Dred Bob Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 just finishing my first year with SASS along with a close friend. I've handloaded pistol/rifle for many many years so picking that up for SASS wasn't an issue although I've had to recently upgrade to a Dillon Progressive after managing with just a single stage Rock Chucker those many years. There's a lot of shooting in SASS and the occasional Wild Bunch match and keeping us both supplied has been a challenge on the green machine. We've been using factory 12ga (Remington Field & Target 7.5 2 3/4"). We've saved all the hulls so have a pretty good stash although I understand that they're not the preferred AA's that most shooters seem to like for quick shucking. I recently found 8lb jugs of TiteGroup powder for sale locally for what is now an incredibly reasonable $220 ea. We bought them out so guess what my powder for Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun is going to be for the next few years? I've been using TiteGroup for SASS Pistol/Rifle anyways so shotgun is the next application. My buddy got a good deal on a MEC 9000 (actually a pair of them) but neither of us have ever loaded shotgun let alone setup a progressive shotgun press. What little I've read leads me to think it can be much more complicated than loading brass with the extra components and tailoring the wad to the amount of powder / hull size / shot size / shot amount etc (stack?). Looking to get ahead of the curve to see if anybody here has a MEC setup around TiteGroup, ~1oz 7.5 shot, guessing ~16gr powder, and 2 3/4" hulls. Assuming we can even assemble a working cartridge on our own I think we'd spend months trying to work out a good setup/recipe without some input. I've also read mixed messages on other forums about using TiteGroup on lighter lead loads like 7/8oz but wasn't sure if that really impacts our type of shooting. We're not exactly knocking down clays in the air. We don't need mouse loads and it's been kind of handy having full loads for some of the knockdowns we've run into even if I occasionally sport some interesting colors on my shoulder for the next week. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Maverick Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 (edited) Well I have the Mec9000E and load all my shells on it. However, I use Clay Dot for my powder. You are going to need to find out which powder bushing throws the right amount of powder you decide to shoot. I don't know much about TiteGroup for shotshells. Hopefully someone else on the forum can help with that. I shoot 7/8 oz shot with a reddish pink wad. I only load STS or AA hulls. I would recommend you find someone in your area that loads shotshells and get them to assist in getting your 9000 tweaked to meet your loads. You will have to fine tune it to get the proper crimp on them but once it is set you should be good to go without any further issues. I love my 9000 and can load a bunch in a matter of minutes. Good luck on your pursuit of reloading shotshells. TM Edited September 29 by Texas Maverick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 (edited) I don't load with Tightgroup or load on a MEC 9000 so can't help you with that powder or that press. However, here are some comments: You will like 7/8 oz loads. Certainly load 7/8 or 3/4 oz loads. Keep a couple game loads on your shotgun belt for those knockdown targets that need a little extra push. #7 1/2 shot is fine but smaller shot works for CAS if you can't find #7 1/2. I often load with #8 1/2 or reclaimed shot. Clay & Field hulls are good for CAS. Those are what my wife will shoot at Land Run and Bordertown. I will shoot STS and Nitro reloads. For local matches I shoot Gun Club reloads. (We shoot back powder, so we toss hulls after a single firing. We consume many hulls.) You can load C&F, STS, Nitro and Gun Club hulls with the same recipes. Gun Clubs are abundant on clays ranges for free pickup. I also load black AA hulls for CAS. Cheddite 209 primers are relatively inexpensive and work well for CAS. Winchester 209s are currently available online if you prefer American-made primers. 