Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 If the world you live in doesn't suit you, you have four choices: 1. Suck it up and live with it the way it is. 2. Change yourself to make a better fit. 3. change to world to fit you. 4.Kill yourself. 1. Will leave you sad, lonely. and bitter. 2. Is easier than you might imagine. You might not need big changes and may have to settle for a partial fix. 3. Can be done to a certain degree, and I have done it many times, again sometimes settling for a partial solution. (Note: it is often possible to work 2 and 3 together to get the results that work best) 4. Is a cowards way out and leaves no one satisfied. 4 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 Well said! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderRiverCowboy Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 (edited) I am perfectly Fine with #1 , Changing yourself to conform to others isn't being you . The worlds gay does that mean I change to better fit it? No . World changes to no meat that that mean I have to become a vegan ? No World changes to say turn in your guns and ammo do I change ? In short # 2 means you live your life for someone elses approval you might as well take option 4 Edited March 26 by PowderRiverCowboy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackwater 53393 Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 Lord! Grant me the SERENITY to recognize the things I cannot change, the COURAGE to change the things that I can, the WISDOM to know the difference between the two, and the KNOWLEDGE of my surroundings to find places to hide the bodies of those that PISS ME OFF!!! 2 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001 Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 42 minutes ago, Blackwater 53393 said: Lord! Grant me the SERENITY to recognize the things I cannot change, the COURAGE to change the things that I can, the WISDOM to know the difference between the two, and the KNOWLEDGE of my surroundings to find places to hide the bodies of those that PISS ME OFF!!! AND a good extenda reach back hoe , tired of hand diggin' holes 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 My dad told me when I was a highschooler that you can do pretty much anything you want in this society if you obey the law, and if you follow a few basic rules of social conduct. If you don't obey the law, you'll always be under someone's thumb. If you don't obey the basic rules of social conduct, you don't get invited back, you miss opportunities, you experience frustrations, and your ambitions are thwarted. Follow this simple formula and you can pretty much do what you want, and achieve what you want to achieve. In short: avoid self-defeating behavior. It works. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trailrider #896 Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 2 hours ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said: My dad told me when I was a highschooler that you can do pretty much anything you want in this society if you obey the law, and if you follow a few basic rules of social conduct. If you don't obey the law, you'll always be under someone's thumb. If you don't obey the basic rules of social conduct, you don't get invited back, you miss opportunities, you experience frustrations, and your ambitions are thwarted. Follow this simple formula and you can pretty much do what you want, and achieve what you want to achieve. In short: avoid self-defeating behavior. It works. Except in places like New York, Chicago and elsewhere, where you can break the law multiple times and be out without bail multiple times! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Riot Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 I moved. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooster Ron Wayne Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 11 hours ago, Pat Riot said: I moved. Too Kalifornia From the kettle to the Pot ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 24 minutes ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said: Too Kalifornia From the kettle to the Pot ! I think he meant his move to West Virginia. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 (edited) 23 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: I am perfectly Fine with #1 , Changing yourself to conform to others isn't being you . The worlds gay does that mean I change to better fit it? No . World changes to no meat that that mean I have to become a vegan ? No World changes to say turn in your guns and ammo do I change ? In short # 2 means you live your life for someone elses approval you might as well take option 4 It seems you see things in black and white, no shades of gray. Looking for the most extreme examples to make your case runs afoul of several logical fallacies. Strawman Fallacy, Reductio absurdum to name a couple. Life is a series of compromises. It is part of the societal contract, something we are taught as toddlers. One who doesn't compromise at all ends up in prison or dead, and is usually labeled a sociopath. To be clear, I am not labeling you as such. On the humorous side, one can accept that polymer striker-fired guns are here to stay, and keep using their 1911. More seriously, one can acknowledge that other groups, be they LGBTQ, atheists, Buddhists(!), or even vegetarians, aren't going anywhere, and learn to accept them as people-as human beings-with the same needs under Maslow's heirarchy as you. Accept that if they treat you civilly, you will treat them civilly. Note that @Forty Rod SASS 3935 pointed out not making big changes and settling for partial fixes. I agree with him that the best option is likely a combination of #2 and #3. Fix what you can, change to your level of comfort and ability while remaining true to yourself, and move on with life. Edited March 27 by DocWard wording Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Riot Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 1 hour ago, Rooster Ron Wayne said: Too Kalifornia From the kettle to the Pot ! 57 minutes ago, DocWard said: I think he meant his move to West Virginia. Yes, absolutely. Thanks Doc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 23 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: I am perfectly Fine with #1 , Changing yourself to conform to others isn't being you . The worlds gay does that mean I change to better fit it? No . World changes to no meat that that mean I have to become a vegan ? No World changes to say turn in your guns and ammo do I change ? In short # 2 means you live your life for someone elses approval you might as well take option 4 Since my parents and wife have all died I don't give a tinkers dam for what other people think and I don'r need anyone's approval for anything nor do I conform to much that I don't want to. I'm me, so just suck it up Jocko. