is a routine security precaution that the Navy (not the White House) applies to other events at the stadium – including ordinary Naval Academy football games." FactCheck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chantry Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 See the link: http://hotair.com/archives/2012/03/14/u-s-troops-asked-to-lay-down-weapons-before-meeting-panetta-at-afghan-base/ If it is to be believed, the order did not come from SoD Panetta or his security detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Well Deadwood Slim...take it up with Congressman West. GG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I just want somebody to tell the author of the article that the weapons use "magazines" not "clips." At some bases, troops entering mess halls are required to remove the clip from their weapon and clear any rounds from the chamber... For example, in Kabul, as recently as seven days ago troops were required to carry their weapons everywhere, with the ammunition clip loaded but no round chambered, the official said. I know, I know, but in this case it is just a bit of a pet peeve. Otherwise, I believe it was a mistake to do so, but a little much ado about very little in the grand scheme of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted March 15, 2012 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 I just want somebody to tell the author of the article that the weapons use "magazines" not "clips." I know, I know, but in this case it is just a bit of a pet peeve. Otherwise, I believe it was a mistake to do so, but a little much ado about very little in the grand scheme of things. Doc Ward, with all the due RESPECT for what you have done for our country, I say this. Bet it was a BIG DEAL to THOSE Marines!.......Same as a slap in the face, me thinks! Respectfully, Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Doc Ward, with all the due RESPECT for what you have done for our country, I say this. Bet it was a BIG DEAL to THOSE Marines!.......Same as a slap in the face, me thinks! Respectfully, Gary I am not going to try to dissuade you of your opinion, notice I didn't say "much ado about nothing." However, they are Marines. They will take their orders, do as they are told and drive on. To the extent they were insulted, and yes I understand the insult, they will put it behind them and focus on the mission remaining ahead of them. That, in the grand scheme, is the important part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted March 15, 2012 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 Doc, yes they will, as ALL of our mil. would...... But, as the father of 3 multi-tour combat vets I'll offer this. That to ORDER our mil. to "disarm" in a war zone, is sign of piss pour leadership. Respectfully, Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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