Ejected Rifle Round

[Hud McCoy]

If a shooter is shooting their rifle and jacks out a live round and catches it in mid air, the shooter should be given a MSV whether they used the round or not, input please.

[Ace_of_Hearts]

The round is DEAD the moment it leaves the gun.

Picking it up / Catching it earns you a Minor Safety.

[Hud McCoy]

That would have been my call at the club I run. We are far from perfect at every match, but it is a msv.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

Once the dropped round leaves the shooter’s hand or control, it is considered to be a dead round. Stop the shooter if he tries to recover the dead round. It is a 10-second Minor Safety Violation if the shooter retrieves the round during the stage.

 

 

RO1 pp. 18-19 - #24

[Most Wanted]

That would have been my call at the club I run. We are far from perfect at every match, but it is a msv.

The trick is to try not to say anything if they grab it from a table or catch it in the air. Because at that point the MSV is earned so they might as well use it rather than drop it and retrieve another.

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

Stoopid rule...vote early...vote often.

 

Phantom

[Most Wanted]

Stoopid rule...vote early...vote often.

 

Phantom

 

Agree. Really surprised it hasn't passed yet.

[Hud McCoy]

Totally agree.

[Hud McCoy]

Stoopid rule...vote early...vote often.

 

PhantoM

 

Totally agree.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

Agree. Really surprised it hasn't passed yet.

 

It probably would have by now if "they" would stop trying to amend the deletion to exclude retrieval of round(s) that end up "on the ground"...whatever that means.

 

[Hud McCoy]

The trick is to try not to say anything if they grab it from a table or catch it in the air. Because at that point the MSV is earned so they might as well use it rather than drop it and retrieve another.

Wasn't my posse, the call got reversed. There's always a brain far in the memory bank.

[Jim No Horse]

Rule....dang rules....lol....Jim

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

Rule....dang rules....lol....Jim

It's an old rule that is redundant and has been a sore spot for many years...many debates.

 

You're new...sooooo...I understand your desire to attack my comments.

 

And yes folks, PM's sent between myself and Jim No Horse would clarify why I'm responding to his post this way.

 

Phantom

[Russ T. Sites]

Stoopid rule...vote early...vote often.

 

Phantom

 

+11111111

[Jim No Horse]

Attack??? Underwhelming. ...lol....Jim

 

I thought I was agreeing with you.....

 

 

After two years I believe I am off probationary membership and can have an opinion....even if it agrees with yours....LOL

[Phantom, SASS #54973]

Attack??? Underwhelming. ...lol....Jim

 

I thought I was agreeing with you.....

 

 

After two years I believe I am off probationary membership and can have an opinion....even if it agrees with yours....LOL

Whatever...

[Jim No Horse]

I understand the rule but the part that I find hard to grasp is jacking the round and catching it. Thanks for the insights on this call....Jim

[Hoss]

Attack??? Underwhelming. ...lol....Jim

I thought I was agreeing with you.....

After two years I believe I am off probationary membership and can have an opinion....even if it agrees with yours....LOL

Jim...Jim...Jim. 2 years only allows you to pick up brass, paint targets, donate prizes to matches. You have to have at least 5 years and a major match win before you can voice an opinion.

[Marauder SASS #13056]

Yup. Be sure to vote concerning this rule - I'm again it myself.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

I understand the rule but the part that I find hard to grasp is jacking the round and catching it. Thanks for the insights on this call....Jim

 

24. Ammunition dropped by a shooter in the course of loading or reloading any firearm during a stage or “ejected” is considered “dead” and may not be recovered until the shooter completes the course of fire. The round must be replaced from the shooter’s person or other area as required by stage description, or if the round is not fired it is counted as a missed shot.

RO1 p.18

[Chuckaroo #13080 Regulator]

There is always a danger posting a situation and call, when you were not there.

This was a shooter that had a round fail to fire. He limp wristed the lever and the round rolled off the top of the carrier and onto his hand. He did not catch it in the air.

As he was about to toss it on the ground he looked at the primer.

There was never an attempt to use it. For me, this was a very gray area as he did not intend to have it in his hand in the first place. The RO was surprised when he looked at it an made the initial call. He later came to me with the details and I reversed the call.

I reversed it for the above gray area reasons. And, in the same situation, I would do it again. Rules are rules but you can push stupid only so far.

[Hud McCoy]

 

There is always a danger posting a situation and call, when you were not there.

