Buckhorn Bud Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 It seems that almost every time I use American Pioneer Powder in a powder measure it gets clogged up. It clogs the powder measures that came with both my Dillon and my Lee progressive presses as well as all the metered powder flasks that I've tried, including my big Walker revolver flask. I've tried different bottles from different lots. It makes no difference if the bottle was just opened or if it has been opened before and has been sitting on the shelf for a few months. 777 also has the problem as well but not quite as bad. The only powder measure that I've had any luck with is this cheap one I got on ebay from Smartleloader. http://www.smartreloader.com/smartreloader-sr400-powder-measure-wsteel-bench-stand-inc-p-3951.html Of course it doesn't work with a progressive reloader. Am I the only one who has this problem? How do you solve the issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Sage, SASS #49891 Life Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 I just use a lee dipper. Slower, but sure solves the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheyenne Culpepper 32827 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 are you leaving it in the hopper after you're done loading for the day? I've used both those powders in different Dillons with no problems, EXCEPT when I left it in the hopper overnight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckhorn Bud Posted November 23, 2013 Author Share Posted November 23, 2013 I just use a lee dipper. Slower, but sure solves the problem. I was kind of hoping to avoid that. are you leaving it in the hopper after you're done loading for the day? I've used both those powders in different Dillons with no problems, EXCEPT when I left it in the hopper overnight. Nope. I always empty the hopper when I'm finished. Even a brand new bottle gives me issues. I get less than 10 cartridges loaded before I have issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowboy Rick, SASS #49739L Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 2Fg will clog almost any powder measure without some kind of vibration or knocker, even then can be problematic. 3Fg seems to be not so finicky. CR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Sandor, SASS #74075 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 2Fg will clog almost any powder measure without some kind of vibration or knocker, even then can be problematic. 3Fg seems to be not so finicky. CR +1 I've been loading APP for 7 years, & in my experience both the grain size and the type of measure have a lot to do with this problem. I've loaded many thousands of rounds, and have found that the slide type measures like the Dillon bind up very quickly. This was especially bad with the old formulation APP (white bottle) in FFg. The larger grain size of the FFg means more crushing, which produces the dust that causes the binding and clogging. I tried a Dillon SDB with no success at all because the floating expander would bind after about 10 rounds. I went to an RCBS rotary type measure and with the new formulation (black bottle) in FFFg I would run through one pound at a time before cleaning the measure. This was a big improvement, but single loading still takes a lot of time. I'm now running a Hornady L-N-L progressive with its rotary measure, using FFFg. With this setup I run through two pounds of powder before I stop and clean the dust from the measure. Thus means productivity is WAY up, even though the L-N-L measure takes more time to disassemble than the old RCBS. For me, a rotary measure and FFFg is the only way to go. CS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loco gringo Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Used APP many years ago , and had the same problems . Recently picked up a case of Goex Pinnacle . It was made by APP for Goex . .Basicly the same stuff , but a little different . It is treated different . It's black , not as nearly hydroscopic as APP ,More power than APP . Seams to be the same power as true black -----.I'm using 3F . Running it threw a Lee 1000 , with NO problems ! Here in VA. , I have forgotten to empty the hopper and left it till the next day , and no problems .I don't recommend doing so , but if it had been APP , there would have been a big hard glob the next day . In high humidity , put it back in the bottle .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peddler Parsons SASS # 31281 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 I have been using 3F APP for 10 years now, the old stuff would bind up bad but the new (black cans) I have no trouble with and I run it through my Dillon 550, but I do not leave it in the tube over night. When I finish loading I dump it back into the can and blow the hopper and bar off with air, about every six month I will take the slide out and clean it and the houseing off, as well as clean the drop with a tube with a bore bursh, I load about several thousand rounds a year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Original Lumpy Gritz Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 It seems that almost every time I use American Pioneer Powder in a powder measure it gets clogged up. It clogs the powder measures that came with both my Dillon and my Lee progressive presses as well as all the metered powder flasks that I've tried, including my big Walker revolver flask. I've tried different bottles from different lots. It makes no difference if the bottle was just opened or if it has been opened before and has been sitting on the shelf for a few months. 