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Is there such a thing?


Coldin Callous

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Posted

I overheard a few of the seasoned shooters at todays match talking about short stroking a revolver. I have a short stroked 73, but never heard of it when speaking of a revolver. Is it true? If so, who does it, cause I want it.

 

Thanks

Posted

Yes. There are a few folks that can SS a Ruger.

Not sure about the other guns. Just know they can a Ruger.

Posted

yes, I would find one and try it out first....

 

lassiter does it, as Does Andy Horvath of LaGrange oh.

 

Cheyenne

Posted

Pards on this wire often recomend West Fargo for short stroked Rugers.

Posted
I overheard a few of the seasoned shooters at todays match talking about short stroking a revolver. I have a short stroked 73, but never heard of it when speaking of a revolver. Is it true? If so, who does it, cause I want it.

 

Thanks

Are ya shooting within .2 seconds per stage of where ya wanna be and have everything else ironed out? If not, move along, nothin to see here IMHO.

Posted
yes, I would find one and try it out first....

Cheyenne

 

 

Yep. I tried some and did not really care for them.

Posted
Yep. I tried some and did not really care for them.

 

Maybe you need to try em some more, Wes Flowers, i.e. West Fargo has short stroked 11 Rugers for my wife, son and myself. We love em. In addition to the short stroke, you get a safety cock, half cock, and no more transfer bar to fail. The safety cock allows you to accidentally remove your thumb from the hammer too early before it reaches fully cocked position and about 9 times in 10 you do not have to go all the way around the cylinder to fire the five shots. Removal of the transfer bar is a separate option. They are completely legal under the firearms covenants.

Posted
Are ya shooting within .2 seconds per stage of where ya wanna be and have everything else ironed out? If not, move along, nothin to see here IMHO.

 

 

I somewhat agree. Unless you shoot one handed. Then the SS revolver really does make a difference. For the Ruger the best is WES Fargo. Wes has forgot more about Rugers than the rest of us know.

Posted
Maybe you need to try em some more, Wes Flowers, i.e. West Fargo has short stroked 11 Rugers for my wife, son and myself. We love em. In addition to the short stroke, you get a safety cock, half cock, and no more transfer bar to fail. The safety cock allows you to accidentally remove your thumb from the hammer too early before it reaches fully cocked position and about 9 times in 10 you do not have to go all the way around the cylinder to fire the five shots. Removal of the transfer bar is a separate option. They are completely legal under the firearms covenants.

 

 

With all due respect to Wes (who does great work), many of us really are comparing apples to oranges BECAUSE folks send their guns out and have multiple mods done at once. The short stroke itself may or may not amount to all that much, when yer also getting other work done. Take a good running average Ruger, install SBH hammer, hammer shims if needed to get er centered and slick, slick up the rest of the action, maybe reduce the mainspring a little, and yer probably 95% there. The removal of the T bar and cutting a half cock notch gives ya a forgiveness factor for those times when ya slip off the hammer or short stroke yer cocking, and have to go round again, but doesn't do anything much for NORMAL operation. The short stroke itself may help a little, but unless ya already got a slick gun with a SBH hammer, go there FIRSTand see how ya like it before ya go to a short stroke BECAUSE ya can't cheat ole Newton. If ya do the same amount of work with a shorter hammer throw, you MUST increase hammer EFFORT, a trade-off some find they don't like.

Posted

I've shot some short stroked Rugers, New and Old Models, they are OK, and I suppose, faster if you need hundredths of a second improvemnt. They can be tricky to get (find) the half-cock notch when loading/unloading, as the travel is telescoped a bit and you pass by the notches pretty quickly. A new mainspring strut is installed designed to stop the hammer at its new place, and the hand and bolt are modified.

 

Personally, I find my thumb capable of traveling the extra 1/4 inch the stock hammer requires, and the factory parts, unmolested, will most likely last longer, and are replaceable from Ruger or Brownells off the shelf without requiring the modifications to be repeated.....

 

I have found, in adjusting a few, that essentially no two are alike, so the parts aren't interchangable, and can't be sent to you by the short stroke gunsmith as a drop-in replacement, should you need a new part...

 

Maybe I'm just ranting here, sorry.

Posted
I've shot some short stroked Rugers, New and Old Models, they are OK, and I suppose, faster if you need hundredths of a second improvemnt. They can be tricky to get (find) the half-cock notch when loading/unloading, as the travel is telescoped a bit and you pass by the notches pretty quickly. A new mainspring strut is installed designed to stop the hammer at its new place, and the hand and bolt are modified.

