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Krazy Kajun

38 Short Colt?

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So, I shot at our monthly match and saw two folks shooting 38 short Colts. I'm fairly new to SASS shooting and had not seen this caliber shot before. I reload and shoot 38 specials in my Ruger Vaqueros and my Marlin 1894. These folks shoot 105 gr TC lead bullets, I have loaded those for my pistol rounds before in regular 38s.

 

A few questions

1. Will the 38 short Colt round shoot in my Ruger Vaqueros and Marlin 1894 all chambered in .357?

2. Is there anything special about this round that would different than loading 38s, other than adjusting the powder.

3. Is there any place to purchase once fired brass for this round?

 

Thanks.

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1. Yes, Vaquero. No, Marlin unless modified.

2. No.

3. The only place that sells brass is Starline. Finding once fired brass is not terribly likely except in the SASS classifieds. You see them once in a great while.

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1. Yes, Vaquero. No, Marlin unless modified.

2. No.

3. The only place that sells brass is Starline. Finding once fired brass is not terribly likely except in the SASS classifieds. You see them once in a great while.

 

 

And for what it's worth, Remmington still loads the round as factory ammo. I see it on the shelves at local stores farily regularly. Saw some yesterday for $32.00 a box, which really surpised me cuz the .38 S&W right next to it was $35. Of all else fails, that's one way to get brass for it.

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So, I shot at our monthly match and saw two folks shooting 38 short Colts. I'm fairly new to SASS shooting and had not seen this caliber shot before. I reload and shoot 38 specials in my Ruger Vaqueros and my Marlin 1894. These folks shoot 105 gr TC lead bullets, I have loaded those for my pistol rounds before in regular 38s.

 

A few questions

1. Will the 38 short Colt round shoot in my Ruger Vaqueros and Marlin 1894 all chambered in .357?

2. Is there anything special about this round that would different than loading 38s, other than adjusting the powder.

3. Is there any place to purchase once fired brass for this round?

 

Thanks.

 

You can get loading data at

 

www.imrpowder.com

 

They list loads for Titegroup, Clays and Trailboss. Larsen answered your other questions correctly, Starline is your best bet for brass as this is not a real popular caliber (outside of SASS and collectors) and factory ammo (as noted) can be a little pricey. The only advantage to using 38 Colt is your laoding density will be better than 38sp with light powder charges and greater accuracy and consistency (less chance for a squib) is possible with the short case.

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Thanks for the info, its good to know pards are here to help others along.

 

I'll look into this a bit more before I decide if I got some brass and load a few to test with.

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I don't think that you can load .38 Short Colts with .38 Special dies. The case is too short. The .38 S&W's are more common but typically come with soft .360 diameter bullets instead of .358".

 

I do not see how any benefit would overcome the cost of new dies and unusual brass, but then I mostly shoot .32WCF, .38WCF and .45 Cowboy Special. This is part of the fun of Cowboy action.

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Thanks for the info, its good to know pards are here to help others along.

 

I'll look into this a bit more before I decide if I got some brass and load a few to test with.

 

The Short Colt should be able to be fired in the Marlin with a Widdermatic conversion, but unless your wanting it to shoot black powder or subs without using fillers I don't see the point in it. Standard 125 or 105gr 38 special out of a Marlin has no recoil anyway. I'm doing some experimenting with a .38 special trimmed down to about half way between a .38 Long Colt and a .38 Short Colt. I call it a .357 Minimum. My reason is to get a full case of 777 and keep the recoil to a minimum. I shot these at the 2009 KY/TN Black Powder State Championship at Possum Trott. They made plenty of smoke and were very pleasant to shoot. They were a full case of 777 minus bullet space for no compression.

 

I'm experimenting with a Widdermatic Marlin now to shoot this round.

 

Randy

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I don't think that you can load .38 Short Colts with .38 Special dies. The case is too short. The .38 S&W's are more common but typically come with soft .360 diameter bullets instead of .358".

 

I do not see how any benefit would overcome the cost of new dies and unusual brass, but then I mostly shoot .32WCF, .38WCF and .45 Cowboy Special. This is part of the fun of Cowboy action.

