Member VictorH seems to be scamming

[jason60chev]

I wish to bring attention to a member, VICTORH (victorherrera32901@gmail.com).

 

He contacted me, via the SASS forum, saying he had an item, that I have been seeking. He's a new member, here

and I requested a pic with his handwritten User Name and date with the item. Said he wasn't able to dothat,

but did send a copy of his Texas driver's license. That seemed ok.

 

After discussion, I agreed to purchase the item and asked price and if shipping was extra or included. He said that shipping was included.

Provided a Paypal email, which wasn;t his name. Red Flag, but when asked, said he was having trouble with hi. Ok, I guess. Went ahead and

sent funds. Modest amount.

 

Comes back later saying his FFL wants $50 to provide a tracking number. Now, I am getting angry. After several heated (On my part) exchanges,

I sent the $50. Even still, total amount modest, but now questioning. Said he shipped but I had to wait til Friday (today) to receive the tracking number. WHAT????!!!

 

Ok......heard from him this evening. Said he was robbed on his way to the FFL (Sure, he was) and that he had a duplicate item, but said I needed to send another $50

to ship!!!!  ISAID"NO!" told him that being robbed is HIS problem and to either ship the duplicate or refund my money. I do not think that he will do either.

 

So, be careful of VICTOR H........

 

Thanks, for listening.

 

Any ideas how I can report him to his local police department?

[Itchy Trigger]

I would file a report with your local police who "should" follow through with their counterparts in the other jurisdiction. Ask for a follow up and contact information for the party that will be looking into the situation at the other end. Squeaky wheel is more likely to gain attention, but it all comes down to the police department and DA at the other end. If you sent it to a home address, you can talk to the Hell's Angels and have them go and knock on the door for a fee and ...

 

Allways send money via the postal system. Some legitimate sellers complain, but if they don't follow through it is a federal crime which the Post Office takes very seriously. I have only had one seller that refused to take something via the USPS and I have no idea if he was a "valid seller."

 

NEVER use Paypal, they are EXTREMELY ANTI-GUN. You might be able to get PayPal to confiscate the money from him since it violated their policies, but it won't be returned to you.

=======================================================================================================================

https://www.paypal.com/us/legalhub/acceptableuse-full

Prohibited Activities
You may not use the PayPal service for activities that: ...

relate to transactions involving ... (j) ammunition, firearms, or certain firearm parts or accessories, or ...

 

[Hoss]

Total scammer. He tried to get me last week. I too asked for him to write HOSS on a piece of paper, send pic of it with gun. He said his flip phone did not do pictures. I told him ok, send the rifle, I’ll pay when it arrives. He agreed to do so but I had to pay shipping & FFL fee upfront. I reckon he figured to get $100 off me.  I refused 

[Badlands Bob #61228]

I would be very wary of dealing with anyone that doesn't have a legitimate looking SASS number and a track record of posts on the SASS wire.  Usually you can get someone to vouch for a person who actually knows them personally.  I've had several transactions with Cowboys on the SASS Wire and all of them went smoothly, but they were all vetted as legitimate first.  Dealing with someone who just joined is risky.   

[Texas Jack Black]

 How many times have we read stories like this on this very wire and still members fall for this obvious scam over and over again.

 

[Michigan Slim]

8 minutes ago, Texas Jack Black said:

 How many times have we read stories like this on this very wire and still members fall for this obvious scam over and over again.

 

This needed to be said. All the signs were there from the getgo. 

[Yul Lose]

14 minutes ago, Texas Jack Black said:

 How many times have we read stories like this on this very wire and still members fall for this obvious scam over and over again.

 

Yep, and people are still posting email addresses and phone numbers and other personal information.

[Cold Lake Kid, SASS # 51474]

Perhaps the Admins on your BUY/SELL forum could consider adding the Traders Rating feature like we have on CanadianGunNutz.ca

It allows buyer and sellers to rate one another's experience with their dealings with one another.

You also have to apply to join the BUY/SELL thread.

We have found it works quite well and weeds out possible scammers very quickly, since their Trader Rating appears with their name and details similar to what appears to the left of this posting, showing some of my details.