8-lbs is not a lot of powder when loading shotshells. You will be surprised how quickly your jug empties. Edited September 29 by Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 more info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted September 29 Author Share Posted September 29 We were going to use the hulls we saved but if they're an issue we'll switch. Before I started researching the loads I picked up some 3/4 oz claybuster pink wads and 7.5 shot because that's all they had. Also picked up CCI 209's since that's what they had. I thought it would be that simple, just add powder and mix. My guess was that it would be about 14gr starting but I really don't have a clue so I don't want to start there. I was hoping for some real world experience here. I've seen some guys mention 16gr for 1 oz for skeet etc but nothing about wads. I'm pretty clueless about how to build these loads and setup the MEC. I bought several 8 lb jugs of TiteGroup. I didn't see anything else there in bulk (or price) that would be good for SASS or Shotgun. A lot of guys shooting at our club like Red Dot but I've only managed to snag 1 lb in over a year of looking for it locally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leroy Luck Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 You will probably find somewhere or may already know. But Hodgdon had made a powder by the name of High Gun. It is the same as titegroup with a different name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade Plowboy Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 (edited) I’m not familiar with the Remington hull you mentioned, but if it’s ribbed and like the Remington Gun club hull you should be fine. 16.5 grns of Titegroup with 1 oz shot was my trap 16-20 yard line round of choice. Worked pretty good all the way back to the 27 as well, when just havin fun. In fact Dad and Mom are still using that load. It’s no mouse fart load, but it’s pretty soft. I experimented down to 13 grns for cowboy and it worked fine as I remember, but I ended up with a different powder and different load that I’m happier with. I was trying out a few different powders at that time so I forget where I liked the Tite Group best. I also prefer the Claybuster CB 8100-12 wad for my 1 oz loads. It’s the Remington Figure 8 replacement wad for 1 oz. It’s light green. I can source them for you if you need, but won’t be around till November Stoney Bottom. However the normal Claybuster 1 oz wad should work as well. I nor my dad, nor my guns are primer snobs. Never have been with shotgun. Whatever is cheapest works. Your CCI’s are fine. I hate the Fiocchi (spelling) shotgun primer packaging with a passion, and they might be the largest diameter primer as well. So they would be a last resort. Edited September 29 by Renegade Plowboy Addition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 MEC has some videos regarding loading on their equipment. View them to learn how to setup and load on your press. Your C&F hulls will make good CAS ammo. https://hodgdonreloading.com/ has some 1 oz loads using Remington hulls, CCI primers and High Gun powder. RP, C&F hulls are smooth and not ribbed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted September 29 Author Share Posted September 29 Turns out that the Hodgdon website has Loaddata for TiteGroup shotgun using lead shot. Not many recipes but they publish 1 oz and 1 1/8 oz recipes for Rem 2 3/4" hulls. They list two wads WAA12SL & TGT 12 with powder ~16 to 20 gr. They have a recipe for 1 1/8 oz loads using WAA12 & FIG 8 with powder ~14 to 18 gr. Looks like I can start with 1 oz / 16 gr Titegroup with either of those wads. Since they only specify weight for lead shot I'm assuming the size doesn't matter and I can use the 7.5. our Rem shotshells are green with ribs. We'll try them. The recipes also list Nitro 27 & Gun Club 1 hour ago, Renegade Plowboy said: I’m not familiar with the Remington hull you mentioned, but if it’s ribbed and like the Remington Gun club hull you should be fine. 16.5 grns of Titegroup with 1 oz shot was my trap 16-20 yard line round of choice. Worked pretty good all the way back to the 27 as well, when just havin fun. In fact Dad and Mom are still using that load. It’s no mouse fart load, but it’s pretty soft. I experimented down to 13 grns for cowboy and it worked fine as I remember, but I ended up with a different powder and different load that I’m happier with. I was trying out a few different powders at that time so I forget where I liked the Tite Group best. I also prefer the Claybuster CB 8100-12 wad for my 1 oz loads. It’s the Remington Figure 8 replacement wad for 1 oz. It’s light green. I can source them for you if you need, but won’t be around till November Stoney Bottom. However the normal Claybuster 1 oz wad should work as well. I nor my dad, nor my guns are primer snobs. Never have been with shotgun. Whatever is cheapest works. Your CCI’s are fine. I hate the Fiocchi (spelling) shotgun primer packaging with a passion, and they might be the largest diameter primer as well. So they would be a last resort. RP, Sounds like what I found online you've already tested. Maybe by the Nov match I'll have some test loads up