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Gun Control is NOT the answer


Rooster Ron Wayne

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Latest reports say he used a Sig a Glock and a Bushmaster. Another long gun was found in the car but they haven't saidwat that was. A Henry, an Enfield and a shotgun were found at his other's house.

It doesn't matter if he used a SAA and a marlin. the fact is he was a criminal maniac that stole the guns, stole the car, foiled a security door, and NO LAW was gonna stop him, but I humbly submit a 230 grain round of GI ball in his punkin or three rounds of .22 LR in his pelvic area woulda slowed him down a bunch.

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This is a breakdown of our family values and morals plain and simple, Unwed mothers,Divorce alcohol and drug abuse,and loss of religion. Sad indeed.

 

Pretty much...

 

GG

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This is a breakdown of our family values and morals plain and simple, Unwed mothers,Divorce alcohol and drug abuse,and loss of religion. Sad indeed.

 

 

MTV, drugs , internet, movies, rap music, Jersey Shore, Kim Kardashians, Jackass on and on...... We are told God isn't real, believe in ourselves only to be left with nothing to believe in.........

Darkness is measured in regards to absence of light, just as evil is measured by the absence of God.

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MTV, drugs , internet, movies, rap music, Jersey Shore, Kim Kardashians, Jackass on and on...... We are told God isn't real, believe in ourselves only to be left with nothing to believe in.........

Darkness is measured in regards to absence of light, just as evil is measured by the absence of God.

 

Yup... :(

 

GG

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Dear Hacker, the four guns used by the maniac in CT were not his. They belonged to his mother who obviously left them in a place of easy access. Locked in a safe with the registered owner being the only one to have a key would have saved 27 lives.

 

Please provide a link to an online article that says that the guns belong to the mother.

THe ABC article doesn't make that assertion yet.

 

If you say so.

Last I saw yesterday before that post, they were saying it appeared he purchased them legally.

If this has been revealed since then. It appears that you may be right.

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Would it really have saved lives if the guns had been locked up? How can you know? All you can know for sure, in that case, is that the crime would not have been commited who THOSE guns. Can you say he couldn't have done the same with a matchete or butcher knife? Or killed even more with a bomb?

 

IT WASN'T THE GUNS, IT WAS THE MAN!!!!!!!

 

If it was more difficult for him to have obtained the guns, he might not have done it.

I was responding to one who indicated that securing firearms might have prevented it.

 

There are no certainties in the world. Except paying taxes, death, and dumbocraps do dumb things. For that matter politicians all do dumb things.

 

 

The real problem is that there is a very small percentage of people in the world who are going to do really bad things.

It is very difficult to find them without violating rights.

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GUN CONTROL....Not the answer! Constructive gun control makes more sense!

The first thing we have to understand that in this day and age their will be no

such thing as "GUN CONTROL" no matter how you go about it. That being said

maybe we need to work together to come up with a better solution that makes

sense. We will always have folks that just snap (not planned, instatanious)

and you will never be able to stop that, but we can be more observant of those

who show strange behaviors like killing animals or aggressive behavior at a

young age towards other people. Parents will have to be more vigilant and

willing to seek help as soon as possible. Medical help needs to be available

and provided at no charge......BEFORE not AFTER. We the people need to calm down

and work together to stop this from happening NOW! How many more lives need

will be sacrificed before we wake up! This goes for the President, the Government

and you and I. God bless America! :FlagAm:/>

Quick Draw Grandpa

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Please provide a link to an online article that says that the guns belong to the mother.

THe ABC article doesn't make that assertion yet.

 

If you say so.

Last I saw yesterday before that post, they were saying it appeared he purchased them legally.

If this has been revealed since then. It appears that you may be right.

 

SHE (THE MOTHER) PURCHASED THEM, NOT THE KID.

QDG

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Sorry to tell all ya'll, the White House web site now has a couple dozen petitions calling for Gun Control. Several if not all by now have the 25K signatures needed to obtain a comment and or support from the White House and its residents. Look out folks the storm is coming.