When we have someone with little or no ratings, indicated, you can still deal with them, but addition caution and steps may be required.

I recently visited a fellow here in Ottawa to meet and view the condition of an item he had for sale, on behalf of another G'Nutter in British Columbia, on our West coast.

[Cold Lake Kid, SASS # 51474]

11 minutes ago, Cold Lake Kid, SASS # 51474 said:

Perhaps the Admins on your BUY/SELL forum could consider adding the Traders Rating feature like we have on CanadianGunNutz.ca

It allows buyer and sellers to rate one another's experience with their dealings with one another.

You also have to apply to join the BUY/SELL thread.

We have found it works quite well and weeds out possible scammers very quickly, since their Trader Rating appears with their name and details similar to what appears to the left of this posting, showing some of my details.

When we have someone with little or no ratings, indicated, you can still deal with them, but addition caution and steps may be required.

I recently visited a fellow here in Ottawa to meet and view the condition of an item he had for sale, on behalf of another G'Nutter in British Columbia, on our West coast.

 

EDITED: Sorry, I just realized you have to join the site, otherwise all the sections are Private. Sorry about that.

[Dungannon Gunner]

6 hours ago, jason60chev said:

I wish to bring attention to a member, VICTORH (victorherrera32901@gmail.com).

 

He contacted me, via the SASS forum, saying he had an item, that I have been seeking. He's a new member, here

and I requested a pic with his handwritten User Name and date with the item. Said he wasn't able to dothat,

but did send a copy of his Texas driver's license. That seemed ok.

 

After discussion, I agreed to purchase the item and asked price and if shipping was extra or included. He said that shipping was included.

Provided a Paypal email, which wasn;t his name. Red Flag, but when asked, said he was having trouble with hi. Ok, I guess. Went ahead and

sent funds. Modest amount.

 

Comes back later saying his FFL wants $50 to provide a tracking number. Now, I am getting angry. After several heated (On my part) exchanges,

I sent the $50. Even still, total amount modest, but now questioning. Said he shipped but I had to wait til Friday (today) to receive the tracking number. WHAT????!!!

 

Ok......heard from him this evening. Said he was robbed on his way to the FFL (Sure, he was) and that he had a duplicate item, but said I needed to send another $50

to ship!!!!  ISAID"NO!" told him that being robbed is HIS problem and to either ship the duplicate or refund my money. I do not think that he will do either.

 

So, be careful of VICTOR H........

 

Thanks, for listening.

 

Any ideas how I can report him to his local police department?

Do you shoot Cowboy action? What club and what is your AKA

[One Gun Jimmy]

Just a thought that may be to much to ask.

 

Another forum I used to visit regularly had a minimum post requirement before you could private message or post in the buy/sell area.

 

Then it was very easy to see who was just trying to spam post to get to there limit to start scamming.

 

Honestly the effort required was usually enough of a deterent.

 

I only saw one scammer in about 8 years and he was called out and banned in about a day.

 

I think the limit was something like 10 posts.

[Tyrel Cody]

41 minutes ago, One Gun Jimmy said:

Just a thought that may be to much to ask.

 

Another forum I used to visit regularly had a minimum post requirement before you could private message or post in the buy/sell area.

 

Then it was very easy to see who was just trying to spam post to get to there limit to start scamming.

 

Honestly the effort required was usually enough of a deterent.

 

I only saw one scammer in about 8 years and he was called out and banned in about a day.

 

I think the limit was something like 10 posts.

 

An even better solution would be to associate members here with their actual SASS numbers and completely lock out non SASS members from the classifieds. If you don't have a legit SASS# you shouldn't even be able to see the classifieds.

 

 

[One Gun Jimmy]

7 hours ago, Tyrel Cody said:

 

An even better solution would be to associate members here with their actual SASS numbers and completely lock out non SASS members from the classifieds. If you don't have a legit SASS# you shouldn't even be able to see the classifieds.

 

 

I would have no issue with that.

 

And honestly anyone who did wouldn't be a member so who cares lol.

 

I

[John Kloehr]

From other forums, restrictions in classifieds typically include requiring 5 to 10 regular posts before starting a thread in classifieds. My observation is 5 posts is a bit too low, but some scammers will still go to the effort of making 10 posts.