777 also has the problem as well but not quite as bad. The only powder measure that I've had any luck with is this cheap one I got on ebay from Smartleloader. http://www.smartreloader.com/smartreloader-sr400-powder-measure-wsteel-bench-stand-inc-p-3951.html Of course it doesn't work with a progressive reloader. Am I the only one who has this problem? How do you solve the issue? Shoot the real stuff. OR, use a 'dipper'. LG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazarus Longshot, SASS #44254 Life Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 I use APP 2F in my MEC Sizemaster with its powder bar, and I use APP 2F and 3F in the Lee Pro Auto-disk Powder Measure. The Lee measure has been used on both Pro 1000 and Loadmaster presses. I've used APP jugs that were brand new, and some that have been half-full for months. I've had no problems with clogging. I do empty the measures after each loading session, and dump the APP back into the sealed jug. I also clean the measures after I use them using a can of compressed air and a paper towel. What kind of environment do you load in? I load in an air conditioned / heated room in the house, so the humidity is generally low. Unfired APP is very hygroscopic, so high humidity could be causing your problem. LaZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fingers McGee Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Have always had problems with APP binding up Hornady and RCBS powder measures after 50 or so rounds. Hornady BP measure will go about 100 rounds before it starts to bind. Switched to Pinnacle and T7 and the problem went away. I don't use APP anymore. YMMV Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty Dude, SASS # 51223 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 I modified the second stage of my Dillon SDB.I epoxied the expander spud/funnel in the adjustment stem, then a small brass funnel is on top. I dip the powder using the yellow Lee Dippers. This process works for me. This tool head is used only for 44WCF black powder loading. I use APP 3F. Dillon makes the same type set-up for the 500 basic press. Several use this for the BP loading on the 550. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beartrap SASS#57175 Posted November 23, 2013 Share Posted November 23, 2013 Been using APP for years in both 2F & 3F with RCBS Little Dandy rotors and a Mec jr. Never had a jam with the RCBS and seldom with the Mec. 2 helpful hints: SHAKE the bottle vigorously before you use it and don't baby the loader, Give the powder time to drop with the RCBS and shake the handle of the Mec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckhorn Bud Posted November 24, 2013 Author Share Posted November 24, 2013 Lots of good tips. Thank you very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Bullweed Posted November 24, 2013 Share Posted November 24, 2013 I use Lee spoons for all BP and APP loads. I inspect every round before seating the bullets just to insure that I will have as much powder compression as I desire. My loads fire, hit and sound very consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Coffinmaker Posted November 24, 2013 Share Posted November 24, 2013 I load APP thru a Dillon 650. With the old formula of APP (white stuff, very dusty) bridging in the powder measure gave me fits. With the new stuff (black, less dust) bridging is an occasional problem. When one case drops short, I know the next case is gonna be real full. I just pull both cases and balance em out. It's a nuisance, but I can live with it. Forgot, loading Cowboy 45 Special and 44 Russian cases. Coffinmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen E. Pettifogger, SASS #32933 Posted November 24, 2013 Share Posted November 24, 2013 2F APP is like trying to meter gravel. It is much larger than 2F BP. Seldom have a problem with the Dillon measures and 3F APP if the can is shaken real well to break up clumps. And, even unopended cans of APP that have sat for a while have clumps. I have one of these lights in my 650 (sits in the hole where the low powder sensor goes when loading smokeless). If the charge is high or low enough to cause a problem with APP you can see it with your eyes. http://www.uniquetek.com/site/696296/product/T1429 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Boy Posted November 25, 2013 Share Posted November 25, 2013 APP clogging the powder measureHow do you solve the issue? Put a couple of desiccants is the powder tube. Nearly all the substitutes have about 4% water in the finished product. Whereas real black powder has about 1.5% Also, both powders are hygroscopic (absorb moisture). Remember the old adage ... 'Keep your powder dry' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOUBLE OUGHT HAGEN SASS#74836 Posted November 26, 2013 Share Posted November 26, 2013 Started with APP White Bottles and had some of the same Clogging issues with my Dillon. Switched to APP Black Gold FFF for Pistol & Rifle in the Dillon. Also use the same with my C&B Flask with a lot Better Results. I continue to use White & Black Bottle FF with my Mec with very few Issues. Note: I try to Break Down and Clean the Powder Drops and Blow Off the Reloader and Bench after each Loading Session. 00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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