and ready for the match, I'll find you at the match to talk shop. Look for me or Brimstone there. His MEC was a good deal? well used but kind of a mess in a box so we're still figuring out how it goes together and whether any pieces are missing. then there's actually trying to use it. Plenty of challenges yet to get a working shot through a barrel. BTW, I think we just shot at your home club (Firelands) last weekend? Had a great time shooting there. My main reason(s) for pushing the TiteGroup are A ) It was available AND in Qty locally, we got 24 lbs of it. B ) it was the cheapest powder I've seen in 5 years at $28 / lb in bulk. That's a winning combination as long it goes bang and the KD's fall. Looking for a sanity check since I'm in totally uncharted water for us and this isn't a common load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGT. ELI 35882 GUNFIGHTER Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 I run 1 oz. 7.5 shot, claybuster grey wads, and 13 grains Titegroup. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted September 29 Author Share Posted September 29 (edited) 3 hours ago, Leroy Luck said: You will probably find somewhere or may already know. But Hodgdon had made a powder by the name of High Gun. It is the same as titegroup with a different name. I ran the LoadData on the Hodgdon website for High Gun. It had the same recipes as TiteGroup + a few more with a couple of other Primers and Wads. But almost identical loads. I wonder why TiteGroup wouldn't be listed with the other wads and primers as High Gun. Did they get tired of testing or is it possible that the powder doesn't work with the other wads and/or primers? edit : found this assuming you can believe anything you read on the internet in a forum https://www.trapshooters.com/threads/titegroup-versus-high-gun.937746/ and closer to home.... Edited September 29 by Dred Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
August West, SASS #45079 Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 (edited) Shotshell loading is all about stack height of the powder/wad/shot column. Since Titegroup/HighGun is a dense powder, it takes small amounts for a proper load. I have been using Titegroup/HighGun for skeet shooting this past year as traditional shot shell powders have become difficult to locate. When using Titegroup/HighGun, I have found it necessary to use a wad that is designated for less shot than I'm actually using, in order to get a proper shot column. In other words, I use a 7/8 oz wad for 1 oz loads and a 3/4 oz wad for 7/8 oz loads. You could otherwise resort to some kind of filler, but that will significantly slow the loading process. So, my skeet load is 16.9 grains of Titegroup/HighGun (MEC bushing # 16) in a Remington Gun Club hull with 7/8 oz of shot with a Claybuster CB0175-12 wad, which is designated as a 3/4 oz wad. The crimps are perfect with this load and it works every time, assuming I have the gun pointed at the target (tenuous assumption). I use this load interchangeably in Remington Gun Club, Nitro 27, and STS hulls with no adjustments necessary. Trying to use this load in AA hulls has required several adjustments to the press -- which is undesirable. Having used Titegroup/HighGun for several thousand skeet loads, the results have been excellent. Hodgdon shows loads for Titegroup/HighGun on their site. You're on your own to experiement with lighter loads. Edited September 29 by August West, SASS #45079 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade Plowboy Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 17 minutes ago, Dred Bob said: RP, Sounds like what I found online you've already tested. Maybe by the Nov match I'll have some test loads up and ready for the match, I'll find you at the match to talk shop. Look for me or Brimstone there. His MEC was a good deal? well used but kind of a mess in a box so we're still figuring out how it goes together and whether any pieces are missing. then there's actually trying to use it. Plenty of challenges yet to get a working shot through a barrel. BTW, I think we just shot at your home club (Firelands) last weekend? Had a great time shooting there. My main reason(s) for pushing the TiteGroup are A ) It was available AND in Qty locally, we got 24 lbs of it. B ) it was the cheapest powder I've seen in 5 years at $28 / lb in bulk. That's a winning combination as long it goes bang and the KD's fall. Looking for a sanity check since I'm in totally uncharted water for us and this isn't a common load. I’ve been loading shotshell since I was barely a teenager. I think it’s easier than cartridges and what we are trying to do with each! 16 grains of Tite