 

Personally, I find my thumb capable of traveling the extra 1/4 inch the stock hammer requires, and the factory parts, unmolested, will most likely last longer, and are replaceable from Ruger or Brownells off the shelf without requiring the modifications to be repeated.....

 

I have found, in adjusting a few, that essentially no two are alike, so the parts aren't interchangable, and can't be sent to you by the short stroke gunsmith as a drop-in replacement, should you need a new part...

 

Maybe I'm just ranting here, sorry.

 

Thanks Flint! It's nice to hear the whole story or at least the other side of the coin. What may sound like a great idea at first or a "got to have one of those" notions (I have 4 Bisley's this could apply to) isn't at all what it seems when you hear the whole speel, and I do like the convenience of calling up Brownells or Midway for that matter and say ship me out a spare part mine just busted. I have spares for transfer bars and for pawls and would find it very inconvenient to have over half a dozen parts that I would have to ship my gun off to have a part custom made for it. Thanks again, I appreciate the heads up. Smithy.

Posted
Maybe you need to try em some more, Wes Flowers, i.e. West Fargo has short stroked 11 Rugers for my wife, son and myself. We love em. In addition to the short stroke, you get a safety cock, half cock, and no more transfer bar to fail. The safety cock allows you to accidentally remove your thumb from the hammer too early before it reaches fully cocked position and about 9 times in 10 you do not have to go all the way around the cylinder to fire the five shots. Removal of the transfer bar is a separate option. They are completely legal under the firearms covenants.

Wow,I just shot a pair of Wes Flowers/West Fargo Short stroked pistols-pretty cool indeed-Very nice craftsmanship.

I question the Level playing field,i.e.range though?They are completely legal under the firearms covenants.

11 Rugers short stroked costs approx.$6000.00 dollars -In most sports today,the person with the most money wins-Yes?

So ,the guy with short stroked pistols,coyote custom shotguns,and the shortest stroked rifles can compete against

another shooter ,in the same catagory, with out of the box pistols,rifle and a 100year old stock shotgun for the same little ribbon.

So,All you guys and gals with unmodified firearms(completely legal under the firearms covenants) that win your

respective catagory CONGRATULATIONS!!!

Moral of my post-CAUTION! LEGAL COVENANTS AHEAD

I will admit I have considerd the short stroke rugers for myself-I just cant believe my ego,pride and wallet want to beat the ribbon out of the other cowboy so much?

D-Wayne

Posted
Wow,I just shot a pair of Wes Flowers/West Fargo Short stroked pistols-pretty cool indeed-Very nice craftsmanship.

I question the Level playing field,i.e.range though?They are completely legal under the firearms covenants.

11 Rugers short stroked costs approx.$6000.00 dollars -In most sports today,the person with the most money wins-Yes?

So ,the guy with short stroked pistols,coyote custom shotguns,and the shortest stroked rifles can compete against

another shooter ,in the same catagory, with out of the box pistols,rifle and a 100year old stock shotgun for the same little ribbon.

So,All you guys and gals with unmodified firearms(completely legal under the firearms covenants) that win your

respective catagory CONGRATULATIONS!!!

Moral of my post-CAUTION! LEGAL COVENANTS AHEAD

I will admit I have considerd the short stroke rugers for myself-I just cant believe my ego,pride and wallet want to beat the ribbon out of the other cowboy so much?

D-Wayne

 

 

This is a game. It is supposed to be FUN. Part of that fun is playing with cool toys. I've got a couple of state of the art rifles, some well-massaged rugers with SBH hammers, my shotgun (I paid a whole $225 for) has been worked on some, etc. I play with bullets, loads, etc and HAVE FUN with em. Tomorrow I intend to shoot my normal category (Duelist) using up some ammo I made up when I was a raw newbie (.45 colt 250s at 800 or so), out of one ruger, and instead of shooting the other ruger, I'm gonna use a .36 C&B revolver with BP. Do I expect to win the match? NO. Do I expect to have fun, using my hotrod rifle with mouse loads, my ruger with "he-man" loads", and a little 5 shoot .36 smokewagon for the other pistol. How can ya NOT have fun?

 

 

Bring on yer Codymatic or yer hardware store fresh wimpchester, I'll shoot with ya, no matter what ya got.