 

These posts are typically of low quality, along the lines of simple agreement or "me too" posts. Experienced members recognize them for what they are and any classified posts are quickly removed and those members banned. It is still a whack-a-mole effort.

 

The same restriction (minimum post count) usually applies to PMs. At many sites, new members can not send PMs to other members. This at least slows down the "I know a guy who has the item you seek. Email him at ..." PMs. Again, the low quality of the member history of posts points to scammy content.

 

These restrictions are often combined with time restrictions, a week or two, or even a month. This does cut down on spam events but still does not eliminate them.

 

I don't think we have a problem here with non-SASS members buying listed items. There are a few scams involving pre-paid cards or checks for excess amounts (send me the item and I trust you to send me my change; then the card is no good or the check bounces), just have not seen those buyer scams on this forum.

 

In short, the first hurdle to starting a thread in the classified section should be member participation. The second is to reserve starting threads for paid members.

 

Unfortunately, I'm not sure this forum software is capable of these settings, and I don't think the management staff has time to actively manage these restrictions.

 

Maybe the best we can do is be vigilant, ask questions, and help new members (SASS paid or not) understand there are scammers and help them recognize bad actors.

[jason60chev]

15 hours ago, Dungannon Gunner said:

Do you shoot Cowboy action? What club and what is your AKA

25 YEARS AGO.  Want to get back in, but may have to wait 4more years.

 

That scammer guy is saying he wants to ship the item, but needs another $50,after being robbed, on way to FFL, after sending all required monies for item and shipping, before. Will just have to learn from this. he won't refund, either.

[One Gun Jimmy]

2 hours ago, John Kloehr said:

From other forums, restrictions in classifieds typically include requiring 5 to 10 regular posts before starting a thread in classifieds. My observation is 5 posts is a bit too low, but some scammers will still go to the effort of making 10 posts.

 

These posts are typically of low quality, along the lines of simple agreement or "me too" posts. Experienced members recognize them for what they are and any classified posts are quickly removed and those members banned. It is still a whack-a-mole effort.

 

The same restriction (minimum post count) usually applies to PMs. At many sites, new members can not send PMs to other members. This at least slows down the "I know a guy who has the item you seek. Email him at ..." PMs. Again, the low quality of the member history of posts points to scammy content.

 

These restrictions are often combined with time restrictions, a week or two, or even a month. This does cut down on spam events but still does not eliminate them.

 

I don't think we have a problem here with non-SASS members buying listed items. There are a few scams involving pre-paid cards or checks for excess amounts (send me the item and I trust you to send me my change; then the card is no good or the check bounces), just have not seen those buyer scams on this forum.

 

In short, the first hurdle to starting a thread in the classified section should be member participation. The second is to reserve starting threads for paid members.

 

Unfortunately, I'm not sure this forum software is capable of these settings, and I don't think the management staff has time to actively manage these restrictions.

 

Maybe the best we can do is be vigilant, ask questions, and help new members (SASS paid or not) understand there are scammers and help them recognize bad actors.

All this makes sence.

 

What about a "verify" section or system.

 

Just an idea, but I am a new shooter, very new, first season.

 

And even I if I had to could get at least 4 members I have met in person that are active on here to vouch that I'm a real guy/member.

 

So maybe just get a single sponsor on here to affirm you.

 

A new guy can tag a member and ask for verification on his post to buy/sell. And they can say G2G or I don't know that scoundrel. 

 

Ive seen some people already pipe in on post to say the seller is stand up just to say it sonit shouldnt be a tough requirment.

 

wouldnt even need a site system.

 

just put a pinned post to explain and then if no body has vouched a post from a unknown leave it be and we as a community can mention to the poster that they need it 

 

Something like that anyway.

 

Also, just as info...if anybody wants a second opinion on a message or post I'm happy to take a look but I'm no columbo.

[Texas Maverick]

2 hours ago, jason60chev said:

25 YEARS AGO.  Want to get back in, but may have to wait 4more years.

 

That scammer guy is saying he wants to ship the item, but needs another $50,after being robbed, on way to FFL, after sending all required monies for item and shipping, before. Will just have to learn from this. he won't refund, either.

