Jump to content
SASS Wire Forum

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Cheyenne Culpepper 32827

a new ammo head scratcher!

Recommended Posts

yesterday,  cool, 19 degrees,,,   ammo kept inside overnight and warm in the car on the way to the shoot,,,  winchester primers,  red dot powder  between 2.5 and 3.5,  and cleaned in a vibrator brass,,,,  had just loaded 200 rounds for the shoot..  first stage two squibs,,,, got to shoot it again,, another squib,,,  got ammo from someone else,,,  put mine on dash of car with motor running and defroster on hot and high,, it got pretty warm, ie hot, still had squibs in pistols, although not in rifle, it must have had enough pressure since it didn't loose any like revolvers do thru the gap,,

 

broke some down at home,,, some the powder was lighter in color than others,,,   all the primers went bang,, squibs not misfires...

 

only thing I can think of,,, I used some bullets that I had broken down before when I used a substance in brass cleaner to try to help clean it, that didn't work,, maybe enough was on the bullet to contaminate the new powder?  had been about 4 yrs ago... I didn't have issues tho when I reloaded the primed brass from that mistake...

 

any ideas?   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well even that low end (way too low) of Red Dot still should be able clear the barrel, course I'm just guessing. Only thing I can think of is moisture in the case if yer using wet tumbler, or something restricting powder flow at the press. I use mid+ range of Red Dot for all my smokeless stuff and it has never been temp. or position sensitive. Good Luck:)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Do you still have some powder in original container? Does that powder have color variation? If powder in original container

Has the same color variations I would call powder manufacture with the lot number and see what they say.

Color variation leads me think some sort of contamination, not the first time powders have been inadvertently gotten mixed

during manufacture.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the powder in my measure is all the same,,,,  I had just refilled it before I started loading that batch,,  I'm going with contaminated somehow, maybe residue on the bullets from a past mistake, perhaps,,,  guess I will duplicate the load with clean bullets and on another cold day try them,,,   I'm glad I hadn't gotten into those bullets for my ammo for winter range that has already been handed off for transport,,,

 

hmmmm I cud take some more apart,,,, and if I find the lighter color powder reload them the same way and test them that way...

if they still go phtttt I wont disturb the neighbors,,, if they go bang,, oh well, I live in a township

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

not really too light a charge of powder, that spread was as to not get into trouble for posting a load.. it was in between the two

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's contamination or powder not what you thought.  Not cold weather because you proved that by warming up rounds.  A change of color in powder supports EITHER contamination or mistaken powder swap. 

 

I've usually found Red Dot to be very cold weather stable, even in light loads.   Red Dot does have a track record of not METERING through powder dispensers real accurately due to it's large flakes.

 

Good luck, GJ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

not mixed powder,,, all from same batch of red dot,,  gotta be contaminated somehow,, maybe the re used bullets from a different bad batch

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Purdy Boy, I had a similar problem, but with Titegroup instead of Red Dot.  I'd normally load 4 or 5 hundred rounds at a time.  Then I started having a series of squibs.  So, I cleaned the powder measure really good - problem solved.  But wait, after a few hundred rounds the squib problem started again.  

 

Poured the the powder back into the container, cleaned the measure again and started having squibs again after a couple hundred rounds.  This time I poured the powder out through a sieve and found a piece of what looked like a small chunk of styrofoam.  The styrofoam would partially plug up the powder measure causing it to throw light charges.  Since I'd pour the powder back into the container after each loading session, the problem was intermittent.  The styrofoam obstruction got poured back into the powder can each time and only caused a problem if it worked its way down to the charge bar.

 

The styrofoam obstruction looked like it may have been a part of the seal that is on the container when it was first opened.  I figured that a small piece got broken off and fell down into the container.

 

That may not be your problem, but it happened to me.  Good. Luck!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Cypress Sam, SASS #10915 said:

Purdy Boy, I had a similar problem, but with Titegroup instead of Red Dot.  I'd normally load 4 or 5 hundred rounds at a time.  Then I started having a series of squibs.  So, I cleaned the powder measure really good - problem solved.  But wait, after a few hundred rounds the squib problem started again.  

 

Poured the the powder back into the container, cleaned the measure again and started having squibs again after a couple hundred rounds.  This time I poured the powder out through a sieve and found a piece of what looked like a small chunk of styrofoam.  The styrofoam would partially plug up the powder measure causing it to throw light charges.  Since I'd pour the powder back into the container after each loading session, the problem was intermittent.  The styrofoam obstruction got poured back into the powder can each time and only caused a problem if it worked its way down to the charge bar.

 

The styrofoam obstruction looked like it may have been a part of the seal that is on the container when it was first opened.  I figured that a small piece got broken off and fell down into the container.