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderRiverCowboy Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 1 hour ago, DocWard said: It seems you see things in black and white, no shades of gray. Looking for the most extreme examples to make your case runs afoul of several logical fallacies. Strawman Fallacy, Reductio absurdum to name a couple. Life is a series of compromises. It is part of the societal contract, something we are taught as toddlers. One who doesn't compromise at all ends up in prison or dead, and is usually labeled a sociopath. To be clear, I am not labeling you as such. On the humorous side, one can accept that polymer striker-fired guns are here to stay, and keep using their 1911. More seriously, one can acknowledge that other groups, be they LGBTQ, atheists, Buddhists(!), or even vegetarians, aren't going anywhere, and learn to accept them as people-as human beings-with the same needs under Maslow's heirarchy as you. Accept that if they treat you civilly, you will treat them civilly. Note that @Forty Rod SASS 3935 pointed out not making big changes and settling for partial fixes. I agree with him that the best option is likely a combination of #2 and #3. Fix what you can, change to your level of comfort and ability while remaining true to yourself, and move on with life. Why Should I live my life so you accept me , you want me to accept you without you changing , why the is the one changing me . The Alphabet mental crowd , hell they cant accept who they were born as why should I have to accept them ? Now Personally I dont give a crap in what you do if I dont like you fine I wont deal with you. You have that same right and I damn sure am not changing so you accept me . And when I speak of you and me not you directly but as in a General sense of You meaning the offended general population. The reason America is in the Crap hole state it is right now is media and groups have pushed you into believing you must change and accept BS we need to start standing up and speak our minds and stand up for yourself . 1 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackwater 53393 Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 ^^^^^THIS! ^^^^^ And a thousand times more!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderRiverCowboy Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 4 minutes ago, Blackwater 53393 said: ^^^^^THIS! ^^^^^ And a thousand times more!!! Well here is the other take to this Maybe just maybe WE are the right ones and they need to change to be more inline with our values . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Riot Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 On 3/25/2024 at 11:58 PM, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said: If the world you live in doesn't suit you, you have four choices: 1. Suck it up and live with it the way it is. 2. Change yourself to make a better fit. 3. change to world to fit you. 4.Kill yourself. 5. Live without caring about what others do or think. @Blackwater 53393posted the “Serenity Prayer” with some added seasonings. I try and stick to that…the original , not with added seasonings. Besides, I am sick and #%$&ing tired of allowing others to manipulate my thoughts and feelings. Including your post, Forty. Live is too damned short to live pizzed off, aggravated, in seclusion, etc due to the thoughts, beliefs and acts of others. It’s hard to live #5, but I am getting better at it every day. It’s sunny and beautiful today. I am headed to my gun club to do some shooting and hopefully meet some new friends. Later Dudes! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgavin Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 My choice is Choice #4 for the misfits, the disgruntled and the Marxists who don't like America. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 So.............you're saying that you won't change your beliefs to make your life easier. I'll bet that goes over great with the IRS, ATF, gasoline companies, grocery stores, most retail outlets, anyone you owe money to, traffic cops, the power company, highway construction crews, airlines, TV stations, the medical professions, and a whole herd more. Let me know how that works out for you. I made minor changes in myself and in the world in all of those and more, and my life is much more serene. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackwater 53393 Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 At some point, one must attach a sprig of mistletoe to their shirt tail and go on about their business!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 (edited) 3 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: Why Should I live my life so you accept me , you want me to accept you without you changing , why the is the one changing me . The Alphabet mental crowd , hell they cant accept who they were born as why should I have to accept them ? Now Personally I dont give a crap in what you do if I dont like you fine I wont deal with you. You have that same right and I damn sure am not changing so you accept me . And when I speak of you and me not you directly but as in a General sense of You meaning the offended general population. The reason America is in the Crap hole state it is right now is media and groups have pushed you into believing you must change and accept BS we need to start standing up and speak our minds and stand up for yourself . I'm not sure you actually read what I wrote, or, if you did, you skimmed it simply in order to strike a rebuttal. Not once did I write anything about living your life to be accepted, or making changes in order to be accepted. Quite the opposite, I suggested changes in order to accept others not like you to the point of treating them civilly, so long as they do the same. Out of the list of several groups, you made it a point to find the one that appears most extreme to your way of thinking (see a pattern?) so you can attack and denigrate them more easily. As an aside, I have friends and family members that are gay and lesbians (The "L" and "G" of your "Alphabet mental crowd") By and large they accept that is "who (or how) they were born as." Finally, you again fail or refuse to respond to what I (and Forty Rod) actually wrote. You can't seem