You never said what you purchased. If a gun you are probably SOL, if something else Paypal has a process to file a claim and get your money back from them.

 

TM

[John Kloehr]

34 minutes ago, One Gun Jimmy said:

Just an idea, but I am a new shooter, very new, first season.

Welcome!

 

Every now and then, there is a challenge to a for sale post to get some verification. I have done this a few times.

 

First, generally not a good idea to challenge a post if you are not interested in the item. Just report it and move on.

 

If you are interested in the item, there is nothing wrong with asking for some sort of authentication from a new member. I have done so and shortly got PMs from other members who do know and shoot with the selling party. There is nothing wrong with this. But if you do this, also be prepared for either the new poster or those who vouch for him (or both) to express some level of displeasure for you requesting authentication...

 

Hey, someone posts some great item claiming they are getting out of the sport but has never been a member of the forum? And their first post is in For Sale? Yes, I do want some sort of warm fuzzy before making a deal.

 

On this forum, we do have a "web of trust." If a long-time member with lots of quality posts says they know the new person, then I'm good. And I have closed deals under these conditions.

 

One case where I requested some authentication went sideways. Very sideways. The seller was incensed that I would possibly question a cowboy, and posted his real name, phone number, and driver's license in his for sale thread! NO!!!!!! Don't ever do that! I reported that post for the member's own good as soon as I saw it. Also asked him to take that info down. A few hours later, another member vouched for him and after feathers got unruffled, we did close a deal.

 

There are other things we can do. We can do Google image searches on any posted pics. If that cool gun was on GunBroker last year, that exact picture including the coffee table it is sitting on... For this, I might actually post in the thread for other's to be cautious. But again, I'm not the Classified Cop and would likely not do such search unless I was interested in the item. At that exact moment, I would lose all interest.

 

One thing becoming common on other forums is to ask for a fresh pic of the item, but to include a hand-written sheet of paper in the picture. The handwritten sheet should have the date (today), the screen name of the seller, and bonus or humor points for writing "I am not a scammer!"

 

OTOH, since you are a new member... If you see something you like and the seller has been a member here for some time, and made numerous posts, and a quick check shows they are quality posts with real content... Don't dawdle, great deals go fast!

[One Gun Jimmy]

56 minutes ago, John Kloehr said:

Welcome!

 

Every now and then, there is a challenge to a for sale post to get some verification. I have done this a few times.

 

First, generally not a good idea to challenge a post if you are not interested in the item. Just report it and move on.

 

If you are interested in the item, there is nothing wrong with asking for some sort of authentication from a new member. I have done so and shortly got PMs from other members who do know and shoot with the selling party. There is nothing wrong with this. But if you do this, also be prepared for either the new poster or those who vouch for him (or both) to express some level of displeasure for you requesting authentication...

 

Hey, someone posts some great item claiming they are getting out of the sport but has never been a member of the forum? And their first post is in For Sale? Yes, I do want some sort of warm fuzzy before making a deal.

 

On this forum, we do have a "web of trust." If a long-time member with lots of quality posts says they know the new person, then I'm good. And I have closed deals under these conditions.

 

One case where I requested some authentication went sideways. Very sideways. The seller was incensed that I would possibly question a cowboy, and posted his real name, phone number, and driver's license in his for sale thread! NO!!!!!! Don't ever do that! I reported that post for the member's own good as soon as I saw it. Also asked him to take that info down. A few hours later, another member vouched for him and after feathers got unruffled, we did close a deal.

 

There are other things we can do. We can do Google image searches on any posted pics. If that cool gun was on GunBroker last year, that exact picture including the coffee table it is sitting on... For this, I might actually post in the thread for other's to be cautious. But again, I'm not the Classified Cop and would likely not do such search unless I was interested in the item. At that exact moment, I would lose all interest.

 

One thing becoming common on other forums is to ask for a fresh pic of the item, but to include a hand-written sheet of paper in the picture. The handwritten sheet should have the date (today), the screen name of the seller, and bonus or humor points for writing "I am not a scammer!"