 

 

38 S&W ain't nowhere near the same size as a 38/357. The 38 short/long colt can be loaded with 38 special dies (I know because I've done it) but all FOUR of these calibers are different but it's a moot point cuz Lee makes dies for 28 bucks a set!

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Hi Krazy,

 

I used to shoot them with 108 grain double ended wad cutters in my Colts. They were pretty accurate. For some reason they were very dirty. So, I switched back to .38 special with the same DEWCs. You would not want to use WCs in a rifle.

 

Regards,

 

Allie Mo

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Hey,

 

I have a 1,000 new in the box that I will gladly sell you.

 

I have had them for about 5 years and never wanted to buy all the stuff to reload them. Never really saw an advantage so why go through all the bother.

 

Anyway, you can send me a PM and I will shoot you price.

 

Dang It

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I have a Lee turret press and the price of dies for that press isn't too bad. I'm just interesting in developing and shooting differing rounds and this one looked interesting and I hadn't seen this one before. I don't think I'll explore these in my rifle but seeing as how it will shoot in my Vaqueros I might just get some brass and load some. I've got plenty of 105 gr TC bullets so that would work.

 

Dangit Dan, I'm sending you a PM about those rounds you have to get an idea of costs.

 

Thanks to everyone for your help.

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For the record:

 

when the Widdermatic mod became a reality, Randy St. Eagle and I talked about the possibility of modifying a Marlin 1894 to reliably feed a particular sized cartridge that Randy had been working with.

 

If my memory serves me correct, this round wasn't as short as a .38 Short Colt but it was shorter than a .38 special.

 

Randy sent me a carrier and I modified its timing to such that it would reliably work in my Marlin 1894 but, I didn't have Randy's Marlin to set it up 'perfect', so to speak.

 

Anyhow, from my experience with this particular cartridge on ONE gun only, I agree with AJ in that setting up a Widdermatic mod for the .38 Short Colt might be possible but you would be riding the edge of what the Widdermatic mod is capable of.

 

I can't speak for the capabilities of what other gunsmith mods are capable of.....like the short stroked Marlins.

 

If you really want to have a rifle capable of shooting these .38 Short Colt rounds, give AJ a call and talk with him about those special items for the 66 and 73's.

 

Best regards

 

..........Widder

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I shoot .38 short colt in my .357 Ruger revolvers.

 

I use a .38 sizing die with a 9 mm set up (powder, seating and crimping dies) with a Dillon 550,

as recommended by Dillon.

 

Starline Brass and a 125 gr bullet. Cartridge is same length as a 9 mm.

 

I use Bullseye powder (cannot disclose load on this site)

 

Velocity is 525 fps

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My wife, the ever loverly Fannie Mostly, has been using this round for 8 years.

Using Titegroup, 125rnfp, Federal Small Pistol Primer.

I use a Dillon 550B and called Dillon for a .38 short colt setup.

Her pistols are the Ruger Vaquero Sheriff's model.

Won't work in her Marlin and I won't modify the rifle to make it, she'll have to do with the .38spl loads.

Oh yeah, she's won 6 CA State Championsips in Ladies B Western and 1 Western Regional Championships in Ladies B Western.

She's always in the Top Gun Shootout so I guess they work for her.

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what I learned

 

a carbon ring will build up in the cylinder based upon the short length

 

if you have to put a regular 38 in later (say ya run out of short ones, or sumthin like that)

 

ya probably wont git it in.......

I lernt that the hard way

on a reload stage, and I only had 38s' in my belt

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what I learned

 

a carbon ring will build up in the cylinder based upon the short length

 

if you have to put a regular 38 in later (say ya run out of short ones, or sumthin like that)

 

ya probably wont git it in.......

I lernt that the hard way

on a reload stage, and I only had 38s' in my belt

 

 

MM is correct, but that crud ring doesn't build up in a day, and a tornado brush and some hoppes will make short work of it if ya actually do clean yer guns :)

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what I learned

 

a carbon ring will build up in the cylinder based upon the short length

 

if you have to put a regular 38 in later (say ya run out of short ones, or sumthin like that)

 

ya probably wont git it in.......

I lernt that the hard way

on a reload stage, and I only had 38s' in my belt

Bullet Boy warned me about that 'en! ;)

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