Posted
Wow,I just shot a pair of Wes Flowers/West Fargo Short stroked pistols-pretty cool indeed-Very nice craftsmanship.

I question the Level playing field,i.e.range though?They are completely legal under the firearms covenants.

11 Rugers short stroked costs approx.$6000.00 dollars -In most sports today,the person with the most money wins-Yes?

So ,the guy with short stroked pistols,coyote custom shotguns,and the shortest stroked rifles can compete against

another shooter ,in the same catagory, with out of the box pistols,rifle and a 100year old stock shotgun for the same little ribbon.

So,All you guys and gals with unmodified firearms(completely legal under the firearms covenants) that win your

respective catagory CONGRATULATIONS!!!

Moral of my post-CAUTION! LEGAL COVENANTS AHEAD

I will admit I have considerd the short stroke rugers for myself-I just cant believe my ego,pride and wallet want to beat the ribbon out of the other cowboy so much?

D-Wayne

 

No, the moral of your story is that anyone can comment on the wire without knowing what the hell they are talking about.

 

Tell me about the guns that Shalako or Bud shoots...oh...wait...you probably don't know...

 

Enjoy your ignorance.

 

Phantom

:rolleyes:

Posted

I will ENJOY your ignorance Phantom-BUD shoots BOX STOCK RUGERS -FOR FACT!! NO Modifications-Zero-Nada

Old model V,s with replacement transfer bars

D-Wayne

Posted
This is a game. It is supposed to be FUN. Part of that fun is playing with cool toys. I've got a couple of state of the art rifles, some well-massaged rugers with SBH hammers, my shotgun (I paid a whole $225 for) has been worked on some, etc. I play with bullets, loads, etc and HAVE FUN with em. Tomorrow I intend to shoot my normal category (Duelist) using up some ammo I made up when I was a raw newbie (.45 colt 250s at 800 or so), out of one ruger, and instead of shooting the other ruger, I'm gonna use a .36 C&B revolver with BP. Do I expect to win the match? NO. Do I expect to have fun, using my hotrod rifle with mouse loads, my ruger with "he-man" loads", and a little 5 shoot .36 smokewagon for the other pistol. How can ya NOT have fun?

 

 

Bring on yer Codymatic or yer hardware store fresh wimpchester, I'll shoot with ya, no matter what ya got.

I totally agree-Fun -Its the reason my family enjoys the game so much.

We have cool toys also-not as much as some people.

have fun tomarrow,We had ours today

Thanks for your perspective

D-Wayne

Posted

Wow. It's amazing how many folks speak "facts" when they really don't know what they are talking about.

 

A ruger can be shortstroked for not much more money then what would be spent on a typical action job if you do some checking around. So it really has nothing to do with who has the most money. While GCK has invested in a lot of rugers he can only shoot two on a stage so his total investment is not relevant.

 

Depending on who does the work the half cock is not difficult to find at all. Actually it should make the cylinder index with the loading gate. Also the mainspring strut does not have to be replaced nor does a hammer stop have to be added. It can be done by modifying 3 parts: hammer, pawl, bolt. There are other ways to do it but this way works for me. After trial and error I have figured out how to do it and have parts with failure rates no higher then factory parts.

 

Does it really make a difference? Since I am a two handed shooter mostly I am only to give my opinion from that perspective. A duelist or gunfighter would be better able to say whether they are worth it. IMHO for two handed shooters the HALF COCK is helpful then the short stroke.

 

Stan

 

P.S. D-Wayne, Phantom has shot with Bud a ton. He is well aware of what guns he shoots.

Posted
Maybe you need to try em some more, Wes Flowers, i.e. West Fargo has short stroked 11 Rugers for my wife, son and myself. We love em. In addition to the short stroke, you get a safety cock, half cock, and no more transfer bar to fail. The safety cock allows you to accidentally remove your thumb from the hammer too early before it reaches fully cocked position and about 9 times in 10 you do not have to go all the way around the cylinder to fire the five shots. Removal of the transfer bar is a separate option. They are completely legal under the firearms covenants.

 

 

Nope. Don't need to. Have tried them many times. And some was done by Wes.

They are just not for me. And don't think they would be for everyone. That is why it might

be good for him to try them first.

 

Have friends that use them. And they love them.

If I liked them. I would have already had it done.

 

Those that beat me. Are not beating me because of this.

 

I shoot Duelist. If that matters.

 

Try before you buy.

Thats all I am saying.

