John Schneider with a Colt

[Rye Miles #13621]

I think John does a good job on this.

https://boundingintocomics.com/2021/12/06/smallville-actor-john-schneider-explains-why-alec-baldwins-gun-could-not-have-misfired-without-the-actor-pulling-the-trigger/?fbclid=IwAR2Va92x5L-6etFzKPqQu137ih6JyIEpHuaH8RoABT9qL2aphvyeNdKdHoc

[Dusty Wyatt]

I agree!

[Pat Riot]

Baldwin lies for a living. He's lying now.

[Hashknife Cowboy]

All I will say is, when the day is done Mr. Baldwin is an actor. 

[Trailrider #896]

See my comments in that section of the Schneider demonstration.  I bet he didn't consciously touch his finger to the trigger when he pulled it from a crossdraw.  But I'd bet the price of a SAA that he did. We know better than (1) pointing a gun at something we don't intend to kill...no matter whether it is loaded or not (and it ALWAYS IS!); (2) letting our finger inside the guard until we are ready to shoot.  I'd score this as an AD, but since somebody was killed and another wounded, it may go down as involuntary manslaughter.  But that is for the authorities, etc. to decide.  Regardless, it won't bring the lady back! 

[John Kloehr]

4 minutes ago, Trailrider #896 said:

..  I'd score this as an AD, but since somebody was killed and another wounded, it may go down as involuntary manslaughter.  But that is for the authorities, etc. to decide.  Regardless, it won't bring the lady back! 

Disagree on AD, I score it as ND.

 

Some degree of manslaughter is likely correct.

[Chicken Rustler, SASS #26680]

If there's no way it can fire, then why did they load 5?

[Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619]

I think 

2 hours ago, Trailrider #896 said:

  I bet he didn't consciously touch his finger to the trigger when he pulled it from a crossdraw.  But I'd bet the price of a SAA that he did. We know better than (1) pointing a gun at something we don't intend to kill...no matter whether it is loaded or not (and it ALWAYS IS!); (2) letting our finger inside the guard until we are ready to shoot.  

 

This is the case for the defense and I think it is plausible, especially with somebody unfamiliar with an SAA. 

Have none of us ever inadvertantly sent a bullet downrange prematurely, because we had a finger inside the guard and the single-action pull was light? With either revolver or semi-auto. Have we never seen a new shooter do that? I can recall twice a learning experience with a new shooter with a Ruger .22 sending a round downrange not thinking he'd even pulled the trigger. 

 

The question of whether Baldwin should have checked the gun himself is separate from whether or not he had a reasonably objective belief that the gun was not loaded. The circumstances and expectations of a movie set are not those of a range, a match, or a hunting trip, where loaded ammo is the whole point.

 

I don't think he'll be charged with any crime, and it has nothing to do with his supposed status.

[Pat Riot]

1 hour ago, Chicken Rustler, SASS #26680 said:

If there's no way it can fire, then why did they load 5?

In case you drop it and the hammer strikes a live round. It could set it off. 
Loading 5 has nothing to do with cocking the hammer because as you do a live round is rotated into position for firing… but I am not telling you anything you already know. Preaching to the choir…

[Rye Miles #13621]

49 minutes ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said:

I think 

 

This is the case for the defense and I think it is plausible, especially with somebody unfamiliar with an SAA. 

Have none of us ever inadvertantly sent a bullet downrange prematurely, because we had a finger inside the guard and the single-action pull was light? With either revolver or semi-auto. Have we never seen a new shooter do that? I can recall twice a learning experience with a new shooter with a Ruger .22 sending a round downrange not thinking he'd even pulled the trigger. 

 

The question of whether Baldwin should have checked the gun himself is separate from whether or not he had a reasonably objective belief that the gun was not loaded. The circumstances and expectations of a movie set are not those of a range, a match, or a hunting trip, where loaded ammo is the whole point.

 

I don't think he'll be charged with any crime, and it has nothing to do with his supposed status.

He specifically said he DID NOT pull the trigger ! He’s lying through his teeth! Sure we’ve all had accidental discharges but I don’t think any of us would say “We never pulled the trigger”

Hes a lying scumbag period !

[Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619]

We might have said we didn't think we had pulled the trigger.

 

I suppose the prosecutor's opinion and analysis will matter more than ours....

[Widder, SASS #59054]

Regardless what WE mostly think might have happened,  that particular pistol will be put thru some VERY 'iffy' testing to

triple check all the variables that could have happened.

 

If they can't get the hammer to fall without pressing on the trigger, then MR B will be in deep doo doo, more so than he is now.

 

..........Widder

 

[Smokin Gator SASS #29736]

If he was practicing drawing and cocking the hammer, assuming he tried more then once, how did he lower the hammer?

 

In interviews before the two people were shot, he listed expertise in guns and gun handling as one of the sets of talent he brings to the table when he is producing or acting on a set.

[Rye Miles #13621]

2 hours ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said:

We might have said we didn't think we had pulled the trigger.

 

I suppose the prosecutor's opinion and analysis will matter more than ours....