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People love to wring their hands and make various statements for and against firearms, as well as our societal woes. We will never find a solution... never. Murder has been with us since the first humans walked the earth, and it will be with us until the last humans walk the earth. As much as we like to espouse our knowledge of the human mind and its workings, we really do not know squat about the brain.

 

What we do know is that some countries have very high murder rates, and some countries have pretty low murder rates. Columbia has the world's highest murder rate at 618 per million population, whereas Japan has a murder rate of 5 per million. Why? Sure, drugs has a lot to do with it, but 120 fold? The USA has a 43 per million rate FWIW.

 

If you look purely at gun murder rates, the USA ranks 15th in the world, not #1 as some would have you to believe. Mexico ranks 12th, and we all know firearms are outlawed in Mexico. :rolleyes:/> The #1 nation for firearm murders, Honduras, has 19 times the USA murder rate with firearms. Why? Will we ever truly know?

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People love to wring their hands and make various statements for and against firearms, as well as our societal woes. We will never find a solution... never. Murder has been with us since the first humans walked the earth, and it will be with us until the last humans walk the earth. As much as we like to espouse our knowledge of the human mind and its workings, we really do not know squat about the brain.

 

What we do know is that some countries have very high murder rates, and some countries have pretty low murder rates. Columbia has the world's highest murder rate at 618 per million population, whereas Japan has a murder rate of 5 per million. Why? Sure, drugs has a lot to do with it, but 120 fold? The USA has a 43 per million rate FWIW.

 

If you look purely at gun murder rates, the USA ranks 15th in the world, not #1 as some would have you to believe. Mexico ranks 12th, and we all know firearms are outlawed in Mexico. :rolleyes:/>/> The #1 nation for firearm murders, Honduras, has 19 times the USA murder rate with firearms. Why? Will we ever truly know?

 

Will we ever know? Probably not. But I think the murder rates in the countries mentioned have a lot more to do with the value that people in each of those societies put on the lives of those around them than they do with the availability of firearms.....

 

But then again, that could just be wishful thinking on my part :unsure:

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This is really a sad day for this country. Something really does need to be done, but blaming it on inanimate objects, whether it is guns, knives, axes, rocks, or cars, or bombs will make no difference. This is a mindset that has to be addressed. Until we become more proactive as a populace these wacko terrorist domestic or foreign will keep killing our children.

 

Look, our future has already been lived be the Israelis. Those folks have lived this for decades and have a history that works. The public at large are vigilant and armed. Yes, even the teachers. If we don’t grasp this concept soon we will only see more and even worse than what’s happened.

 

 

ARMED ISRAELI CITIZENS

 

ARMED ISRAELI CITIZENS

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All I know is ,if he did NOT use a gun .

 

Maybe he used a Chevy truck, and ran over the kids in the cross walk on the way home .

Is the government going to ban Gm from making Chevy Trucks ?

 

If He went to the hardwire store and made a pipe bomb and blew up the school .

Is the government going to put a ban on PVC or Hardwire stores or ?

 

The Issue is the nut job not the GUN or the Chevy or any thing else !

 

1. we need to start to see capital punishment !

2. we need to hold the owner of the firearm responsible for there property !

3. we need to stop this 30 years on death row and implement the the outcome Immediately !

4. we need to show the criminals that you will be executed publicly !

5. we need to arm law abiding citizens every were !

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The only thing that would have saved those lives had there been a teacher in the immediate area who was armed and trained and willing to put a bullet in the bad guys' head.

 

Remember October 1, 1997, Pearl, MS.? What many historians consider the beginning of the latest round of student shootings.

 

Sixteen year old Luke Woodham - after stabbing and beating his mother to death in their home - takes her car to Pearl High School where he proceeds to kill two girls [one a former girlfriend] and wound seven other students with the rifle he was carrying.

 

He then goes back to his mothers car and is preparing to leave and go to Pearl Junior High to continue his rampage...

