Doc Ironbeard Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 First post so be gentle. Had an opportunity to experience a SASS shoot a couple of years back and really had a good time. Now life has finally slowed down to allow me to consider jumping into this sport.....YEAH!! Right now I own a Stevens 311D 20 ga double barrel, a Henry Big Boy Steel .357/.38spl lever action and believe it or not an actual 1874 Peacemaker .45 Colt that I inherited from my FIL. So far I've traced it back through the family to a U.S. Marshal from the Oklahoma Indian Territories. Dad said he had shot it without any problems. I am going to get it authenticated, but might....maybe, possibly, consider actually shooting it with very reduced loads.....maybe. Of course not until I know it would be safe and not damage this family heirloom. OK....stupid question: is it safe and practical to shoot? Would blackpowder loads be better, correct, safe? What about the other guns I've mentioned. I'm an old fart so I'm in this for fun, not speed or competition. Thoughts, Advice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knarley Bob Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 I would relagate that gun to a lazy day at the range. Those weren't made to do the rapid fire at matches. It would be fun at a match, but I wouldn't make it a habit. Oh, by the way I AM drooling Knarley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 the other guns will service you well for fun,,, Like Knarley said tho, I wud leave that Colt behind,,, cherish it's history and find a couple other revolvers to shoot SASS.. and yes. I'm drooling too!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickel City Dude Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 Seeing that it is an 1875 I would think that Black powder is the only thing you would want to use in it. If you want a gun for CAS you would be better using a Uberti or Ruger reproduction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackey Cole Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 I pair of Rugers would be better since you need two revolvers and matching works better.the Sgt and rifle will get you started but the fifle needs to be upgraded to something better suited for the game a Winchester or Marlin in pistol caliber anything except the 94 Winchester should work well the only problem I see with the sh is the gauge it's hard to find ammo suited for the game in 20. But like I said they will work until you can get better if you stay with us. You'll also need a gun cart and leather. Check here in the classifieds for everything you need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog McCoy SASS #5672 Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 Do a bit of looking around for Low Noise Low Recoil AA shotgun shells in 20ga.(Item #:AA20FL8) I have 3 cases and they are available as I have been using them for years. http://www.academy.com/shop/pdp/winchester-aa-low-recoil-20-gauge-8-shotshells The henry will work for now since you already have it and your just need a couple revolvers in the same caliber as your rifle as it makes things easy. Good Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Ironbeard Posted November 16, 2016 Author Share Posted November 16, 2016 Thanks.....yeah I really don't want to harm the Colt. But I am totally itching to actually fire it. This pistol might actually be a battlefield "take away" or stolen from the Army as all the serial numbers match. This particular Army Colt pistols were re-arsenalled in the late 1800's, barrels shortened and then reassembled but with no regard for serial numbers. It has received "field" modifications: i.e. barrel shortened, however....the serial number of my Peacemaker actually falls within the possible range of having been issued to elements of the U.S. 7th Cavalry. No....B.S., but until I get the pistol authenticated I don't know for certain. So far I've only been able to trace it back to just before the turn of the century and in the general number range of the U.S. Cavalry issue, if I remember correctly the 6th & 7th Cavalry units. The other piece that I inherited is a Colt 1911 "C' model .45 ACP., that is the "Civilian" sale model of the original .45 Automatic.....so actually made around 1911 and I think "Wild Bunch" eligible? As for 20 gauge rounds, I reload so that aspect is taken care of, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 Doc, Yes, that 1911 is probably WB legal. However, like that SAA, keep it for mild range time. With the family history, both are irreplaceable. Get some modern guns for this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rio Brazos Kid Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 A bit of advise from another old shooter is to purchase a set of SASS Rugers, (Vaqueros), in 357 cal. They usually work very well right out of the box. Most they might need is spring kits to ease cocking and trigger pull, and they are match ready. They are built like tanks, and will most likely last you a lifetime. You then can use the same ammo in your pistols and rifle, which is