Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 Am I reading this right?? http://www.dailymail...o=feeds-newsxml Doesn't sit well....what y'alls thoughts "The final car that police searched yielded a suspect who was armed with high powered handguns" It looks like a Glock to me GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Scatterbrain Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 The result of the whole ordeal is that it paid off. We have arrested and charged a suspect. I guess the ends have justified the means. Nothing to see here, move along... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted June 6, 2012 Author Share Posted June 6, 2012 I guess the ends have justified the means. Nothing to see here, move along... If you say so....just kinda seems to infringe on the 4th Amendment. BUT...just not sure in this case (Terry search??). GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Smokepole #29248L Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 All I can say is that I would never have done it nor would I have allowed any of my Officers to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butcher Brinkworth Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 I drive through that area occasionally and always have a loaded pistol in the door of my car (nobody in their right mind should drive through Aurora without sufficient firepower for protection ). I'm glad I wasn't there at the wrong time today or I might be sitting in jail trying to convince them I wasn't a bank robber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Cherokee, SASS#48332 Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 If I had been one of those 40 motorists, I would have been more than a little P.O.ed..they got the perp, so that's good..But no, it don't sit too well with me either.. Does that mean if someone reports a suspected bank robber in a certain neighborhood they can go door to door and handcuff everyone in their houses until the perp is caught? Being checked out is one thing, being handcuffed for two hours is another..Gestapo-esque tactics, IMHO..Maybe those 40 motorists should put their heads together and hire 40 lawyers.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted June 6, 2012 Author Share Posted June 6, 2012 I drive through that area occasionally and always have a loaded pistol in the door of my car (nobody in their right mind should drive through Aurora without sufficient firepower for protection ). I'm glad I wasn't there at the wrong time today or I might be sitting in jail trying to convince them I wasn't a bank robber Wow! didn't think about a feller having a CCW...that would probably have been a problem. GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 These are false arrests, pure and simple. Nice to be in handcuffs if the perp and police start firing.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted June 6, 2012 Author Share Posted June 6, 2012 These are false arrests, pure and simple. Nice to be in handcuffs if the perp and police start firing.... Holy smokes! GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Scatterbrain Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 If you say so....just kinda seems to infringe on the 4th Amendment. BUT...just not sure in this case (Terry search??). GG ~ Perhaps I should have added some emiticons: I guess the ends have justified the means. Nothing to see here, move along... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Hand Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 No "Terry" issue here, clear violation of the 4th 5th, and maybe 14th amendments. Clearly when you are removed from your vehicle at gunpoint, detained and handcuffed, you are "under arrest". If they were looking for a male suspect, how did they justify handcuffing women, some who had children with them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Steel Duke Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 Gunner, the trolls must be on summer vacation! BSD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badlands Bob #61228 Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 As usual, the media doesn't give the whole story. The article mentions an annoymous tip that the bank robber was at a specific intersection. That sounds suspiciously like a GPS tracking device was in the money he stole. Of course, I'm just using my experience and connecting the dots here. Using GPS tracking, the officers would only know that the freshly stolen loot was at that geographic location. They couldn't nail down which car so I guess they stopped all of them. Why it took 2 1/2 hours, I have no idea. Maybe they were waiting on someone to make a decision. Yep, they are probably going to catch some heat for this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jittery Jim Jonah, SASS #64913L Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 Trouble is we are only getting one side of the story. In my experience I don't trust anything the press prints..... Does seem excessive on the face of it.... Not the best decision me thinks, would never fly in CA, not even in Los Angeles! JJJ-D :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forty Rod SASS 3935 Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 I'd probably have spent more time cuffed because I would NOT give them permission to search my vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subdeacon Joe Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 As usual, the media doesn't give the whole story. The article mentions an annoymous tip that the bank robber was at a specific intersection. That sounds suspiciously like a GPS tracking device was in the money he stole. Of course, I'm just using my experience and connecting the dots here. Using GPS tracking, the officers would only know that the freshly stolen loot was at that geographic location. They couldn't nail down which car so I guess they