Group with whatever 1 oz Wad is for your hulls with 1 oz of whatever size lead shot will work. The important thing is to have the corrected wad base for the style hull your reloading. Some hulls are straight up and down internally (most elcheapos) verses tapered hulls towards the bottom (AA, STS, Nitro). Sealing the powder for consistent ignition is key. With my current load, the figure 8 was has less felt recoil (in my opinion) than the standard wad style. Either wad with a 1 oz load will be considerably softer than your current factory 1 1/8 oz load! I’ve only ever shot with the Sandusky County Regulators currently. However Firelands appears to be closer, but I haven’t been free on their Saturday to go. Been invited lots of times, and someday I’ll get that chance and capitalize on it. Seems a while back here on the wire load data, and sharing it, became a HUGE topic for a bit. Tite Group to me seems like it has always gotten a lot of attention in those threads. But it’s been awhile now. I think a shooter by the name Fretless (could be totally wrong on the name) had a post about Tite Group for shotshells that got a lot of responses as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 1 hour ago, Dred Bob said: Looks like I can start with 1 oz / 16 gr Titegroup with either of those wads. Since they only specify weight for lead shot I'm assuming the size doesn't matter and I can use the 7.5. A MEC charge bar will throw slightly different weights of shot depending on shot size. Without bothering with details, you can load #7 1/2 shot safely using Hodgdon's load data. After you load your shells, check them with a gauge. They may be oversize and unsuitable for CAS. Slix makes a device for fixing bulging shells. A properly adjusted press will produce shells that work for CAS. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted September 29 Author Share Posted September 29 (edited) 1 hour ago, Renegade Plowboy said: I’ve been loading shotshell since I was barely a teenager. I think it’s easier than cartridges and what we are trying to do with each! 16 grains of Tite Group with whatever 1 oz Wad is for your hulls with 1 oz of whatever size lead shot will work. The important thing is to have the corrected wad base for the style hull your reloading. Some hulls are straight up and down internally (most elcheapos) verses tapered hulls towards the bottom (AA, STS, Nitro). Sealing the powder for consistent ignition is key. With my current load, the figure 8 was has less felt recoil (in my opinion) than the standard wad style. Either wad with a 1 oz load will be considerably softer than your current factory 1 1/8 oz load! I’ve only ever shot with the Sandusky County Regulators currently. However Firelands appears to be closer, but I haven’t been free on their Saturday to go. Been invited lots of times, and someday I’ll get that chance and capitalize on it. Seems a while back here on the wire load data, and sharing it, became a HUGE topic for a bit. Tite Group to me seems like it has always gotten a lot of attention in those threads. But it’s been awhile now. I think a shooter by the name Fretless (could be totally wrong on the name) had a post about Tite Group for shotshells that got a lot of responses as well. I'll have to have somebody show me the difference in the hulls and take a look at the ones I've saved. How do you tell which wads are for tapered vs straight once I figure out what the hull is? I think I found that topic you mentioned and Fretless mentioned having to use a Federal 209A primer with a tapered hull. I get the wad being different but how does the primer play into this? and found a good video on the tapered vs straight. Never would've ocurred to me and I can see all kinds of challenges figuring that out without this conversation Edited September 29 by Dred Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Maverick Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 This is the load a friend of mine uses with Tite Group. I use tight group for my shotgun loads and had to create my own recipe. I use AA hulls or whatever hulls work in my Dillon sl 900 shotgun loader. I shoot 7/8ths oz of #7 1/2 or #8 shot and I use 13 grains of Titegroup It chronos around 960-980 fps which is the exact same as the Winchester AA factory loads I modeled them after. I use Either Winchester 209, Cheddite 209. Clay Buster CB-0178-12 Grey in color with 4 petals Also, the MEC 9000's last stage puts a tapered crimp on the shell so you should be ok. TM 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 Posted September 29 Share Posted September 29 25 minutes ago, Dred Bob said: I'll have to have somebody show me the difference