 

OTOH, since you are a new member... If you see something you like and the seller has been a member here for some time, and made numerous posts, and a quick check shows they are quality posts with real content... Don't dawdle, great deals go fast!

For sure, I've done one semi sketchy deal with a guy, friend of a friend...but worked out fine.

 

And one deal where it was obvious people new him.

 

I will say, I get having your integrity questioned dosent set well with me in person and never sets well with an older crowd we're a handshake is a bonding contract.....but over the wire, with no prior knowledge and with a guy 5 states away using an Alias....I wouldn't take it personal to want a little reassurance before in some cases dropping several thousand dollars.

 

On the flip side tho, I wouldn't ask a pard with 1000 posts about rules and regulations and an obvious long term member to prove anything without expecting to hear about it

[John Kloehr]

28 minutes ago, One Gun Jimmy said:

On the flip side tho, I wouldn't ask a pard with 1000 posts about rules and regulations and an obvious long term member to prove anything without expecting to hear about it

You fit in the "member here for a long time with lots of quality posts." I would buy from you. I also think you would buy from me.

 

But the guy who has a first post with an expensive item for sale? Or the guy with a handful or two of posts, but they are all as substantive as "I agree" or "Me too?" Frankly, the new guy with no other posts has more chance to prove up the the guy with the handfuls of worthless posts.

 

Now going a bit off-topic...

 

Even then... I arranged to buy an item, but friends of the seller introduced doubt as to the legality of a direct shipment of the item across state lines. I did want the item, a blackpowder muzzle-loading derringer kit. So I called up my most-friendly FFL and he agreed to receive it for me. All papers properly exchanged and item paid for and shipped.

 

And on arrival, my FFL charged me $10 for receiving the item, but it simply was not an item requiring an FFL, did not require a background check. I wanted the item (it is still in my safe waiting for a winter day to work on it),  so I was willing to make it work as a buyer rather than argue the seller's friends were wrong. The FFL I chose to handle this one for me is kind of special, he likes to see the cool stuff I bring in. He told me he would even accept cat litter for me for a $10 fee, as long as I use him for the cool stuff.

 

I also had a time where I was wanting to buy an item, but the seller here seemed to get me confused with someone else, or forget the item I was interested in, or something. I stopped following up. He sold it to someone else. He then sold a bunch of stuff to a bunch of other members. Fine, I'm just glad I was able to drop it without drama. I watched all those other sales go through with no problems. I consider the experience a win for everyone. He was not a scammer, but the deal with me was not working smoothly.

 

That might be another lesson for sales here. Absent bad intent, don't hold hard feelings if there is confusion or someone ends up ahead of you in line (in-thread post versus PM, seen that result in one buyer get ahead of another). I like the cowboy way here.

[One Gun Jimmy]

25 minutes ago, John Kloehr said:

You fit in the "member here for a long time with lots of quality posts." I would buy from you. I also think you would buy from me.

 

But the guy who has a first post with an expensive item for sale? Or the guy with a handful or two of posts, but they are all as substantive as "I agree" or "Me too?" Frankly, the new guy with no other posts has more chance to prove up the the guy with the handfuls of worthless posts.

 

Now going a bit off-topic...

 

Even then... I arranged to buy an item, but friends of the seller introduced doubt as to the legality of a direct shipment of the item across state lines. I did want the item, a blackpowder muzzle-loading derringer kit. So I called up my most-friendly FFL and he agreed to receive it for me. All papers properly exchanged and item paid for and shipped.

 

And on arrival, my FFL charged me $10 for receiving the item, but it simply was not an item requiring an FFL, did not require a background check. I wanted the item (it is still in my safe waiting for a winter day to work on it),  so I was willing to make it work as a buyer rather than argue the seller's friends were wrong. The FFL I chose to handle this one for me is kind of special, he likes to see the cool stuff I bring in. He told me he would even accept cat litter for me for a $10 fee, as long as I use him for the cool stuff.

 

I also had a time where I was wanting to buy an item, but the seller here seemed to get me confused with someone else, or forget the item I was interested in, or something. I stopped following up. He sold it to someone else. He then sold a bunch of stuff to a bunch of other members. Fine, I'm just glad I was able to drop it without drama. I watched all those other sales go through with no problems. I consider the experience a win for everyone. He was not a scammer, but the deal with me was not working smoothly.