stopped all of them. Why it took 2 1/2 hours, I have no idea. Maybe they were waiting on someone to make a decision. Yep, they are probably going to catch some heat for this one. Trouble is we are only getting one side of the story. In my experience I don't trust anything the press prints..... Does seem excessive on the face of it.... Not the best decision me thinks, would never fly in CA, not even in Los Angeles! JJJ-D :ph34r: Even if we are only "getting one side of the story" the LEOs over reacted. If a suspect ran into a shopping mall, would you say that LEOs have the power to arrest and cuff everyone inside that mall? Better example, an armed suspect somehow gets to EOT and is tracked there. Would you agree that LEOs have the power to disarm and cuff everyone there? Yes, I know, extreme hypothetical examples, but the suggestion that the officers did good by detaining everyone in a car at that intersection argues that they should have the same power in my examples. Look at how upset we all were when LEOs were disarming honest citizens in New Orleans. This is just a variant on that theme, violation of civil and constitutional rights is violation of civil and constitutional rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 I smell a massive lawsuit. One more proof positive that there are LEOs out there that operate under the us vs them philosophy. And that there are situations that look more and more like we really are living in a police/gestapo state. The lines that I liked the most are; The result of the whole ordeal is that it paid off. 'We have arrested and charged a suspect.' What other violations of our rights can be justified the same way. But why can't the government round up all the illegal aliens the same way. Would the ends justify the means? But many don't care about the illegal aliens rights. I don't for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hacker, SASS #55963 Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 Even if we are only "getting one side of the story" the LEOs over reacted. If a suspect ran into a shopping mall, would you say that LEOs have the power to arrest and cuff everyone inside that mall? Better example, an armed suspect somehow gets to EOT and is tracked there. Would you agree that LEOs have the power to disarm and cuff everyone there? Yes, I know, extreme hypothetical examples, but the suggestion that the officers did good by detaining everyone in a car at that intersection argues that they should have the same power in my examples. Look at how upset we all were when LEOs were disarming honest citizens in New Orleans. This is just a variant on that theme, violation of civil and constitutional rights is violation of civil and constitutional rights. As much as I agree somewhat.... There are several strong differences. 1. What happened here happpened on a public road. 2. your EOT example would be about LEOs invading a private property where they were not invited. Yet if they went in having pursued a suspect, I believe that that is probably legal. But could they handcuff everyone they came across on private property particularly behind a fenced lot line. I hope that is not legal. I also hope that Founders Ranch is surrounded by fence. My 2 cents worth. A real lawyer might contribute useful interpretation of law. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 I drive through that area occasionally and always have a loaded pistol in the door of my car (nobody in their right mind should drive through Aurora without sufficient firepower for protection ). I'm glad I wasn't there at the wrong time today or I might be sitting in jail trying to convince them I wasn't a bank robber I saw a few weeks ago that Aurora is one of the top ten safest cities in the country. You must be mistaken. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calico Mary Posted June 6, 2012 Share Posted June 6, 2012 It all depends on what part of Aurora you're in. Some areas are really nice neighborhoods, other areas I wouldn't go into in broad daylight with every gun I own on me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uno Mas SASS #80082 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 To our LEOs: If one had been cuffed, and then refused to have the car searched, what ramifications could there be? Four to six hours sitting handcuffed in the sun while a warrant is prepared (just a formality right?) An especially diligent (destructive) search of the car? Ticky-tack tickets? Any other "special" treatment? I've heard some commentators say the the guy popped with the guns was likely NOT the bankrobber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okie Sawbones, SASS #77381 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Am I reading this right?? http://www.dailymail...o=feeds-newsxml Doesn't sit well....what y'alls thoughts "The final car that police searched yielded a suspect who was armed with high powered handguns" It looks like a Glock to me GG ~ Lawyers are lining up for civil rights lawsuits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoken D Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Wonderen if in the future instead of those exploding dye packs in the money bag that the last set of bills have a tracking device. Say 3 police vehicles are equipped with the program to track those bills and give you a point within 300 feet where those bills are. Now you are at an intersection with 30 vehicles and the tracker is saying those bills are within that area. What ya gonna do, just ignore it, or check every vehicle till ya find the one with those bills. Let me tell ya one thing that I have learned that bad guys don't start out robbing banks. Maybe started stealing gum from your local store, then bigger stuff, then purse snatching, then knocking over the little ole ladies to get the purse. Then breaking into homes unoccupied. Then it don't matter if anyone home or not. Then business