No we wouldn't have because we know better, at least I do! I don't know about you but I assume all of us KNOW how these guns work. This is total BS on Baldwin's part. 

[Widder, SASS #59054]

3 minutes ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

No we wouldn't have because we know better, at least I do! I don't know about you but I assume all of us KNOW how these guns work. This is total BS on Baldwin's part. 

 

I agree RYE.    But the ole hollywood boy has his back to the wall and the script writers can't get him out.

The more he talks, the more he has to prove that he ain't lying.

And the more he gets caught in a lie, the more it appears his actions were deliberate without fore thought of any consequences.

 

The little white spot in the middle of chicken $H!& is still $H!&.

 

..........Widder

 

[Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619]

I don't care a whit about Alec Baldwin, but I'm interested in what happened, and how it might have happened. I expect the investigating officials  and the prosecutor care mostly about that, too.

 

He said he cocked the gun; unlike a lot of pre-interview news accounts, he did not say 'it just went off'. So he admitted that his action led to the discharge, one way or another.

 

If we assume it was Christian Bale, or Thomas Haden Church, or Little Annie Fannie [name any other nice person], rather that the reviled Alec Baldwin, how would we assess it? That's all.

 

I'm too old for endless emotional condemnations of people I don't like.

[Widder, SASS #59054]

2 minutes ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said:

 

I'm too old for endless emotional condemnations of people I don't like.

 

Agree.   But, its easier on the conscience than condemning people you do like.

 

..........Widder

 

[Rye Miles #13621]

12 minutes ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said:

I don't care a whit about Alec Baldwin, but I'm interested in what happened, and how it might have happened. I expect the investigating officials  and the prosecutor care mostly about that, too.

 

He said he cocked the gun; unlike a lot of pre-interview news accounts, he did not say 'it just went off'. So he admitted that his action led to the discharge, one way or another.

 

If we assume it was Christian Bale, or Thomas Haden Church, or Little Annie Fannie [name any other nice person], rather that the reviled Alec Baldwin, how would we assess it? That's all.

 

I'm too old for endless emotional condemnations of people I don't like.

It’s not about how much I hate Baldwin it’s that he’s lying! He said he never pulled the trigger. Really? If Tom Selleck said that I wouldn’t believe him either! 

[Smokin Gator SASS #29736]

52 minutes ago, Red Gauntlet , SASS 60619 said:

I don't care a whit about Alec Baldwin, but I'm interested in what happened, and how it might have happened. I expect the investigating officials  and the prosecutor care mostly about that, too.

 

He said he cocked the gun; unlike a lot of pre-interview news accounts, he did not say 'it just went off'. So he admitted that his action led to the discharge, one way or another.

 

If we assume it was Christian Bale, or Thomas Haden Church, or Little Annie Fannie [name any other nice person], rather that the reviled Alec Baldwin, how would we assess it? That's all.

 

I'm too old for endless emotional condemnations of people I don't like.

Red.

If it was a conservative actor in Baldwins situation, how do you think Baldwin would assess it? Yeah. I don't  like Baldwin but I wouldnt support any actor who did the same actions and made the same statements and blaming anyone but himself as he has done. 

I know we still have to wait for any determination of facts or possible charges to be resolved, but Baldwin hasn't waited before pointing fingers at everyone else. 

[Capt. James H. Callahan]

One simple thing that seems to be overlooked in all these debates.....WHAT THE HELL WAS LIVE AMMO DOING ON THE SET!?!?!?!

JHC

[watab kid]

we all know how this happened - it may have been a compounding of failures but we all know the results of failing to be safe - its why we here depend on our safety measures and respect what we are handling , 

[John Kloehr]

6 hours ago, watab kid said:

we all know how this happened - it may have been a compounding of failures but we all know the results of failing to be safe - its why we here depend on our safety measures and respect what we are handling , 

None of those safety measures allow for us to take someone else's word for a firearm being unloaded.

[watab kid]

3 hours ago, John Kloehr said:

None of those safety measures allow for us to take someone else's word for a firearm being unloaded.

that is correct - only to verify safe chamber , but the responsibility is on the holder to know 

[Eyesa Horg]

A broken or worn sear could cause an AD when he let go of the hammer. Don't misunderstand, I'm not defending the POS Mr. B, just a possibility. Had it happen to one of my 1851's, when it went bad all you had to do was breath and the gun went off. But then I don't point it at people.

[Rye Miles #13621]

36 minutes ago, Eyesa Horg said:

A broken or worn sear could cause an AD when he let go of the hammer. Don't misunderstand, I'm not defending the POS Mr. B, just a possibility. Had it happen to one of my 1851's, when it went bad all you had to do was breath and the gun went off. But then I don't point it at people.

I’m sure if the sear was broken they would have come out with that info from the get go!

 

[Trailrider #896]

7 hours ago, Rye Miles #13621 said:

I’m sure if the sear was broken they would have come out with that info from the get go!

 

Well, they are saying the sheriff hasn't turned over all the evidence/details to the DA yet.  Maybe they are waiting to find someone who knows how to disassemble the gun and knows what to look for...