Morgun Play Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Stage description calls for staging long guns on horse, pistols holstered. No mention of where to re-stage long guns.Can long guns be safely re-staged on table as well as horse? Table and horse are in front of shooting position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Were the long guns safe? Then, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokestack SASS#87384 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Perfect example of why I use the words "make safe" when I write stages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodyMaverick Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 It is best to pose the question at the end of the reading of the stage instructions. Then everyone can benefit from the answer and it will save time and frustration later when someone is trying to determine if you deserve a penalty for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Perfect example of why I use the words "make safe" when I write stages. Do you also tell them to pick up their long guns and take them to the unloading table? If they need to be told to make them safe, maybe they're too unsafe to be shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Dave Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Wide variety of folks playing this game, from young to old, to new to the game to seasoned hands. While many of us understand that no specified place to restage a long gun means 'make safe anywhere' there are those who can benefit from having those few extra words in the stage description. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rio Brazos Kid Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 If the instructions didn't specifically state to make safe back on the horse, then no, you can make them safe on anything available, such as the table you describe. It's really quicker, easier, and usually safer to make safe on a table or shelf, than on a horse, as sometimes those horses can allow a gun to fall, if not carefully placed. RBK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Stage description calls for staging long guns on horse, pistols holstered. No mention of where to re-stage long guns.Can long guns be safely re-staged on table as well as horse? Table and horse are in front of shooting position. REF: STAGE CONVENTION #6 SHB p.22 RO1 p.14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 GREAT alias, BTW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widder, SASS #59054 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Did any of you notice 'HE' used red ink? ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Did any of you notice 'HE' used red ink? ..........Widder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flying W Ramrod Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Do you also tell them to pick up their long guns and take them to the unloading table? If they need to be told to make them safe, maybe they're too unsafe to be shooting. Actually, this term is used to mean, stage/restage them where you will as long as it's safe. Not instructing the shooter to make them safe as in, "rifle staged safely at position 1". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgun Play Posted October 3, 2016 Author Share Posted October 3, 2016 Thanks to all that replied. I was called for a P by the T.O. For restaging my rifle on the table. I made my argument to the M. D. Using the stage conventions rules and the penalty was overturned. Just didn't want the win if I was wrong about the understanding of the rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight Arrow Hombre Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Perfect example of why I use the words "make safe" when I write stages. Unfortunately not every shooter knows the stage conventions and these few words answer their questions. Easy fix that doesn't make the stage description too wordy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Actually, this term is used to mean, stage/restage them where you will as long as it's safe. Not instructing the shooter to make them safe as in, "rifle staged safely at position 1". I refer you to post #8 above by PWB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Unfortunately not every shooter knows the stage conventions and these few words answer their questions. Easy fix that doesn't make the stage description too wordy. So, if they don't know the stage conventions, every stage description needs to list them all? Or where do you draw the line? Tell them to make the long gun safe or shotguns are staged open and empty. Or revolvers are returned to leather after the shooting string? Knowing to make the long guns safe is one of the simplest things they need to learn to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Ranger, 48747L Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 at some point folks need to use their brains for things other than keeping their head from collapsing cr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sloe Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 At some point new shooters should be referred to the SHB. Nuf said, BS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jefro, SASS#69420 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Did any of you notice 'HE' used red ink? ..........Widder Maybe cause it's his birthday and he's just seeing red. Happy Birthday PW So, if they don't know the stage conventions, every stage description needs to list them all? Or where do you draw the line? Tell them to make the long gun safe or shotguns are staged open and empty. Or revolvers are returned to leather after the shooting string? Knowing to make the long guns safe is one of the simplest things they need to learn to begin with. Ta Daaaa!! We usually mention Stage Conventions at the safety briefing Any questions If I have to write one in then I would need to include them all...like default start position "upright-hands by side-no crouching tiger" That's why I only use 4 not 4+ for a four target shotgun round count, the Stage Conventions tell us we can shoot till down. The only time I write in "make safe" is when there is downrange movement and the need to take it with you. Also there is a note at the bottom of the stages that says sumpin' like...."Note; sweeps may go in either direction, Nevada sweep from either end". This allows the left hander, two handed, duelist, DD style, GFer the option to shoot the stage that best suits their category and transitions. Beats the #&!! out of "Start on the left" Start on the left" Start on the left" ....Good Luck Jefro Relax-Enjoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight Arrow Hombre Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Knowing to make the long guns safe is one of the simplest things they need to learn to begin with. You'd think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Kid Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 Thanks to all that replied. I was called for a P by the T.O. For restaging my rifle on the table. I made my argument to the M. D. Using the stage conventions rules and the penalty was overturned. Just didn't want the win if I was wrong about the understanding of the rule. The most disappointing part of this simple call is it even had to go to the match director! Why the TO couldn't grasp the simple concept is a bit baffling. Maybe he needs to get his RO1 pin current! Baffles me how some can't grasp simple English. Don't read more into the stage description than what is there, you always have to make the gun safe so there is no need to write it in, the difference between "and" and "then" is significant, and if it doesn't say you can't and there isn't a rule prohibiting it, than you can! Sheeesh! If I had a dollar for every time I got, "So can I double tap?" I'd have at least a couple monthly matches paid for by now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted October 3, 2016 Share Posted October 3, 2016 You are fortunate that the Match Director knew the rules. This is not always the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Joaquin Shootist Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 REF: STAGE CONVENTION #6 SHB p.22 RO1 p.14 I have read each page specified and don't see the reference to where a shooter may leave the firearms. Can someone enlighten me? Thanks in advance, SJS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 I have read each page specified and don't see the reference to where a shooter may leave the firearms. Can someone enlighten me? Thanks in advance, SJS That's just it. There is no specific place. As long as they are open and empty and safely pointed downrange, there is no other requirement. With all the different ranges and props around the world, there is no way to list them all. So, open and empty pointed safely downrange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jefro, SASS#69420 Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 REF: STAGE CONVENTION #6 SHB p.22 RO1 p.14 I have read each page specified and don't see the reference to where a shooter may leave the firearms. Can someone enlighten me? Thanks in advance, SJS 6. Long guns will be cleared and discarded with their barrels pointed safely down range. 17. Long guns will be cleared and discarded with their barrels pointed safely downrang Pick a spot, table, window, horse, wagon, hay bale..etc..etc. As long as it's open and empty and pointed safely down range, that's it. Good Luck Jefro Relax-Enjoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleWolf Brunelle, #2495L Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 That's just it. There is no specific place. As long as they are open and empty and safely pointed downrange, there is no other requirement. With all the different ranges and props around the world, there is no way to list them all. So, open and empty pointed safely downrange. Fixed that for ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Joaquin Shootist Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 OK got it, thanks! Just for clarification. If the stage writer has left placement of the safe firearms after shooting them up to the shooter the following are the default positions: Pistols go back in the holsters. Long guns may be placed anywhere safe including taking it with you to the next shooting position. And if the action closes inadvertently it is OK if the firearms proves to be safe when shown clear by the shooter to the TO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boggus Deal #64218 Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 Fixed that for ya. Knew I could count on you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokestack SASS#87384 Posted October 4, 2016 Share Posted October 4, 2016 OK got it, thanks! Just for clarification. If the stage writer has left placement of the safe firearms after shooting them up to the shooter the following are the default positions: Pistols go back in the holsters. Long guns may be placed anywhere safe including taking it with you to the next shooting position. And if the action closes inadvertently it is OK if the firearms proves to be safe when shown clear by the shooter to the TO. Action closing does not have to be inadvertently. Intentional closing is ok, so long as it is cleared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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