 

WHEN...

 

Ass't Principal Joel Myrick - who has retrieved a .45 from the glovebox of his truck - confronts and subdues Woodham. Thus preventing further tragedy. As Woodham would have had time to leave and get to the Junior High well before the Pearl PD arrived at the High School.

 

Myrick also showed great restraint in not killing Woodham when he had the chance. As a result, Woodham was able to supply insightful information into the thinking that goes into the commission of this heinous act.

 

Prayers to all affected by yesterdays senseless tragedy.

 

Professor Tull

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I agree with Muleshoe Bill, Watch out for Gun Control Legistration, Its coming like a frieght train, The Congress will debate it and the first Gun rights supporter to speak will be staring at the pictures of 20 First Graders and haranged about supporting the murder of children. The gun Ban Crowd has to be salivating.

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Sorry to tell all ya'll, the White House web site now has a couple dozen petitions calling for Gun Control. Several if not all by now have the 25K signatures needed to obtain a comment and or support from the White House and its residents. Look out folks the storm is coming.

 

That's right. Critical mass has been reached politically and socially, and this country is about to take a very cold bath in terms of gun rights.

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In an emotional time like this I doubt that reasoned arguments against more gun laws will be effective. I'm afraid that many people who are not gun owners but have never been either supportive or oposed to gun control one way or the other will jump off the fence on the wrong side. They do not see the issue as we do. We can preach to the choir here and on other web forums but we need to be pro active and contact legislators with courteous, intelligent and impassioned communication.

The sad state of mental health care in this country needs to be addressed. The one common thread running through the incidents is the mental state of the shooters. Until more is done to identify and treat these individuals, senseless killings like this will continue.

Give to the NRA, keep your eyes and ears open and remain strong.

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In an emotional time like this I doubt that reasoned arguments against more gun laws will be effective. I'm afraid that many people who are not gun owners but have never been either supportive or oposed to gun control one way or the other will jump off the fence on the wrong side. They do not see the issue as we do. We can preach to the choir here and on other web forums but we need to be pro active and contact legislators with courteous, intelligent and impassioned communication.

The sad state of mental health care in this country needs to be addressed. The one common thread running through the incidents is the mental state of the shooters. Until more is done to identify and treat these individuals, senseless killings like this will continue.

Give to the NRA, keep your eyes and ears open and remain strong.

 

 

Well stated, but we will never completely understand the human mind... not even 30%. Loose screws will always slip through the system. How many times have you heard neighbors say about a perp, "This is a total surprise. He is such a nice guy, and this is totally out of character."? I know how it is. One of my patients was seemingly one of the happiest ladies that I knew... right up to the point she put a gun in her mouth and ended her existence. I had two other patients that I warned psychiatry about and they ignored me, the ignorant family practice doc. They both killed themselves as well. We will never reliably be able to state, "This person is a serial killer."

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We are all wringing our hands about what might happen with this increased focus on gun control. To be honest we are in uncharted territory right now. We have a President who is operating with an agenda that is anti American in the traditional sense. We have a Republican Party leadership which is mediocre at best. I think most gun owning Patriots feel right now they have their backs up against the wall. We don't control the narrative with the mainstream media who have now come out of the journalistic closet and are taking sides in our national debate.

 

I don't know what wonderful plans our anti-American government has in store for gun owning Americans, and I'm sure it's not good. I have the luxury of living in the middle of nowhere in New Mexico, a gun friendly State. Whatever evils come down the pike, whether it be gun registration, AWB, confiscation, etc., I plan to just ignore it since any illegal law will never replace my God given right of self-defense. I'm sure there will be millions of other gun owners operating behind the scenes in a new black market, like bootleggers did during prohibition. For the time being I have enough firearms and ammo to last quite a while. Too bad for those wanting to enjoy the sport and hobby of firearms in the future.