 

That might be another lesson for sales here. Absent bad intent, don't hold hard feelings if there is confusion or someone ends up ahead of you in line (in-thread post versus PM, seen that result in one buyer get ahead of another). I like the cowboy way here.

Appreciate the vote of confidence...might need it I'm about to post a gun for sale hahaha.

And agreed I'd ship my money to you no worries.

 

And there is always the chance of confusion of an "oops" if you will.

 

And I think any member deserves the benefit of the doubt that a transgression was an honest mistake vs I'll intent.

 

No different then a missed call or something at a shoot.

 

That's the cowboy way, but if someone is found to be less than honorable a cowboy has the right to call a spade a spade in my humble opinion. 

 

[Cholla]

On 7/21/2023 at 2:20 PM, jason60chev said:

I wish to bring attention to a member, VICTORH (victorherrera32901@gmail.com).

but did send a copy of his Texas driver's license. That seemed ok.

 

Paypal email, which wasn;t his name.

 

Any ideas how I can report him to his local police department?

1. You don't know the Texas driver's license is actually the "seller". Most likely it is not the actual "seller" and the license was ripped from some other site. This is very common and exactly why he didn't fulfill your other requests.

2. Was the transaction via PayPal Friends and Family? If so, you are SOL. That is the same as sending cash. The F&F feature is to be used for sending money for birthdays, college book money, etc to friends and family, as in people you know and trust, not some dude selling something on the 'web.

3. Which police department? The PD in the town from the fake driver's license?

 

Sending money to someone you don't know using any cash app (Venmo, Zelle, PayPal, ApplePay, BitCoin, etc.) is risky. All of them are the same as handing cash to someone in a trench coat in a dark alley hoping he returns with the goods you wanted. It's not going to happen.

 

You will never get your goods. You will never get a refund. This is a classic scam, unfortunately. There are some that have lost thousands.

 

Posting personal information on an open forum, like this one, is asking for trouble. It is prime information for identity theft.

[Waxahachie Kid #17017 L]

A preacher once told me that you can go to hell for stealing, same as you can for killing. 

 

For me, if anyone wants me to pay for it, with anything other than a U.S. Postal money order, the red flags come right up.

Paypal is anti-gun, and won't do the transaction, unless you can somehow hide, what you are buying, from them. 

Never give out your credit-card number to someone you do not know...especially not over the internet. Maybe over the phone.

The red flags should also go up, if they contact you, right out of the blue, and you never heard of them before.

Beware the ones that offer just what you are looking for, at a better price than you have seen before. They seem to have an inventory that not even some of the big, well-known retailers, have.

In the past I have told them to ship the item C.O.D., and then I sit back and listen to them stutter and stammer. That tells me all I need to know about their honesty. 

 

I hate a thief. They not only steal an item, but they steal the precious time it took you to work, and earn the money, to buy the item. In effect, they are stealing the finite moments of your life, that you cannot ever get back again. 

I don't care if they come in my home, and steal cobwebs, if I catch them, they will be in trouble, and they won't believe what will happen next...even while it's happening!!!

 

[Eliphalet R. Moderator]

VictorH (previously known as Vicher), is not a SASS member.  He was very briefly a Wire member on July 14.  

He was listed as a scammer in the pinned and starred scammer thread in the Classified Section.

This thread has been kept active and updated for over a year.  

At this point, get the police involved.

 

The classic mode these folks use is to PM everybody who lists a WTB ad, and hope that someone bites before they get kicked off.  They can no longer contact you through the Wire.  But, if you've given them your e-mail address, they can keep going at you.

 

Every shipping service provides a tracking number FREE, once the label is printed.  

If the item was not a firearm, Paypal will issue you a refund.  If you used Paypal Friends and Family, no refund.

If it was a firearm, no refund, firearm sales are prohibited by Paypal.  

 

If you receive an unsolicited PM offer, if anything strikes you as suspicious, or even if it doesn't,  just report it by clicking the three dots in the upper right corner of any post or PM.  We'll check it out for you and let you know if we see any "Red Flags", before going any further.