Posted

I shoot a Codymatic rifle, a Stoeger I "wore out' myself, and two SASS Rugers that were "tuned up" a little by a local fella, Three Cut. I've been shooting a year, am just now getting into the upper twenties for a stage, and regularly compete where some of the best shooters in the country shoot. They beat me every time. My point is, this sport is like any other game, the best will beat ya no matter what they use. Tiger Woods could out golf me with a set of JC Higgins clubs, and local State Champs beat me with anything they use. I LIKE my short stroked rifle, it is FUN to shoot, so are my SASS Rugers with lower hammers. It's about having a good time, if I had been a real wild west gunslinger, I'd have been on Boot Hill....

Posted

A pistol with a short stroke won't make you any faster. And if you keep the really light springs in, it may not go bang as the hammer is moving slower when it hits the firing pin. Gotta beef up the springs.

 

However, for someone with arthritis, broken up hands, or limited thumb mobility (I fit all 3 of these categories), then a pistol with a short stroke can make a gun easier to deal with.

 

I don't believe it costs a great deal either.

Posted

The OP's original topic has pretty much gone of track here so I'll add this.

 

Like race cars, race guns is a relative term, a matter of degree, in the eyes of the beholder. If you compete against a clock, it's a race. Any equipment used would be race equipment. As they say in auto racing, "How fast you want to go is directly proportional to how much you want to spend." but that doesn't nesassarily mean just money. You have to spend the time, as well. Windshield time or trigger time. A tricked out car or gun won't win a race unless you do your part.

 

There are basically 3 elements to winning in either, a fast reliable car, the proper fuel and a driver that knows the track and how to get the best from it all. If you have a really fast car and the driver or the fuel aren't up to the task a faster car won't help. Same with guns that race. You will need a smooth reliable gun, the proper ammo and a lot of trigger time to be a top competitor.

 

Also, as Doc has pointed out, at some point a slick squishy sprung gun will only cause you to miss. As you get faster you actually out run the gun.

Posted

A couple of years ago I was talking to Santa Fe River Stan and the subject of short stroking the Rugers came up. He was on a mission to do it, and it inspired me. Being one to never leave anything alone, I went out and bought a small tig welder and went to work.

 

I have two sets of old model Rugers. One set I short stroked and one set I left alone. So I have a good comparison.

 

Are they faster? Sure sounds like it on a dump. Sure feels faster when you shoot them.

 

Will they help me win? Practicing more with my shotgun would probably help me more, but I love the way they shoot and I will never go back.

I have broke three transfer bars so eliminating the transfer bar does away with something that could fail in a match. ( Murphy's Law )

 

I have posted a photo of one of my short stroked Rugers and One stock stroke. I also removed all that ugly writing on my barrels.

 

http://i775.photobucket.com/albums/yy37/De...boy/2Rugers.jpg

 

Deadeye Dallas

Guest diablo slim shootist
Posted
I've been told that an Open Top right out the box is already short stroked compared to a Uberti Peacemaker or a Ruger. Can anyone confirm?

SO THATS WHY YOUR SO FAST TRAVELLER! LETS HOLD IT UP TO MY MONTADO AND SEE! :D

o yea missed you at the match today deacon cleaned and won top gun!!!Darn it- that boy dont even practice! (or does he)?

Posted
I will ENJOY your ignorance Phantom-BUD shoots BOX STOCK RUGERS -FOR FACT!! NO Modifications-Zero-Nada

Old model V,s with replacement transfer bars

D-Wayne

 

You were making a statement that pretty much implied that you have to do mods to win. And putting down folks that do.

 

Bud shoots stock rugers...OMV's just like I do. He also doesn't slip hammer...which I do. Shalako pretty much shoots box stock rifles...I don't and neither does Bud.

 

I'm glad you've had an opportunity to speak with either Bud or his dad about what type of equipment he uses...work his 97 some time...you might be further impressed.

 

Now has far as you being ignorant...yes, you are. And being that you are rather new at this game, this is something that would be expected.

 

Phantom

:D

Posted

Well I just cant leave this alone!!! :D

I own short stroked colts, and rugers both and I also own stock colts and rugers with very good actions jobs. I have put it on the timer, time and time again and for a two handed shooter such as my self it does NOT help to have a short stroked pistol. My times are the same with the ruger with the action work and the ruger with the short stroke. I have spoke on the phone and face to face with many top shooters in this game such as Long Hunter, Evil Roy and so on. They all have stated that a short stroke gun does NOT help a two handed shooter.