 

T.H. O'Sullivan

Black Mesa Ranch

New Mexico

:FlagAm:

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Don't be too fast to hold up Israel gun laws as an example. Their laws are FAR AND AWAY MORE RESTRICTIVE than you think. :excl:/>

 

That is true to some extent but what they are doing is working. Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating stricter gun laws. Just a mind set change. As a society they are constantly on guard. Security for those folks isn’t just a part time retirement job. They actively seek out potential threats before it can fully develop. Armed teachers and students is the norm there. It is an effective deterrent. You don't here of these thing happening there anymore.

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Well stated, but we will never completely understand the human mind... not even 30%. Loose screws will always slip through the system. How many times have you heard neighbors say about a perp, "This is a total surprise. He is such a nice guy, and this is totally out of character."? I know how it is. One of my patients was seemingly one of the happiest ladies that I knew... right up to the point she put a gun in her mouth and ended her existence. I had two other patients that I warned psychiatry about and they ignored me, the ignorant family practice doc. They both killed themselves as well. We will never reliably be able to state, "This person is a serial killer."

 

Howday, Pards,

OS, I've been talking with a relative-by-marriage, who is a psychiatrist, and has been treating children and young adults for over 40 years. Part of the problem, one which is very frustrating, is that the medical insurance and laws in this country do not make it any easier to detect and treat problems that may or may-not presage a violent outburst. There are more components to the causes for such behavior, ranging from drug abuse, over-prescribed medications for other maladies, under-prescribed meds, genetic imperfections, and a bunch of other stuff I don't begin to understand from the conversation. What it boils down to is our system does NOT make it any easier to detect and treat people with mental illnesses. He agrees that, while he personally would like to see "guns that aren't useful for hunting" eliminatd, more legislation is probably NOT going to stop such massacres!

 

There will probably be a bunch of restrictive legislation on local, state, and national levels coming down the pike. But in addition to fighting the worst of it, we need to get our lawmakers to look at what can be done on the mental health front, as well.

 

In spite of all of this...

 

Happy Holidays, Pards! God's healing balm to those who have suffered from such horrors! Godspeed to those still in harm's way in the defense of Freedom everywhere! God Bless America! :FlagAm:

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Well stated, but we will never completely understand the human mind... not even 30%. Loose screws will always slip through the system. How many times have you heard neighbors say about a perp, "This is a total surprise. He is such a nice guy, and this is totally out of character."? I know how it is. One of my patients was seemingly one of the happiest ladies that I knew... right up to the point she put a gun in her mouth and ended her existence. I had two other patients that I warned psychiatry about and they ignored me, the ignorant family practice doc. They both killed themselves as well. We will never reliably be able to state, "This person is a serial killer."

 

Exactly. Too many avertable tragedies.

Of course some will always slip through the cracks. Being a free society does have dangers.

Like Franklin said, "Those who give up their liberty for more security neither deserve liberty nor security."

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All I know is ,if he did NOT use a gun .

 

Maybe he used a Chevy truck, and ran over the kids in the cross walk on the way home .

Is the government going to ban Gm from making Chevy Trucks ?

 

If He went to the hardwire store and made a pipe bomb and blew up the school .

Is the government going to put a ban on PVC or Hardwire stores or ?

 

The Issue is the nut job not the GUN or the Chevy or any thing else !

 

1. we need to start to see capital punishment !

2. we need to hold the owner of the firearm responsible for there property !

3. we need to stop this 30 years on death row and implement the the outcome Immediately !

4. we need to show the criminals that you will be executed publicly !

5. we need to arm law abiding citizens every were !

 

 

I agree with what you say in principle. Yet the only thing that might had an affect upon the Newtown school shooting is number 5.

The alleged owner of the guns is dead killed by her sone. so 2 doesn't work.

The murderer is dead so 1, 3 and 4 don't work.

All this is relative to the Newtown shooting.

Not for cases such as the Aurora movie theater where the killer is still alive.

 

Yet he will probably plead out as insane and get effectively life in some insane asylym.

Where he really should die of leathal injection within a few years.