a great way to do it. RBK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Ironbeard Posted November 16, 2016 Author Share Posted November 16, 2016 You then can use the same ammo in your pistols and rifle, which is a great way to do it. RBK That's what I was thinking. Also if the War Department (Dearest Wife) gets involved she could use .38 light loads which would be a more manageable recoil for her much smaller stature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chili Ron Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 Howdy, That Colt is a little piece of history and relatively fragile. If it goes to the range and if it gets just one round of full speed modern ammo accidentially fired in it, you could well have junk in place of it. Also I would be very concerned about theft. A good friend had a nice old colt grabbed at a gun show. He had an offer on the colt but was just a little greedy and wanted more. He did something else for a minute and the old colt was poooof gone. Careful. Best CR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 First post so be gentle. Welcome Desert Doc! I hope I can safely say the Wire is a bit milder than its reputation. If anyone is rude, they will have to answer to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Ironbeard Posted November 16, 2016 Author Share Posted November 16, 2016 Howdy, That Colt is a little piece of history and relatively fragile. If it goes to the range and if it gets just one round of full speed modern ammo accidentially fired in it, you could well have junk in place of it. Also I would be very concerned about theft. A good friend had a nice old colt grabbed at a gun show. He had an offer on the colt but was just a little greedy and wanted more. He did something else for a minute and the old colt was poooof gone. Careful. Best CR DANG! Hadn't thought about theft! Well it's probably best that it goes back into the safe.....sniff. THANKS Allie Mo......man that is one mean looking nun!! I'm scared straight!! No wonder my Catholic school friends were so well behaved. I'm new to this arena and don't want to be the newbie asking the stupid questions, so I do try to search for answers first, but sometimes my "Google-Fu" is weak. THANKS AGAIN!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 Actually, I look more like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Riot Posted November 16, 2016 Share Posted November 16, 2016 Desert Doc, Ask away. No one will flame you here for being part of the fun...If they do we have Allie Mo to keep them in check. She wields a mean stick! Seriously, ask away. As my Aunt used to say "The only stupid questions are the ones that aren't asked". Welcome! Regards, Pat Riot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innocent Bystander SASS #24171 Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 A friend of mine had a Colt SAA Frontier Six Shooter that he dated to 1878. This is way back when about 45 years ago. We used to shoot it with modern 44-40 hunting loads with not a thought about the fact that it might just give way. Guess we were lucky as it never gave a bit of trouble. It was stolen a few years later and has never shown up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Ironbeard Posted November 17, 2016 Author Share Posted November 17, 2016 There's a guy in Redding, Ca that is supposed to be the Subject Matter Expert on authenticating these old Colts. The Peacemaker is an "1874" Colt and the .45 is a 1915 "Civilian" Colt 1911. FIL told me he had shot the revolver and I've regularly taken the 1911 "C" to the range. It's an awesome piece. But I wouldn't want either of these family heirlooms to grow legs and I definitely would never want to damage the Peacemaker!! So I will probably authenticate it and retire it. Such a shame when you think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abe E.S. Corpus SASS #87667 Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 I don't own a Colt SAA but I've read some articles about which of them can be safely fired with "standard pressure" smokeless ammo. I seem to remember reading that Colt did not pronounce them safe with smokeless ammo for some time after smokeless powder became commercially available. I'm not a collector so if a mechanically sound Colt SAA found its way to me I would shoot it. I can understand, though, how a family heirloom might be different from a used gun picked up from wherever. Welcome aboard, by the way. The best way to get started is to get started. Just get your carcass to a match. Bring what you have, even if it's just a good attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innocent Bystander SASS #24171 Posted November 17, 2016 Share Posted November 17, 2016 Thanks.....yeah I really don't want to harm the Colt. But I am totally itching to actually fire it. This pistol might actually be a battlefield "take away" or stolen from the Army as all the serial numbers match. This particular Army Colt pistols were re-arsenalled in the late 1800's, barrels shortened and then reassembled but with no regard for serial