Quiet Burp Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 I'm after a reduced .45-70 load using H4198 or IMR4198, looking for below 1100fps. Any suggestions for powder weight and projectile weight? (p.s I don't have any and I can't get any Trailboss) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantankerous Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 On edit... I just saw your comment about Trailboss. Apologies. (Not wearing my readers, ugh. ) It's not the powder you asked about but I've shot really nice "reduced" 45-70 405 grain loads with 13 grains of Trailboss. So, IF you have Trailboss that's an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 H4895 will allow you to reach that velocity with a 405 gr Cast bullet. Read this from Hodgdons website. It is located under Resources/Reference Data Found Hodgdon's Cowboy Action load data from 2002. Go to page 8. It will get you close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tex Jones, SASS 2263 Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Hodgdon lists a load for 45-70 using H4198 for bullet weights from 300 to 405 grains, RNFP. With the exception of the 300 gr load, all start at below 1,100 fps. and top out around 1,250 fps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John E. Law Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 I use H4198 in both 38-55 and 45-70. I've found it very consistent and super easy to meter. Now these are my cowboy long range loads which are light and they are both Hi-Walls. Also I'm going off the top of my head remembering, but I can confirm them tonight when I get home from work. My CAS recipes for them are 38-55, 245gn RNFP with 23 gns 4198. I don't remember the FPS but It's a great CAS load and is a laser out to 300yds and still very good out to about 400-500yds on steel. 45-70, 440gn RNFP with 38.5gns 4198. This is great at 300 yards but I rarely shoot the 45-70 anymore. Also H4198 and IMR4198 are similar but they ARE NOT the same. I missordered one time and got the IMR. I loaded it the and and there was a very noticeable difference. I traded the IMR off and repurchased the Hodgdon. JEL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 Give Unique a try Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sedalia Dave Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 1 hour ago, John E. Law said: Also H4198 and IMR4198 are similar but they ARE NOT the same. I missordered one time and got the IMR. I loaded it the and and there was a very noticeable difference. I traded the IMR off and repurchased the Hodgdon. ^^^^THIS ^^^^ This is true for all Hodgdon powders where there is both an H and an IMR version Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 4 hours ago, The Original Lumpy Gritz said: Give Unique a try I figured Lumpy would chime in! I think he puts Unique on his eggs instead of pepper! 14.2 grains Unique with a 330-405 cast Bullet makes a very nice load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 A 300 to 350 grain lead bullet. Heavier bullets just kick more, and at 1100 FPS, I'm sure you are not trying to make a long-range (300 yard plus) load. Up to 300 yards, you can have lots of fun with the light (for 45-70) slugs. Best groups for me with 45-70 usually come when I use 2400. And pretty easy to get down to 1100 FPS, around 16 grains. If you are dead set on IMR 4198, then 25 grains under that light-ish bullet. You will see you need a lot more powder with the "4198 type" rifle powders. Most of my 45-70 guns will group better at 1250 or 1300 FPS than they do at 1100 FPS. Just a hint. good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 4 hours ago, Hoss said: I figured Lumpy would chime in! I think he puts Unique on his eggs instead of pepper! 14.2 grains Unique with a 330-405 cast Bullet makes a very nice load. Goes on my salads too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krazy Kajun Posted September 12, 2022 Share Posted September 12, 2022 I’ve used 33g of H4198 with a 300gr cast bullet. Kajun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet Burp Posted September 12, 2022 Author Share Posted September 12, 2022 Thanks for all the pointers and links posted appreciated. For the Pat Garret match, the club wants the rifle loads to be below 1100fps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrison Joe, SASS #60708 Posted September 13, 2022 Share Posted September 13, 2022 2 hours ago, Quiet Burp said: For the Pat Garret match, the club wants the rifle loads to be below 1100fps. OK, so very light rifle loads on steel targets, it sounds like. Will be tough to make the 4198 powders even burn with that light a load. Unique (12 grains) or Red Dot (11 grains) pistol powders would be where I'd go with THAT light a load. 2400 in a pinch. Read this thread for tested 1100 FPS loads in 45-70. https://www.marlinowners.com/threads/red-dot-and-45-70.32851/ And several powders tested here: http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm BTW - Club needs to get some AR steel targets! We shoot full power military rifles, jacketed bullets, on 1/2" AR 500 steel with next to no damage. good luck, GJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H. K. Uriah, SASS #74619 Posted September 13, 2022 Share Posted September 13, 2022 On 9/12/2022 at 5:42 AM, Quiet Burp said: I'm after a reduced .45-70 load using H4198 or IMR4198, looking for below 1100fps. Any suggestions for powder weight and projectile weight? (p.s I don't have any and I can't get any Trailboss) When I first started reloading for .45-70, I used H4198. Using a "trapdoor safe" load, I found it to be very pleasant to shoot in my 1884 Trapdoor rifle, and a painful shoulder thumper with the same load in an 1873 carbine trapdoor and a 20" Winchester 1886. And this was minimal load as well, using a 405 grain bullet. I switched to Trail Boss, but as you pointed out, you can't get that right now. I'm going to have to find something else to use for that caliber, one that won't hurt to shoot, and that can also be used with 300 grain bullets as well as 405 ones, and of course, Trapdoor Sage. Any suggestions would be welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Crimes Posted September 14, 2022 Share Posted September 14, 2022 H4198 (NOT IMR4198) is ADI AR2207 powder bought from Australia and repackaged by Hodgdon (same as Trail Boss for IMR). There are no 2207 loads for 45/70 in their manual that are below 1100fps. The closest is 1251 fps with a 405 lead cast proj with 27gr of 2207 (H4198). Unique or 5744 may be better options for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt Dan Blodgett, SASS #75655 Posted September 29, 2022 Share Posted September 29, 2022 Good luck finding unique these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Crimes Posted September 30, 2022 Share Posted September 30, 2022 On 9/29/2022 at 2:06 PM, Cpt Dan Blodgett, SASS #75655 said: Good luck finding unique these days. It's even harder for us, we are both in Australia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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