This was a shooter that had a round fail to fire. He limp wristed the lever and the round rolled off the top of the carrier and onto his hand. He did not catch it in the air.

As he was about to toss it on the ground he looked at the primer.

There was never an attempt to use it. For me, this was a very gray area as he did not intend to have it in his hand in the first place. The RO was surprised when he looked at it an made the initial call. He later came to me with the details and I reversed the call.

I reversed it for the above gray area reasons. And, in the same situation, I would do it again. Rules are rules but you can push stupid only so far.

 

I wasn't calling anyone out Roo, I have seen this a few times at various places and everyone makes a different call. Nothing personal.

[Chuckaroo #13080 Regulator]

Hud,

 

The way the original post described the event, as a round caught in mid air, I would agree that it was a penalty.

 

The call was overturned because the situation was not as described above. The original call was overturned using all of the facts and an addition of common sense.

 

There was no intent on the shooters part to go after the round, nor was there any intent on using the round.

 

The shooter had several rounds misfire in a row and reloaded them. He then operaterd the lever slowly believing there was a problem with the rifle. This is what caused the round to roll over and into his hand.

[Hud McCoy]

My OP wasn't intended to stir the pot amongst friends and I apologize for any misinterpretation of my OP. I have the utmost respect for Chuckaroo and his club.

[Cheyenne Culpepper 32827]

it's called wrong 50% of the time,,, sure hope it takes a hike!!!

[VICIOUS, SASS#8014]

OK; SO a Marlin fails to cycle the round and the bullet nose is pointed out but still sitting on the carrier. The shooter clears the bullet by pulling it out, then holds the round in hand, fires the rest of the bullets and reinserts the bullet fires the round last shot.

IS this a NO CALL?

[Yusta B.]

Yes, it is a no call.

 

Bullet never shooter's control or contact.

[PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L]

OK; SO a Marlin fails to cycle the round and the bullet nose is pointed out but still sitting on the carrier. The shooter clears the bullet by pulling it out, then holds the round in hand, fires the rest of the bullets and reinserts the bullet fires the round last shot.

IS this a NO CALL?

 

YES.

[Cold Lake Kid, SASS # 51474]

Juggling a rifle and a cartridge while it's on the air?

MSV at least.

Too easy for a shooter to lose control of his firearm, drop it or break 170°

(If you let it pass with an experienced shooter, able to handle it, how would you deal with someone less capable?)

[Guest Cinch, SASS#29433]

If a shooter is shooting their rifle and jacks out a live round and catches it in mid air, the shooter should be given a MSV whether they used the round or not, input please.

They should get a ten second bonus!! I just jacked a dummy 10 times and had one good catch in mid air. So how often does this jacking catching thing really happen? Maybe 38's go higher and straighter in the air? My 45's headed west while I was facing east and were damned near impossible to catch!!

 

If truly caught in mid air and not trapped against the gun somehow it Should be a Bonus!!

 

The MSV for retrieving shotshells could go as I reckon as it happens WAY more often and isn't nearly as entertaining. But in the big scheme of things matches could be made more interesting if it were mandatory to retrieve shotshells. Just think of the excitement; the world championship in the balance and the two top gun drainers drop a shotshell and are forced to retrieve it on the clock!

 

Just think of the hours of gun clicking, stage study, and limbering up to be ready to dive after all of those dropped shells... FUN!!

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

 

 

I reversed it for the above gray area reasons. And, in the same situation, I would do it again.

Good call, Chuckaroo. The details OFTEN really do matter, because our rules have been written so that often they require details to determine if a penalty applies or not. Things like this can make our rule set real hard to apply, because of having to get such small details right, both as it happens (to make the initial call) and as it gets explained to folks who might have to review the initial call.

 

Good luck, GJ

[Most Wanted]

The round was ejected.

The shooter took control after the ejection and inspected it.

MSV

The rule doesn't deal with intent or what the shooter is planning on doing with it after recovery. As a matter of fact the rule only addresses the recovery and once that is done the MSV is earned and the round is free to be used.

Had it landed in his hand by accident and then he let it hit the ground without the inspection I wouldn't have made a call.

I wasn't there but both descriptions from the shoot say the right call was made on the line due to a rule that shouldn't exist. Let the call stand and maybe that would be another vote to get rid of said rule.

[Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217]

Hi Folks,

 

I didn't read every post. I just want to say that, occasionally an ejected rifle round has a light strike on the primer and you may not wish to use it again, even if it was legal.

 

Regards,

 

Allie