numbers. It has received "field" modifications: i.e. barrel shortened, however....the serial number of my Peacemaker actually falls within the possible range of having been issued to elements of the U.S. 7th Cavalry. No....B.S., but until I get the pistol authenticated I don't know for certain. So far I've only been able to trace it back to just before the turn of the century and in the general number range of the U.S. Cavalry issue, if I remember correctly the 6th & 7th Cavalry units. You might want to consider that if you can get provenance that places this revolver with the 7th Cavalry, it might be worth in the five figures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff Posted November 18, 2016 Share Posted November 18, 2016 Don't you mean a model 1873? Or, as some purists would say, a Model P. According to my source, hard rubber grips weren't offered until 1882.-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Ironbeard Posted November 18, 2016 Author Share Posted November 18, 2016 Yes the Colt is a Model 1873, however as far as I've been able to ascertain it was manufactured in 1874. (1873 serial nos: 1 to 199, 1874 serial nos: 200 to 15,999) and was most likely part of the Lot 6 - (1000 revolvers, estimated serial numbers 5522-6530, (my Colt is ser# 6404) received at the Springfield Armory February 17, 1874. (Although shipping records are incomplete, it is almost conclusive, some guns from this range were issued to the 7th Cavalry for Companies D and I, which included turn-ins from Company K.)My FIL was given this revolver from his FIL who purchased it from a gent that went by the name of "Buck" Denny (spelling?) who back in the day was some sort of sheriff or lawman from the Oklahoma Territory around the turn of the century. Exact dates are uncertain as is the name of the "original" civilian owner in this particular historical chain of events.The barrel shortening was an obvious "field" job and not part of any rearsenal modification, by virtue of the crude file work of the front sight and the fact that all the serial numbers on this pistol match. It could have been done by the "Sheriff" during his ownership. The grips are excessively worn smooth but in pretty good shape over all for their age and use, but probably not original to the pistol. Because of the matching numbers I suspect that this pistol was either a battlefield take away or possibly liberated from the Army at some point. Hard to say until I learn more.A information letter was sent to Colt back in 2006, but they replied that they didn't have any information available on this particular revolver. I don't know if it would be worth a second attempt to see if they might have "found" other documents since that time. There is a Colt Peacemaker expert in Redding, Ca. about and hour and a half north of me. I need to run it up and have it evaluated by him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allie Mo, SASS No. 25217 Posted November 18, 2016 Share Posted November 18, 2016 .... There is a Colt Peacemaker expert in Redding, Ca. about and hour and a half north of me. I need to run it up and have it evaluated by him. Hey Doc! You aren't too far from where I shoot. Check out this Website for clubs in No. CA. http://www.californiagunslingers.com/ I usually shoot the first Saturday at Diamond Dick's Cowboy Town. Hope to see you there sometime. Also, the CA State Matches will be there at the end of April.. Regards, Allie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted November 18, 2016 Share Posted November 18, 2016 Put the old Colt away and buy a couple modern revolvers. Not quite as nice as yours, but I've shot my 1st gen, born in 1876, in ONE match, just to say I did it. It was shot slow and deliberate with 230 grain bullets and the reduced military load of black powder from later years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Ironbeard Posted November 18, 2016 Author Share Posted November 18, 2016 Yeah J-Bar, that's probably what I'm going to do as well. Take it out once to shoot it, then retire it for the next generation it gets handed down to. If only pistols could talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Foot Johnson Posted November 18, 2016 Share Posted November 18, 2016 Mine was found under the mattress of a dead drifter who went by the name "Soapy Smith" in a hotel in Butte, MT back in 1931 or 1932 - not THE Soapy Smith though. I ordered a Colt letter and found it had no special known provenance - it was one in a shipment of fifty sent to Schuyler, Hartley, & Graham sporting goods company in New York City on October 18, 1876. How it got to Elk Park/Butte Montana is anybody's guess. The front sight is a dovetailed base with a blade fashioned from a piece of a Liberty half-dollar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Ironbeard Posted November 19, 2016 Author Share Posted November 19, 2016 Now that's some cool history J Bar! Love the leather. Looks like it stepped right off a cattle drive. Sweet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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