to acknowledge that there is a middle path, where you compromise where you can, and stand up and fight for change where you can. As Neil Peart wrote, "changes aren't permanent, but change is." Edited March 27 by DocWard wording Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderRiverCowboy Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 (edited) 33 minutes ago, DocWard said: I'm not sure you actually read what I wrote, or, if you did, you skimmed it simply in order to strike a rebuttal. Not once did I write anything about living your life to be accepted, or making changes in order to be accepted. Quite the opposite, I suggested changes in order to accept others not like you to the point of treating them civilly, so long as they do the same. Out of the list of several groups, you have to find the one that appears most extreme to your way of thinking (see a pattern?) so you can attack and denigrate them. As an aside, I have friends and family members that are gay and lesbians (The "L" and "G" of your "Alphabet mental crowd") By and large they accept that is "who (or how) they were born as." Finally, you again fail or refuse to respond to what I (and Forty Rod) actually wrote. You can't seem to acknowledge that there is a middle path, where you compromise where you can, and stand up and fight for change where you can. As Neil Peart wrote, "changes aren't permanent, but change is." See , and thanks for proving my point. You expect me to change and none on their part , Not acceptable terms. period . Fact Is I don't not care who or what you do in private that's your business not mine to accept . I treat people on how they treat me period . I do not have to accept how they live nor do they mine . If you don't like me because of my views ask if I a give a crap , because when it comes right down to it , if You don't see another sunrise it don't matter to me . As far as Compromise where I can and stand up and fight , well maybe we as Americans have compromised enough and its time WE stand up and fight back . Again Why must I be the one to change to get acceptance from you ? You are not will to accept me for my views , instead to try to lecture me to conform to suit your feelings which I don't care about . You single me out because I upset you, tough deal with it . I will not condone a group or lifestyle that doesn't align with mine. So by your reasoning you come to my home for a beer and bbq , I must coddle to you and your beliefs ? Not going to happen dont let the door hit you on the way out , You accept me for the way I am . Edited March 27 by PowderRiverCowboy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 On 3/26/2024 at 11:20 AM, Chickasaw Bill SASS #70001 said: AND a good extenda reach back hoe , tired of hand diggin' holes A power post hole digger capable of digging holes 10 plus feet deep is a better option. Disturbs less surface area and you can put a nice tree on top when filling it in. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 7 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: Why Should I live my life so you accept me , you want me to accept you without you changing , why the is the one changing me . The Alphabet mental crowd , hell they cant accept who they were born as why should I have to accept them ? Now Personally I dont give a crap in what you do if I dont like you fine I wont deal with you. You have that same right and I damn sure am not changing so you accept me . And when I speak of you and me not you directly but as in a General sense of You meaning the offended general population. The reason America is in the Crap hole state it is right now is media and groups have pushed you into believing you must change and accept BS we need to start standing up and speak our minds and stand up for yourself . I don't recall even remotely suggesting that anyone had to change, and I'm certainly not asking anyone to accept me under any circumstances. (Their loss, not mine.). 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderRiverCowboy Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 47 minutes ago, Forty Rod SASS 3935 said: I don't recall even remotely suggesting that anyone had to change, and I'm certainly not asking anyone to accept me under any circumstances. (Their loss, not mine.). You didn't and I agree you shouldn't have to , Just some want to play dictator and tell other we need to change to accept them , screw them . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 37 minutes ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: You didn't and I agree you shouldn't have to , Just some want to play dictator and tell other we need to change to accept them , screw them . Those are called legislators or do-gooders, mostly leftist pukes, and I pay them no mind and give them no consideration nor courtesy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 4 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: See , and thanks for proving my point. You expect me to change and none on their part , Not acceptable terms. period . So, wait, you're saying you refuse to change to conform and be accepted. OK, great. But you're also saying, by me "proving your point," that you refuse to accept certain other people as human beings and treat them civilly IF they treat you civilly. If others are treating you civilly, then it would seem axiomatic that the others have made steps toward compromise and change. However, this seems to contradict to an extent what you wrote below, that: 4 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: Fact Is I don't not care who or what you do in private that's your business not mine to accept . I treat people on how they treat me period . I do not have to accept how they live nor do they mine . You are saying if people treat you civilly, then you will treat them civilly? 4 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: If you don't like me because of my views ask if I a give a crap , because when it comes right down to it , if You don't see another sunrise it don't matter to me Meh. 4 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: As far as Compromise where I can and stand up and fight , well maybe we as Americans have compromised enough and its time WE stand up and fight back . Again Why must I be the one to change to get acceptance from you ? You still leave me wondering if you are reading for comprehension. 