burglaries, then armed robbery with shaky hands. Then armed robbery without shaky hands. Then bank robbery, then don't care if they shoot anyone or not, probably will. Think they got courage, no, it ain't courage, it's no longer a conscious as we know it or care one bit. OK, lets do it, no need for cops anyway with all interpretation of the Constitution everyone has. Yea, I agree, you all right, no need fer cops anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Gatlin, SASS 10274L Posted June 7, 2012 Author Share Posted June 7, 2012 Wonderen if in the future instead of those exploding dye packs in the money bag that the last set of bills have a tracking device. Say 3 police vehicles are equipped with the program to track those bills and give you a point within 300 feet where those bills are. Now you are at an intersection with 30 vehicles and the tracker is saying those bills are within that area. What ya gonna do, just ignore it, or check every vehicle till ya find the one with those bills. Let me tell ya one thing that I have learned that bad guys don't start out robbing banks. Maybe started stealing gum from your local store, then bigger stuff, then purse snatching, then knocking over the little ole ladies to get the purse. Then breaking into homes unoccupied. Then it don't matter if anyone home or not. Then business burglaries, then armed robbery with shaky hands. Then armed robbery without shaky hands. Then bank robbery, then don't care if they shoot anyone or not, probably will. Think they got courage, no, it ain't courage, it's no longer a conscious as we know it or care one bit. OK, lets do it, no need for cops anyway with all interpretation of the Constitution everyone has. Yea, I agree, you all right, no need fer cops anymore. NO SIR!! We NEED our LEO's ~ not sayin' that at all. This specific example is concerning though. Let be on record that I beleive the LEO's we have out there are overwhelmingly operating within' lawful bounds and that I back them 100%. With the many folks out there protecting and serving the community, there might be a bad apple cop or policy or decision....but I still smile when I see my local law enforcement. Thanks for all the replies... GG ~ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Smokepole #29248L Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 My take on this is that you had a large group of well intentioned Officers doing what they thought was right. The problem was with supervision... There should have been somebody of rank overseeing this that had a useful understanding of The Constitution. In plain English.... Where the hell was their Sergeant or Lieutenant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 The problem was with supervision... As is frequently the case. And not just supervision, but competent and professional supervision. I don't live up in Aurora but I've see that department do a few things I didn't agree with recently. Could be some changes need to be made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacknife Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Gestapo tactics. And ya can bet your booty the cops will get away with it, no problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okie Sawbones, SASS #77381 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Gestapo tactics. And ya can bet your booty the cops will get away with it, no problem. I find it disgusting when people throw around terms like Nazi, Gestapo, and Hitler. Your comment is over the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Chance Morgun Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 That's all some people can do, Okie. Get 10% of the facts and rush to condemn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah Bob #35998 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 I find it disgusting when people throw around terms like Nazi, Gestapo, and Hitler. Your comment is over the line. Used to get called Gestapo, Nazi, Storm Trooper, and worse all the time. Usually by ex-hippies, youngsters, or pretty girls (who came to the realization that their good looks wouldn't get them out of a ticket). And drunks. Drunks love to call you a Nazi. Funny when they can't pronounce it. Now as to the situation in question...if it was true Gestapo tactics, NObody would have been released. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacknife Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Your comment is over the line. Personal opinion? I am sure that if you are correct the administrators will let me know. Till then, just try to make the best of it. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Okie Sawbones, SASS #77381 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Personal opinion? I am sure that if you are correct the administrators will let me know. Till then, just try to make the best of it. :lol: Personal opinion? Yes. Make the best of it? Don't need to -- people like you I usually ignore. I try to spend my time on the positive things in life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Think I'll go over to the Wire to see if there are any rank points threads... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sneaky Gun Runner SASS 79775 Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 This one summer at band camp..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoken D Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 One thing that cracks me up about Aurora is that back in either 79 or 80 dad applied for the chief position in Aurora. He went for the interview and when he came back said he withdrew his name after finding out more about the place. Just said interresting how the place was run. Went ahead and took chief job in Independence, Mo. Doesn't seem like much has changed over there. Just a note I'm sayen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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