in the hulls and take a look at the ones I've saved. How do you tell which wads are for tapered vs straight once I figure out what the hull is? Here is the Claybuster website. They list wads for tapered hulls and straight-walled hulls. The Clay and Field hulls you mentioned are tapered hulls. Both Remington style and Winchester style wads work in them. Using the Hodgdon Reloading site, just select a wad they list for your chosen hull. They won't list an incorrect wad. BTW, Claybuster makes wads that are clones of ammunition manufacturer's wads. They work well and are less expensive. I just load tapered hulls and only keep wads on hand that fit them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted October 7 Author Share Posted October 7 (edited) On 9/29/2024 at 2:26 PM, Renegade Plowboy said: I’m not familiar with the Remington hull you mentioned, but if it’s ribbed and like the Remington Gun club hull you should be fine. 16.5 grns of Titegroup with 1 oz shot was my trap 16-20 yard line round of choice. Worked pretty good all the way back to the 27 as well, when just havin fun. In fact Dad and Mom are still using that load. It’s no mouse fart load, but it’s pretty soft. ... I also prefer the Claybuster CB 8100-12 wad for my 1 oz loads. It’s the Remington Figure 8 replacement wad for 1 oz. It’s light green. I can source them for you if you need, but won’t be around till November Stoney Bottom. However the normal Claybuster 1 oz wad should work as well. The recipe for TiteGroup on Hodgdon with Rem shells was "1 oz / Win 209 / WAA12SL / 16.3 gr TiteGroup" which is VERY close to your recipe. I went out this weekend purchased stuff to try that load. My first shotshell reloads ever btw. I'm using the Hodgdon recipe with CB wads CB1100-12 (WAA12SL). I measured and the shot bar is throwing 1.005 oz of 7.5 shot and a #17 bushing is throwing 16.2 gr Titegroup. I'm setup for just a hair > 40 lbs compression on the wad. However my crimp is "dished?" and if I shake the shell I get just a little rattle although no felt movement. I'll upload a picture. Is this a problem or do I need to change something like go to the "Fig 8" wad RP is using? edit : uploaded pic Edited October 7 by Dred Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted October 7 Author Share Posted October 7 On 9/29/2024 at 5:41 PM, Texas Maverick said: This is the load a friend of mine uses with Tite Group. I use tight group for my shotgun loads and had to create my own recipe. I use AA hulls or whatever hulls work in my Dillon sl 900 shotgun loader. I shoot 7/8ths oz of #7 1/2 or #8 shot and I use 13 grains of Titegroup It chronos around 960-980 fps which is the exact same as the Winchester AA factory loads I modeled them after. I use Either Winchester 209, Cheddite 209. Clay Buster CB-0178-12 Grey in color with 4 petals Also, the MEC 9000's last stage puts a tapered crimp on the shell so you should be ok. TM See my message above.... Maybe I need to use the CB0178-12 with 1 oz of shot to fill the hull? I'm not sure how this works. I'm hesitant to stray too far from the Hodgdon recipe at first and I'm not sure which dial to turn to tighten up the stack. powder / pressure / wad / shot ? also I ended up buying a used MEC Sizemaster for the reloads since my buddy with the 9000 took off for Arizona and I didn't feel like waiting. Not sure if that matters but it is a change from my original thread with 9000 setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Maverick Posted October 7 Share Posted October 7 16 minutes ago, Dred Bob said: See my message above.... Maybe I need to use the CB0178-12 with 1 oz of shot to fill the hull? I'm not sure how this works. I'm hesitant to stray too far from the Hodgdon recipe at first and I'm not sure which dial to turn to tighten up the stack. powder / pressure / wad / shot ? also I ended up buying a used MEC Sizemaster for the reloads since my buddy with the 9000 took off for Arizona and I didn't feel like waiting. Not sure if that matters but it is a change from my original thread with 9000 setup. have had most of the mec models and they are all pretty much the same but more bells and whistles on the bigger models. I have a friend that has found that if he puts a cotton ball on top of the shot just before he crimps it that it helps with any flaws he has in his crimp and prevents the shot from falling out. When he shoots it he says it looks like snow coming down. TM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted October 7 Author Share Posted October 7 (edited) the crimp actually seems good and reasonably tight it's just "pushed in" a bit. I wasn't sure how bad that is since all the factory stuff is