Ammo

[EL LOBO TEJANO]

What kind of ammunition do you guys use to shoot your matches?

 

is there a specific projectile you fire for .357 and 12 gauge?

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

I am currently shooting 125 grain bullets in my revolvers chambered for .357 (but I shoot 38 Specials).  These a common choice though some shoot 105 grain bullets.  I carry 158 grain loads for knockdown targets.  (I shoot on windy ranges where falling targets must be set to keep wind from blowing them over.)

 

For 12-gauge I shoot 7/8 oz of birdshot (usually #8 1/2).  I load to a minimum published velocity.  I prefer smaller pellets as some pitted targets bounce pellets back in my face.  Smaller pellets hurt less.  I carry a few game loads to whack targets harder when needed.

 

I reload my ammo.  However, my wife shoots factory Winchester AA low noise, low recoil 12-gauge shells.  These are a popular choice for those who do not reload.  Winchester loads these a few times a year.  I've seen them on the shelf at Wal*Mart for $16/box - about twice the cost of promo Federal or Winchester shells.

 

I also load black powder ammo.  The specs are different than stated above.

Edited April 26 by Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971
more info

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

All lead, NO JACKETED.

Poly or moly coated is OK.

You want RNFP profile, for feeding in the rifle.

Find the lightest shotgun load you can.

 

[EL LOBO TEJANO]

 

5 minutes ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

All lead, NO JACKETED.

Poly or moly coated is OK.

You want RNFP profile, for feeding in the rifle.

Find the lightest shotgun load you can.

 

For the shot gun how do you determine it’s a light load is it the shot or the powder?

[I. M. Crossdraw, SASS# 8321]

125/130gr FP, RNFP (whichever is available projectile) 38 special.  Red Dot for propellant
12ga with 1 oz of #7, 7 1/2, 8, 8 1/2 (whichever is available shot) Red dot for propellant.

For BP, I shoot the same component except for propellant, Black powder (no subs) as propellant.

 

 

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

5 minutes ago, EL LOBO TEJANO said:

 

For the shot gun how do you determine it’s a light load is it the shot or the powder?

Less shot=less recoil 

[Garrison Joe, SASS #60708]

Quote

For the shotgun how do you determine it’s a light load is it the shot or the powder?

 

Any load that is not considered a magnum or high velocity shell by the manufacturer, and uses lead bird shot of pellet size 4 or smaller .  It's a rather loose definition.

 

Winchester used to market a 12 gauge shotshell load that went by the name of Featherlite, and now may still be around as Low Noise Low Recoil.  That was the poster child for cowboy matches.  But loads typically used for any of the major shotgun clays games would be legal.

 

Cartridges for rifle and revolvers are almost all rimmed cartridges, mostly developed before 1900,  firing lead or polymer coated bullets.  With velocities for revolvers between 400 and 1000 FPS, and rifles less than 1400 FPS.

 

The Cowboy Action Shooting rule book covers this pretty definitively.  Get your own copy from this page:

Handbooks in SASS

 

The game is largely played best by reloading.  If you don't reload, Cowboy shooting can be done, but it's sometimes difficult to find ammunition that is available and competitive.  Buying competitive ammo for the revolvers is often especially difficult.  So, most of us  reload.  But you can get started by buying lead bullet "target" ammo, but avoiding wadcutter bullet designs.  And in lever action rifles, also avoiding  semi-wadcutter (Keith style) bullets since they may not feed well.  

 

COME OUT to a local match BEFORE you start buying guns and ammo and leather, etc.  You will be surprised how many friends you will make, and how you will make much better choices!

 

good luck, GJ

 

 

Edited April 26 by Garrison Joe, SASS #60708

[EL LOBO TEJANO]

 

13 minutes ago, I. M. Crossdraw, SASS# 8321 said:

125/130gr FP, RNFP (whichever is available projectile) 38 special.  Red Dot for propellant
12ga with 1 oz of #7, 7 1/2, 8, 8 1/2 (whichever is available shot) Red dot for propellant.

For BP, I shoot the same component except for propellant, Black powder (no subs) as propellant.

 

 

Ok so if I were to go to the store look for 125/130grain flat point or round nose flat point.

 

And look for 12 gauge with #7-#8 shot?

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

6 minutes ago, EL LOBO TEJANO said:

 

For the shot gun how do you determine it’s a light load is it the shot or the powder?