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I'm sure there will be a push for an assault weapons ban. It really didn't work the last time and I doubt it would work in the future. All it will likely do is drive up the price of AR's.

 

In 2011 almost 1 in 6 homicides were by knife. 3 of the states with very strict gun laws (New York, New Jersey and Mass) had the highest percentage of knife homicides. Remove the gun and a different weapon gets used.

 

I don't want to be insensitive to the families and friends in this tragedy, but the homicides in Sandy Hook don't speak to any obvious solution...except maybe mom should have kept her firearms under lock and key when she had an obviously unstable child.

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Guest Texas Jack Black

This can and will be debated till HELL freezes over This is a complete breakdown of family ,morals and faith .We as a country have to look at ourselves and the answer is we are the problem.

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Many are the woes of the wicked, but the LORD's unfailing love surrounds the man who trusts in him.

Psalm 32:10 (NIV)

 

It seems to me that everyone is missing ONE BIG factor that total pure unadulterated EVIL visited this poor school! This young man was controlled by a supernatural force that is centuries old and takes control of weak, stressed or mentally ill minds. There is only one defense. I would feel more comfortable with a 45 in my hand or pocket when confronting this young man but my only effective defense would be Jesus! Perhaps God stepped back and allowed this dark force to SHAKE and WAKE US UP to the fact that as a Country, we are headed in the wrong direction, away from God's influence and his protection. There is no doubt in my mind that these little ones are being LOVED, CRADLED and COMFORTED by the Creator of the Universe. But we are still left here in this world trying to make sense of why this happened. My dear friends, it happened because satan is real. His influence is REAL. His demon spirits are real. Our only way to make war and defeat this spiritual enemy is Jesus. Please pray for the victim's families, those hurting and grieving. Don't forget about all of the emergency workers, 1st people on the scene, the investigators and of course the surviving teachers at the school. They have an extremely difficult task of dealing with the horror that no one should have had to see. But most of all, please pray that this Great Nation will see the error of it's ways, turn from it's wicked way and turn to GOD for direction.

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I'm sure there will be a push for an assault weapons ban. It really didn't work the last time and I doubt it would work in the future. All it will likely do is drive up the price of AR's.

 

In 2011 almost 1 in 6 homicides were by knife. 3 of the states with very strict gun laws (New York, New Jersey and Mass) had the highest percentage of knife homicides. Remove the gun and a different weapon gets used.

 

I don't want to be insensitive to the families and friends in this tragedy, but the homicides in Sandy Hook don't speak to any obvious solution...except maybe mom should have kept her firearms under lock and key when she had an obviously unstable child.

I'm very afraid it may work this time. The antis want to strike while emotions are high before the subject can be debated rationally.

Another idiot makes things worse.

http://news.msn.com/us/ind-man-with-47-guns-arrested-after-school-threat

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Part of the problem, one which is very frustrating, is that the medical insurance and laws in this country do not make it any easier to detect and treat problems that may or may-not presage a violent outburst. There are more components to the causes for such behavior, ranging from drug abuse, over-prescribed medications for other maladies, under-prescribed meds, genetic imperfections, and a bunch of other stuff I don't begin to understand from the conversation. What it boils down to is our system does NOT make it any easier to detect and treat people with mental illnesses.

 

100% true. Then throw in all of the civil rights folks who effectively prevent keeping folks in a mental facility -- 'treat and street' is the name of the game.

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Many are the woes of the wicked, but the LORD's unfailing love surrounds the man who trusts in him.