level. I'm not concerned with shot falling out and it's not loose enough that I feel it move. it might be worth it just as a tease to the black powder shooters. lol Edited October 7 by Dred Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texas Maverick Posted October 7 Share Posted October 7 45 minutes ago, Dred Bob said: the crimp actually seems good and reasonably tight it's just "pushed in" a bit. I wasn't sure how bad that is since all the factory stuff is level. I'm not concerned with shot falling out and it's not loose enough that I feel it move. it might be worth it just as a tease to the black powder shooters. lol Go shoot some and see how it patterns and hits the knock downs. That is the test. TM 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life Posted October 7 Share Posted October 7 I don’t use TiteGroup but I do use a MEC 9000. I had dished crimps at first at 40 on the wad pressure and my solution was to back off the wad pressure to the point that the indicator just started to move which on my machine was about 30. No more ugly crimps, they are now flat and look like factory with a dime sitting flush with the end of the shell, no rattle of components when shaken and seem to work fine as long as I actually hit the target. I did have to make a tiny (and I mean tiny) adjustment to close the pinhole in the center of the crimp, which I preferred even though nothing was leaking. My recipe is 15 grains Clays, 3/4 oz shot, bright pink # CB 0175 Claybuster wad, Remington STS or Nitro hulls and a Remington 209 STS primer. Works for me. Regards Gateway Kid 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watab kid Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 nice part is there are so mANY POWDERS IN THE SAME BURN RATE THEY ARE INTERCHANGEABLE 0 JUST HAVE TO LOOK AT THE METERING Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted October 8 Author Share Posted October 8 8 hours ago, watab kid said: nice part is there are so mANY POWDERS IN THE SAME BURN RATE THEY ARE INTERCHANGEABLE 0 JUST HAVE TO LOOK AT THE METERING My issue is that I am completely new to shotshell reloading and unless I'm overthinking it I know enough to know that there's more to it than that. Managing pressure and optimizing stack size and just learned about matching wad and shell for tapered vs non-tapered and.... Change the shot charge and you can really change pressure, change the powder and density as well as rate changes which can change pressure, change the wad you can really change pressure, too loose and .... Even a change in primer brand seems to have almost as much impact has powder burn rate and density for rifle/pistol loads. Matching all of this stuff and not building a dangerous load by accident is a challenge for somebody that has never tried to load before. Since this is for SASS at least I don't really care if it is accurate or how it patterns. I just want a safe load using what's available which in my case is TiteGroup powder and Rem Gun Club (tapered 2 3/4") shells, and lead shot (req'd for SASS). The whole wad choice is very intimidating for somebody not familiar with the components. Now throw in press setup and actually building a shotshell and making sure it was assembled correctly like wad pressure, fill, crimp, and taper. Plus I remember the good old days when you could just pick a powder, primer, husk, shot, wad and go to the store and buy all the stuff you wanted. Now it's pick your top 3 choices for each, see what you can get and then try to substitute and find a combination that's close and works. Most of the people reloading have a very good understanding of how to build a load, what can be substituted, and probably have an inventory of what they like and use and just replenish it as it becomes available however briefly. If I want to load now I have to use what I can find now and probably not in a documented or optimal recipe. Then there were all the extra parts in the baggy that came with the used press I bought..... lol. Wondering where they go and what happens if I don't figure it out! I know, long reply to a short statement. But these are the things that I (over)think about since I don't have somebody looking over my shoulder to stop me from doing something stupid or wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyesa Horg Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 (edited) Due to your intrepidation, I'd see if can't find a local Pard to help you get started. Keep em at Cowboy velocities around or below 1000 fps you should be fine. Edited October 8 by Eyesa Horg Otto 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gateway Kid SASS# 70038 