Both.  A light load of shot going less that 1,000-fps is ideal.  Be flexible on the shotgun powder you select.  Many popular Alliant powders are currently unavailable.  I like Alliant Extra-Lite but will probably switch to Hodgdon Perfect Pattern when my supply of Extra-Lite is consumed.  

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

29 minutes ago, EL LOBO TEJANO said:

 

Ok so if I were to go to the store look for 125/130grain flat point or round nose flat point.

 

And look for 12 gauge with #7-#8 shot?

A local sporting goods store may only have ammo loaded with 158-grain lead bullets.  These will do but will have excessive recoil.  You could order ammo online from Cowboy Choice Ammunition, Bullets by Scarlet or Bang and Clang.  They load ammo specifically for the CAS market.  There are many casters who sell 125 grain bullets suitable for CAS.  If that is all you need ask us and we can give you the names of at least a dozen casters who can sell you cast lead bullets in the weight and profile you want.

 

You won't see much shotgun ammo loaded with #7 shot.  However, #7 1/2 and #8 are very common.  If you can tolerate the recoil, Wal*Mart 100-round bulk packs are not too expensive.  One couple I shoot with shoots these.  I only use them for busting clays.  Fiocchi makes 7/8 oz, 12-gauge Extra Low Recoil shells you can order online.  These are a possibility if you can't obtain Winchester AA low noise, low recoil shells.  You can load equivalent shells for about half the cost of these with the right equipment.

Edited April 26 by Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971

[I. M. Crossdraw, SASS# 8321]

26 minutes ago, EL LOBO TEJANO said:

 

Ok so if I were to go to the store look for 125/130grain flat point or round nose flat point.

 

And look for 12 gauge with #7-#8 shot?

I didn't mention above that most shooters reload their ammo.  You might be able to find ammo but mostly 38 specials 158gr LRN are available as factory rounds.

As I mentioned before all components are used specifically for reloading cowboy action shooting ammo.  You didn't mention if you reload.  

[I. M. Crossdraw, SASS# 8321]

19 minutes ago, Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971 said:

A local sporting goods store may only have ammo loaded with 158-grain lead bullets.  These will do but will have excessive recoil.  You could order ammo online from Cowboy Choice Ammunition, Bullets by Scarlet or Bang and Clang.  They load ammo specifically for the CAS market.  There are many casters who sell 125 grain bullets suitable for CAS.  If that is all you need ask us and we can give you the names of at least a dozen casters who can sell you cast lead bullets in the weight and profile you want.

 

You won't see much shotgun ammo loaded with #7 shot.  However, #7 1/2 and #8 are very common.  If you can tolerate the recoil, Wal*Mart 100-round bulk packs are not too expensive.  One couple I shoot with shoots these.  I only use them for busting clays.  Fiocchi makes 7/8 oz, 12-gauge Extra Low Recoil shells you can order online.  These are a possibility if you can't obtain Winchester AA low noise, low recoil shells.  You can load equivalent shells for about half the cost of these with the right equipment.

 

And this.

[EL LOBO TEJANO]

I want to reload, but don’t have the space in our tiny apartment. 
 

my dad however has a rcbs press.

 

is there a specific set of dies you would suggest?

[ORNERY OAF]

 Not sure why they are all leading you to the light, or mouse fart loads. Pooftinkers are ok but you wouldn't carry that crap in a gun fight. Load em like they did in the west, the holy black. If you reload you can shoot whatever grain or shot load you desire to just barely meet the pellet gun minimum squib loads or come to the dark side!!!! Nice, darn near case of the holy black with a good size bullet smashed on top. But beware, the holy is very addictive!!!!

[EL LOBO TEJANO]

1 hour ago, ORNERY OAF said:

 Not sure why they are all leading you to the light, or mouse fart loads. Pooftinkers are ok but you wouldn't carry that crap in a gun fight. Load em like they did in the west, the holy black. If you reload you can shoot whatever grain or shot load you desire to just barely meet the pellet gun minimum squib loads or come to the dark side!!!! Nice, darn near case of the holy black with a good size bullet smashed on top. But beware, the holy is very addictive!!!!

The holy black?