Psalm 32:10 (NIV)

 

It seems to me that everyone is missing ONE BIG factor that total pure unadulterated EVIL visited this poor school! This young man was controlled by a supernatural force that is centuries old and takes control of weak, stressed or mentally ill minds. There is only one defense. I would feel more comfortable with a 45 in my hand or pocket when confronting this young man but my only effective defense would be Jesus! Perhaps God stepped back and allowed this dark force to SHAKE and WAKE US UP to the fact that as a Country, we are headed in the wrong direction, away from God's influence and his protection. There is no doubt in my mind that these little ones are being LOVED, CRADLED and COMFORTED by the Creator of the Universe. But we are still left here in this world trying to make sense of why this happened. My dear friends, it happened because satan is real. His influence is REAL. His demon spirits are real. Our only way to make war and defeat this spiritual enemy is Jesus. Please pray for the victim's families, those hurting and grieving. Don't forget about all of the emergency workers, 1st people on the scene, the investigators and of course the surviving teachers at the school. They have an extremely difficult task of dealing with the horror that no one should have had to see. But most of all, please pray that this Great Nation will see the error of it's ways, turn from it's wicked way and turn to GOD for direction.

AMEN BROTHER ! 100%

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That is true to some extent but what they are doing is working. Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating stricter gun laws. Just a mind set change. As a society they are constantly on guard. Security for those folks isn’t just a part time retirement job. They actively seek out potential threats before it can fully develop. Armed teachers and students is the norm there. It is an effective deterrent. You don't here of these thing happening there anymore.

 

I pretty much agree that the mind set is very different, given that people in Isreal live in a war zone. You behave differently in a war zone. You will find the following articles fairly accurate. The key is ... every person in the country goes into the military, they are screened for physical and mental health. This is where they weed out the mentally ill people. This evaluation must reoccur every 3 years if the person is permitted to own a firearm. You may find these links interesting, and they shed light on the mindset of gun owners in Isreal and who those people are that are wearing rifles while strolling around the Gaza strip.

 

Gun Facts

militarized society

Gun Law Summary

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When a person comes at you with a weapon, there is only one way to stop the attack. It isn't by exploring his mental history, or limiting other peoples access to weapons, or rating entertainment as violent, or having a caring intervention, or trying to understand his childhood, or by keeping a log of the wings he pulls off flies, or praying for him, no, the only sure method of stopping a deadly attack is to meet it with deadly resistance! The heroism shown by the principal, administrators, and teachers clearly shows that had they been armed and skilled with the proper tools, there would be more children alive today!

 

What's really the most important, feel good discussion groups or saving lives that didn't have to be lost?

 

Frankly, I'm thankful the killer had the presence of mind upon realizing the armed police were arriving that he killed himself. Without armed resistance arriving at the scene how many more of the 600 children present would have been victims?

 

Cowards like this killer, the mall shooter, etc never choose to attack a location that has armed persons at the site.

 

It truly is that simple.

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Guest Tennessee Stud, SASS# 43634 Life

I'm very afraid it may work this time. The antis want to strike while emotions are high before the subject can be debated rationally.

Another idiot makes things worse.

http://news.msn.com/us/ind-man-with-47-guns-arrested-after-school-threat

 

 

Don't forget their motto...

 

"Never fail to take advantage of a crisis."

 

My Motto:

 

"I will not give in to terrorism.... foreign or domestic."

 

ts

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When a person comes at you with a weapon, there is only one way to stop the attack. It isn't by exploring his mental history, or limiting other peoples access to weapons, or rating entertainment as violent, or having a caring intervention, or trying to understand his childhood, or by keeping a log of the wings he pulls off flies, or praying for him, no, the only sure method of stopping a deadly attack is to meet it with deadly resistance! The heroism shown by the principal, administrators, and teachers clearly shows that had they been armed and skilled with the proper tools, there would be more children alive today!

 

What's really the most important, feel good discussion groups or saving lives that didn't have to be lost?

 

Frankly, I'm thankful the killer had the presence of mind upon realizing the armed police were arriving that he killed himself. Without armed resistance arriving at the scene how many more of the 600 children present would have been victims?

 

Cowards like this killer, the mall shooter, etc never choose to attack a location that has armed persons at the site.

 

It truly is that simple.

Alas, gun grabbers think that banning the firearm will stop violence. I don't see how any intelligent, educated adult could believe that.

But then, I live in the real world.

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