 

That may not be your problem, but it happened to me.  Good. Luck!

I keep a piece of nylon netting that I pour my power thru into the hopper.  My reason is just such an occurrence as above.  I actually learn from some of my mistakes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Noz said:

I keep a piece of nylon netting that I pour my power thru into the hopper.  My reason is just such an occurrence as above.  I actually learn from some of my mistakes.

 

I have a wire screen I use after having a desiccant pack get into my powder measure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Condensation would be formed when moving from cold into warmth.  I'm with Garrison Joe.  Did you weigh the rounds you pulled down?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yup weighed each one and spot on,,,  tomorrow I'll try to get around to tearing more down and rebuilding ones with suspect powder and then fire them..

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I say condensation because you took cold ammo and heated it with a hot air vent.

What bullet lube do you use.

It could/may have 'bled' into the powder, when the ammo was heated.

OLG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

had the failures before I heated it,,,  brought it from the reloading room in the barn,, 40 degrees, into the house to the car in the morning and then to the shoot,,  same as I've done countless times before,,

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Did you do anything different in case preparation and ammo loading this time?

Different lot of primers maybe?

New can of powder??

Any details you can add?

OLG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/13/2017 at 10:11 AM, Cypress Sam, SASS #10915 said:

styrofoam would partially plug up the powder measure causing it to throw light charges.  Since I'd pour the powder back into the container after each loading session, the problem was intermittent.  The styrofoam obstruction got poured back into the powder can each time and only caused a problem if it worked its way down to the charge bar.

 

This is my guess, something restricting consistent  powder flow. Going from cold to hot to cold to hot to cold should not effect properly loaded ammo, otherwise there would be a whole bunch a squibin going on.;) Good Luck:)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I had something similar happen (poof rounds but no squibs) and the contamination came from excessive case lube getting inside the case and contaminating the powder. Did you change anything in your case prep routine?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ok, I'll try to do that tomorrow,,,  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

loaded 10 new ones,, and powder measured each one, spot on,,,,  tore 7 more apart,, all spot on too  and put powder from the ones I tore apart on a paper in piles,,, they all looked the same,,, sheesh!!

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Poo happens.......don’t know why 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ok,,, so today  I did my best to duplicate my loads that were crummy..   First, I did empty the powder measure and examined the powder carefully,, no foreign objects,,,  took measure apart, free of debris too.    loaded 25 rounds with the bullets that I had torn down before because of squibs,,, and 25 with other bullets, both using the same powder and primers as before..    we'll see....  I'll let them sit a few days before I try them out

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CC-How often do you calibrate your powder scale?

Are you loading at the bottom of the powder charge range, or in the middle?

OLG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I calibrate it often,,, whenever I move it,,,

 

when I was 3 I played with the red dots on the wall....or with the clay in the field

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have just started cowboy shooting and am using equipment that has laid dormant for many years.

I had three misfires during practice shooting last week. Granted my CCI primers are old (back when they were $.84/100). I have shot about 900 rounds in competition without incident.

I think I found the problem to be the use of old case lube RCBS (that was changed into another container). I was having trouble cleaning the lube off after resizing (it just wouldn't come off for nothing). I'm trying new lube alternatives this week.

I am still noticing an oily substance inside the cases and the powder is sticking to the sides of the interior case when loaded. These cases had already been re-primed so re-cleaning is an issue.

I suspect that may have more problems in this batch. I may have to run a cleaning patch into each casing and hope for the best.

I would be looking towards contamination issues. Specifically because of the discoloration of powder.

This is a common problem with black powder/muzzleloader hunting when you don't clear your gun after each day of hunting and bring the gun indoors. I Always store the gun upside down (muzzle down) to prevent the problem of bullet lube diffusing into the powder and try to keep it outdoors and away from temperature changes as much as possible.

When you pull your bullets, see if you have any powder sticking to the inside of the case. This may indicate case lube or bullet lube contamination.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no powder was sticking to the cases...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Coffee Pot SASS#55659 said:

 

 

going to miss getting to shoot all winter,,  I will be down in march for the IDES, maybe in Jan for a spell

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

smokewagons,,  both guns, but not the rifle,, I figure the rifle, Marlin, captured what pressure there was  and really didn't feel anything strange with the rifle

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 said:

smokewagons,,  both guns, but not the rifle,, I figure the rifle, Marlin, captured what pressure there was  and really didn't feel anything strange with the rifle

When you say 'squib', do you mean the round did not fire at all?:huh:

A 'squib' is a round where the bullet does not exit the bore, but does 'fire'.

If you have a 'no-fire', that's a 'dud'.......;)

IF-this is the case-the hammer springs on the SW's have weakened. Did you try this ammo in your rifle??

Are these flat or coil springs?

OLG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.