[Abilene, SASS # 27489]

The Holy Black is a term for Black Powder.  O.O. is being sort of an elitist  plenty of time for BP later (it's worth the wait).  My suggestion: to start with, order loaded .38's from Bullets by Scarlet.  You have to pay shipping, but the cost per round will likely be less because store ammo is expensive, plus it will be loaded for CAS.  Save the brass.  If you are using a side by side shotgun, in general avoid ribbed hulls and hulls with a base that is silver.  Those tend to stick in the chambers and don't shuck well.  If you can find the Winchester AA LNLR by all means get them.  They say Low Recoil Low Noise on the box but also look for 980fps.  If you can't find those, AA's that are 1 oz at 1180 fps are about the next lightest load.  1 1/8 oz at 1145fps kick harder.  You can get those loads in the Winchester white box but those will have the silver base.  If you are shooting a '97 then it will eject most anything.  Regarding your dies question, almost any dies will make decent CAS .38's.  I've used nothing but inexpensive Lee for years along with their Factory Crimp Die, and no complaints.

 

Welcome aboard and have fun!

[DeaconKC]

7 minutes ago, EL LOBO TEJANO said:

The holy black?

People who shoot only Black Powder loads use that term. Okay, reloading costs about 1/4 compared to factory loads. 38 special is the most cost effective way to shoot this game. Don't worry about super light loads at this stage. Get used to the game first and as you improve, you will then be able to go all out like the top shooters do. RNFP means round nose flat point, you want a flat point for safety of loading in our leverguns, where the nose of the bullet rides against the base of the next cartridge.

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

1 hour ago, EL LOBO TEJANO said:

I want to reload, but don’t have the space in our tiny apartment. 
 

my dad however has a rcbs press.

 

is there a specific set of dies you would suggest?

An RCBS press will do fine - just slow.  Regarding dies, RCBS makes dies specifically for cowboy action.  However, I started with a used set of Lee dies I bought for $10.  They loaded perfectly satisfactory CAS ammo.  I now load on progressive presses.

 

Reloading equipment is very durable.  Used equipment is sold at gun shows and estate sales.  There are videos on YouTube how to create small, portable loading benches.  Here is an article how to create one using a Black and Decker WorkMate.

Edited April 26 by Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971
WorkMate info

[Cholla]

I recommend going to a match and asking about reloading. Someone, if not many, will step forward to mentor you. I have offered at our club to teach anyone how to cast bullets from .38/.357 to .458 for the .45-70. The match director has offered to teach anyone to reload. I would do the same.

[Cholla]

If you posted where you live, some on here may also step forward to help.

[DeaconKC]

He said in another thread he is around Nashville TN.

[The Original Lumpy Gritz]

12 hours ago, EL LOBO TEJANO said:

 

Ok so if I were to go to the store look for 125/130grain flat point or round nose flat point.

 

And look for 12 gauge with #7-#8 shot?

You won't find that type of .38 ammo.

99.999% of cowboy shooters reload. 

[Go West]

I use Lee carbide 4 die sets that include the factory crimp die. They are the least expensive dies out there and produce quality ammo.

I would ditto the comments about loaded cowboy ammo from those companies mentioned perhaps initially.

The wife and I started with Remington 12 ga. game loads way back when and saved all the hulls. If you do buy some loaded cartridges, save your brass for later when you do reload.

You'll have a bunch of research to do starting out. It's a fun hobby and there's something for everyone.

[Sedalia Dave]

Have you read the Shooters Handbook?

 

Attend a local match. All your questions can be easily answered at a match.

 

 

[Rye Miles #13621]

I reload .38's for my .357 Colts and rifles. You pretty much have to reload for this game unless you got big bucks!! Winchester 12 guage AA's can be found but I reload those as well and so do most of the shooters. Happy hunting!!

[Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971]

Magtech sells 125 grain RNFP ammo for the CAS market.  (At 919 fps this ammo is hotter than I shoot.)  Each round costs 78 cents +shipping.  That's why most of us reload our metallic cartridge ammo.  

Edited April 26 by Edward R S Canby, SASS#59971

[ORNERY OAF]

I'm sorry, phone is horrible....the Holy Black is what we call real black powder, Goex,Shutzen, old ensford, Swiss, we like shooting it because it's what was loaded in the old west, I like it causes it goes big boom and lots smoke. When I started I went to black powder first, moonwaltz,  blackjack and a few other big smoke bangers talked me into pale Rider and I never went back. I gotta say, every aspect of this game if fun,from the old mouse fart to the big booms. And you will never find a better,more willing to help group anywhere...like everyone said, go-to a match, try everything cause most these guys will stuff several different guns in your hand so you can see all.. then decide what blows your dress up!!! An elitist, me,wow....ThankS, better than what I'm usually called,hence the name

Ornery OAF ...enjoy all!

Edited April 26 by ORNERY OAF

[Hells Comin]

23 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said:

Less shot=less recoil 

Less powder more shot

[DeaconKC]

Choice ammo loads Cowboy ammo too.