Life Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 Sounds like you are taking a reasonable and safe approach to shotshell reloading. I would second Eyesa’s recommendation to find a mentor (you are comfortable with) to help you get started. You are correct about component availability, but just a guess that you will come across nearly as many “off the book” recipes as “standard” ones. Differences may be small and should be approached with caution but are often the result of the experimentation you are going through now. Not saying they are 100% safe but they are fairly common. Regards Gateway Kid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abilene Slim SASS 81783 Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 (edited) Howdy Bob. If you don’t already have this, I highly recommend downloading and reading it from start to finish. Page 27 has instructions on adjusting the crimp. But repeating myself, read the whole thing before going any further. https://www.mecoutdoors.com/images/document/SR Owners Manuals/9000.pdf Also, Lyman’s Shotshell Reloading Handbook is excellent and should be required reading for newbies. It’s available from a number of online retailers. Good luck! Edited October 8 by Abilene Slim SASS 81783 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fretless Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 I load titegroup in a strait walled hull. 14.7 grains, 1oz shot. That's with a federal 209a primer (which is hotter, and will develop higher pressures, than any other 209 primer). That's in a straight walled Hull, so more space where the powder belongs. In a tapered hull that recipe should work beautifully with any common 209 primer. I believe you will find no need to go above 15 grains, and may in fact end up at 14. I am using a Mec jr. I can't help you with bushings because I have an adjustable load bar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fretless Posted October 8 Share Posted October 8 On 9/29/2024 at 4:27 PM, August West, SASS #45079 said: When using Titegroup/HighGun, I have found it necessary to use a wad that is designated for less shot than I'm actually using, in order to get a proper shot column. In other words, I use a 7/8 oz wad for 1 oz loads and a 3/4 oz wad for 7/8 oz loads This makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted October 8 Author Share Posted October 8 5 hours ago, Abilene Slim SASS 81783 said: Howdy Bob. If you don’t already have this, I highly recommend downloading and reading it from start to finish. Page 27 has instructions on adjusting the crimp. But repeating myself, read the whole thing before going any further. https://www.mecoutdoors.com/images/document/SR Owners Manuals/9000.pdf Also, Lyman’s Shotshell Reloading Handbook is excellent and should be required reading for newbies. It’s available from a number of online retailers. I'll check out the link. I did indeed buy that manual last week and read it over the weekend. 11 minutes ago, Fretless said: I load titegroup in a strait walled hull. 14.7 grains, 1oz shot. That's with a federal 209a primer (which is hotter, and will develop higher pressures, than any other 209 primer). That's in a straight walled Hull, so more space where the powder belongs. In a tapered hull that recipe should work beautifully with any common 209 primer. I believe you will find no need to go above 15 grains, and may in fact end up at 14. I am using a Mec jr. I can't help you with bushings because I have an adjustable load bar. The recipe I'm starting with is right from Hodgdon for TiteGroup so with the exception of the stack being a tiny bit loose it seems to be good. It looks like a CB 7/8oz wad is about an 1/8" taller than the 1 oz wad recommended. I loaded a couple shells swapping out that wad (loading 1 oz of shot using the longer 7/8" wad) and it solves the stack issue and the case is full and crimp where it should be. Now is that a reasonable substitute? I have a match this weekend so I'll try a few shells from both versions of the mfg load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted October 8 Author Share Posted October 8 On 9/29/2024 at 4:27 PM, August West, SASS #45079 said: When using Titegroup/HighGun, I have found it necessary to use a wad that is designated for less shot than I'm actually using, in order to get a proper shot column. In other words, I use a 7/8 oz wad for 1 oz loads and a 3/4 oz wad for 7/8 oz loads. yep, this is exactly what appears to solve my only concern with the load. I am still using the mfg recommended 16gr. I may lighten it up a little later once I'm comfortable with the load and loading the shells. 