4 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: You are not will to accept me for my views , instead to try to lecture me to conform to suit your feelings which I don't care about . You single me out because I upset you, tough deal with it . I will not condone a group or lifestyle that doesn't align with mine. Don't flatter yourself. I didn't "single you out" and certainly not because you upset me. I replied to your post because it appeared you were missing something in the original post, and attacking it in a way that was not in line with what was actually being stated. You have been the one taking offense and responding angrily, not me. I tend to be a rationally driven person, not an emotionally driven one. To the extent my writings could be taken as "lecturing," they certainly weren't to get you to conform to my feelings. Nor have I suggested you "condone" anything, although the direction your statement leads is one I find worrisome. How many groups don't align with your beliefs? Religious groups? Ethnic groups? 4 hours ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: So by your reasoning you come to my home for a beer and bbq , I must coddle to you and your beliefs ? Not going to happen dont let the door hit you on the way out , You accept me for the way I am . In logic terms, this is a "Strawman fallacy." You've taken an exaggerated and distorted version of what I have said so that you could attack it, not what I've actually said. your logical reaches leave me nearly nonplussed. Why in the wide, wide world of sports would you have someone to your home for any type of social gathering that you know you would not get along with? But what the heck, I'll play along. Assuming, for the sake of argument, that you do invite someone to your home and find out that there is something about their belief system you don't agree with, I would expect that: A- If not a major deal, one would agree to disagree, not discuss it, and move along, or; B-If that were not possible either because the beliefs are so diametrically opposed that it creates an untenable situation, or the other person were so rude as to not be able to set the discussion aside, then I would expect that person to be asked to leave. Coddle to someone's beliefs? I can't fathom where anything I've written could be interpreted to suggest such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderRiverCowboy Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 4 minutes ago, DocWard said: So, wait, you're saying you refuse to change to conform and be accepted. OK, great. But you're also saying, by me "proving your point," that you refuse to accept certain other people as human beings and treat them civilly IF they treat you civilly. If others are treating you civilly, then it would seem axiomatic that the others have made steps toward compromise and change. However, this seems to contradict to an extent what you wrote below, that: You are saying if people treat you civilly, then you will treat them civilly? Meh. You still leave me wondering if you are reading for comprehension. Don't flatter yourself. I didn't "single you out" and certainly not because you upset me. I replied to your post because it appeared you were missing something in the original post, and attacking it in a way that was not in line with what was actually being stated. You have been the one taking offense and responding angrily, not me. I tend to be a rationally driven person, not an emotionally driven one. To the extent my writings could be taken as "lecturing," they certainly weren't to get you to conform to my feelings. Nor have I suggested you "condone" anything, although the direction your statement leads is one I find worrisome. How many groups don't align with your beliefs? Religious groups? Ethnic groups? In logic terms, this is a "Strawman fallacy." You've taken an exaggerated and distorted version of what I have said so that you could attack it, not what I've actually said. your logical reaches leave me nearly nonplussed. Why in the wide, wide world of sports would you have someone to your home for any type of social gathering that you know you would not get along with? But what the heck, I'll play along. Assuming, for the sake of argument, that you do invite someone to your home and find out that there is something about their belief system you don't agree with, I would expect that: A- If not a major deal, one would agree to disagree, not discuss it, and move along, or; B-If that were not possible either because the beliefs are so diametrically opposed that it creates an untenable situation, or the other person were so rude as to not be able to set the discussion aside, then I would expect that person to be asked to leave. Coddle to someone's beliefs? I can't fathom where anything I've written could be interpreted to suggest such. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bgavin Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocWard Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 33 minutes ago, PowderRiverCowboy said: Apparently someone cares enough to reply. Not that I'm surprised by the reply. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Riot Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 3 hours ago, Sedalia Dave said: A power post hole digger capable of digging holes 10 plus feet deep is a better option. Disturbs less surface area and you can put a nice tree on top when filling it in. Plant Federally protected/ endangered trees. It would be against environmental law to dig them up. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PowderRiverCowboy Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 9 minutes ago, Pat Riot said: Plant Federally protected/ endangered trees. It would be against environmental law to dig them up. No need we have plenty of old mine shafts that the water table has filled in and mixed with old Highly corrosive mining chemicals or a wood chipper and use it for fertilizer in the field . Then there is the rumor of a rancher that found some people that decided they could do as they want on his land that he buried the entire car some where on his ranch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyesa Horg Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 26 minutes ago, Pat Riot said: Plant Federally protected/ endangered trees. It would be against environmental law to dig them up. In a wetland 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rip Snorter Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 You have to decide if it is smart to paint a bullseye on yourself these days. Just a question of choosing the hill you find it to be worth dying on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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