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.44-40 APP/777 Loading Data Confusion


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I am want to load a few .44-40 using APP or 777.  The charts I find confuse me. It seems 30 grains by volume is what I need. My Lee 1.9 CC scoop doesn't fill the case to the point that the powder touches the bullet. I tried using my old adjustable BP measure set to 30 grains and it didn't fill the case to what I feel is the right level. I am using APP FFFG. While I have not tried it yet, my 777 is FFG.

 

Ideally, I would like to use my 1st Generation Colt SAA (not VP proofed) occasionally in matches just for the fun of it.

 

Advice?

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With BP and its subs its loaded by volume.  BP with compression subs typically with out compression depends on manufacturer.  So measure how much it takes to touch the base of the bullet with the compression or lack of that you need and cut a cartridge to that length and solder a handle on it and dip away.  If you want to reduce the load just put less powder and add your filler of choice.  Loading BP and Subs is the easiest reloading there is.

 

All you need to know in one place  http://www.curtrich.com/bpsubsdummies.html

 

 

20210214_102447.jpg

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Use the APP instead of the 777.  There will be less recoil.  Both subs will easily make the smoke standard.  Use the same bullets you load for smokeless.  Test your revolvers before taking them to a match to see how many stages you can shoot before they bind.  Wash your brass soon after shooting.  The residue from both these subs will corrode brass.

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I have some 777 44-40 loads and would not want to shoot them out of a pistol. Out of my 1860 Henery they will dent mild steel targets at 10 yards.

 

BTW there is no issues running 3F APP through your Dillon or any other powder measure. Just be sure to clean it thoroughly at the end of a loading session. Don't have to clean it every day just when you are done loading APP for a while. 

 

If you want to use a dippers use two 1 cc dippers vice a single 1.9. Mix and match them as needed. Or as pointed out above make you own out of an empty case.

 

If you want to discuss further over the phone then PM me your # 

Edited by Sedalia Dave
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If you are shooting with barrels under 7 1/2" it will give hard recoil with full house 777.  I viberate my 777 loads and can get 36-37 gr in a .44-40 with less than a 1/16" compression using Springfield Slim's 200 gr .429".  I normally use Goex FFFg but 10 years ago WalMart had 777 @ $11.00 a bottle, I ended up with 48 bottles. I still have around 15.  I use 777 in my Marlin .45-70 with a 405 gr RNFP, as I like the extra power down range.

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14 hours ago, Sedalia Dave said:

If you want to use a dippers use two 1 cc dippers vice a single 1.9.

 

Why is that? More consistent?

 

I haven't started with BP yet, but try to gather as much info as possible. I purchased the Lee dipper set to start with.

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21 hours ago, Cholla said:

I am want to load a few .44-40 using APP or 777.  The charts I find confuse me. It seems 30 grains by volume is what I need. My Lee 1.9 CC scoop doesn't fill the case to the point that the powder touches the bullet. I tried using my old adjustable BP measure set to 30 grains and it didn't fill the case to what I feel is the right level. I am using APP FFFG. While I have not tried it yet, my 777 is FFG.

 

Ideally, I would like to use my 1st Generation Colt SAA (not VP proofed) occasionally in matches just for the fun of it.

 

Advice?

I use APP. I load one Lee 1.3 scoop and 2 Circle Fly .430 1/8" nitro cards, 200 gr. Big Lube bullet. Do not need the big lube bullet but it keeps the fowling soft enough I do not have any binding on the pistols.

JJ

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7 hours ago, Equanimous Phil said:

 

Why is that? More consistent?

 

I haven't started with BP yet, but try to gather as much info as possible. I purchased the Lee dipper set to start with.

 

OP stated 1.9 cc wasn't quite enough powder. Using two 1 cc dippers will give 2 cc of powder which may be enough powder.  Lee made two different dipper sets. The old one was red & black in color with the volume listed in cubic inches. The current production is yellow and volumes are listed in cubic centimetres.

 

 

It also comes with a cardboard slide rule that tells you which dipper or dippers to use with a given smokeless powder to obtain the desired charge weight in grains. 

 

For hunting and plinking the Lee dippers are way more accurate than most people would believe. All you have to do is follow their directions.

Edited by Sedalia Dave
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Take an unsharpened pencil and measure the distance from the base of your preferred bullet to the crimping cannilure.  Mark this distance on the blunt end of the unsharpened pencil with a sharpie marker.  Then fill your 44-40 case with APP until the pencil mark is even with the case mouth.  Then dump the APP on your powder scale an weigh it.  next set your powder measure to throw charges equal to the measured weight from your case and start loading. 

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14 minutes ago, Middlefork Bob, SASS #53945 said:

Take an unsharpened pencil and measure the distance from the base of your preferred bullet to the crimping cannilure.  Mark this distance on the blunt end of the unsharpened pencil with a sharpie marker.  Then fill your 44-40 case with APP until the pencil mark is even with the case mouth.  Then dump the APP on your powder scale an weigh it.  next set your powder measure to throw charges equal to the measured weight from your case and start loading. 

 

For APP MB does it pretty much the way I do it.  When you read loading data for APP it states that you shouldn’t compress it, a little gap between powder and bullet won’t hurt. 

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Been shooting B/P only for the last 12 years FYI 44/40 half case APP fill the rest with grits put a 200gr bullet on top and start shooting never had problem lots of smoke have a blast 

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For Pistols I use 18-20 gr of Goex FFFg then fill with grits.  Rifles are full case loads.  Best pistols for recoil control for me was 7 1/2' RUGERS in .44-40.

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Do Not compress 777

 

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777 is 18% hotter than other subs.

 

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I use the 1/16" compression so I know there is no air under bullet.  When I started loading 777 there was very limited info on using it.  At that time I was told up to 1/4" after using a 30" drop tube.   777 didn't publish any loadings other than load like black.   My grandson has several deer using full case 777 and Laser Cast 200 gr RNFP in a Uberti 66 Yellowboy.  

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