 

Any way this is what I have found out in my reasearch -

 

Pros:

(1) It sounds cool to say, "My pistol is short stroked !" :D

 

Cons:

(1) Cost me about $150 more per pistol over a regular action job. :D

(2) Does not help my pistol speed or split times.:D

 

 

Just my Two cents worth!!

 

Slick

Posted

Slick, you are indeed correct. There is no speed difference with a short stroked pistol. However, for those of us with busted up hands, it certainly helps just in being able to operate the gun.

Posted
You were making a statement that pretty much implied that you have to do mods to win. And putting down folks that do.

 

Bud shoots stock rugers...OMV's just like I do. He also doesn't slip hammer...which I do. Shalako pretty much shoots box stock rifles...I don't and neither does Bud.

 

I'm glad you've had an opportunity to speak with either Bud or his dad about what type of equipment he uses...work his 97 some time...you might be further impressed.

 

Now has far as you being ignorant...yes, you are. And being that you are rather new at this game, this is something that would be expected.

 

Phantom

:D

Yes,I did make a statement-NO implications Nor did I put anybody down.(until you did)

I have shot with Gold Canyon Kid and wife and son-Grade AAA people -Nice to shoot with,

also have shot with SHALAKO and Pinto many times,also Bud -VERY VERY nice people

I may not have been in SASS as long as some ,So if it makes you feel good-Call me ignorant

I would like to thank AKJ and Doc Shapiro for their views.

And Phantom ,already worked Buds 97 , very nice-Smooooth.

D-Wayne

Posted
Slick, you are indeed correct. There is no speed difference with a short stroked pistol. However, for those of us with busted up hands, it certainly helps just in being able to operate the gun.

 

Doc,

Your correct, I have a older(73+) shooting pard of mine that I sold one of my sets of short stroked USFA to and they help him because of his hands. This is a good thing, but if one is looking for a increase in speed this is NOT it. Only lots and lots of practice will get some shooters speed and then others well.. they just want ever get any faster, it's just the way god made some people.

 

Slick

Posted

Slick & Doc: yep, your both on the money with this one.

 

SS pistols do not necessarily quate to speed and faster times.

 

Of course, I can only speak from personal experience.

 

 

Best regards

 

 

..........Widder

Posted
Yes,I did make a statement-NO implications Nor did I put anybody down.(until you did)

I have shot with Gold Canyon Kid and wife and son-Grade AAA people -Nice to shoot with,

also have shot with SHALAKO and Pinto many times,also Bud -VERY VERY nice people

I may not have been in SASS as long as some ,So if it makes you feel good-Call me ignorant

I would like to thank AKJ and Doc Shapiro for their views.

And Phantom ,already worked Buds 97 , very nice-Smooooth.

D-Wayne

 

Where'd you shoot with Shalako Joe?

 

Oh, and Bud's SG is smooth?????

 

Now ya got me wondering.

 

:D

Posted
Where'd you shoot with Shalako Joe?

 

Oh, and Bud's SG is smooth?????

 

Now ya got me wondering.

 

:D

 

Well, Bud does cycle through a bunch of shotguns, depending on which one is actually working. Every once in a while, he ends up with a smooth one, though that never seems to last long as I believe that the smooth one is his mom's!

Posted
Where'd you shoot with Shalako Joe?

 

Oh, and Bud's SG is smooth?????

 

Now ya got me wondering.

 

:D

 

 

Groupies........ :D

Posted

I've been shooting a set of Ruger Vaquero's short stroked by Lassiter but I started doing some split time comparison between guns sets with different style hammers & short stroked or not & springs & found for my style of shooting which is two handed & I slip hammer after 1st shot, That NON- short stroke were faster for me not by much.

 

Others folks may be different.

 

 

As far as the slip hammering goes I know for sure its not necessarily faster but it works for me.

 

 

 

Regards AO

Posted
However, for someone with arthritis, broken up hands, or limited thumb mobility (I fit all 3 of these categories), then a pistol with a short stroke can make a gun easier to deal with.

 

Doc hit the nail right on the head. My much better half, Lucky Wheeler, has a pair of Wes Flowers short stroked Rugers. Do they give her a competitive advantage.....No. She shoots just as fast with non-short stroked Rugers - but with these, her thumb, and hand hurt a lot less, if at all.

 

That's the long and "short" of it! :D

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