11 minutes ago, Fretless said: This makes sense. planets are aligned 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dred Bob Posted October 14 Author Share Posted October 14 Final followup. Shot our monthly match this weekend with the new loads. Found a cowboy at the match that I know has a ton of experience reloading shotgun and everything else and went over my load and had him check over the shells I made. I only had a few of the short stack rounds (5) and the rest were the final recipe using the 7/8" wads. He said the crimps on my final recipe looked good and the others would be safe if not exactly ideal. I shot them all up and they all shot well. No misses, no problem with knockdown, they sounded normal and felt just a little lighter than the factory load originally in the hulls. Perfect cartridge for me Here's the final recipe that I'll be sticking with - Remington Green Gun Club 2 3/4" - Winchester 209 primer - TiteGroup, ~16 gr (#16 MEC bushing) - 12ga, 7/8 oz, WAA12L CB0178-12 (grey), gave me the extra 1/8" for a full shell stack and tight crimp over 1oz wad - 1 oz, #7.5 soft lead shot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yohan Posted October 15 Share Posted October 15 On 9/29/2024 at 10:36 AM, Dred Bob said: just finishing my first year with SASS along with a close friend. I've handloaded pistol/rifle for many many years so picking that up for SASS wasn't an issue although I've had to recently upgrade to a Dillon Progressive after managing with just a single stage Rock Chucker those many years. There's a lot of shooting in SASS and the occasional Wild Bunch match and keeping us both supplied has been a challenge on the green machine. We've been using factory 12ga (Remington Field & Target 7.5 2 3/4"). We've saved all the hulls so have a pretty good stash although I understand that they're not the preferred AA's that most shooters seem to like for quick shucking. I recently found 8lb jugs of TiteGroup powder for sale locally for what is now an incredibly reasonable $220 ea. We bought them out so guess what my powder for Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun is going to be for the next few years? I've been using TiteGroup for SASS Pistol/Rifle anyways so shotgun is the next application. My buddy got a good deal on a MEC 9000 (actually a pair of them) but neither of us have ever loaded shotgun let alone setup a progressive shotgun press. What little I've read leads me to think it can be much more complicated than loading brass with the extra components and tailoring the wad to the amount of powder / hull size / shot size / shot amount etc (stack?). Looking to get ahead of the curve to see if anybody here has a MEC setup around TiteGroup, ~1oz 7.5 shot, guessing ~16gr powder, and 2 3/4" hulls. Assuming we can even assemble a working cartridge on our own I think we'd spend months trying to work out a good setup/recipe without some input. I've also read mixed messages on other forums about using TiteGroup on lighter lead loads like 7/8oz but wasn't sure if that really impacts our type of shooting. We're not exactly knocking down clays in the air. We don't need mouse loads and it's been kind of handy having full loads for some of the knockdowns we've run into even if I occasionally sport some interesting colors on my shoulder for the next week. Okay on the mec if you use the number 15 bushing with tite-group powder for 7/8 oz. of #8 or #7.5 shot with the grey CB-1278 you will get a very comfortable load that is roughly 910 fps. I have several people I have helped with tite-group recipes and this is a wonderful load. It never fails to knock down a shotgun target at least not yet. this load sounds like a cannon going off put the recoil is so light I can shoot it at arms length like a pistol in my SKB. **** a #15 bushing loads appx 11.7 to 11.9 grains of powder and shoots very clean. notice the recoil of my shotgun in this video it is the very load I shoot week in and week out. 20240727_105116.mp4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyesa Horg Posted October 15 Share Posted October 15 What is the difference between the CB-1278 wad you list and a ClayBusters CB0178-12? I couldn't seem to find info on the 1278. Is it slightly taller to account for the lighter load? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowtown Scout, SASS #53540 L Posted October 15 Share Posted October 15 56 minutes ago, Eyesa Horg said: What is the difference between the CB-1278 wad you list and a ClayBusters CB0178-12? I couldn't seem to find info on the 1278. Is it slightly taller to account for the lighter load? -12 is for 12 gauge 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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